Uncharted 2: Among Thieves

[Famine]

So because NFS Shift and GT share many of the same cars and tracks makes them the same? Ok.

So you're complaining that an action/adventure games has you doing the things that make it an action/adventure game? Hilarious. That's like playing Mario and complaining that you have to jump between platforms and jump on mushroom guys. As for the other stuff...the Half Life games also have sequences where you lose your guns, have to jump between platforms (or fall to your death), and even solve puzzles. Must mean it's just like Tomb Raider.

Depends how much like Tomb Raider it is. If it's a lot like Tomb Raider then, yes, it's like Tomb Raider.

What's the problem here?

Uncharted has many differences in mechanics that make it a much more enjoyable experience...one of the most significant is the fact that you dont NEED a picture perfect jump in order to not die (btw if you fell to your death a lot in Uncharted, please, play different games. I don't play these types of games much but had no problem navigating most of the platforming areas). Drake would hang onto ledges if you were a little short...hand to hand combat was awesome. Controls were crisp. The story presentation is lightyears beyond anything in TR. But nope, they're in the same genre so they're the same.

I'll play exactly what games I want, thanks.

The differences you've come up with so far are:

• Jumping is easier
• You can punch people
• The controls work
• Nice cutscenes
• You enjoyed it more

And yet you're still happy to denigrate others who note that there are very, very many similarities?

Many of your complaints are the core things that make action/adventure games what they are, so yes, you hit the nail on the head here.

I've been playing games since 1980. I've played thousands of games, seen the evolution of existing genres and the creation of entirely new ones (much more rarely). After all of that experience I can say that Uncharted reminds me very strongly of Tomb Raider. Not any other game in the "action/adventure game" genre. Tomb Raider.

And I only have one complaint - that it is very similar to Tomb Raider. All those other things? They were the similarities...

 

[Omnis]

I have to agree with Famine. The demo of Uncharted 1 was enough for me to pass on it. Tomb Raider-style game in the jungle? No thanks. Adventure games bore me to tears.

I'm very willing to check out Uncharted 2 though. I hope the online portion isn't gimmicky and frustrating as hell like Metal Gear Online was.

 

[Custer85]

I loved Uncharted 1 and buying Uncharted 2 is a nobrainer for me. I never really liked Tomb Raider, but after playing Uncharted i wanted to try the new Tomb Raider, but after that i thought Uncharted was superior in every aspect, especially the shooting and climbing.

I dont care that much for multiplayer, but i might give it a try.

@Omnis:
I liked MGO, though iam not into multiplayer that much, i felt MGO was a lot of fun, especially after you got into it. It was even more fun to me than Killzone 2 multiplayer.

The only multiplayergames i ever played extensively were Battlefield 1942, Battlefield 2, Call of Duty 2 and Dawn of War 1 and 2. I might be playing GT5 online, since i have a wheel now and the ai is not that challenging.

 

[FoolKiller]

Perhaps I should point out to people that Famine never once said it was a bad game, just that he didn't like it (well, he did say hate).

I'm playing the first one right now (rental) and...

I'm afraid I hate it. Not as much as I hated Fallout and some distance less than I hated PAIN, but I do hate it.

And it's a pity, because I like Naughty Dog's stuff. Crash Bandicoot without them was pap. Jak and Daxter was great but this...

It's Tomb Raider. I don't like Tomb Raider, whatever the wrapper. It's a very pretty wrapper, but it's still Tomb Raider.


So, like Fallout, I'll rock up that Platinum and send it back.

Look, he also hated Fallout, another game that is apparently good (I haven't played it but some friends won't shut up about it).

The only thing that can be inferred to comment on the quality is that he doesn't find it to be original. And let's be honest, treasure hunting in a jungle, gun play, platforming, and fighting zombies mutants are not original, and do sound a lot like Tomb Raider on the surface. Even I have complained about the unoriginality of the zombies mutants in all games these days, including in the first Uncharted. When zombies/mutants/infected/whatever they call flesh eating, transformed, pale gray skinned humans show up it is a definite sign of a lack of creativity when attempting to prevent the story from becoming monotonous.

Famine just notices a lot more of this throughout the entire game.

 

[Famine]

Fallout is a love it/hate it game though.

I know some people who think it's the best thing ever. Others complain about just how damn boring it is. There doesn't seem to be a middle ground. Looked nice, but was pretty much a dice-rolling RPG with a computer rolling the dice - and all that walking!

Uncharted did everything it did very well and was very pretty. Still hated it.

 

[Shokz]

Am i odd?

I mean, i hate Tomb Raider. Damn thing.

