The GT Sport Epic Whining and Crying Thread

[SlipZtrEm]

AC doesn't deserve an average score of 5

Says who? Outside of the veritable tongue-baths from Italian and Spanish outlets (oh hey, more objectivity), the media outlets don't settle much higher than that.

Great physics and FFB wrapped in a mediocre game will do that. If one well-done aspect of a game is enough to overlook every other poorly-realized aspect, then I suppose GT6 deserves a 10/10 for having more cars available to drive than any other game.

Anyhow it's a weak argument

A weak argument is suggesting you need to add false scores to a game you haven't played to balance out ones you deem unjust. It's no better than exactly what you're complaining about.

I bet you know very well what i mean with the GT being in a steady decline since 6 years now (when GT5 was released). It means that in 2010 the GT series found itself in a stalemate, it didn't feel like a top notch quality racing game as the 4 games before that felt, and in many areas it became worse (chase the rabbit was introduced, standard cars that were ported straight from PS2 made up more than half the roster). there was also next to no innovation to the career mode, sounds, AI... the list goes on.

Ah, so you mean certain aspects of the game have gotten worse in your opinion, or they haven't improved at a rate you deem acceptable. That's quite a bit different than "GT being in a steady decline since 6 years now".

I've already listed ways one could argue the GT brand is on the up, or at least maintaining its reputation. Just by those existing, we can't conclusively determine the entire franchise is on a decline.

For the third time now: it's a vague non-statement.

No game deserves a ten! There's no such thing as perfect game Give me any game, and I will find something to complain soon or later

I disagree. The original Metal Gear Solid was a seminal title on the original PS1, and I believe it deserved a perfect score. FFVII, Chrono Trigger, Zelda: OOT, Castlevania: SOTN, Super Mario World... the list goes on. Being a physics pedant doesn't change that.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

I disagree. The original Metal Gear Solid was a seminal title on the original PS1, and I believe it deserved a perfect score. FFVII, Chrono Trigger, Zelda: OOT, Castlevania: SOTN, Super Mario World... the list goes on. Being a physics pedant doesn't change that.

Feel free to disagree, everyone has different view/expectation about games. For me, 10 out of 10 means perfection, without flaws, which is impossible to attain even when it comes to satisfaction or experience. I have played many games from 80's to now, none of them can be given 10 / 10 score, some of them may stand the test of times ( I still play old games from time to time ), like old Sega F355 Challenge or MGS I, but not because they are perfect or had 10/10 score.

 

[mister dog]

Says who?

Me.

Great physics and FFB wrapped in a mediocre game will do that. If one well-done aspect of a game is enough to overlook every other poorly-realized aspect, then I suppose GT6 deserves a 10/10 for having more cars available to drive than any other game.

One could argue that great physics and FFB are the essence of a driving simulator. If it was a 'game' you were looking for with upgrades and unlocks you should have informed yourself better before buying AC.

A weak argument is suggesting you need to add false scores to a game you haven't played to balance out ones you deem unjust. It's no better than exactly what you're complaining about.

Might be. But a moderator having to resort to posting off topic background checks on a user, in order to try and discredit said users opinion is equally as weak.

Ah, so you mean certain aspects of the game have gotten worse in your opinion, or they haven't improved at a rate you deem acceptable. That's quite a bit different than "GT being in a steady decline since 6 years now".

If you'd make a GTP poll asking "has the GT series been in a steady decline these past 6 years", you'll probably find that it won't be only 'my opinion'.

I've already listed ways one could argue the GT brand is on the up, or at least maintaining its reputation.

Please elaborate because i'd love to hear how the GT brand is on the up 👍

 

[Mr Grumpy]

Feel free to disagree, everyone has different view/expectation about games. For me, 10 out of 10 means perfection, without flaws, which is impossible to attain even when it comes to satisfaction or experience. I have played many games from 80's to now, none of them can be given 10 / 10 score, some of them may stand the test of times ( I still play old games from time to time ), like old Sega F355 Challenge or MGS I, but not because they are perfect or had 10/10 score.

