The GT6 Epic Whining and Crying Thread

[TokoTurismo]

Been a while since I played GT5 it got that boring but from memory to complete all the events standard cars did have to be used from the top of my head two that spring to mind are Chapparel 2j and FGT.

Also that there is a pointless excuse, They dropped the PS1 era cars, GT3 had a sixth the number or cars that they had in GT2, Enough said really.

Yeah, to gain progress you have to use a standard car, but hey you did it anyway so your fault for doing so. You could have just always ignored those said events. *Shrugs*

T_T

 

[ghostrider135]

Yeah, to gain progress you have to use a standard car, but hey you did it anyway so your fault for doing so. You could have just always ignored those said events. *Shrugs*

T_T

Gordon Bennett, GT5 lacked events as it stands if I didn't bother to race them based on car choice or lack there of then I would have had even less events to do.

 

[Lewis_Hamilton_]

Yeah, to gain progress you have to use a standard car, but hey you did it anyway so your fault for doing so. You could have just always ignored those said events. *Shrugs*

I don't like this "advice" at all. Again, it's a bit like the comment before about if you don't like the sounds, then turn the effects off and put your own music on instead, and as I responded, it's the equivelant to sticking your fingers in your ears and shouting "lalalala".

Why should anyone have to sacrifice the ability to complete the game?

 

[MeanElf]

Well, I guess I'm disappointed that PD is using the same cars from GT5 for GT6 and only adding on 200 cars at the most...

Only c'mon that is a lot more than a few other PS3 racing games have in total. They will also be adding cars via DLC so that won't be the figure for very long - ergo: it will increase.

Even if the entire GT5 car list is present, and updated visually; it's an optional thing surely if anyone decides to collect them. I'm sure a number of events will require a car that was formerly standard - if the appearance is improved as suggested and wheel/aero options are ubiquitous, then I don't really see the issue. The cars have the same physics. The only potential issue may be the interior view - for that though we'll need to wait on more info or confirmation either way. This last paragraph was more of a general comment by the way; not in reply to your post.

 

[Imari]

They will also be adding cars via DLC so that won't be the figure for very long - ergo: it will increase.

Considering how well GT5 DLC worked out, I wouldn't get your hopes up too high on this.

 

[CoolColJ]

Chuckle at the first page posts

 

[Racer Dee]

Wow it's been a while since I last logged into gtplanet. Look at all the whining here in this thread !

 

[MeanElf]

Considering how well GT5 DLC worked out, I wouldn't get your hopes up too high on this.

With the GT5 DLC PD was more vague about the delivery schedules (about every two months, if I recall.) Okay though, that was GT5.

Let PD prove themselves right, or wrong with GT6 first - I think there is a whole different reason for DLC with GT6 and no, it's not just money before someone jumps in with that...

 

[Johnnypenso]

With the GT5 DLC PD was more vague about the delivery schedules (about every two months, if I recall.) Okay though, that was GT5.

Let PD prove themselves right, or wrong with GT6 first - I think there is a whole different reason for DLC with GT6 and no, it's not just money before someone jumps in with that...

It's not just money...just 99% money. Easy way to pay for ongoing development costs of GT7 is with steady DLC income from GT6. I think the reason you didn't see a lot of DLC on GT5 is they are hoping for a larger DLC market for GT6 for content that is already ready to go. Why release Bathurst for example, 2 years into the life cycle of GT5 when the user base is down to a million or two? Better to save it for 6 months into GT6 where everyone is still hot to trot about the game.

 

[tillbot8]

A few reoccurring comments I see on this GT6 forum quite often, 'You don't have to use standard cars' '200 new cars is a lot' That is correct on both accounts, but you must also take into account this is not another Burnout or NFS, This is a AAA first party developer who has given one of the longest time frames in Gaming history along with a budget of over 60 MILLION! PD should be held to a higher regard considering they themselves want you to believe they hold themselves. GT5 as a whole was flawed but in my opinion very good! If they outsourced some of the work not all but some it could of been a fantastic game! I.E 'Swallow pride for the greater good' I genuinely thought when we would find out about GT6 the transition would be as large as when GT3 progressed to 4! Until further info we have 200 cars (acceptable, not mind blowing but okay) and 3-7 tracks! (That track count until proven otherwise is ABYSMAL, almost unforgivable)! Nearly 3 years People, 3 YEARS since GT5, now the physics look great, but wasn't that a given? It was always going to improve. I hope E3 wow's me, I hope there is something in the pipeline for PS4 soon! I hope GT6 will be like GT4 on steroids, But I am not seeing that being the case yet. God I hope it is

 

[RandomCarGuy17]

Still doesn't hide the fact PD are still using base models from what is now 2 generations ago. Yes they are being improved .. So its still old out of date tech from what 12 years ago.