And i have to say i LOVED Uncharted, the only bad section was the last little bit with the mutants; if it was at least a little more realistic i think i would have enjoyed it even more (i mean, considering it seemed a reasonably "serious" game).

From the Beta (just from getting to play online), i can say without much doubt, judging from the way the game handles, how the graphics are, and the different locations available, that the single player should be even more awesome than last time.

The multiplayer can be pretty fun, the only problem i have is that aiming can be a little awkward sometimes with the over the shoulder viewpoint, but otherwise, it's something that i'm pretty impressed by.

Preordered it a while back, and i've got to say that judging from the Beta, i made the right decision.

 

[FoolKiller]

Am i odd?

I mean, i hate Tomb Raider. Damn thing.

And i have to say i LOVED Uncharted, the only bad section was the last little bit with the mutants; if it was at least a little more realistic i think i would have enjoyed it even more (i mean, considering it seemed a reasonably "serious" game).

No, you are not odd. In fact, I agree with every single thing you said here.

 

[Omnis]

@Omnis:
I liked MGO, though iam not into multiplayer that much, i felt MGO was a lot of fun, especially after you got into it. It was even more fun to me than Killzone 2 multiplayer.

MGO was a headache unless you were part of the first contingent of players who leveled up. And even that was a grind. If you weren't leveled up, it was impossible to make any progress because you would just get shut down by other players with their abilities unlocked and stats boosted.

Hopefully UC2 is more balanced.

 

[Nicko]

Many thanks for that review a few posts earlier, desperate for Uncharted 2!

 

[Mad Matt]

Perhaps the reason I still quite like Uncharted is that I played Tomb Raider for about ten minutes, hated it and stopped (I appreciate that there'll be lots of people who liked it, but I didn't. Just a matter of taste). So I've still got some tolerance, whereas it sounds like Famine played Tomb Raider to the bitter end, despite hating it (sadist perhaps?).

I suppose I find Uncharted a bit like the film Transporter. I watched the film and there was nothing brilliant about it but for some reason I enjoyed it and have watched it loads of times. It's silly, unrealistic, has got a corny plot but makes me smile and doesn't require too much thought.

Someone said Uncharted 2 is a no-brainer. Well I find myself encumbered with a smallish brain, but never-the-less I think I'll buy it and hope that it's better than Transporter 2!

 

[Famine]

Masochist, but yes.

I can't get a game and not finish it. In fact I have done only once so far - Sonic Unleashed. It bugs me no end, but in the case of that game it'd bug me more having to play it.

 

[Mad Matt]

Sorry, yes masochist.

I can understand some of the kids finishing all the games but I just don't know where you get the time from. I'm still only about 90% completed on Uncharted and even less on MGS. I'm on the last scene of Resistance but I did finish Resistance 2. The only time I male significant progress is if I'm off with a cold for a few days over winter.

 

[kingcars]

Depends how much like Tomb Raider it is. If it's a lot like Tomb Raider then, yes, it's like Tomb Raider.

What's the problem here?



I'll play exactly what games I want, thanks.

The differences you've come up with so far are:

• Jumping is easier
• You can punch people
• The controls work
• Nice cutscenes
• You enjoyed it more

And yet you're still happy to denigrate others who note that there are very, very many similarities?



I've been playing games since 1980. I've played thousands of games, seen the evolution of existing genres and the creation of entirely new ones (much more rarely). After all of that experience I can say that Uncharted reminds me very strongly of Tomb Raider. Not any other game in the "action/adventure game" genre. Tomb Raider.

And I only have one complaint - that it is very similar to Tomb Raider. All those other things? They were the similarities...

I suppose my classification of "action/adventure" was a bit too ambiguous, but I'm talking about the whole Indiana Jones style games...I guess we could call it a sub genre. Apparently you're simply not a fan of the sub genre occupied by games like Tomb Raider and Uncharted; yes they have many similarities but so do Gran Turismo and NFS. So do Killzone and Unreal Tournament. IL-2 Sturmovic and Blazing Angels. The similarities are genre specific ones; that's what I'm getting at. The difference for me is that one game did it perfectly and the other one fell way short.

 

[Famine]

Apparently you're simply not a fan of the sub genre occupied by games like Tomb Raider and Uncharted

No, I'm not a fan of Tomb Raider and Uncharted.

 

[kingcars]

No, I'm not a fan of Tomb Raider and Uncharted.

Thanks for backing up my point...

 

[Famine]

Thanks for backing up my point...

I didn't.

 

[FoolKiller]

Thanks for backing up my point...

But he may still be a fan of that sub genre. All he said was he didn't like two specific games, not the sub genre they exist in.

