Stock -vs- Tuned: It's been too long.
- Thread starter MOTORTRENDmitch
- 360 comments
- 33,683 views
- 434
I know this is double posting but this is kind of an important set of Questions..
1. I talked to someone who was interested in being the photographer for SvT, I meant to add you on PSN, and before I did I deleted my PM Inbox.. and lost your name/psn.. I am deeply sorry for the dumb mistake, and could you PM me again
2. I've noticed that some pictures I have put in the write-ups have disappeared, only to have a "Picture Moved or Deleted" Sign left in its wake.. Can some one give me a link to a Fast and Easy, Pic file to forum picture code website, I don't know if photo bucket, flickr, Razzi, or what ever else ones, are the best. Lemme' know please..
Episode 4 is ready to post, it's been edited and everything, I just need to add the pictures and font/size/colour parts to it.. so that is why I had those questions, please give me some answers
....I'd love a reply
Try tinypic.com
You don't even need an account.
Photobucket is good too, but you need to sign up.
- 3,531
- London, Ontario
- Starky513
Tiny pic is what I use now, the thing is, (I don't know if you have noticed) it randomly deletes pictures, and in the Episode Post, a "Picture is deleted or Moved" where I want a picture.. to STAY.
I'll stick to tinypic for now 
Thanks for the help
- 434
MOTORTRENDmitchTiny pic is what I use now, the thing is, (I don't know if you have noticed) it randomly deletes pictures, and in the Episode Post, a "Picture is deleted or Moved" where I want a picture.. to STAY.
Hmm... strange. I've never had that happened. Then I'd say PhotoBucket is your best bet, and in hindsight it's the superior choice since you can save all the pictures on your account for future reference and editing.
- 1,616
- Australia
- GTP_ealirendur
I've had no problems with photobucket, and I can also manage to post from my phone.
I have heard people say imgur and Flickr are fine, too (mostly the former), but I naturally can't say.
And nice work here!
Edit: ... And maybe have a quick squizz at what the Photomode dudes use?
I have heard people say imgur and Flickr are fine, too (mostly the former), but I naturally can't say.
And nice work here!
Edit: ... And maybe have a quick squizz at what the Photomode dudes use?
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- 3,531
- London, Ontario
- Starky513
Stock-vs- Tuned - Episode 4
Welcome to yet another episode of Stock -vs- Tuned!! In this series we compare two cars often at completely different levels, and price ranges, and put the money you saved on the cheaper car, back into it in the form of "upgrades" in order to see what car has the potential to be faster at the same price range. Now, enough with what you already know, lets get to it. This week I have chosen quite an unconventional pairing. Both have four doors, long wheel bases, and powerhouses under the bonnet. May I introduce to you, the Chrysler 300C, and the BMW M5. It is a pretty striking match-up and both have very different methods of going to pick up the kids from soccer practice. You would be more used to seeing these cars cruising down town streets, and not usually racing at your local track. Buying the 300C you will take a 34,780cr hit to the bank. The M5 on the other hand, carries a considerably bigger price tag: 137,000cr. That leaves a 102,220cr Budget on this project. So what will it be, the Muscle from America, or the Finesse of the European. We'll soon find out.
Before beating these cars up on the track, lets have a closer look at them, the Chrysler 300C is powered by the same 5.7 Liter, HEMI V8 that moves the Dodge RAM. It produces 345HP as well as 385 ft-lbs torque, which make it to the wheels through a very dated 5 speed automatic slush box. Shift times really have a negative impact on the performance figures. Red line starts at an astonishing *sarcasm* 5500 RPM and will take you to a 6200RPM Rev Limiter. The Big 300 weighs in at 1848KG. Certainly not the numbers you expect to hear, when looking at this car's laid back curves. The exhaust note from it is a nice V8 rumble. Sounds to me like we may have a sleeper at hand.. and that is indeed a fact.
