Time Trial Discussion

  • Thread starter seadog777
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So I am thinking now, I might be wrong it would not be first time, but my conclusion, not only reading this table but all comments on this forum is that the faster the car and the more challenging the track is, with fast S parts, the more difficult it is, and more people on controllers have harder time reaching gold, (placements) in general. So it might be of course skills that are part of results, but it also might be that controllers just cant handle fast challenges like this one, Road Atlanta + GT Red Bull X2019, equally fast like players playing on steering wheels and pedals.
Maybe I am not saying anything revolutionary here, but Kaz did claim that game will be played equally on controllers and wheels, but, IDK, maybe it is not really true what Kaz claim?

It would be ideal if someone who is really skilled could prove if he/she can reach same times in with both wheel and controller?

(or I am just finding excuse for myself that I cant reach gold this time haha )
As someone pointed out above, controllers can't get the same steering angles at these high speed combos.

Since the analogue stick has such a small range of motion PD has to synthetically generate the steering angles and change over time to mimic that of a wheel, otherwise you'd be able to go from max right to max left steering in unrealistic (and unphysical) times which would also make driving impossible.

To be fair to PD they've done a good job with controller steering, but in these unrealistic, high down force, high speed cars there seems to be a crossover where their model moves the steering input a lot slower (relatively speaking) than you can with a wheel. Generally the faster you're driving the less steering angle and slower change you get even if you point the stick as far left and right as you can, which mimics what you would do with a wheel in order to not loose control of the car.

In my experience as well, with a wheel and force feedback you can often more adequately keep the wheels pointing where you want them to go over curbs which makes it easier to be consistent and take the crazy lines the top guys are doing.

If you're on controller I think it's best to follow gotmaxpowers example above and take cleaner lines. Trying to mimic the top wheel times requires extremely fast changes to steering input which doesn't seem to be possible on controller, and as you can see from this thread people even see a benefit to reducing the force on their wheel so they can turn it faster. Gold is possible on controller on this one, but I agree you're at a disadvantage, whereas in the slower cars it is more debatable.
 
speaking about T1...
I'm quite angry with myself

I can constantly make it lifting a bit, 280-285kmh, if a try it flat out (for me its 300kmh), I nail it one out of five times.

I'm trying to convince my brain that in terms of reaction time and things to do these 15kmh difference shouldn't make that of a difference with this car, but my brain does not collaborate, my foot here and there takes control and lifts, my hands reacts with disjointed movements
 
zjn
speaking about T1...
I'm quite angry with myself

I can constantly make it lifting a bit, 280-285kmh, if a try it flat out (for me its 300kmh), I nail it one out of five times.

I'm trying to convince my brain that in terms of reaction time and things to do these 15kmh difference shouldn't make that of a difference with this car, but my brain does not collaborate, my foot here and there takes control and lifts, my hands reacts with disjointed movements
Turn in at the end of the tarmac on the left and concentrate on hitting the kerb at the apex. You’ll be able to take it flat every time.
 
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Top time was lowered. Gold now 1:00.267.
Trying my best not to jinx it, but IIRC, it seems they only improved the top time by a thousand of a second for now. Crazy.

Edit: nevermind. Just checked the top time. They improved more than a thousand of a second. Only the gold requirement got reduced a thousand of a second, from 0.268 to 0.267.
 
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Jesus Christ!

EAD0B550-8225-4BB9-837C-A083567712A2.jpeg
 
Holy Moly!

This must be down to pixel level now. These people are incredibly talented IMHO. I am happy to sit this one out, as the best I can manage on "test" is a sluggish 1:04. 😔

Best regards to all here and Merry Christmas to you all.

Ian.
 
I have skipped the past 2 TTs (Escudo at Willow and R34 at Interlagos) due to time constrains (and being sick of the game to be honest with its piss poor updates), so I can't objectively tell, but other than the last 2, this one with the Red Bull X2019 is so far, the hardest one to get gold, by far.

It's the only one so far that after a 60-70km session I still haven't gotten gold on my own (without using the Ghost of a higher time or watching the best time's lap).

And from the looks of it, only the top 1600ish of all people have gotten the gold time. So yeah, this one is going to be very hard.
It's probably because the track is so short and technical and the car is so fast with lots of downforce, which makes the margin of 3% in seconds, a lot less.

Majority of the TTs have been giving us over 3-4 seconds of leeway into the gold times. This one is below 2 seconds... Now take into account that this track has a few tight corners and that throttle input at lower than 4th/5th gear with this car (no TC) is of utmost importance to not spin or lose traction, and you have a really hard challenge to overcome.

I like it... And I'll definitely try to aim for a 59 second time. I'm 1 second off... But I believe that I have a lot of learning to do to nail turn 2, turn 6 and the final chicane and get that 1 second off my time. It's the corners where quite clearly I'm noticing I'm losing time.
 
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If I can easily do it, you can too.
I wouldn't say that.

Sometimes, different cars suit different players. Regardless, tomorrow I'll see a lap of the best time and put a ghost in front of me to follow it and get better.
A 58 second lap is definitely out of question for me. And from the looks of it, it's out of question even for DualSense/DS4 users as well. As usual, with high downforce cars, the controller's steering response is simply not going to keep up with an actual wheel.
 