I don't like Need for Speed (need to try Shift) or Test Drive games, but I don't dislike arcade racers. In fact, I love Burnout Paradise.

I didn't.

Aren't you busy modding the GT5 forum?

 

[Famine]

Aren't you busy modding the GT5 forum?

I'm mainly avoiding it. There's only so many of exactly the same kind of post from complete polar opposite points of view one mod can take in one day.

But he may still be a fan of that sub genre. All he said was he didn't like to specific games, not the sub genre they exist in.

I don't like Need for Speed (need to try Shift) or Test Drive games, but I don't dislike arcade racers. In fact, I love Burnout Paradise.

Perfect example.

I dislike both Forza and Ferrari Challenge, but there's this quite similar game called Gran Turismo or something that I'm quite partial to.

 

[Sprite]

Ok so this game looks very pretty and shiny, but under the fresh new more polished graphics how different is it going to be?

I loved TR1; from then on in; the franchise tumbled down hill like a very heavy sack of rotten potatoes. I even tried to get back into the franchise on the PS2 with TR: Legend and at first it was a good game but after the first two chapters it followed the franchise down the slippery slope to being cliche and ridicules.

Like Famine I have played games since the 80's and creativity of game creation was at its best (In my own opinion) but as the market grew and consoles came onto the scene trash became the staple and the demo scene and other creative outlets within the gaming arena got bypassed for the money.

Naughty Dog are one of the few game houses I respect, because they still hold values of story and art direction high above how much turnover can they squeeze out of a game or franchise, unlike some other big names **Cough EA Cough, Cough** so I have high hopes for this game, but I have to agree along with Famine and say that this particular franchise smells so much of Tomb Raider that I have to admit to steering clear of the first game till way after it was a regular in the bargain bin.

Do I like this type of gaming? Yes, will I ever complete Uncharted 1? Probably not now I know it has zombie/mutants in, Will I play Uncharted 2? Yes, just for the eye candy on offer and to see if the story grabs hold.

I really hope this isn't the same old wolf in a new nightie.

 

[kjb]

I feel the same way about Uncharted 1. I never bought it but I intended to get it at some time or another but after hearing about the mutants/zombies I kinda lost interest. I am very interested in Uncharted 2 so much so that I have pre-ordered it. Everything that I have seen read has gotten me excited about this game. Hopefully there are no mutants/zombies that has become so cheesy to me. It's like when you run out of story ideas let's throw some zombies/mutants in.

 

[kingcars]

Perfect example.

I dislike both Forza and Ferrari Challenge, but there's this quite similar game called Gran Turismo or something that I'm quite partial to.

There's a difference. You obviously don't dislike driving cars. However, you have clearly stated that you do dislike platforming and hunting for treasure in a jungle setting, as seen here:

You're doing the same thing as Lara (hunting an ancient treasure in Central America) by doing the same thing as Lara (jumping, "puzzle" solving, swimming, falling to your death several times)

Those are some of the core mechanics of the sub genre, hence why we're back at my original point. It's like hating GTA sandbox style games (which has become its own sort of sub genre) then wondering why you also hate Saints Row and Mafia.

 

[Famine]

There's a difference. You obviously don't dislike driving cars. However, you have clearly stated that you do dislike platforming and hunting for treasure in a jungle setting, as seen here.

Fascinating. You managed to cite a quote which clearly stated nothing of the sort.

Read what's written. Stop inventing things in your head and pretending I've said them.

It's like hating GTA sandbox style games (which has become its own sort of sub genre) then wondering why you also hate Saints Row and Mafia.

Amusingly I like the GTA games and hate Saints Row.

 

[kingcars]

Fascinating. You managed to cite a quote which clearly stated nothing of the sort.

Read what's written. Stop inventing things in your head and pretending I've said them.

So wait...the things you mentioned in that quote are things you LIKE about the game? If I remember correctly, that was a post where you mentioned what you DISLIKE about the game.

Later in the same post...

But the overall feeling is... Tomb Raider. And that's disappointing for a fan of Naughty Dog's previous work.

I suppose that translates into "I like the game because of the Tomb Raider-esque subgenre stuff it does?" Man, I guess I should go back to school.

Amusingly I like the GTA games and hate Saints Row.

It's quite normal and extremely common to like one game in a certain subgenre and dislike another game in the same subgenre. Has absolutely nothing to do with what I was getting at.

 

[Famine]

So wait...the things you mentioned in that quote are things you LIKE about the game?

