"Three Legendary Cars" Trophy

[Samus]

The trophy description is just silly. You could have said in 1966 that all three of those cars are destined to win the 1967 LM24, whilst only one can/will, like they might put on a poster.

But the trophy description was written in 2022. You can't say in 2022 that all three of those cars were destined to win the race with post-race knowledge, especially when one of them didn't even get anywhere near the Sarthe circuit.

 

[Famine]

and the Jaguar which of course never raced

Not only that, it was never finished.

It was technically an unofficial project lead by Jaguar's engineering department but without any particular Jaguar involvement. The prototype car was already obsolete by the time it turned a wheel, thanks to the GT40 MkII, and as Jaguar had been sold to BMC there was neither interest nor enough money to develop it further, so it was shelved.

When it crashed five years later it was being filmed for an advert for the S3 E-Type, and it was rebuilt shortly after by an external company... but not entirely to the original design, so the car in the game (and the British Motor Museum at Gaydon) isn't even the original 1966 car.


"Destined" has two distinct meanings in English, one relating to geography and one to chronology. One is, of cargo (whether goods or beings), to be travelling on a geographical path towards a given location - whether it reaches it or not - as in "the ship was carrying 3,965 vehicles destined for the U.S. market". The other is to be on a path towards a certain (as in "guaranteed") outcome that is, by virtue of being certain, reached, as in "the oracle told Althaemenes that he was destined to kill his own father". Although this one is usually used retroactively*.

You can tell the difference between the two meanings because the geographical result is the destin-ation, and the chronological result is the destin-y ("I'm George, George McFly. I am your density").

The Jaguar was never cargo sent in the direction of a 24-hour race (any 24-hour race) because it was never finished, nor was it ever on the path towards the certain outcome of winning a 24-hour race (any 24-hour race) because it was obsolete before it was even driven.

It simply does not fit this trophy description in any way.


*There's an emergent meaning whereby someone who escapes a fate that merely looks to be guaranteed but isn't can be said to have changed their destiny.

 

[Magog]

Buy three very old overpriced cars Kaz really likes doesn't have the same ring to it.

 

[ethomaz]

The trophy description is just silly. You could have said in 1966 that all three of those cars are destined to win the 1967 LM24, whilst only one can/will, like they might put on a poster.

But the trophy description was written in 2022. You can't say in 2022 that all three of those cars were destined to win the race with post-race knowledge, especially when one of them didn't even get anywhere near the Sarthe circuit.

That is why the trophy is described as legendary? I mean it should not be 2022 but the past.

In any case I read the trophy as cars specifically designed to race LeMans 24 Hours and not that they had success winning.
But that was me... last week I was looking on google for "specific designed LeMans cars".

 

[Famine]

That is why the trophy is described as legendary?

The cars being in Legends Cars should be why it uses the word "legendary"...

... but then it uses the word "destined" wrongly so I guess words are just thrown at the screen at random now.

 

[Samus]

That is why the trophy is described as legendary? I mean it should not be 2022 but the past.

In any case I read the trophy as cars specifically designed to race LeMans 24 Hours and not that they had success winning.
But that was me... last week I was looking on google for "specific designed LeMans cars".

I said it was written in 2022, after the event being referenced. That changes how you write about something.

The trophy is unclear whichever way you slice it. If you read it simply as "Cars designed to race LeMans 24 Hours" as you say then why don't a huge number of other cars that fit that criteria count? It makes no mention of three specific cars, but it wants three specific cars.

 

[jpl]

I'm going to hope to win all three in the roulette. 🙏

Fat chance. Worse reward without fail for me. 10k credits the max I ever get, normally less or an exhaust part for a car I don't have or care about

 

[Magog]

Fat chance. Worse reward without fail for me. 10k credits the max I ever get, normally less or an exhaust part for a car I don't have or care about

I got a Mercedes AMG Black today. Unfortunately I had already bought one last week. 😅

 

[jrbabbitt]

Now to keep this thread alive we shall debate the validity of the Jaguar XJ13 being one of the "destined" cars... or dense cars McFly.