I'll give my two cents on what I believe were 10/10 games (my opinion of course)
Doom, Cannon Fodder, Syndicate. The sheer playability of all 3 regardless of any faults. But hey this is a GTSport discussion so I'll now show myself the door

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

I'll give my two cents on what I believe were 10/10 games (my opinion of course)
Doom, Cannon Fodder, Syndicate. The sheer playability of all 3 regardless of any faults. But hey this is a GTSport discussion so I'll now show myself the door

Ah, the original DOOM, I used to have the original diskette release, multiple pack of them ( bought them a few times everytime I saw them on the store ), now they are gone, along with handful collection of DOS games ( Wolfenstein, Raptor, and the Rebel Assault series ) I used to hoard It was enjoyable back in the day, still is today, about 9/10 for me 👍

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Me.

Well it's a good thing you're not an authority on what a game's aggregate review score should be, since you've proven to have no objectivity in the matter.

One could argue that great physics and FFB are the essence of a driving simulator. If it was a 'game' you were looking for with upgrades and unlocks you should have informed yourself better before buying AC.

One certainly could, sure. Just as one could argue GT6 nails the point of a driving game by having more cars to drive than any other game.

Can you point me to where I suggested I wanted either upgrades or unlocks?

But okay, let's turn your particular brand of logic around: any complaints you've had about GT6 (or, indeed, that anybody has had about any game) were your own fault for not informing yourself better.

I suppose all games really are 10/10, then.

Might be. But a moderator having to resort to posting off topic background checks on a user, in order to try and discredit said users opinion is equally as weak.

If you don't like people pointing out childish past actions, I've got an easy solution: don't do them.

If you'd make a GTP poll asking "has the GT series been in a steady decline these past 6 years", you'll probably find that it won't be only 'my opinion'.

That's not proof of anything, unless you're seriously suggesting every single person that looked at the poll voted the same way as you. Yes, some people will share your opinion. Others will believe that no, it isn't on the decline.

As @Tornado hinted at a page ago, people will vote for whatever they want in the hopes of getting the desired outcome. We could post a poll asking if GT Sport has the most advanced physics on consoles, and people will vote yes, quite possibly without playing it (or the competition). You're even proof of that approach.

Please elaborate because i'd love to hear how the GT brand is on the up 👍

Already did that. You even quoted it, so perhaps going back and reading it will help.

 

[TS050]

No game deserves a zero!

...Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric?

 

[Dark_ZR1]

Why can't people just let other people say whatever they want about the game? Doesn't really matter, the game won't change if you make your point right or wrong, mature or childish.

Not to mention, this thread is all about whining and crying, i don't get this argument between @SlipZtrEm and @mister dog .

For one, it is declining, for other isn't. For one it is 10/10, for other isn't. So what? What's the point?

 

[mister dog]

Why can't people just let other people say whatever they want about the game? Doesn't really matter, the game won't change if you make your point right or wrong, mature or childish.

Not to mention, this thread is all about whining and crying, i don't get this argument between @SlipZtrEm and @mister dog .

For one, it is declining, for other isn't. For one it is 10/10, for other isn't. So what? What's the point?

Meh just one of these forum pages where two blokes are going at it and refuse to give each other the light of day.
Best to skip straight to page 52 when it appears 👍

Already did that. You even quoted it, so perhaps going back and reading it will help.

Ok this part then:

If we look at things in another way, GT's on the rise. What other developer has been courted by as many manufacturers for things like GT Academy and Vision GT? Who has the FIA partnered up with, again?

So a couple of fantasy concept cars and a FIA sticker on the box means the GT series is on the up again? To each his own i guess.

 

[AKps3]

Why can't people just let other people say whatever they want about the game? Doesn't really matter, the game won't change if you make your point right or wrong, mature or childish.