Now lets turn the spot light to the BMW M5. Behind this car's swooping lines and elegant styling, lies a 5 Liter V10 that screams to over 9000RPM!! producing 500HP and 372ft-lbs or torque. This makes it to the wheels through a quick-shifting 7 Speed flappy paddle gear box. She tips the scales at 1888KG. The exhaust note on this machine is a thing of beauty, whether it be flat out accelerating or during aggressive down shifts. It really is the kind of car I picture Lewis Hamilton driving to pick up the groceries.
We eagerly take these Super Sedans to the runway strip to gather some performance figures and we are genuinely surprised at how fast these heavy weights get up to speed.
In the 300C: 0-60: 5.4 0-100: 13 1/4Mile: 13.8 Max Speed: 155
In the M5: 0-60: 4.4 0-100: 9.540 1/4Mile: 12.7 Max Speed: 198.2
They could both cause some embarrassment for many sport car drivers, but the M5 is much much faster in a straight line no question. With the boring stuff out of the way, we take to the twisties. I have a feeling we are in for some fun.
"Fun" doesn't begin to describe what these cars we're like to test. We had a blast putting them through their paces! Long wheel bases plus lots of horse power will usually result in enormous, controlled, drifts. Drifting however is not part of the test, so we went on with the important things. We started with the 300C. It is a barge through turns. If I compared this to an animal, it would be a cow. It has the power but doesn't really show it. Much of the weight is in the front, so understeer is unavoidable, but to this extent?! You really need to go through a turn wide to be able to maintain any kind of speed, and even then, you're going slow enough to check what time it is and change the radio station... Get impatient with this Cow however, and it'll bite you. It sort of wobbles around, and then will snap, and just like that you are going around. Mostly due to its soft - and certainly not sporty- suspension. Beyond the body roll and drift session like time attack runs we were making, came some lap time. Our average time of the first 5 Laps turned out to be about a high 1:25. Fastest time- 1:24.323..
Lots of weight and not enough power to move it along with the body roll and understeer as earlier mentioned, contributed to this, somewhat slow lap. All of it is curable through tuning, but first lets thrash around in the M5.
The M5. Looks like the classic city cruiser, and most people won't look at it thinking "fast as hell", and they'd be wrong. Very wrong.. This car is just amazingly quick. The nose dives into turns, it's sharp, it's nimble, and it flies down the straights. If I were to compare this M5 to an animal, it wouldn't be a cow.. It would be a Killer Whale. It is about as precise as something this big could possibly be. As loud as any Ferrari, and as fast as many Sport/GT cars. This Bimmer is not to be messed with. It goes into turns with the grip of a two door sports car, and maintains the speed all the way through. Out of the turn you can get it loose, but in some cases you have to actually put work into it, just to kick the rear out. In fact, during the photo shoot, I wanted a shot of the M5 and 300 Drifting out of the follow-through... the driver couldn't, and this is a driver that is part of "MajorLeagueDrifting"! All in all, the car is planted. I honestly thought that the C63 was a better car.. I won't say the M5 simply better, but if you want to be fast, the M5 is.. simply better.
Top Gear Test Track is a place you would like to find yourself while piloting the M5. It works well with this car. Average warm up lap time- 1:16.657 Fastest Lap- 1:15.856. That's a fast lap. Just to put it into perspective, its almost 4 seconds faster then the NSX is around this track! Considering there is not much more to say about the M5, it's time to make an attempt at upgrading the 300C. M5 - look out.
We found that the 300 took the biggest hit through the turns, we also evened out the tire situation, we gave it Sport Hards to match the rubber on the M5. Rather then the Comfort Softs it had prior to upgrades. More additions to the car included: all 3 stages of Weight Reduction along with a racing suspension kit to help it through corners. Stage 1 Engine Upgrade, ECU Tune, racing air filter, sport exhaust manifold, and a sport catalytic converter, to get this pile driver up to speed. As well as a customizable gearbox, twin plate clutch, semi racing flywheel, adjustable differential, and carbon driveshaft to bring the cars drivetrain up to date. Can you tell I let a Nurburgring Tester decide which upgrades to get this week? So, this was the outcome.
