Should PD have let the modding slide? ... OP Updated.

[Griffith500]

Ummm just to let you know the grip multiplier isn't actually all the difference is in the tire model in GT5 anyway. Do you really think that GT5's different tires are actually totally different things? No all when you do say change from racing hard to racing medium to racing softs is changing the grip multiplier nothing else.
This has been known for a very long time. And proven by the GTP member Scaff in his threads comparing GT5 vs Forza 4 physics.

So basically the grip multiplier if you look at the whole big picture is changing tire grades/compounds which is exactly what you do in real life.

So basically you saying that the grip multiplier correct at all is about as ludicrous as me saying a I can take a 8G turn in a jeep with a six inches lift kit.

Yes, just like swapping different engines only changes a few "power multipliers".

Different tyre types have different behaviours (like sports in the wet, large slip angles of comforts etc.), but these are just more scalars (which just means multipliers...) applied elsewhere in the model.

This is just how games work; they're all numerical models running in a framework of rigid (often buggy) logic. That's why this "hacking" (it's modding, only Sony say it's "illegal", of course) is possible in the first place - all you need to do is swap a few numbers here and there. Of course getting access to those numbers is tricky, and is where the legal grey area starts, (along with my ignorance, I'll admit).

If I get banned.. it was worth it

I witnessed what gt5 couldve been and what GT could become.
I REGRET NOTHING !

Liberté, égalité, fraternité ou la mort! Vive la revolution!

 

[Johnnypenso]

Sony actually did a better job with the PP system than we ever realized. You cannot edit a car in any way that affects performance on the track, that does not also affect the PP level of that car, other than massively excess use of power which is easy to spot and check in lobbies with an HP check or Racing Super Soft tires, which can be eliminated by sticking to Race Mediums or less.

Hybriding actually brings many, many more cars into competitiveness that ever before. I can make my 69' Vette handle like an Evora now, with the same power and weight of an Evora, and with a proper racing V8 sounds. Not quite as fast, but within shouting distances at least, and certainly 10 times the car it was before. I'd bet that given enough time, I could make 100+ cars competitive with those Elises, NSX's, Evora's, LFA's etc, that were so consistently winning races for more than 2 years. A 60's Shelby Cobra that can compete with an Audi R8? How can anyone argue that's a bad thing?

 

[Lock2Lock]

Sony actually did a better job with the PP system than we ever realized. You cannot edit a car in any way that affects performance on the track, that does not also affect the PP level of that car, other than massively excess use of power which is easy to spot and check in lobbies with an HP check or Racing Super Soft tires, which can be eliminated by sticking to Race Mediums or less.

Hybriding actually brings many, many more cars into competitiveness that ever before. I can make my 69' Vette handle like an Evora now, with the same power and weight of an Evora, and with a proper racing V8 sounds. Not quite as fast, but within shouting distances at least, and certainly 10 times the car it was before. I'd bet that given enough time, I could make 100+ cars competitive with those Elises, NSX's, Evora's, LFA's etc, that were so consistently winning races for more than 2 years. A 60's Shelby Cobra that can compete with an Audi R8? How can anyone argue that's a bad thing?

This is very true too.

 

[Sphinx]

A 60's Shelby Cobra that can compete with an Audi R8? How can anyone argue that's a bad thing?

Perhaps the IP (Intellectual Property) owner of the brand name Audi?

 

[TouGeMonster33]

Ok i get the whole grip multiplier thing.THANKS What im asking is what do you guys think makes your hybrid realistic compared to the real thing?In real life your not going to be able to have a gt300 gt500 chassis available to put what engine you want in or vice versa.Yet thats what most are doing and calling it realistic,I mean cmon now.Explain someone????? i have yet to see something as simple as K20 ek,rb 240's.But ill see a nsx with a gt500 engine and thats realistic tho???????????????

 

[iainoflo85]

Perhaps the IP (Intellectual Property) owner of the brand name Audi?

How come your quote is misnamed? JP is not named Spikeyhairdude.

 

[Sphinx]

How come your quote is misnamed? JP is not named Spikeyhaireddude.

Maybe we've been hacked?

 

[SpeedyishOlly]

How come your quote is misnamed? JP is not named Spikeyhaireddude.

I wonder.

 

[Lock2Lock]

Ok i get the whole grip multiplier thing.THANKS What im asking is what do you guys think makes your hybrid realistic compared to the real thing?In real life your not going to be able to have a gt300 gt500 chassis available to put what engine you want in or vice versa.Yet thats what most are doing and calling it realistic,I mean cmon now.Explain someone????? i have yet to see something as simple as K20 ek,rb 240's.But ill see a nsx with a gt500 engine and thats realistic tho???????????????

I am talking about realistic modifications like you said up there.

Say like a D1GP or Formula Drift replica.
Like 1JZ powered 240SX (or 180SX) or 1JZ or 2JZ powered Silvia S13.