No. They were similarities. Read it again:

You're doing the same thing as Lara (hunting an ancient treasure in Central America) by doing the same thing as Lara (jumping, "puzzle" solving, swimming, falling to your death several times), occasionally losing all your weapons like Lara (and upgrading your pistol to bigger pistols, uzis, shotguns) and facing the same enemies as Lara (right down to the "mutants"). The mechanics, the cutscenes, the plot - it's all Tomb Raider updated for the 21st century.

Can you see where I said "I like" or "I hate" anywhere in there?

If I remember correctly, that was a post where you mentioned what you DISLIKE about the game.

You don't remember correctly. Going back and checking what is actually written saves having to use your memory at all.

Make up your mind dude, good lord.

I did. You are trying to ascribe to me a position I never stated, hinted or implied. You have made it up and are pretending that it is absolute fact. I'm getting very bored of it now. Cease.

I suppose that translates

You do not need to translate anything. You do not need to interpret anything. You do not need to infer anything. What is written is what is written - nothing more, nothing less.

It's quite normal and extremely common to like one game in a certain subgenre and dislike another game in the same subgenre. Has absolutely nothing to do with what I was getting at.

Except that you told me that I hate all games in that subgenre because I hate these two games, which is a position not supported by logic, reality or anything I have said.

And lest we forget, you started this off because I compared Uncharted with Tomb Raider. First it was:

Uncharted = Tomb Raider? That's laughable at best.

And now it's:

the sub genre occupied by games like Tomb Raider and Uncharted.

 

[TB]

Can we get back to discussing Uncharted 2, pwetty pwease?

*looks at Famin's sig* I see you found a new admirer! Aww...

 

[Famine]

In the words of Bill Bailey, I am a Mecca for those with no agenda.

 

[yeti]

Slightly off-topic here - but what's "a nightmare tosser"?

C.

 

[Famine]

There's an obvious answer...

dancardesigner is.

 

[kingcars]

No. They were similarities. Read it again:

You said you hated Tomb Raider. Then you made comparisons of features in Tomb Raider...a game which you hate.

I don't like Tomb Raider

Can you see where I said "I like" or "I hate" anywhere in there?

Read above.

You don't remember correctly. Going back and checking what is actually written saves having to use your memory at all.

Take your own advice.

I did. You are trying to ascribe to me a position I never stated, hinted or implied. You have made it up and are pretending that it is absolute fact. I'm getting very bored of it now. Cease.

So a game that you compare to a game you hate means that you like those things? OK.

Except that you told me that I hate all games in that subgenre because I hate these two games, which is a position not supported by logic, reality or anything I have said.

Once again, take your own advice. You clearly said you disliked Tomb Raider. Then you went and mentioned the features that Uncharted shares with it. Unless your mind has created some logical fallacy where you DO LIKE the features/aspects/implementation of a game without actually liking the game (in the case of Tomb Raider), I fail to see where your argument holds ground.

And lest we forget, you started this off because I compared Uncharted with Tomb Raider. First it was:



And now it's:

Just because two games are in the same sub genre doesn't mean they're near identical like you seem to think. Good try grasping at straws.

Anyways, I'm done with this. I hate dealing with argument dancing.

 

[Famine]

You said you hated Tomb Raider. Then you made comparisons of features in Tomb Raider...a game which you hate.

In two different posts.

So a game that you compare to a game you hate means that you like those things? OK.

Who said that? Where?

Once again, take your own advice. You clearly said you disliked Tomb Raider. Then you went and mentioned the features that Uncharted shares with it. Unless your mind has created some logical fallacy where you DO LIKE the features/aspects/implementation of a game without actually liking the game (in the case of Tomb Raider), I fail to see where your argument holds ground.

I can only imagine you're doing this on purpose now.

I said I hated Uncharted and compared it directly to Tomb Raider.
You said that such a comparison wasn't "knowledgeable".
I made a list of direct similarities between the two games.
You changed your mind and said that actually the two games belong to the "same sub-genre"

At no point did the list of similiarities contain "and I hate this" or "and I hate games that you have to do this in". YOU have made this up from your own interpretation. YOU have decided that since I hate two games that are so similar (despite initially insisting quite firmly that they are nothing alike) I must also hate every feature that makes them similar on no evidence at all.


I have made my position clear with the words I have actually said. You have invented a completely different position with words you have made up in your head and are using it as a basis to attack me.

I hate Uncharted. I hate Tomb Raider. They are very similar in many respects. I don't hate OR like the specific respects that make them similar. I don't hate ALL games in this "sub-genre".

Just because two games are in the same sub genre doesn't mean they're near identical like you seem to think. Good try grasping at straws.

What the hell are you talking about now?

Anyways, I'm done with this. I hate dealing with argument dancing.

Then stop inventing things you can argue with.