- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Is the volume button broken on your tv?
Sound Update (PD is now hiring! + Email!)Answered
- Thread starter FoRiZon
- 1,262 comments
- 96,780 views
- 8,723
Knowing what I do about how these sounds can be made, no. I think it's because PD have more control over the Red Bull cars, and the Senna cars, so their little social experiment is more tolerable should it potentially "fail".
A cross-plane V8 put through the current exhaust (that all the aforementioned cars share) would sound hilariously over-the-top. Presumably, there's a reason they haven't invested in creating another one, which of course implies I think it's specially made for the purposes of teasing.
- 2,013
- WNC
- TRLWNC
You know, I don't understand the problem with the dyno. All you have to do is put a microphone imediately beside the tires and FILTER THAT SOUND OUT!
Is this REALLY that hard to do? I listen to the newer cars (using this new bolt-on dyno system), and there is a slow pulse going on with EVERYTHING that drives me NUTS!
So there is STILL noise coming from the dyno system, and they are STILL NOT FILTERING IT! Grr...
And, no, there is nothing wrong with my volume. I just run it EXTREMELY low because it hurts too much to turn it up.
Is this REALLY that hard to do? I listen to the newer cars (using this new bolt-on dyno system), and there is a slow pulse going on with EVERYTHING that drives me NUTS!
So there is STILL noise coming from the dyno system, and they are STILL NOT FILTERING IT! Grr...
And, no, there is nothing wrong with my volume. I just run it EXTREMELY low because it hurts too much to turn it up.
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
He may answer all the questions for all we know. Maybe it's just a matter of formulating all the answers so no one busts a vein upon hearing the answers. I have faith in PD and that has increased since the recent happenings.
What I stumbled upon this morning is also astounding to say the least. Since it's suspected that PD will be using Dynapacks and all that jazz to record audio of the vehicle works, they can also kill 2 birds with one stone. The other bird being something I've mentioned in a question and that is Torque Physics. Like when the engine reaches its powerband, the turbo spooling, VTec, VVti what have you. How are those all recorded and placed into the game's driving physics because at the moment, Turbo lag, Vtec transition etc aren't really pronounced and noticible. More on that in this thread: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/torque-physics-turbo-vvti-vtec.309458/#post-9779396
GT6,Chucks racing exhaust on Ferrari F40, sounds like this
Get a Subaru, rolls out of the dealership like...
What I stumbled upon this morning is also astounding to say the least. Since it's suspected that PD will be using Dynapacks and all that jazz to record audio of the vehicle works, they can also kill 2 birds with one stone. The other bird being something I've mentioned in a question and that is Torque Physics. Like when the engine reaches its powerband, the turbo spooling, VTec, VVti what have you. How are those all recorded and placed into the game's driving physics because at the moment, Turbo lag, Vtec transition etc aren't really pronounced and noticible. More on that in this thread: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/torque-physics-turbo-vvti-vtec.309458/#post-9779396
GT6,Chucks racing exhaust on Ferrari F40, sounds like this
Get a Subaru, rolls out of the dealership like...
- 8,723
You can't really "filter" noise like that because neither the amplitude nor the phase of the tyre noise will be coherent between the exhaust recording and the tyre recording. Trying to naïvely "subtract" the tyre noise from the exhaust sound will result in a "ghost" of the tyre sound being left behind, which will still be audible as tyre noise.
You can get clever and account for the phase and amplitude differences by taking an impulse response from the tyre location(s) to each microphone, but that's a lot more effort for probably little gain, especially since disturbances in the air and the source geometry will still leave a residual spectre of the original noise. The best defence is simply to record the thing you want as closely as possible, because at those short distances (where environment reflections are relatively quiet), the amplitude effectively scales inversely with distance (1/r).
As an example, recording a source from half a metre away will be about 18 dB louder than the first reflection from a wall 2 metres away; that probably doesn't sound much, but approximately every 6 to 10 dB difference sounds twice as loud to us (18 dB is therefore minimum 3.5 times louder, maximum 8). Shorten that distance to a foot and place the source in a more sensibly sized room, and the direct sound is 26 dB (at least 6 times) louder than the first reflection. A tyre half a metre away is 4 dB (minimum 30%) quieter than the exhaust one foot (0.3 m) away; in reality, some of the tyre noise is occluded by the car itself, and the two sounds overlap (in the frequency range) to a degree, plus microphones are directional: all meaning the exhaust sound is even more prominent in practice than the numbers suggest. Proximity is everything.
I don't think I can hear any dyno or tyre noise in any of the samples in the game, and the vast majority of those are from before they started removing the wheels...
- 10,956
- Canada
mister dog
(Banned)
- 8,396
- Spain
- misterdog
- misterdog7
I concur with the others here; saying "uum i'm sorry" and explaining how GT generated sounds in the past isn't an answer on the OP's question when they will be finally updated to acceptable standards, so @ a mod can "answered" be removed please?
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
What could have Kaz said though? Something at least that won't cause or uproar or have us being like "Yeah we told you so"
- 16
- United States
- CobraLover567
- 2,059
- Under your bed.
- Ask me, man.
The question has begun to be addressed, but clearly not answered in its entirety. I expect in part 3 that we'll get a more concrete response as to what PD are doing to create more impressive, believable sounds.
"To be continued".
"To be continued".
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Falling for what? The answer is not yet finished. We've got background information which has been very informative and entertaining for me and I'm sure lots of others. You may not like the way Kaz/PD is answering the question but the point is, they aren't finished answering. Why is this so hard to understand? When Kaz is done and moved on to another question, feel free to criticize to your hearts content, until then at least let the guy finish his answer.
