The definitive GT5 transmission tuning guide.

oppositelock
Here's an Integra Type R putting down around 1800 lb-ft in first gear.

itrfds.jpg
Click to expand...

So you are saying, through some myth of creation, more power was created after leaving the engine????

Please, give the rest of the world this invention of yours so that we may all prosper. Every scientist in the world would love to hear about this magic creation that creates more power just via the use of gears!!!

In reality, gears are just a way for an engine to put power to the wheels. They reduce the RPM of the engine via load and transmit the TQ "created" to the wheels. In reality, there is no TQ being created.

If you could feasibly use the crank to power the wheels of a car, we would. The wheels would spin at 7000 rpms...yeah uh.. That would put insane amounts of load on the engine and your engine wouldn't spin...

So what we do instead is create all sorts of gears to take the load off the engine and to transmit the power to the wheels in a usable fashion.

No new power is created. The numbers you are seeing on the graph is basically the efficient operating range of the engine in any given gear. The TQ number I quote in my calculations and the TQ number on your graph is not showing new power being made.
 
Not "new" power. Perhaps it's better to simply think that first gear is using the most and last gear is using the least, Moving on.

So, how do I use the dyno sheet in GT5's tuning menu effectively?

I really want to get the point where tq begins to fall and the point it starts to plummet, ohh and the initial tq reading.

The damn graph in GT is garbage, we should have a way to blow it up in size & detail.
 
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grenadeshark
So you are saying, through some myth of creation, more power was created after leaving the engine????

Please, give the rest of the world this invention of yours so that we may all prosper. Every scientist in the world would love to hear about this magic creation that creates more power just via the use of gears!!!
Click to expand...

I love sarcasm, but you suck at it.
In reality, gears are just a way for an engine to put power to the wheels. They reduce the RPM of the engine via load and transmit the TQ "created" to the wheels. In reality, there is no TQ being created.

If you could feasibly use the crank to power the wheels of a car, we would. The wheels would spin at 7000 rpms...yeah uh.. That would put insane amounts of load on the engine and your engine wouldn't spin...

So what we do instead is create all sorts of gears to take the load off the engine and to transmit the power to the wheels in a usable fashion.

No new power is created. The numbers you are seeing on the graph is basically the efficient operating range of the engine in any given gear. The TQ number I quote in my calculations and the TQ number on your graph is not showing new power being made.
Click to expand...

Torque is being multiplied, not created out of thin air. You're trading distance (forward vehicle movement per engine revolution) in exchange. The graph represents the actual amount of force being applied to the tires, and thus, the car, which is what we actually care about. If you were to attach a G meter to the car above and do an acceleration run you would see the G plot would match the above chart almost exactly. I really don't give a **** whether that meets some semantic textbook definition of "power" or not. Go argue that on wikipedia.
 
oppositelock
I love sarcasm, but you suck at it.

Torque is being multiplied, not created out of thin air. You're trading distance (forward vehicle movement per engine revolution) in exchange. The graph represents the actual amount of force being applied to the tires, and thus, the car, which is what we actually care about. If you were to attach a G meter to the car above and do an acceleration run you would see the G plot would match the above chart almost exactly. I really don't give a **** whether that meets some semantic textbook definition of "power" or not. Go argue that on wikipedia.
Click to expand...

I agree. So many people here are arguing about dynos and they have no idea what is actually going on. Gears reduce load on an engine. That's basically it. Same amount of work is being done. Gears just optimize the work for the engines power band.
 
grenadeshark
Well its not a correct TQ graph. But hp = tq * rpm / 5252 will get you an idea.
Click to expand...

I know...

I can get the hp from the peak tq and given rpm, then I get the tq from the peak hp and given rpm. With this I get the general angle the tq drops in that range, but I don't get the angle of the slope after peak hp to where it falls off completely. Or the slope up to peak tq from idle.
 
A short question about the Suzuki Cappuccino RM. I use it for the seasonal without a turbo, now would you agree that for this car it is best to drive all in the 5th gear because there is the best acceleration? I use the RKM tuning settings. Peak power is 65kW @ 7100 RPM and peak torque is 130Nm @ 4100 RPM and torque drops fast after 4100RPM. And if I add a turbo I would go for the low RPM turbo.