Not to mention, this thread is all about whining and crying, i don't get this argument between @SlipZtrEm and @mister dog .

For one, it is declining, for other isn't. For one it is 10/10, for other isn't. So what? What's the point?

The problem is that some people are giving a game a 10/10 without playing it.

 

[mister dog]

The problem is that some people are giving a game a 10/10 without playing it.

But but... PS4!

 

[Dark_ZR1]

The problem is that some people are giving a game a 10/10 without playing it.

Honestly? What is the problem with that? Is that rating something important to some kind of media, news or is it just an opinion?

If it's just someone saying the game is 10/10, let them rate it that way. The game won't change a bit because their ratings.

If they have played it or not is completelly useless. If you don't agree with their personal ratings, just ignore it.

 

[AKps3]

Honestly? What is the problem with that? Is that rating something important to some kind of media, news or is it just an opinion?

If it's just someone saying the game is 10/10, let them rate it that way. The game won't change a bit because their ratings.

If they have played it or not is completelly useless. If you don't agree with their personal ratings, just ignore it.

I don't have a problem if someone gives a game a 10/10 when they played it.

 

[Tornado]

Not to mention, this thread is all about whining and crying, i don't get this argument between @SlipZtrEm and @mister dog .

Then don't comment on it.

 

[Dark_ZR1]

I don't have a problem if someone gives a game a 10/10 when they played it.

You'll have a lot of trouble on internet then, as it's filled with people doing such thing.

Then don't comment on it.

What i meant is, their argument is totally pointless. It won't have an end, because they both were trying to be right and both wouldn't ever get in an agreement. So, why keep it going? Why keep doing those little small provokes? Why keep poking each other to see who will lose it first?

 

[AKps3]

What i meant is, their argument is totally pointless. It won't have an end, because they both were trying to be right and both wouldn't ever get in an agreement. So, why keep it going? Why keep doing those little small provokes? Why keep poking each other to see who will lose it first?

I'm gonna use your quote to answere this

You'll have a lot of trouble on internet then, as it's filled with people doing such thing.

 

[Dark_ZR1]

I'm gonna use your quote to answere this

k.

 

[Tornado]

What i meant is, their argument is totally pointless.

Except it's not. The argument is whether the perception of the series failings as perceived by a vocal portions of the fanbase match the reality of the series' standing in the industry; particularly from someone who has done the same blind devotion to a game that he would (and has) undoubtedly call people out for if done towards Gran Turismo. That's wholly relevant to this thread.

 

[Dark_ZR1]

Except it's not. The argument is whether the perception of the series failings as perceived by a vocal portions of the fanbase match the reality of the series' standing in the industry. That's wholly relevant to this thread.

Fair enough, but then i ask you, how do we find that out? Argueing on a forum, doing small passive-aggressive comments?
I don't really think so. And that is the point that i am trying to showcase.

 

[Tornado]

The point you're trying to showcase could be applied to literally any topic on this message board about this series, since very little if anything discussed is for anyone's benefit but the people discussing.

 

[Dark_ZR1]

The point you're trying to showcase could be applied to literally any topic on this message board about this series, since very little if anything discussed is for anyone's benefit but the people discussing.

Sort of, won't deny that.

 

[mister dog]

That was deep
Anyhow i don't want to continue going back and forth with ol' @SlipZtrEm and take up space that could be used to whine and cry about Gran Turismo, so if he agrees we'll just call it a day and put this discussion to bed.

 

[fatkid]

That's the thing with scores, especially when rating from a 1-10. Some people judge an ok to decent game as a 7. Same could be applied to a 10 rating. Some think it applies to a game that has all the elements neccesary for it's genre whike others judge a 10 as an unachievable score. Some judge an ok game as a 5 as that is the middle of the scale. Personally, I think a on 1-5 star rating is easier to interpret, or just indepth verdict and direct comparison to similar games to leave no confusion.