That's what I am and others I chill with are into.

Maybe you are getting a bad vibe with the realism factor of some hybrid cars because you hang with the wrong crowed.

 

[Voodoovaj]

Edit - Sorry, the post made me sound like a douche bag.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Perhaps the IP (Intellectual Property) owner of the brand name Audi?

Yeah I can see the Audi Board Meeting now.

Junior Marketing VP in squeaky voice: Uhhhh Sir, I was playing a video game last night, driving one of our Audi R8's, and I got beat by a Shelby Cobra. This is an outrage sir, what are we going to do about this?

CEO: Dummkopf!!! [Fool]

How come your quote is misnamed? JP is not named Spikeyhaireddude.

Haha, never noticed that Iain, thanks for pointing that out:tup:

 

[Sphinx]

A 60's Shelby Cobra that can compete with an Audi R8? How can anyone argue that's a bad thing?

Perhaps the IP (Intellectual Property) owner of the brand name Audi?

Fixed.

 

[Cote Dazur]

I wonder.

Me to.

 

[TouGeMonster33]

i havent met any like that would be cool to drive.But thats where it needs to stop dont you think?How does the game accept the engine swap i.e does the weight change,power/weight ratio,handling characteristics?????

 

[Lock2Lock]

i havent met any like that would be cool to drive.But thats where it needs to stop dont you think?How does the game accept the engine swap i.e does the weight change,power/weight ratio,handling characteristics?????

Depends. Like take my RX-7 Enfini for example.

I took the spoiler off it and set the downforce to 0
I put in the Re Amemiya GT300 car's engine in it. That is the only thing. I didn't do a chassis swaps or anything else ridiculous.

The engine makes it think 20-30HP less than the original Enfini engine. Reason for that particular engine is because of the sound. I only use it for drifting.

On my G27 it feels like it is a little bit heavier than what it was before. And has a better overall feeling of weight in the wheel.

 

[Sphinx]

Yeah I can see the Audi Board Meeting now.

Junior Marketing VP in squeaky voice: Uhhhh Sir, I was playing a video game last night, driving one of our Audi R8's, and I got beat by a Shelby Cobra. This is an outrage sir, what are we going to do about this?

CEO: Dummkopf!!! [Fool]

My point is;
Every brand within the game has an IP owner. PD is ony the licensee of the brand and as such would have signed a detailed contract with the IP owner. Would it be in the best interest of the IP owner to allow the licensee's users to manipulate its multi million pound brand image? Would PD be in breach of contract by allowing this manipulation to continue? Would the IP owner be happy in the knowledge that they are no longer in control of thier brand as many thousands of PD's users set out to manipulate it?

 

[Hei]

It's on a per car basis. Chassis swaps do affect weight. p/w is an easy one, always changes with engine swaps and such, and handling changes tons depending on chassis. For example, my twincharged Miata with a 20b has slight understeer until you pushed it above 5k rpm. That isn't a general miata thing.

 

[iainoflo85]

Me to.

This made me lol! Thanks Cote.

 

[GTWelsh]

My point is;
Every brand within the game has an IP owner. PD is ony the licensee of the brand and as such would have signed a detailed contract with the IP owner. Would it be in the best interest of the IP owner to allow the licensee's users to manipulate its multi million pound brand image? Would PD be in breach of contract by allowing this manipulation to continue? Would the IP owner be happy in the knowledge that they are no longer in control of thier brand as many thousands of PD's users set out to manipulate it?

Hey man, all I did was lower and convert to rear wheel drive an r33 skyline for drifting.

The brand image of my new skyline will be very much the same as it was before or maybe even closer to how it is in real life if I'm honest.

It's just idiots being idiots causing the hassle, not really the "extra customisability".

 

[Johnnypenso]

Depends. Like take my RX-7 Enfini for example.

I took the spoiler off it and set the downforce to 0
I put in the Re Amemiya GT300 car's engine in it. That is the only thing. I didn't do a chassis swaps or anything else ridiculous.

The engine makes it think 20-30HP less than the original Enfini engine. Reason for that particular engine is because of the sound. I only use it for drifting.

On my G27 it feels like it is a little bit heavier than what it was before. And has a better overall feeling of weight in the wheel.

You know this so I'm pointing it out for those not familiar with hybriding, but engines are just a bunch of codes PD uses to calculate how fast to accelerate the car. Unlike in real life, there is nothing magical about a race car engine. Might sound better, but how fast it makes your car is simply a function of how PD programmed the power curve. Certain power curves work better for circuit racing, in real life and in the game on the track and under the PP system. Swapping in racing motors often means losing rather than gaining peak HP, but they do sound better so it's sometimes a tradeoff between sound and outright performance.