  • No turbo: 65kW @ 7100 RPM and 130Nm @ 4100 RPM
  • Low RPM turbo: 82kW @ 5300 RPM and 176Nm @ 4100 RPM
  • Mid RPM turbo: 82kW @ 6000 RPM and 153Nm @ 4100 RPM
  • High RPM turbo: 86kW @ 7100 RPM and 140Nm @ 4100 RPM
 
Basilea
A short question about the Suzuki Cappuccino RM. I use it for the seasonal without a turbo, now would you agree that for this car it is best to drive all in the 5th gear because there is the best acceleration? I use the RKM tuning settings. Peak power is 65kW @ 7100 RPM and peak torque is 130Nm @ 4100 RPM and torque drops fast after 4100RPM. And if I add a turbo I would go for the low RPM turbo.

  • No turbo: 65kW @ 7100 RPM and 130Nm @ 4100 RPM
  • Low RPM turbo: 82kW @ 5300 RPM and 176Nm @ 4100 RPM
  • Mid RPM turbo: 82kW @ 6000 RPM and 153Nm @ 4100 RPM
  • High RPM turbo: 86kW @ 7100 RPM and 140Nm @ 4100 RPM
Click to expand...

No one basically follows any of the advice listed in my thread and now are just posting random questions that are basically answered already.

The answer to your question has literally been covered at least in 5 different posts or more in this thread including the original post.

Anyone that would like to comment on the original thread and what they believe needs changing/fixing/updating, I would appreciate it. To everyone else, I will be no longer answering questions that have been covered multiple times in hopes of creating an understanding.
 
grenadeshark
No one basically follows any of the advice listed in my thread and now are just posting random questions that are basically answered already.

The answer to your question has literally been covered at least in 5 different posts or more in this thread including the original post.

Anyone that would like to comment on the original thread and what they believe needs changing/fixing/updating, I would appreciate it. To everyone else, I will be no longer answering questions that have been covered multiple times in hopes of creating an understanding.
Click to expand...

Could I see a set up that uses your method please?
 
No_OBsT33R
Could I see a set up that uses your method please?
Click to expand...

I'll build a new car this weekend using my setup. I have actually been fine tuning my style of transmission tuning to be more user friendly. It's been overwhelmingly obvious in this thread that basically no one either understands why i am doing something one way or another, or thinks there is a better way.

This is all completely understandable. I found another way to update my calculator that will make the ease of understanding even better then it was before. I don't like to give out any of my cars that I have tuned already as they are a lot of input and I don't want just everyone having stupidly fast cars with no effort put in.

I am trying to help you make your own :). But, I will be happy to show one of my cars in a race. I am busy through the weekend, but I will be back some time next week.
 
grenadeshark
I'll build a new car this weekend using my setup. I have actually been fine tuning my style of transmission tuning to be more user friendly. It's been overwhelmingly obvious in this thread that basically no one either understands why i am doing something one way or another, or thinks there is a better way.

This is all completely understandable. I found another way to update my calculator that will make the ease of understanding even better then it was before. I don't like to give out any of my cars that I have tuned already as they are a lot of input and I don't want just everyone having stupidly fast cars with no effort put in.

I am trying to help you make your own :). But, I will be happy to show one of my cars in a race. I am busy through the weekend, but I will be back some time next week.
Click to expand...

I want to see the method put to use to see if the method is worth all the work.

I would expect you to already have a car tuned with this method, or is it only theoretical? Saying you have one but you won't show it leaves a lot of doubt in my mind.
 
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No_OBsT33R
I want to see the method put to use to see if the method is worth all the work.

I would expect you to already have a car tuned with this method, or is it only theoretical?
Click to expand...

I have lots of cars. Particularly a couple 450pp cars I am pretty proud of. Granted, they still need some work as well. Most of them are tuned for course racing, no drag stripping. Although they do well in both areas. Just not mix/maxxed right now.
 
Ok sorry if I didn't get it but maybe it's not that easy to understand if you're not a native english speaker and it's quite a lot text.

I tested this now with the Suzuki Cappuccino RM on Grand Valley Easy in the FR Challenge. Maybe you can use some of this information? It gives a nice overview, still there was some traffic on the road...

