The Formula 1 calendar development threadFormula 1

[LewyOs]

On the sky f1 special report, Bernie talks about alternating Barcelona and Valencia, and alternating Spa and a French GP.

http://www1.skysports.com/formula1/video/12870/7574934

7:30 into the video.

 

[m8h3r]

Good god, I cant even begin to imagine what they would name the corners on a Russian track

 

[Liquid]

Good god, I cant even begin to imagine what they would name the corners on a Russian track

Yeltsin Hill, Brezhnevs, Curva Krushchev, Stalin Straight, the Old Kremlin and Lenin Hairpin?

And the Putin Pits, of course.

 

[ExigeEvan]

Yeltsin Hill, Brezhnevs, Curva Krushchev, Stalin Straight, the Old Kremlin and Lenin Hairpin?

And the Putin Pits, of course.

No room for Kalashnikov and Sputnik? Sad.

 

[Furinkazen]

Don't forget The Gagarin Esses...

 

[Dennisch]

If only F1 would come back to the Netherlands. There would easily be 150000 spectators.

 

[peter_vod69]

If only F1 would come back to the Netherlands. There would easily be 150000 spectators.

That's only because it's so flat that everyone could see the track.

 

[nitrorocks]

Go back to Zandvoort..

 

[Sach]

That's only because it's so flat that everyone could see the track.

 

[Pupik]

Go back to Zandvoort..

Sorry, much of the land was developed; thus, it's half the track it used to be. Definitely not long enough for F1.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Bernie says that Barcelona and Valencia will alternate from 2013, but a deal still has to be made.

 

[F1 fan]

Good news. I can see a lot more of this happening to help accommodate the new tracks.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Well, no deal has been made yet, and Bernie has said that he would be happy to see Valencia continue every year when a new contract is negotiated in 2014.

 

[Pezzarinho17]

"We really want to be in Valencia. Everyone is happy there; both the teams and the sponsors, and it would be a shame to miss an event like that." - Bernie

And the fans? Barcelona was actually a very good race last year and hoping more of the same this year. Would be a shame for that level of race to alternate with Valenzzzzzzzzzzz....

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Barcelona 2011 was unusual in the circuit's history in that it produced a decent race. The circuit itself is very popular with the teams for testing because the climate is stable year-round, and also because the layout is very mid-range when it comes to set-up, making it good for neutral cars.

As for the fans, they are not a physical stakeholder in the sport. Unlike the teams and the sponsors, they don't get much of a say as to where the sport goes.

 

[GTPorsche]

If fans didn't buy tickets for a specific race, then they would have a say in it.

 

[Pezzarinho17]

Barcelona 2011 was unusual in the circuit's history in that it produced a decent race. The circuit itself is very popular with the teams for testing because the climate is stable year-round, and also because the layout is very mid-range when it comes to set-up, making it good for neutral cars.

This is true, but if 2012 also produces a good race with the current rules package then you could argue that this circuit layout is angled towards them. The start straight has always been the best spot for overtaking and its a matter of staying close as possible for the remainder of the lap.

As for the fans, they are not a physical stakeholder in the sport. Unlike the teams and the sponsors, they don't get much of a say as to where the sport goes.

Not directly. For example, you make a championship consisting of 15 races around this Valencia circuit and the fans would quickly start to dwindle (if you choose to neglect that 15 repeated races around even the best circuit would see fans dwindle). Less fans, less viewing figures. Less viewing figures, less revenue margin. Less revenue margin, less sponsors. Less sponsors, less stakeholders.

Whilst I can see the attraction of this circuit financially (Formula 1 of course being a business as well), the viewing element suffers which you'd hope also has some impact in a sport.

If fans didn't buy tickets for a specific race, then they would have a say in it.

EDIT - And this.

 

[Hun200kmh]

As much as I'd love to see F1 in Portugal (Estoril or Portimão I don't care), I would absolutely be against it considering the millions Bernie asks for it. Let him milk richer countries and unaccountable government systems.

I'm very happy that I get, with reasonable costs, these races in 2012:

http://www.motogp.com/en/news/2012/Portugal+round+confirmed+for+2012

http://www.europeanlemansseries.com/

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Not directly. For example, you make a championship consisting of 15 races around this Valencia circuit and the fans would quickly start to dwindle (if you choose to neglect that 15 repeated races around even the best circuit would see fans dwindle). Less fans, less viewing figures. Less viewing figures, less revenue margin. Less revenue margin, less sponsors. Less sponsors, less stakeholders.