My point is;
Every brand within the game has an IP owner. PD is ony the licensee of the brand and as such would have signed a detailed contract with the IP owner. Would it be in the best interest of the IP owner to allow the licensee's users to manipulate its multi million pound brand image? Would PD be in breach of contract by allowing this manipulation to continue? Would the IP owner be happy in the knowledge that they are no longer in control of thier brand as many thousands of PD's users set out to manipulate it?

Thank you for not manipulating my name in the quote.

This may be a concern and it may not. Nothing I can do about that, it's up to Sony/PD and the manufacturers to deal with it, it's out of my hands. My guess is though, if this has been going on for 2+ months and Sony/PD haven't gone ballistic in their response, it's not that big of a deal. If Ferrari had contacted them and said, "Fix this or else" , GT6 development would have ceased instantly and within 24 hours they would have patched this come heck or high water. I think they've had no feedback from any manufacturers and all they've done is keep them out of the TT's.

 

[Lock2Lock]

You know this so I'm pointing it out for those not familiar with hybriding, but engines are just a bunch of codes PD uses to calculate how fast to accelerate the car. Unlike in real life, there is nothing magical about a race car engine. Might sound better, but how fast it makes your car is simply a function of how PD programmed the power curve. Certain power curves work better for circuit racing, in real life and in the game on the track and under the PP system. Swapping in racing motors often means losing rather than gaining peak HP, but they do sound better so it's sometimes a tradeoff between sound and outright performance.

Like i said only reason is because of the sound. I like lower powered cars anyway so with the car making less HP was just a bonus.

I don't like drifting cars above 500HP

 

[Team THRT Drift]

Like i said only reason is because of the sound. I like lower powered cars anyway so with the car making less HP was just a bonus.

I don't like drifting cars above 500HP

Me neither. My Integra was an exception though.... I used the racing chassis from the '69 Maro abd it had the tendancy to straighten out mid drift. So I Turbo'd the engine (same engine from the 'Maro) and now it has 798HP. Probably more due to excessive use...

 

[Tornado]

My point is;
Every brand within the game has an IP owner. PD is ony the licensee of the brand and as such would have signed a detailed contract with the IP owner. Would it be in the best interest of the IP owner to allow the licensee's users to manipulate its multi million pound brand image? Would PD be in breach of contract by allowing this manipulation to continue? Would the IP owner be happy in the knowledge that they are no longer in control of thier brand as many thousands of PD's users set out to manipulate it?

Wouldn't this apply just the same to all of the cars that PD themselves screwed up, then?

 

[spikeyhairdude]

How come your quote is misnamed? JP is not named Spikeyhairdude.

Off topic
?. I don't understand. What did I do.

 

[Sphinx]

Wouldn't this apply just the same to all of the cars that PD themselves screwed up, then?

PD has a licence agreement. You and I don't.

 

[Voodoovaj]

Wouldn't this apply just the same to all of the cars that PD themselves screwed up, then?

Yup

After cooling off a bit and giving it some thought, Sony simply did what the community asked for. The majority asked that those who RUIN online be punished. As long as a player does not ruin online, it would appear you are safe.

I will continue to run my 505-550 rooms and leave it open to anyone as long as their set up isn't ridiculous and no SUPER SOFT tires.

 

[TouGeMonster33]

Depends. Like take my RX-7 Enfini for example.

I took the spoiler off it and set the downforce to 0
I put in the Re Amemiya GT300 car's engine in it. That is the only thing. I didn't do a chassis swaps or anything else ridiculous.

The engine makes it think 20-30HP less than the original Enfini engine. Reason for that particular engine is because of the sound. I only use it for drifting.

On my G27 it feels like it is a little bit heavier than what it was before. And has a better overall feeling of weight in the wheel.

hmmm sounds interesting u may of peeked my intrest ...Thanks

 

[Tornado]

PD has a licence agreement. You and I don't.

And wouldn't that make it even worse for them when they screw something up then when someone hacks the game and screws something up, since they directly violated that agreement (which presumably asks for realistic representation of the brands included) rather than violated it through inaction?

 

[Johnnypenso]

Yup

After cooling off a bit and giving it some thought, Sony simply did what the community asked for. The majority asked that those who RUIN online be punished. As long as a player does not ruin online, it would appear you are safe.

I will continue to run my 505-550 rooms and leave it open to anyone as long as their set up isn't ridiculous and no SUPER SOFT tires.

What kind of tires are you running? If you're on streets I'm interested for sure, maybe RH. Shoot me an FR on PSN if you don't mind.

 

[Lock2Lock]

hmmm sounds interesting u may of peeked my intrest ...Thanks

No problem. I just would like some people to see hybriding from every point of view before they automatically hate on it.

Also. If you want another example.
One of my drift teammates. He owned a Supra drag car with a 1jz or 2jz. He had sold the supra shell but kept the drive train.

He has now built a S13 in real life with the engine and drive train from that supra and put it in it. He has it for a daily driver/drift car and thanks to hybriding he owns the same car on GT5 as he does in real life.