  • No turbo:
    • Shifting at redline: 1:26,467 / 1:21,402 / 1:20,147 = 4:08,016
    • All in 5th gear: 1:21,816 / 1:18,038 / 1:16,879 = 3:56,733
  • Low RPM turbo:
    • Shifting at redline: 1:24,352 / 1:20,075 / 1:18,956 = 4:03,383
    • All in 5th gear: 1:18,617 / 1:14,336 / 1:14,117 = 3:47,130
  • Mid RPM turbo:
    • Shifting at redline: 1:26,022 / 1:19,029 / 1:16,867 = 4:01,918
    • All in 5th gear: 1:18,393 / 1:14,484 / 1:14,044 = 3:46,921
  • High RPM turbo:
    • Shifting at redline: 1:20,545 / 1:14,797 / 1:15,323 = 3:50,665
    • All in 5th gear: 1:17,664 / 1:13,793 / 1:13,582 = 3:45,039
 
Basilea
Ok sorry if I didn't get it but maybe it's not that easy to understand if you're not a native english speaker and it's quite a lot text.

I tested this now with the Suzuki Cappuccino RM on Grand Valley Easy in the FR Challenge. Maybe you can use some of this information? It gives a nice overview, still there was some traffic on the road...

  • No turbo:
    • Shifting at redline: 1:26,467 / 1:21,402 / 1:20,147 = 4:08,016
    • All in 5th gear: 1:21,816 / 1:18,038 / 1:16,879 = 3:56,733
  • Low RPM turbo:
    • Shifting at redline: 1:24,352 / 1:20,075 / 1:18,956 = 4:03,383
    • All in 5th gear: 1:18,617 / 1:14,336 / 1:14,117 = 3:47,130
  • Mid RPM turbo:
    • Shifting at redline: 1:26,022 / 1:19,029 / 1:16,867 = 4:01,918
    • All in 5th gear: 1:18,393 / 1:14,484 / 1:14,044 = 3:46,921
  • High RPM turbo:
    • Shifting at redline: 1:20,545 / 1:14,797 / 1:15,323 = 3:50,665
    • All in 5th gear: 1:17,664 / 1:13,793 / 1:13,582 = 3:45,039
Click to expand...

It doesn't look like you equalized the PP between races so, basically you are showing me a graph of a car that is going up in power.
 
grenadeshark
I have lots of cars. Particularly a couple 450pp cars I am pretty proud of. Granted, they still need some work as well. Most of them are tuned for course racing, no drag stripping. Although they do well in both areas. Just not mix/maxxed right now.
Click to expand...

Saying you have them, your method works, and they were tuned by it, then refusing to show them leaves much doubt in my mind and I most certainly won't crack my skull on your method until I can see it in action.

Saying your method is great but with nothing to show how great it is, makes it an unfounded claim.

Refusing then to show it in use leaves me to believe it's only theoretical.
 
Why should the PP have been equalised? It just shows that in this case you rather not shift at all and it makes it very clear. It also shows that the difference between shifting or not is getting smaller with a higher RPM turbo.


And how would you equalise PP? Add weight? Or limit the engine? Or detune some parts and then which parts?
 
No_OBsT33R
Saying you have them, your method works, and they were tuned by it, then refusing to show them leaves much doubt in my mind and I most certainly won't crack my skull on your method until I can see it in action.

Saying your method is great but with nothing to show how great it is, makes it an unfounded claim.

Refusing then to show it in use leaves me to believe it's only theoretical.
Click to expand...

I'm not refusing to show. I am refusing to give out free settings to my best cars to every schlub that comes around. I'll be happy to show you in game.
 
grenadeshark
I'm not refusing to show. I am refusing to give out free settings to my best cars to every schlub that comes around. I'll be happy to show you in game.
Click to expand...

Okay, so clearly you won't prove your claim. This is not about proving your faster then a next on the track, this is about wether your method yields faster better gear ratios then the auto tune, or another less complicated method. It's about proving your method is even applicable to the game.

If I take car A will it be faster with your gears or will auto tune's (Top Speed Tuner) or somebody else's gears be better.

I don't need to meet you at the track, that tells me nothing. I need to drive a car with your gear set up and feel it outperform any other.

If you think your method provides set ups that are so wonderful put them up or really, more unfounded claims about your method. Your just blowing your own horn for no reason.

This is about tuning gears, not driver skill.
 
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No_OBsT33R
Okay, so clearly you won't prove your claim. This is not about proving your faster then a next on the track, this is about wether your method yields faster better gear ratios then the auto tune. It's about proving your method is even applicable to the game.

If I take car A will it be faster with your gears or will auto tune's (Top Speed Tuner) gears be better.