True, I just felt like giving my input on what makes up for the poor decision they made though. Of course, maybe some of the 200 cars will update some of the major car manufactures. Well, I'm going to hope for that.

Only c'mon that is a lot more than a few other PS3 racing games have in total. They will also be adding cars via DLC so that won't be the figure for very long - ergo: it will increase.

Woah buddy, I just wanted to let out a little of my frustration. I'm aware that that's more new cars than a typical racing game on a current gen console. I was just annoyed with PD's decision of adding only 200 new cars because they use to add more than that on some of their GT games in the past. I didn't forget about the dlc either, it only makes me more curious on what cars will come to GT6 after launch.

 

[Samus]

Don't forget 200 is the generous maximum, depending on what figures PD manipulated it could be less than 100 new cars.

 

[daus26]

I don't know what's worst, the 100-200 cars or 4-7 new tracks. Actually, that's an easy one for me. I don't mind only 100 cars for worst case scenario, but 4 tracks worst case scenario? C'mon. Best case scenario 7 tracks? Not cool.

I will wait further judgement in the coming months.

 

[RandomCarGuy17]

I'm just hoping to be wrong and it not just being 3 new locations and 100 new cars. E3 can't come soon enough.

 

[seanyb505]

This is how PD operates and competes. Realistically GT6 will have 700-800 cars, and 1200 different titles for those cars. Still a lot, but you can help but think they're trying to pull one over on you, that car enthusiasts wouldn't know or care about the difference. There are two Sprint Cup stock cars in GT5. Not ~15 because they are different color.

PD does the same thing with tracks. The whole locations/tracks is ridiculous. 20 Some locations but 77 tracks for GT5? No. 20 Some tracks. But I guess technically a different layout is a different track, it's just dissappointing.

I haven't heard anyone else say this, but I'm going to wager that the "thousands of aero parts" goes with the same philosophy. Maybe 4-5 different parts, spread across 700-800 different cars, 2800-4000 aero parts!

Same for personalization. Let's see, wheels, paint car a different color, wing...you're own personalized car! I really can't count on a competitive livery editor making it in.

I want nothing more to be wrong on all acounts, and for PD to produce an outstanding game. I want to give them my $70. Unfortunately they have shown a different desire for the last eight years.

 

[Exorcet]

This is how PD operates and competes. Realistically GT6 will have 700-800 cars, and 1200 different titles for those cars. Still a lot, but you can help but think they're trying to pull one over on you, that car enthusiasts wouldn't know or care about the difference. There are two Sprint Cup stock cars in GT5. Not ~15 because they are different color.

For race cars I guess I can kind of excuse it, and they actually modeled the penalty weight differences on some Super GT's (though I wish you could remove it). For the road cars, it gets silly.

PD does the same thing with tracks. The whole locations/tracks is ridiculous. 20 Some locations but 77 tracks for GT5? No. 20 Some tracks. But I guess technically a different layout is a different track, it's just dissappointing.

As with cars, the technical differences matter. I think it's fair to call all the different Nurburgings separate tracks. Suzuka with the bike chicane on/off maybe not. I think that the track number in GT is more accurate than the car number though.

I haven't heard anyone else say this, but I'm going to wager that the "thousands of aero parts" goes with the same philosophy. Maybe 4-5 different parts, spread across 700-800 different cars, 2800-4000 aero parts!

That would be taking things to extremes, even consider what PD has done before. I'd hope not.

 

[MeanElf]

It's not just money...just 99% money. Easy way to pay for ongoing development costs of GT7 is with steady DLC income from GT6...

Still not convinced that it's even 30% of the reason. If so, there was little stopping them releasing the track packs from previous titles on GT5 to fund GT6 - didn't happen. I say this because the DLC on GT5 doesn't look to be included automatically with GT6 - okay, maybe those who already have bought track DLC can add them to GT6 with proof from their savedata, or a nominal fee. That though is speculation presently.

I'm going with this being more about saving disc space and providing an earlier release date instead of holding the game back until the tracks they want in GT6 are ready.

...This is a AAA first party developer who has given one of the longest time frames in Gaming history along with a budget of over 60 MILLION!

That was for GT5 - budget is unknown for GT6 as yet.

Woah buddy, I just wanted to let out a little of my frustration. I'm aware that that's more new cars than a typical racing game on a current gen console...I didn't forget about the dlc either, it only makes me more curious on what cars will come to GT6 after launch.

Sorry, but in fairness that's not what your wording implied

...and only adding on 200 cars at the most...

hence the response.

I agree though, I too am curious about what cars will come via DLC. The guessing is definitely a plus point for me about how this is looking.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

So? Not like it's a surprise standard cars are even in GT6 anyway. Don't like them, don't drive them. Simple as. T_T

Do you not believe in any sort of QC? And to say don't drive them...is a good cop out. So you basically say this and many others for other issues say "don't play or don't use it". So I shouldn't be able to use the extent of a game because people enable the developer to utilize their poor quality control skills.