 

[jpl]

I have bought pretty much all of the cars on this game on the LCD aside from obvious legends that aren't required like the F50, Supra GT500, Alfa 155 (early on in the game).

The only ones I didn't buy were the Ford Mark IV and the Jaguar. So yes, it's confirmed it's these two alongside the 330 P4.
The F1 GTR, Porsche 962 C and Shelby Daytona are not required given that NO ONE has them yet and yet the trophy has popped for a lot of people already.

It's a copy paste from GT5 trophy, however, the wording on it is purposely misleading to make you waste credits on all the cars for confirmation, and the game's poor content was dragged by this stupid time gate (1 month and a half) so that people wouldn't get the Platinum early...

The GT5 trophy wasn't misleading at all, just in case people want to start defending this trophy description. Had I known from the start which cars were they, I would've definitely put in some effort to get these two.

Instead, now I have to wait, possibly, one more month to get this trophy... ridiculous.

Enjoy the game, the platinum will come

 

[Grimm6Jack]

I don't think anyone is trying to defend that the trophy description is outright wrong...

Enjoy the game, the platinum will come

Enjoy the game doing what?

Or are you one of those that has a "defined way" to enjoy a game that should be enforced on others? I hope you aren't...

 

[WRECKU]

I saw a confirmation somewhere > Jag XJ 13 - Ford Mark IV - Ferrari 330 P4

 

[rhalgr]

Not only that, it was never finished.

It was technically an unofficial project lead by Jaguar's engineering department but without any particular Jaguar involvement. The prototype car was already obsolete by the time it turned a wheel, thanks to the GT40 MkII, and as Jaguar had been sold to BMC there was neither interest nor enough money to develop it further, so it was shelved.

When it crashed five years later it was being filmed for an advert for the S3 E-Type, and it was rebuilt shortly after by an external company... but not entirely to the original design, so the car in the game (and the British Motor Museum at Gaydon) isn't even the original 1966 car.


"Destined" has two distinct meanings in English, one relating to geography and one to chronology. One is, of cargo (whether goods or beings), to be travelling on a geographical path towards a given location - whether it reaches it or not - as in "the ship was carrying 3,965 vehicles destined for the U.S. market". The other is to be on a path towards a certain (as in "guaranteed") outcome that is, by virtue of being certain, reached, as in "the oracle told Althaemenes that he was destined to kill his own father". Although this one is usually used retroactively*.

You can tell the difference between the two meanings because the geographical result is the destin-ation, and the chronological result is the destin-y ("I'm George, George McFly. I am your density").

The Jaguar was never cargo sent in the direction of a 24-hour race (any 24-hour race) because it was never finished, nor was it ever on the path towards the certain outcome of winning a 24-hour race (any 24-hour race) because it was obsolete before it was even driven.

It simply does not fit this trophy description in any way.


*There's an emergent meaning whereby someone who escapes a fate that merely looks to be guaranteed but isn't can be said to have changed their destiny.

If gtplanet ever gets the chance to interview Kaz again a question about the trophy needs to be asked.

 

[GOTMAXPOWER]

I guess words are just thrown at the screen at random now.

It's all part of the Human Comedy 💩

 

[jpl]

Now to keep this thread alive we shall debate the validity of the Jaguar XJ13 being one of the "destined" cars... or dense cars McFly.

Not only that, it was never finished.

It was technically an unofficial project lead by Jaguar's engineering department but without any particular Jaguar involvement. The prototype car was already obsolete by the time it turned a wheel, thanks to the GT40 MkII, and as Jaguar had been sold to BMC there was neither interest nor enough money to develop it further, so it was shelved.

When it crashed five years later it was being filmed for an advert for the S3 E-Type, and it was rebuilt shortly after by an external company... but not entirely to the original design, so the car in the game (and the British Motor Museum at Gaydon) isn't even the original 1966 car.


"Destined" has two distinct meanings in English, one relating to geography and one to chronology. One is, of cargo (whether goods or beings), to be travelling on a geographical path towards a given location - whether it reaches it or not - as in "the ship was carrying 3,965 vehicles destined for the U.S. market". The other is to be on a path towards a certain (as in "guaranteed") outcome that is, by virtue of being certain, reached, as in "the oracle told Althaemenes that he was destined to kill his own father". Although this one is usually used retroactively*.