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
I'm thinking Jordan knows something that we don't . Either way, people must chill. Just wait for that other part.
mister dog
(Banned)
- 8,396
- Spain
- misterdog
- misterdog7
- 2,013
- WNC
- TRLWNC
Thank you for clarifying. I had a feeling I was barking at the wrong tree, much less up.
Oh, well.... But that begs the question, why don't they just go to a track..... (I'm sure you can use the same explanation, so.... shrug....)
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
PD can use a track more for sound projection. Also for city circuits I'd expect sound to bounce off the building walls. Like Citta Di Aria for example
- 8,723
Recording in a circuit environment is useful as a reference only. You get the colouration of the environment much more prominently (it's to do with the radiated power that your ears "capture" at that range, and the split of that power as direct and reflected sources), and that is very hard to remove.
iRacing and pCARS use (something like) this method, and it does sound good. The drawback, though, is that the cars always sound like that - any attempt to add a different colouration just makes a mess, and as I said, you can't remove it from the recording to make room to add your own. Recording cars in several environments would multiply the workload and the size of the sample database (e.g. 2 sources, 5 rpm ranges, 2 throttle positions, x upgrade part combinations, y circuits etc.)
Better is to synthesise the sound without any colouration, then add it dynamically according to what the scene dictates.
iRacing and pCARS use (something like) this method, and it does sound good. The drawback, though, is that the cars always sound like that - any attempt to add a different colouration just makes a mess, and as I said, you can't remove it from the recording to make room to add your own. Recording cars in several environments would multiply the workload and the size of the sample database (e.g. 2 sources, 5 rpm ranges, 2 throttle positions, x upgrade part combinations, y circuits etc.)
Better is to synthesise the sound without any colouration, then add it dynamically according to what the scene dictates.
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Make the sound real good.In Laymanns Terms?
Kidding!! If I may...when you record at a track, you get environmental effects. Sounds bounce around in the environment, it's affected by weather, humidity, temperature, grandstands, trees etc. All these are recorded and in the sample so your car will always sort of sound like it did at the track it was recorded on.
Or, you can make a perfectly clean recording in a studio, in a completely controlled environment, and add the effects of the environment at each individual track. You can program in changes due to humidity, temperature, proximity of objects and whatever else factors into sound.
Or something like that..
If I'm off the mark I'm sure Griffith will point you in the right direction.👍
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
Make the sound real good.
Kidding!! If I may...when you record at a track, you get environmental effects. Sounds bounce around in the environment, it's affected by weather, humidity, temperature, grandstands, trees etc. All these are recorded and in the sample so your car will always sort of sound like it did at the track it was recorded on.
Or, you can make a perfectly clean recording in a studio, in a completely controlled environment, and add the effects of the environment at each individual track. You can program in changes due to humidity, temperature, proximity of objects and whatever else factors into sound.
Or something like that..
I get it now thanks
I like the 2nd option better. Though it more sound a bit more generic, it seems more sensible.
- 8,723
Recording samples with strong environmental cues is generic; adding them to a dry recording on the fly is general.
The beauty of a general method is that you can account for any combination of conditions you should choose to imagine; the generic approach gives you the same results no matter the supposed conditions in the game.
The beauty of a general method is that you can account for any combination of conditions you should choose to imagine; the generic approach gives you the same results no matter the supposed conditions in the game.
- 2,822
- Espoo
- GTP_Raitzi
That cracked me up
"Kaz answering you long time!"
- 10,456
- United States
- WrecklessAbandon
Yeah, leave it to PD to take more than a single installment to answer a question.
The point is that it currently isn't answered, nor has it even been addressed, other than to say it will be addressed. Yet the thread says "answered".
I find it interesting.
Got a release date on that answer?
(and how many installments?) 
v1.04?!?!?!? Answer Spec II?
- 8,723
I think it's wise to remember how this sub-forum came about, and Jordan's comments about things "being in the works" around the time people started asking in earnest exactly how and when the questions would be answered.
In that sense, I'd suggest that the marking of this question as "answered", despite only the partial publication of that answer so far, is an indication of yet more communication behind the scenes. GTPlanet was directly mentioned in the first part of the answer, also.
The rest is probably ready to be posted (and I'd say it has been for some time), it's just that information is always best released in a controlled manner. It's likely PD don't want to show their hand too soon.
I think if PD had shown us last May what their new sounds would be like, and then here we are still without them, it's possible people would be going even more crazy about it.
In that sense, I'd suggest that the marking of this question as "answered", despite only the partial publication of that answer so far, is an indication of yet more communication behind the scenes. GTPlanet was directly mentioned in the first part of the answer, also.
The rest is probably ready to be posted (and I'd say it has been for some time), it's just that information is always best released in a controlled manner. It's likely PD don't want to show their hand too soon.
I think if PD had shown us last May what their new sounds would be like, and then here we are still without them, it's possible people would be going even more crazy about it.
- 647
- Zagreb
- johnwalter1044
Main reason why car sound in GT6 sucks: Echo, one long, annoying, continues echo which muffles the car sound.
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
U wot? I don't get it
- 647
- Zagreb
- johnwalter1044
Think about it, try to listen the car sound in GT6, you'll notice that every engine sound echos too much, as a result, every single car sound like a microwave.
- 15,532
- Cairo, Egypt
- GTP_SEMS
Would love to know how Driveclub record their sounds.
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