 

[Samus]

Metacritic user scores are about the most pointless score going, I don't think anyone genuinely used them to value the quality of a game. Every single console exclusive is voted 0 by the kids who support the other console and 10 by those with the console, even if they don't own it. Totally pointless.

 

[chengman]

At this rate, GTS is going to come out when I upgrade my computer to be VR compatible.

 

[Luminis]

Feel free to disagree, everyone has different view/expectation about games. For me, 10 out of 10 means perfection, without flaws, which is impossible to attain even when it comes to satisfaction or experience.

"I don't hand out A's because no human is perfect and, thus, no student of mine will ever get a perfect score." My favourite kind of teacher. Give an correct answer to every question, still get an A- at best.

What's the point of making something part of the scale if it's not supposed to be reached? Might as well cut the scale of at 9 and call it a day

Metacritic user scores are about the most pointless score going, I don't think anyone genuinely used them to value the quality of a game. Every single console exclusive is voted 0 by the kids who support the other console and 10 by those with the console, even if they don't own it. Totally pointless.

Amen.

Those reviews are filled with so much bias it hurts to even read them. The aggregated reviewer score is a much, much better indicator of a game's quality - and even that is severely questionable at times.

 

[Imari]

What's the point of making something part of the scale if it's not supposed to be reached? Might as well cut the scale of at 9 and call it a day

But then 9 is the best score and no one can get the best score! Better just give everyone zero. Or better yet, no score at all but a prize for participation. Maybe a hug. That way everyone is a winner!

 

[Luminis]

But then 9 is the best score and no one can get the best score! Better just give everyone zero. Or better yet, no score at all but a prize for participation. Maybe a hug. That way everyone is a winner!

That's obviously true. I'll be honest, though, slapping a numerical rating onto something as inherently subjective as a review, in order to make it look more objective than it actually is, is pretty much bull anyway. It's what I love about Rock Paper Shotguns' reviews. No numeric score at the end of the review. Just a single paragraph trying to summarise the game's ups and downs.

 

[fatkid]

...Clearly, you haven't played a 1992 arcade game called Warriors of Fate by Capcom.

Hey! Take it easy. I actually liked it. It wasn't that bad during it's day. I had Warriors of Fate aka Dynasty Wars aka Devouring of Heaven and Earth part 2 as a Japanese import disc for my PS1. It had slightly more depth than the average scrolling beat-em up in it's day; good range if weapons, horses that could be ridden and a 3 player co-op mode. Although it is just a simple button basher by today's standards and extremely repetitve.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

That was deep
Anyhow i don't want to continue going back and forth with ol' @SlipZtrEm and take up space that could be used to whine and cry about Gran Turismo, so if he agrees we'll just call it a day and put this discussion to bed.

Sure. Though I do have to cover just one other thing:

But but... PS4!

I don't know if you're familiar with the fiasco that was Batman: Arkham Knight on PC, but if you aren't, take a look: you'll see why it's important to review the platform you've actually played. A review of the game on PS4 certainly wouldn't be applicable to the original launch state of the PC version!

That's obviously true. I'll be honest, though, slapping a numerical rating onto something as inherently subjective as a review, in order to make it look more objective than it actually is, is pretty much bull anyway. It's what I love about Rock Paper Shotguns' reviews. No numeric score at the end of the review. Just a single paragraph trying to summarise the game's ups and downs.

That's actually something we've grappled with for the front-page reviews. Numerical scores are easily digestible, so sites like Metacritic and Rotten Tomatoes offer a helpful service, allowing people to get a general consensus on a title easily. But for those looking to drill down to know the pros and cons, it's not very useful. The media/marketing teams behind new games also tend to like reviews with scores attached: it makes for good press.

We like to think our readership is more like the second group: they want to know the details, not necessarily a number. Both approaches have their benefits, and we haven't ruled out a rating system somewhere down the line ("4/5 Planets, would play again!"), but for now, the Conclusion is the TL;DR of it all.