You can tell the difference between the two meanings because the geographical result is the destin-ation, and the chronological result is the destin-y ("I'm George, George McFly. I am your density").

The Jaguar was never cargo sent in the direction of a 24-hour race (any 24-hour race) because it was never finished, nor was it ever on the path towards the certain outcome of winning a 24-hour race (any 24-hour race) because it was obsolete before it was even driven.

It simply does not fit this trophy description in any way.


*There's an emergent meaning whereby someone who escapes a fate that merely looks to be guaranteed but isn't can be said to have changed their destiny.

Maybe we're looking at this in too much detail. There's no other cars from any year where there's cars manufactured by proven winners of 24hr races and 3 of them, whether they never entered like the Jag or didn't win like the Ferrari. Maybe the key is they are from the same year.

Either way, with twice as many legendary cars in each rotation, they will come around again soon.

 

[Grimm6Jack]

Maybe we're looking at this in too much detail. There's no other cars from any year where there's cars manufactured by proven winners of 24hr races and 3 of them, whether they never entered like the Jag or didn't win like the Ferrari. Maybe the key is they are from the same year.

Either way, with twice as many legendary cars in each rotation, they will come around again soon.

We aren't looking at this without any "too much detail" at all.

The trophy describes, literally, 3 legendary cars that were born/built to win 24 hr races.

It doesn't say if it's 3 specific cars, heck it doesn't even mention 24hr of LE MANS, it only mentions 24hr races (which can technically mean any other circuit which has 24 hr races like Nurburgring, Spa, Daytona).
From this description you have over a dozen of cars in the game that fit the criteria... And, what a coincidence that quite a few of them are also very expensive.


And actually, in this very same thread was already stated that there are actually 3 cars in the game that are also from 3 manufacturer winners that raced against each other in the exact same year, in 1989 you had the Mercedes Sauber C9, the Jaguar XJR-9 and the Porsche 962C competing against each other for the win.

^This is actually much more accurate and realistic because these 3 cars actually raced against each other and were all built to win Le Mans, in fact, all 3 of them won Le Mans at one point. The Porsche in 86/87 - Jaguar in 88 and the C9 in 89.


Much unlike the 3 cars we need for this trophy where only one won Le Mans, one other never won Le Mans and the other never even raced.

The trophy description is misleading (not just misleading, but straight up wrong), and I would bet my every cent that it was on purpose.


This could've easily been described as:

"Buy 3 legendary cars that were supposed to face each other at Le Mans" - Which is not saying outright which cars it is but it gives us players an actual way to figure them out.

From the trophy description, the XJ13 simply doesn't fit at all. While several other cars, fit to an absolute T.

 

[GOTMAXPOWER]

I think they should've replaced this trophy with "Complete Collection - Own one of every car available in game".

It takes away the mystery and makes it a longer term thing for the lifespan of the game.

 

[Magog]

We aren't looking at this without any "too much detail" at all.

The trophy describes, literally, 3 legendary cars that were born/built to win 24 hr races.

It doesn't say if it's 3 specific cars, heck it doesn't even mention 24hr of LE MANS, it only mentions 24hr races (which can technically mean any other circuit which has 24 hr races like Nurburgring, Spa, Daytona).
From this description you have over a dozen of cars in the game that fit the criteria... And, what a coincidence that quite a few of them are also very expensive.


And actually, in this very same thread was already stated that there are actually 3 cars in the game that are also from 3 manufacturer winners that raced against each other in the exact same year, in 1989 you had the Mercedes Sauber C9, the Jaguar XJR-9 and the Porsche 962C competing against each other for the win.

^This is actually much more accurate and realistic because these 3 cars actually raced against each other and were all built to win Le Mans, in fact, all 3 of them won Le Mans at one point. The Porsche in 86/87 - Jaguar in 88 and the C9 in 89.


Much unlike the 3 cars we need for this trophy where only one won Le Mans, one other never won Le Mans and the other never even raced.

The trophy description is misleading (not just misleading, but straight up wrong), and I would bet my every cent that it was on purpose.