Trying my best not to jinx it, but IIRC, it seems they only improved the top time by a thousand of a second for now. Crazy.

Edit: nevermind. Just checked the top time. They improved more than a thousand of a second. Only the gold requirement got reduced a thousand of a second, from 0.268 to 0.267.
That's not how math works, my friend. The gold time is simply 1.03 x the best time. The old best time was 58.542 and it is now 58.512... making the old gold time 60.298, and now it's 60.267. We have a .030" and .031" delta, respectfully.
 
Okay, so I took another stab tonight after my last post. I didn't really want to, but it was better to try and get it out of the way and not be forced to go again at the buzzer if when the silver time drops below my best.

It took me forever to put down some "fast" laps. I just couldn't get into the groove. In fact, I restarted 4 times before I even put down a single lap, because I went off turn 1 in three of those tries and turn 5 the other attempt. :banghead: I had another stretch of 4 straight invalid laps later where I went lawn mowing.

I think it was lap 20? before I finally dipped down to my previous best; a low 1:01.4. I was able to whittle it down lap by lap after that, though always leaving time on the table in either the first sector or the final chicane. Eventually I got down to 1:01.199, while still an imperfect lap. I feel a safe silver with that time, I think...:scared:
 
That's not how math works, my friend. The gold time is simply 1.03 x the best time. The old best time was 58.542 and it is now 58.512... making the old gold time 60.298, and now it's 60.267. We have a .030" and .031" delta, respectfully.
Yeah, I was sure the previous gold requirement was 0.268 instead of 0.298, the math didn't make any sense when I saw how much the actual best time had dropped. I thought PD may have changed the equation after the latest update, but no.
 
Idk what I’m doing in turn 3 (after the esses) but it seems like I get a track limit penalty like 70% of the time trying to take the “on the grass” line I see in every fast lap.

Is it more likely that I’m getting it for being too far on the grass? Or is it that I need to keep both tires on the big curb at the exit?
 
First one that I'm not in the golds yet. 1:00.349 on dualsense... and it wasn't the best first sector, I must have nailed (for me) s2/3. I am awfully inconsistent though and usually restart a dozen times before getting a full lap. I'm not sure if I'll get a chance to have another attempt on gold. Gutted tbh.
 
That was just... crazy. Especially given that I'm playing with the DS4. I have no idea how many km's it took me for that laptime, definitely more than 2000.

View attachment 1216400
First one that I'm not in the golds yet. 1:00.349 on dualsense... and it wasn't the best first sector, I must have nailed (for me) s2/3. I am awfully inconsistent though and usually restart a dozen times before getting a full lap. I'm not sure if I'll get a chance to have another attempt on gold. Gutted tbh.
Yeah, no wonder... I've driven a 400 km session today and I'm still not on gold... Best so far I did was a 1:00:557 with a combined best sector times of 1:00.072.

I'm so terribly inconsistent in the first sector (the final turn of the esses especially), in the U turn and in the final chicane, it's borderline crazy. Not a single TT so far I've stuggled with Gold. This is a first. I'm also using a DualSense.

I didn't want to... But at this point, I'm probably going to use assists... More specifically, Traction Control at least on 1 to see if I can be more consistent. Drives me crazy how this car has sooooo little traction even in 4th/5th gears in corner exits at full throttle.

This makes all other TTs look disgustingly easy by comparison.
 
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So I am thinking now, I might be wrong it would not be first time, but my conclusion, not only reading this table but all comments on this forum is that the faster the car and the more challenging the track is, with fast S parts, the more difficult it is, and more people on controllers have harder time reaching gold, (placements) in general. So it might be of course skills that are part of results, but it also might be that controllers just cant handle fast challenges like this one, Road Atlanta + GT Red Bull X2019, equally fast like players playing on steering wheels and pedals.
Maybe I am not saying anything revolutionary here, but Kaz did claim that game will be played equally on controllers and wheels, but, IDK, maybe it is not really true what Kaz claim?

It would be ideal if someone who is really skilled could prove if he/she can reach same times in with both wheel and controller?

(or I am just finding excuse for myself that I cant reach gold this time haha )
You are right. Last patch reduce the steering angle a bit. Hopefully they bring it back with the next patch. Its always a back and forth with these patches. I wish we had the same 1:1 input to wheel translation like the steering wheel user. Is hard to catch the wheel racer imo.
 
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The wheel inputs that are faster and more precise than the controllers...

I have to slow down like 20-30kph more on on the S section to actually make the turns, and in a lower gear (for better rotation), like 3rd and 4th, while these guys do it in 4th-5th and at higher speed.
Same car placement... I even tried it with the ghost pretty much glued to me to notice it.
Sometimes I even turn earlier, while not bumping kerbs or running into the grass, and yet I still go wider than they go turning later and at higher speeds.

One more thing that is, quite an obvious advantage, are the pedals for much better brake/throttle control. But that's just natural. Nothing can really be done about that. You have to be an alien controller user to have the same control with both inputs with just your fingers on R2/L2 or analog sticks.

However, the way the wheel just turns that much more precisely and faster than the controller is really noticeable at the higher levels in technical tracks and fast/dowforce cars.

As I said before, I'll be damned if a controller user is capable of doing a sub 59.5, and I will take my hat off for a sub 59...
 

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