Never, has an american 4-door sedan, ever had this kind of excitement to it. 460HP, 489ft-lbs of torque. Once it hooks up with the pavement, this thing is a rocket! No that's too cliche, this thing is more of a cruise missile. We are now only weighing in at 1427KG which may seem like a fair bit still, but in comparison to the car 10 minutes ago, we're behind the wheel of a Lotus Elise with room for 5. That can't be a bad thing. Unable to wait any longer, we once again went to the straight-away, to see what we could accomplish in the beast. We weren't disappointed.
0-60: 4.243 0-100: 8.445 1/4Mile: 12.3 Max Speed: 190.8MPH
We can now safely say our "cow" is faster then a killer whale. Which brings me to this, it isn't a cow anymore. It's a Bear. It still isn't that menuverable, but boy does it have the power. The M5 is a good 5+ Car lengths behind through a 1-Mile stretch. Not bad for the old Chrysler. Time for the scariest part of all SvT tests, taking the newly tuned car to the track.
Just as I had suspected - it's a handful - but hey, she keeps up the pace very well. A steady foot and a good race line is all it takes for this car to be pretty fast. Wait, I forgot to mention, skill and patience are more then key while commandeering this whip. On the gas too early = hold on for your life. Hot into a turn = understeer galore. This is still far from being the perfect track car.. or even a good track car to be honest with you. The car still loses far to much time through the turns despite weighing 461KG less then the M5, and is just simply not grippy enough. Lets show the tires some stress and see if we can beat the M5's time. Average first 5 laps- 1:16.976. We were a little worried at this point, but there was certainly room for improvement. We scraped our way closer to M5 territory, until we reached our peak. 1:15.889 -that in essence, is a tie. I figured at that point I could beat it, think again. I just couldn't catch that German Four Door Rocket, no matter what line we tried. I couldn't get that extra .030 seconds. Heartbreaking, I know.. I do think that Mike's choice of upgrades were perfectly selected, if this car were harder to go through bends, or more powerful, it wouldn't have came close..
We handed the 3 cars over to Mac K and Mike_GT3 to sprint around the Nurburgring. Numbers gave us quite a suprise. Stock M5: 7:23.287, that is a properly fast lap. Up there with many Super Cars! Max speed reached in the BMW: 294 km/h. It was now the stock 300C's turn it crawled around the circuit in a painfully slow: 8:10.481 max speed reached of 255 km/h. The defining moment of this test was now at our door step, could the tuned 300C break a 7:23?
Unfortunately it came no where close. 7:26.884. Still nothing to laugh at, but certainly not a 7:22..
With all the testing, driving, and comparing done, we can conclude another episode of Stock -vs- Tuned. We have came to realize that it is not just the numbers on paper that make a car fast around the track, confidence and predictability, is what truely makes a fast car. This is somthing that the Big Chrysler cannot offer, and that is what drives the nail in it's coffin & if you're not careful while driving this car fast it will be your coffin as well!
We hope you enjoyed this episode, it was a fun one to make. Driving these high-powered Limousine's was as fun as it gets, and having a race that goes right down to the wire is always a blast..
Please comment/give opinions or give future suggestions as that's always loved. We will see you next time!!
Can the photographer that offered to join us please send another PM to me, I accidentally deleted my inbox before adding you 👎
SvT Team
MOTORTRENDmitch - Writer, test driver, photographer
Turbolefty78 - Editor
SebaEspinosa93 - Test Driver, Photo Shoot
Mike_GT3 - NurburgKing
Mac K - NurburgStig
Jesse208 - Test Driver
MOTORTRENDmitch - Writer, test driver, photographer
Turbolefty78 - Editor
SebaEspinosa93 - Test Driver, Photo Shoot
Mike_GT3 - NurburgKing
Mac K - NurburgStig
Jesse208 - Test Driver
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- 3,531
- London, Ontario
- Starky513
- 1,020
- risewithefallen2
My only complaint is terrible overuse and misuse of commas! It was slightly awkward to read, but aside from that all of the content was great.