This could've easily been described as:

"Buy 3 legendary cars that were supposed to face each other at Le Mans" - Which is not saying outright which cars it is but it gives us players an actual way to figure them out.

From the trophy description, the XJ13 simply doesn't fit at all. While several other cars, fit to an absolute T.

The description could be a whole lot better but people used the word destined in similar circumstances all the time. Every kid racing karts thinks they are destined to one day win the F1 world championship. Few of them do. LeClerc seems destined to win it with Ferrari this year. Maybe he will, maybe he won't. Destiny is akin to hope and obviously as this is a Japanese game something could well have been lost in translation. It's sort of like when people say "I'm literally dying of thirst" when they really mean they are very thirsty.

 

[Grimm6Jack]

I think they should've replaced this trophy with "Complete Collection - Own one of every car available in game".

It takes away the mystery and makes it a longer term thing for the lifespan of the game.

Or this!!!
If collecting cars is the focus of the game (which is in your profile page), I wouldn't mind this kind of trophy. And it's direct to the point.

 

[Famine]

Maybe we're looking at this in too much detail.

Not really, no.

The words used in the trophy description do not lead to the correct conclusion of the task required for the trophy. That's not "detail", rather the entire object.

There is no reasonable way to conclude that the XJ13 - a car that never won a race, never raced a race, was never completed, and which the car modelled in the game is actually really only an officially recognised recreation of built by a third party - is one of the correct three cars from the words used in the trophy description.

Look at the other trophies and their descriptions. In each case - with the exception of Rain Royalty and Time Attacker - the exact task is laid out with the correct words. Buy 10 sets of wheels, reach a speed of 600km/h, finish a Sport Mode race. None of these tasks lead you down the wrong path.

Time Attacker is technically wrong because you don't need to enter 100 time trials, only complete 100 laps in time trials... but then each lap is itself a time trial so that's an easy confusion, and ultimately you will pick it up for completing 100 separate time trials as well. Rain Royalty is technically wrong because there is no "rain license"... you just need to complete each license test which features rain, and you'll inevitably do that in the course of picking up the other licence trophies.


This one though uses wording that does not lead to the correct conclusion at all and you cannot pick it up by doing what is asked. More to the point, it leads to expensive (time-consuming) incorrect conclusions; there are eight different cars in the game that are both in the Legends dealer and which won 24 hour races and two more that are in the Legends dealer and which later won 24 hour races. That's ten candidate cars, rocking an average of five million credits each...

... and the 12m credit Jaguar XJ13 isn't one of them. If you were misled by the trophy description, you could be out 50 million+ credits discovering this fact and still not own the correct cars until the next time the XJ13 rotates into stock.


Not exactly "detail", is it.

An appropriate description would have been something like "Acquired three legendary race cars that were once intended to fight for the 1967 24 Hours of Le Mans". There's no real room for (mis)interpretation there.

The description could be a whole lot better but people used the word destined in similar circumstances all the time. Every kid racing karts thinks they are destined to one day win the F1 world championship. Few of them do. LeClerc seems destined to win it with Ferrari this year. Maybe he will, maybe he won't.

Terribly florid, but inaccurate - and also looking the wrong way down the timeline.

Looking to the future and saying something that might happen is destined is... poetic, but not apt. Looking to the past and saying something that did happen was destined is appropriate.

The wording in the trophy description looks to the past and says something that didn't happen was destined. Which is wrong.

Destiny is akin to hope and obviously as this is a Japanese game something could well have been lost in translation.

It's not, and the original Japanese description is available in the first post.

 

[mrmattsly]

Hey guys… a thought. “Destined to win”. Lead the most laps but ultimately lost the races?

 

[ederss7]

My interpretation about this trophy description: the words "once destined" mean two things to me:

• it makes eligible any car that was built (for 24h races), even in its early stage of development, regardless whether it ever hit the track or not;
• it suggests cars that would have competed against each other in the same race or era;

So in my view the description (considering other languages too) fits perfectly the three cars.

 

[Samus]

it suggests cars that would have competed against each other in the same race or era;

How does it suggest that?