Such a pity way saying "oh should they include GT2 cars cause of standard cars", oh yawn... Like less cars will do anything, and how less are speaking at hmm? If it's less 100 no thanks. PD can ditch the standard cars at some point but as of now there here to stay, mind as well get used to it. T_T

You're as bad as Earth, just opposite end of the spectrum. It is poor quality and marketing!!! What don't you get about that? Why is it okay for a majority of items to be vastly different than the high end.

Don't forget 200 is the generous maximum, depending on what figures PD manipulated it could be less than 100 new cars.

Good point, 200 news to them is vastly differnt than 200 new to us...one only looks at a former standard car being turned premium then sold off as new DLC content, all while it was planned to be released originally in the game from the get go. Maybe 140 3/4ths new???

 

[Earth]

I'll publish my findings here

Of course the biggest reason many are using against GT6 on PS4 is that PS4 has not sold any consoles yet, so at the moment there are zero consumers for a GT6/PS4, whereas there are 70 million possible consumers for a GT6/PS3.

This implies that GT6 MUST sale around 10M units again in order for it to be profitable for Polyphony Digital, and in order for GT6 to fund the development of GT7.

Is that really true? No, not at all.

In 2008 Polyphony Digital solid 4.12M copies of Gran Turismo Prologue. Thats more then any Forza game outside Forza 3 (5.37M). In 2010 they sold 10.39M copies of Gran Turismo 5. If you add those sales together thats 14.51M copies of Gran Turismo sold on the PS3. Thats not including the nearly 3M copies of GTPSP sold

I'll put this in perspective

Total number of exclusive games sold on PS3 per franchise, and the Forza Franchise (3,4, plus Horizon)

16.61M - Uncharted
14.51M - Gran Turismo
10.71M - Forza
9.08M - God of War
5.36M - Killzone

So how exactly is Polyphony Digital bleeding for so much money that they must release on the old console again? Its the old double dip routine. Get the consumer to pay for the inferior product now (ex: DVD with no extra features, no 3D, no extended scenes) then down the line, in a year or two, release the better version (all features, extended scenes, etc) which the faithful fans will no doubt buy again.

The "there are zero PS4 consumers" story is absolute nonsense and marketing speak for several, obvious reasons. I do agree a launch GT6 on PS4 wouldnt be the best decision, but still a better decision then a GT6 PS3 around the same time. A Q2/Q3 2014 or even Q4 2014 release of GT6 On PS4 would have been the way to go. Once the initial hype blows over and the PS4 needs an extra pair of legs to keep going GT6 could be there to pick it up.

They did the same thing with Gran Turismo 3, releasing the game just 8 months after the North American and Europe Playstation 2 launch. And Gran Turismo 3 is far and away the best selling Gran Turismo title of all time. GT6 will be the worst selling, easily.

So what changed this time? Why are they not looking to replicate the success of GT3? They think they have the fanbase, hook, line, and sinker, and that they will follow and approve whatever choice they make. Polyphony Digital's announcement could have been a black background which said in white lettering: GT6, Coming to PS3 this Holiday season, and all the fans would have been just as happy. Buy inferior game now because it offers instant gratification at just $60, then buy what the game should have been now on PS4 in 2 years.

Just look how many apologists are on this very website. They say once again they'll give us garbage damage that would be passable on a PS1 game. The fans response? 'We dont care about damage'. Once again we hear bad sounds. The fans response? 'Its not as bad as it seems'. Instead of expecting excellence, or even just improvement, their standards have dropped to rock bottom. What they dont know is that will only help ruin the franchise.

People are starting to catch on

Gran Turismo North America Sales

GT3 - 6.85M
GT4 - 3.01M
GT5 - 2.59M

Gran Turismo Japan Sales

GT3 - 1.87M
GT4 - 1.10M
GT5 - .80M

With standard cars, return of poor damage, sound, a handful of new tracks, minimal new car increase when compared to the competition, competition from next gen racers, and being an extremely late gen release all means GT6 wont get great reviews. Reviewers will see it as and even call it GT5 XXL, or even GT5.5. It will pretty much lose its AAA status as a franchise and will no longer be a true console seller.

All this because instead of shooting for the stars and excellence and being in the forefront of innovation, they decided to turn the series into a cash cow. The problem is, unlike other cash cows in gaming, Gran Turismo is no longer fun, and it will belly flop like Louie Anderson.

 

[Tornado]

I'll publish my findings here

Above all else, I just love how that's what you led in with.

 

[Dmarc_Atl]

It makes total sense to compare games sales for games that released years apart.. /s

 

[jabofu]

I'll publish my findings here
...