I don't need to meet you at the track, that tells me nothing. I need to drive a car with your gear set up and feel it outperform any other.

If you think your method provides set ups that are so wonderful put them up or really, more unfounded claims about your method. Your just blowing your own horn for no reason.

This is about tuning gears, not driver skill.
Click to expand...

Well, Ill make a new car that I don't use on a every day basis and then we will have this "test" of yours. I don't see how any of this is to "toot" my own horn.

All that comes from this is a bunch of trolls and people spouting off crap that makes no sense. Some people actually try to give out information to help the community. I feel I have some knowledge that many other people don't have or don't know how to use. That was the whole purpose of the thread. Nothing else. To teach the tuning methods I use every day that make my cars faster in a straight line then other people with very similar cars.


How about this. You name a car, you tell me the parts. (make it a new car so we don't have to worry about engine wear). I'll then tune the cars transmission and share it. Then you can tell me what you think. Also give me every setting outside of the transmission. Including suspension/lsd whatever else. We can take out all the other variables. Also, please SS tires or CS.
 
grenadeshark
Well, Ill make a new car that I don't use on a every day basis and then we will have this "test" of yours. I don't see how any of this is to "toot" my own horn.

All that comes from this is a bunch of trolls and people spouting off crap that makes no sense. Some people actually try to give out information to help the community. I feel I have some knowledge that many other people don't have or don't know how to use. That was the whole purpose of the thread. Nothing else. To teach the tuning methods I use every day that make my cars faster in a straight line then other people with very similar cars.

How about this. You name a car, you tell me the parts. (make it a new car so we don't have to worry about engine wear). I'll then tune the cars transmission and share it. Then you can tell me what you think. Also give me every setting outside of the transmission. Including suspension/lsd whatever else. We can take out all the other variables. Also, please SS tires or CS.
Click to expand...

Your the tuner, pick a car.

If I had to choose, I'd do it random, how bout the Volvo C30, let's do 2 versions, 1 stock(with a tunable tranny), one fully tuned.

You tune it up or leave the all the settings stock, all I care about are the gears.

Use R3 tires only so that gears are the only variable.
 
No_OBsT33R
Your the tuner, pick a car.

If I had to choose, I'd do it random, how bout the Volvo C30, let's do 2 versions, 1 stock(with a tunable tranny), one fully tuned.

You tune it up or leave the all the settings stock, all I care about are the gears.

Use R3 tires only so that gears are the only variable.
Click to expand...

R3 tires takes my first gear tuning and makes it useless. Half of my tuning comes from the engine tuning as well. That's why I need you to give me the parts. The reason my cars do well is the combination of picking the right power curve (choosing the right parts) in combination with the right transmission settings.
 
grenadeshark
R3 tires takes my first gear tuning and makes it useless. Half of my tuning comes from the engine tuning as well. That's why I need you to give me the parts. The reason my cars do well is the combination of picking the right power curve (choosing the right parts) in combination with the right transmission settings.
Click to expand...

Okay, whatever tires you want, its all good.

Stock 1 version only with a tunable tranny. The second modified with every part, or however you like or fell it would be best. Your the tuner, I'm tha No_OBsT33R.
 
No_OBsT33R
Okay, whatever tires you want, its all good.

Stock 1 version only with a tunable tranny. The second modified with every part, or however you like or fell it would be best. Your the tuner, I'm tha No_OBsT33R.
Click to expand...

I won't be back online till Monday or possibly thursday of next week. lots of work coming up, so send me a PM with full car details and Ill get on it.
 
grenadeshark
I won't be back online till Monday or possibly thursday of next week. lots of work coming up, so send me a PM with full car details and Ill get on it.
Click to expand...

Um you have the game don't you. Get a Stock C30 with a tunable tranny, tune the gears, post en up.

The tune the C30 with whatever parts you want, tune the tranny and post the gears and parts used.

If I had to choose what parts I'd say all of them, simple as that. So go whatever way you want, your the Tuner.
 
No_OBsT33R
Um you have the game don't you. Get a Stock C30 with a tunable tranny, tune the gears, post en up.

The tune the C30 with whatever parts you want, tune the tranny and post the gears and parts used.

If I had to choose what parts I'd say all of them, simple as that. So go whatever way you want, your the Tuner.
Click to expand...

No... I work on the road :(
 

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