- 434
Another great episode. Although, I'll have to admit that the car selection put me off, since they're not cars I would consider using - or commonly used cars.
That's actually a really cool idea. But it would take a lot more effort & time from them; and not to mention money to buy the equipment necessary to record.
You guys should make your own youtube channel. I would watch that alllllll the time. Plus actually seeing the tests go down as someone narrates it would be👍👍👍
That's actually a really cool idea. But it would take a lot more effort & time from them; and not to mention money to buy the equipment necessary to record.
- 2,652
- Las Vegas NV USA
- entertowin(1st) and niNjasPY55(2nd and m
DJonesYou guys should make your own youtube channel. I would watch that alllllll the time. Plus actually seeing the tests go down as someone narrates it would be
I agree with DJ, you guys should do one. I'll subscribe to the channel like it was the end of the world(or was that too much
.)Great review, so it seems that the 300C is a monster as well with some mods and tuning. When I get my new PS3, I'll take a look at one of my 300s then. Just imagine the 300 SRT-8 and how it can stand with the M5, CTS-V, E63 AMG and S65 AMG
👍. GO HEMI!!! 
How about these challenges:
C63 AMG vs. M5
C4 ZR-1 Corvette vs. C6 ZR1
FC RX7 vs. FD RX7 Spirit R
Skyline GTR R34 V-Spec vs. GTR SpecV
Supra MKIII vs. Supra MKIV
Viper GTS vs. Viper ACR
Cerbera Speed 12 vs. McLaren F1
- 2,200
- montreal,canada
- GTP_Mike_Peperni / Mike_Peperni
Thank you sir:tup: I'll let you know next weeks match-up tomorrow so you have time to test longer (if you wish) .. I think I know what it's going to be
Awesome 👍
- 5,814
- Hillsboro Oregon
- XDesperado67
- XDesperado67
Nice review guys.👍👍
Curious though as to which M5 you used. There's two in the game, the premium '08 and the standard '05. I personally prefer the '05s handling but both have arguably the best stock suspension of any street car in the game.
As for the 300 did mike try using any ballast to improve its weight distribution? The extra weight might make its acceleration a hair slower but a better weight distribution should improve its handling.💡
Anyways great stuff, keep up the good work and looking forward to your next review.
Curious though as to which M5 you used. There's two in the game, the premium '08 and the standard '05. I personally prefer the '05s handling but both have arguably the best stock suspension of any street car in the game.
As for the 300 did mike try using any ballast to improve its weight distribution? The extra weight might make its acceleration a hair slower but a better weight distribution should improve its handling.💡
Anyways great stuff, keep up the good work and looking forward to your next review.
- 636
- Alexandria, MN
- TurboLefty78
Aye, Mitch can get a bit overzealous with their use. The final product is after my editing out many commas already. I had a feeling there were too many at the end still, but went with it anyway.
I wouldn't call the usage of them terrible, just overkill.
Thanks for pointing this out and I'll pay closer attention to that detail next time.
Thetruth28
(Banned)
- 84
- California
- Thatswackson
another solid test and still very entertaining as usually. Well done. Pics coming up soon?
- 3,531
- London, Ontario
- Starky513
Man, I just realised, I will scimm through it and make sentences flow more later on, when writing I was trying to simulate pauses when talking (If I were talking I would read it with those pauses) so yeah, sorry about that.. It is a little excessive.
You guys should make your own youtube channel. I would watch that alllllll the time. Plus actually seeing the tests go down as someone narrates it would be
I kid you not, I have thought of this before. I would actually be up for it!! I'd love to
I agree with DJ, you guys should do one. I'll subscribe to the channel like it was the end of the world(or was that too much
Great review, so it seems that the 300C is a monster as well with some mods and tuning. When I get my new PS3, I'll take a look at one of my 300s then. Just imagine the 300 SRT-8 and how it can stand with the M5, CTS-V, E63 AMG and S65 AMG
Yeahh, I wish the New SRT8 was in it, along with all the other Super Sedans haha.. it'd be a much closer fight if that was the case.