I can fully agree with you. They could have atleast release it parallel on both systems.

I think many dont understand how I and others feel about the PS3 release at this time. Just for example:

The new Ipad 4 (I dont buy apple stuff) will release in oktober 2013. Sure, I want to buy it. New system, better hardware and new apps. And the most important apple-app I always use on my Ipad 3 probably will have a new version for launch too. And now there begins the problem: The new improved app will officially release in Oktober 2013. "Yay!" On the Ipad 3. "What?" Heavily updated and new features. But you, who invest in their expensive hardware, who love this very useful and great app wont get a piece of the cake. Go away, we dont care if you are a core fan, we want to make money and you can buy it for Ipad 3 now. Maybe we will bring the same app on Ipad 4 later too. "Then I will pay twice for it?!!!" Well, you could wait for it to release. "But I dont want to wait so long." Then buy it now and later the updated version. "Then I have to pay twice and dlcs?" Hey, we want to make money.

I am utterly confused why so many people hate the PS4? I just dont see the reason. It is a new generation, way more power, many new features, new games and more. Is it the price? Or just because it is new? Is it now a bad thing to like the latest creations from the top console producers?

It just wont get in my head. Especially when you see how other racing games use the new power to exceed many boundaries of current gen racers.

Things like "PS4 fanboy" on a forum that is mainly focused on the playstation consoles and Sony/PD is just another sign that something is not quite right.

 

[Downhill Dino]

People are starting to catch on

Gran Turismo North America Sales

GT3 - 6.85M
GT4 - 3.01M
GT5 - 2.59M

Gran Turismo Japan Sales

GT3 - 1.87M
GT4 - 1.10M
GT5 - .80M

You do have to take into account that are there are roughly 75 million more PS2s then there are PS3s. A lot of those who have a PS2 may not have purchased a PS3.

 

[Scaff]

Total number of exclusive games sold on PS3 per franchise, and the Forza Franchise (3,4, plus Horizon)

16.61M - Uncharted
14.51M - Gran Turismo
10.71M - Forza
9.08M - God of War
5.36M - Killzone

Did they all cost the same amount to develop?

Simply looking at units shifted will only allow you to (roughly) calculate income figures, without accounting for costs you can't work out profit.

I've worked that out roughly for GT5 (in a number of threads) and it covered development and made a small profit.

You also moan about PD 'double dipping', yet it could be argued that every title on that list did exactly the same, as did many other franchises. Its a sane business practice, you get the majority of your development costs out of the way with your first release (which may or may not make you any money) and they use further releases to generate some actual profit.

You do have to take into account that are there are roughly 75 million more PS2s then there are PS3s. A lot of those who have a PS2 may not have purchased a PS3.

Which ever way you cut it overall sales of GT have declined.

Its also missing sales figures for Europe (which as GT's biggest market is a little bit odd.

Gran Turismo Europe Sales

GT3 - 5.85M
GT4 - 6.82M
GT5 - 6.74M

 

[Downhill Dino]

Which ever way you cut it overall sales of GT have declined.

I only pointed that out because he said "People are starting to catch on."

Its also missing sales figures for Europe (which as GT's biggest market is a little bit odd.

Gran Turismo Europe Sales

GT3 - 5.85M
GT4 - 6.82M
GT5 - 6.74M

I was looking for these myself because I knew that they had increased from game to game, but couldn't find anything. It's like the internet hates me, where did you find this?

 

[Brend]

Europe has always been the main adopter to the GT series, it's like the Sony guy said in the last interview on the blog, other continents just don't take to racing titles like Europe does.

 

[Scaff]

I only pointed that out because he said "People are starting to catch on."



I was looking for these myself because I knew that they had increased from game to game, but couldn't find anything. It's like the internet hates me, where did you find this?

Here you go....

http://www.polyphony.co.jp/english/list.html

 

[Downhill Dino]

Thanks Scaff. How I didn't find that is beyond me.

 

[CorvetteConquer]

I predict GT6 will sell under 9 million in total sales.

I honestly don't see how the casual fans that tried GT5 could have been impressed. Many were probably surprised at the standard vs premium divisions and the terrible A-spec mode. I think few will return.

GT6 will be the worst selling full-numbered GT title. 8 million is still a lot, so it's difficult to call that a failure.

 

[Spagetti69]

I predict GT6 will sell under 9 million in total sales.

I honestly don't see how the casual fans that tried GT5 could have been impressed. Many were probably surprised at the standard vs premium divisions and the terrible A-spec mode. I think few will return.

GT6 will be the worst selling full-numbered GT title. 8 million is still a lot, so it's difficult to call that a failure.

If its ported to PS4 which is a strong rumour then GT6 could be the best selling ever, with combined sales.