Exactly - fans only influence the sport indirectly. So indirectly, in fact, that it is difficult for them to establish any kind of influence. Races have taken place with grandstands so empty that they have ad to be covered up before. The only way the fans could create any kind of impact would be with a KONY 2012-style viral video.

 

[Tesla]

Races have taken place with grandstands so empty that they have ad to be covered up before.

Which, funnily enough, is probably the case with Valencia.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner, president of Argentina, has (supposedly) just announced that Formula 1 will return to Argentina in November/December 2013, with a street circuit planned for Mar del Plata (which was Bernie's preferred location when he said he wanted a race in Argentina a few years ago). According to Fernandez, the three-year contract has not been signed yet, but it is "almost complete".

 

[cgr-10]

Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner, president of Argentina, has (supposedly) just announced that Formula 1 will return to Argentina in November/December 2013, with a street circuit planned for Mar del Plata (which was Bernie's preferred location when he said he wanted a race in Argentina a few years ago). According to Fernandez, the three-year contract has not been signed yet, but it is "almost complete".

Another Grand Prix, wow.

What do you think is the practical limit to how many races Bernie could pack into a season? If we're getting into the twenties it will make things pretty hard on the teams in terms of fatigue and logistics I imagine.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Twenty is the current limit, as dictated by the current Concorde. However, I think that number could be as high as twenty-five with the agreement of the teams and some creative allocations. By running events that are close together physically (ie Montreal-New Jersey, Brazil-Argentina, Bahrain-Abu Dhabi, and so on), the calendar could easily fit a few extra races. We're also losing the European Grand Prix, and the Koreans are said to be very unhappy with their race, so they could go to. If Bahrain is cancelled again, then they could be removed entirely as well.

For now, the 2013 calendar has seventeen confirmed races. Spa, Suzuka and Singapore are all up for re-negotiation this year, and dropping Europe makes way for New Jersey. Paul Ricard and Spa are planning to alternate, so if Argentina comes in, one event needs to go. I'm guessing Korea could fall by the wayside to be replaced by Argentina, which means one more event needs to be given up to fit Russia in - unless the teams agree to more races under the new Concorde. Which they might do in exchange for a stake in the sport.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I just found something interesting online: a proposal for a street circuit around the London Olympic Precinct.

It’s an interesting concept, because what do you do with your Olympic venues after the Games are over and you’ve spent tens of millions of dollars on building the facilities to begin with? The Homebush Bay site in Sydney sat mostly unused for years before they idea to use it for the Sydney 500 took hold. And the Russians are working their circuit into the plans for the Sochi Olympic Village. So, what does London have in store for the Olympic Precinct once the 2012 Games are over and done with?

Of course, it’s not that serious a proposal. Silverstone has the rights to the British Grand Prix for the next fifteen years, the City of London has said that a Grand Prix is too expensive, the International Olympic Committee shot down Bernie’s idea of an Olympic Grand Prix to co-incide with the 2012 Games, and the firm that designed this circuit has said they did it mostly for fun – but it was enough to earn them a partnership with Tilke GmbH.

 

[hawkeye122]

European Grand Prix?

I thought I heard years back that they couldn't do it in London..

 

[F1 fan]

European Grand Prix?

I thought I heard years back that they couldn't do it in London..

It's not so much that they can't do it. It's more to do with the fact that the British government doesn't give a damn about motorsport despite the number of people in the UK who make a living from it. Evidence of this is the fact that they did nothing about the possibility of the British Grand Prix disappearing from the calendar.

If, a Grand Prix were to happen in London, not a single penny would be coming from the Government.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

European Grand Prix?

I thought I heard years back that they couldn't do it in London..

It's not going to happen. Like I said, it's not a serious proposal.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Pardon the double-post, but I've just found this: the proposed circuit for Mar del Plata.

Apparently it was drawn up in 2009 when Bernie first suggested a race there, and the Argentine media are waving it around as a circuit that is ready to go.

I'll say this - it's certainly a radical departure from anything on the calendar. It reminds me a lot of the Göteborg circuit in Sweden. I'm guessing it will be pretty low-downforce, maybe even moreso than Monza.

 

[PeterJB]

That's a very interesting design. The proximity to the water makes me a little uncomfortable though.

 

[GTPorsche]

Not a bad layout. Looks like a good mix of high speed and low speed.Also looks like it has a tunnel or a massive overhang down the one straight.