 

[Famine]

My interpretation about this trophy description: the words "once destined" mean two things to me:

• it makes eligible any car that was built (for 24h races), even in its early stage of development, regardless whether it ever hit the track or not

Which gives us 11 cars in Legends. Maybe 12 if you consider the 8C 2300 as a general umbrella given that others competed in and won 24hr races.

• it suggests cars that would have competed against each other in the same race or era;

But... why? How is that implied by the words used?

It also leaves four eligible cars (the Mk1 GT40 raced at Le Mans in 1967), without considering any other cars that didn't make the entry list or any other years (there's a case for 4/5/6 cars from the 1964 Le Mans) or any other 24hr races, so still open to misinterpretation even if true...

 

[ederss7]

How does it suggest that?

@Famine
The context together with the word "destined" in my view may also indicate a "crossed destiny", a possible battle between them. It's hard to explain because english isn't my native language.

 

[Famine]

The context together with the word "destined" in my view may also indicate a "crossed destiny", a possible battle between them.

The phrase used is "destined to win" not "destined to battle/fight/compete". It also says "24 hour races"; that's a plural. If it were implying the same single race it should be "a 24 hour race".

The description doesn't in any way imply they were racing for the same win - and as I said above, even if they were, that's four cars in the 1967 24 Hours of Le Mans, along with myriad other possibilities from other years and 24 hour races (since Le Mans isn't specifically mentioned either).

However you cut it, it's a flawed description even in the original Japanese, that is open to considerable, expensive (and therefore time-consuming) misinterpretation - and there's no reasonable way to conclude the task required from the description given.

 

[jpl]

Not really, no.

The words used in the trophy description do not lead to the correct conclusion of the task required for the trophy. That's not "detail", rather the entire object.

There is no reasonable way to conclude that the XJ13 - a car that never won a race, never raced a race, was never completed, and which the car modelled in the game is actually really only an officially recognised recreation of built by a third party - is one of the correct three cars from the words used in the trophy description.

Look at the other trophies and their descriptions. In each case - with the exception of Rain Royalty and Time Attacker - the exact task is laid out with the correct words. Buy 10 sets of wheels, reach a speed of 600km/h, finish a Sport Mode race. None of these tasks lead you down the wrong path.

Time Attacker is technically wrong because you don't need to enter 100 time trials, only complete 100 laps in time trials... but then each lap is itself a time trial so that's an easy confusion, and ultimately you will pick it up for completing 100 separate time trials as well. Rain Royalty is technically wrong because there is no "rain license"... you just need to complete each license test which features rain, and you'll inevitably do that in the course of picking up the other licence trophies.


This one though uses wording that does not lead to the correct conclusion at all and you cannot pick it up by doing what is asked. More to the point, it leads to expensive (time-consuming) incorrect conclusions; there are eight different cars in the game that are both in the Legends dealer and which won 24 hour races and two more that are in the Legends dealer and which later won 24 hour races. That's ten candidate cars, rocking an average of five million credits each...

... and the 12m credit Jaguar XJ13 isn't one of them. If you were misled by the trophy description, you could be out 50 million+ credits discovering this fact and still not own the correct cars until the next time the XJ13 rotates into stock.


Not exactly "detail", is it.

An appropriate description would have been something like "Acquired three legendary race cars that were once intended to fight for the 1967 24 Hours of Le Mans". There's no real room for (mis)interpretation there.

Terribly florid, but inaccurate - and also looking the wrong way down the timeline.

Looking to the future and saying something that might happen is destined is... poetic, but not apt. Looking to the past and saying something that did happen was destined is appropriate.

The wording in the trophy description looks to the past and says something that didn't happen was destined. Which is wrong.

It's not, and the original Japanese description is available in the first post.

Enjoying the game are we? 😂😂😂😂 Could've earnt some credits while typing that

 

[Grimm6Jack]

My interpretation about this trophy description: the words "once destined" mean two things to me:

• it makes eligible any car that was built (for 24h races), even in its early stage of development, regardless whether it ever hit the track or not;
• it suggests cars that would have competed against each other in the same race or era;

So in my view the description (considering other languages too) fits perfectly the three cars.