Nice review guys.👍👍
Curious though as to which M5 you used. There's two in the game, the premium '08 and the standard '05. I personally prefer the '05s handling but both have arguably the best stock suspension of any street car in the game.
As for the 300 did mike try using any ballast to improve its weight distribution? The extra weight might make its acceleration a hair slower but a better weight distribution should improve its handling.💡
Anyways great stuff, keep up the good work and looking forward to your next review.
We used the Premium M5, gave us more budget for tuning which we knew we needed! Plus, I have noticed that the Standard M5 handles flatter..
Oh yeah.. I am kind of mad at my self now that I look at it. Next episode I am going to be super timid when using a comma. I'm going to go through it and get rid of unnessecary commas.
There is pictures.
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Thetruth28
(Banned)
- 84
- California
- Thatswackson
Hey Mitch, I don't see any pics, but maybe that's just me. I usually do though so unless something changed????? Ehh, i'll just chalk it up to my computer being that i'm at work.
- 3,531
- London, Ontario
- Starky513
Update: I went though it quickly and made it cleaner. I changed a few sentences to. I think it flows better now, you should read over it again, and let me know.. I'll go over it more carefully when I get home. 👍
Yeah, that's odd.. because there is a pic after every paragraph
Maybe check back when you're home? .. strange!
Yeah, that's odd.. because there is a pic after every paragraph
Maybe check back when you're home? .. strange!
Thetruth28
(Banned)
- 84
- California
- Thatswackson
Will do. Anyway, still a great write up bro.
Just saw the pictures now. Computer must have been acting up. Nice.
Hey, I know this would be purely aesthetic but maybe next time you can swap out some wheels on the cars to enhance them visually as well. I know the 300 would definitely look better with some new shoes.
Just saw the pictures now. Computer must have been acting up. Nice.
Hey, I know this would be purely aesthetic but maybe next time you can swap out some wheels on the cars to enhance them visually as well. I know the 300 would definitely look better with some new shoes.
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- 3,531
- London, Ontario
- Starky513
- 3,531
- London, Ontario
- Starky513
- 2,200
- montreal,canada
- GTP_Mike_Peperni / Mike_Peperni
Nice review guys.👍👍
Curious though as to which M5 you used. There's two in the game, the premium '08 and the standard '05. I personally prefer the '05s handling but both have arguably the best stock suspension of any street car in the game.
As for the 300 did mike try using any ballast to improve its weight distribution? The extra weight might make its acceleration a hair slower but a better weight distribution should improve its handling.💡
Anyways great stuff, keep up the good work and looking forward to your next review.
I did not used ballast, the diff and suspension were tuned to what worked best for me, there was still an amount of oversteer on throttle but it was more manageable than stock. Should have tested the ballast though! forgot about it
, will do next time if needed. Thx! Yes it was stock with oil changed and fully broken-in. There was still a little more in it but would require more time.
Cant wait to see the next cars.
As for the videos, i can send my replay file to you mitch if you want to put them back to back or in the same screen in same time...
- 3,531
- London, Ontario
- Starky513
The Idea of a gauged of having a YouTube series has be thinking, if we can get some video editors and what not, I will narrate SvT along with a write up 👍
I will contact SebaEspinosa93 to get his guys on it, he is part of youtube GT5 Squad "MajorLeagueDriftHD" and I will also contact C-Reddy, a friend of mine that makes many YouTube street racing vids.. If anyone else has video editing skills or know how, PM me and we will set this up. 👍👍
No need to feel slow, the guy's the best in the business.
I will contact SebaEspinosa93 to get his guys on it, he is part of youtube GT5 Squad "MajorLeagueDriftHD" and I will also contact C-Reddy, a friend of mine that makes many YouTube street racing vids.. If anyone else has video editing skills or know how, PM me and we will set this up. 👍👍
I'm still bewildered you got that pig around there that fast! Now I feel slow
No need to feel slow, the guy's the best in the business.