The word Destiny or Destined is not present in the original trophy description (the japanese one). You can check this in the OP.

*Your first point is negated by the fact that we had a Ford GT40 Mark I, Alfa Romeo 8C 2900, and about 10 others which have participated in Le Mans and won, followed by others which didn't won but were built to win it. Yet none of these made the trophy pop.

*Your 2nd point is just way off. Nowhere near in this trophy description, in any language, does it even imply the cars faced each other in a race. And for a fact, these 3 cars never faced each other because the XJ13 never raced.

So I really am failing to understand how you consider this description fit for these cars. It's not even a discussion mate. It is blatantly wrong.

 

[ballyn]

Much fanfare or hoopla has been made around the three required cars and their inclusion in GT games; see https://www.gran-turismo.com/us/news/02_0005293.html Also consider they have featured in a prior trophy (race against rather than collect) and have until GT 7 notoriously been among the most expensive cars.

I'm honestly surprised that it was so much of a mystery to many GT veterans as it was, but I guess I have a little confirmation bias going on as I firmly believed it to be these three cars from the beginning. The game celebrates motor history and car culture and often sacrifices or ignores rigid adherence to racing norms and modern conventions to do so.

In the spirit of the wording, which many feel is more spurious in nature than whimsical or poetic as I believe it was trying to be, consider that;

• In the 1950's Jaguar had achieved some 5 victories, most with the D - Type, the XJ13's predecessor.
• From 1958 to 65, Ferrari won 7 titles in all but 1 of those years, for a total of 9 up until the 1966 race.
• The only other manufacturers that put up those numbers where Bentley and Alpha Romeo, decades prior with 5 and 4 wins respectively.

Based on this alone, it can be stated as a fact that Jaguar and Ferrari have serious racing pedigree. Much the same as today we can say that Toyota's next Hyper car will be destined to win Le Mans, based on their history of being proven race winners. The same could be said of Jaguar and Ferrari (at the time) and I'm sure many debated the very likely hood of Jaguar ending Ferrari's great streak of wins with their next car.

However, there was, at the time an unknown about to upset the pecking order. Ford's entry to Le Mans. Spurred on by Ferrari rejecting their take over or whatever their motivation they caused major upset. They not only defeated Ferrari but introduced a car so advanced that it rendered Jaguar's concept irrelevant before it even raced (Jaguar's takeover debacle and end to racing not withstanding ). This (arguably) monumental event in motor sport history has been the subject of car culture and pop culture and of a recent-ish movie. It birthed a rivalry and has been a talking point for over 50 years, to say nothing of the fact that even non car enthusiasts are aware of the Ford v Ferrari rivalry even if they know nothing about the cars involved.

 

[ederss7]

The phrase used is "destined to win" not "destined to battle/fight/compete". It also says "24 hour races"; that's a plural. If it were implying the same single race it should be "a 24 hour race".

The description doesn't in any way imply they were racing for the same win - and as I said above, even if they were, that's four cars in the 1967 24 Hours of Le Mans, along with myriad other possibilities from other years and 24 hour races (since Le Mans isn't specifically mentioned either).

However you cut it, it's a flawed description even in the original Japanese, that is open to considerable, expensive (and therefore time-consuming) misinterpretation - and there's no reasonable way to conclude the task required from the description given.

As a said, you have to consider the context. You are taking every single word literally.
The first time I read this trophy I was 99% sure it was the cars from GT5.

The word Destiny or Destined is not present in the original trophy description (the japanese one). You can check this in the OP.

*Your first point is negated by the fact that we had a Ford GT40 Mark I, Alfa Romeo 8C 2900, and about 10 others which have participated in Le Mans and won, followed by others which didn't won but were built to win it. Yet none of these made the trophy pop.

*Your 2nd point is just way off. Nowhere near in this trophy description, in any language, does it even imply the cars faced each other in a race. And for a fact, these 3 cars never faced each other because the XJ13 never raced.

So I really am failing to understand how you consider this description fit for these cars. It's not even a discussion mate. It is blatantly wrong.

My first point is not negated. Of course those cars could pop the trophy, but PD had to choose three.
About my second point: yes, literally it doesn't. You have to consider the context.