Who can do an F1 game right?

[MagpieRacer]

I always appreciate a mature and balanced view. I also agree we are too much in a tush to call something trash or disaster.

At the same time…just for myself, I know 100% that the F1 2023, 2024 is not the same quality of a game as GT7. Yet, it costs the same. I am able to play GT7 and for me the experience is very solid. Tore deg predictable, TC and other assists too. I see a lot of passion for cars and racing. Noone told me anything about GT7, I just tried it and it was amazing. Not perfect. When I compare an F1 game to it that costs the same, I know what I think - to me, it is not worth it. In fact, seeing what GT7 is, I think it should cost more.

And yet to long term Gran Turismo fans, such as me, it doesn't even rank in the top 3 in the series. Like the F1 games, it's all a matter of perspective. F1 and Gran Turismo are completely different beasts with completely different requirements in development, hard to compare. And PD haven't exactly got clean hands when it comes to messing with the physics update to update.

 

[Lightpilgrim]

I am in no contest to say much as I simply have no knowledge and experience, like you. And I respect what you say…I see some glimpses of it: event the change from 1.55 to 1.56. Also I came to realize the times in CE had to be adjusted due to the change of physics.

But think about a person, like me that has no historical knowledge. I only know GT7, F1 23 and 24 and tried iRacing and ACC. For PS5…for me…between GT7 and F1 24 there is no contest and like I said, it is unfair to pay the same money for a game that has a life span of 6-8 months and is in a „beta” stage for most of this period.

And yet to long term Gran Turismo fans, such as me, it doesn't even rank in the top 3 in the series. Like the F1 games, it's all a matter of perspective. F1 and Gran Turismo are completely different beasts with completely different requirements in development, hard to compare. And PD haven't exactly got clean hands when it comes to messing with the physics update to update.

 

[m355y]

Much as in many ways GT7 is absolutely mighty, for me easily the weakest part of the package is the actual offline racing. I've recently been stockpiling the new Formula car and trying to recreate a full '92 F1 grid, and I'm pretty much there. I've even tried to adjust the PP for individual cars to make the Williams fastest etc, and when you set it up and get to turn one it looks incredible and you think 'this is the only racing game I'll ever need'. Then you actually start racing and it's a bit....deflating. The challenge just isn't there for me. Maybe I'll have a nice battle for the lead till the first stop, then for no obvious reason I'll emerge from the stops with a ten second lead, or the other car will just randomly slow and I'll just feel like the game is handing it to me, and it's just so frustrating.

For all its foibles, a game like F1 23 or ACC offers a consistent challenge. Ofcourse it's not as wide ranging and varied as GT, it's a different type of game entirely.

Maybe all this thread shows is that we're all looking for something slightly different from these games? Nobody's actually wrong, just coming from a slightly different angle.

 

[Lightpilgrim]

It might be. My main issue with the F1 game is this: it is released as a Beta product in May/June, has a life-span of 6-8 months for most people, it costs premium and it is more or less stable by Dec when the F1 season is over.

Much as in many ways GT7 is absolutely mighty, for me easily the weakest part of the package is the actual offline racing. I've recently been stockpiling the new Formula car and trying to recreate a full '92 F1 grid, and I'm pretty much there. I've even tried to adjust the PP for individual cars to make the Williams fastest etc, and when you set it up and get to turn one it looks incredible and you think 'this is the only racing game I'll ever need'. Then you actually start racing and it's a bit....deflating. The challenge just isn't there for me. Maybe I'll have a nice battle for the lead till the first stop, then for no obvious reason I'll emerge from the stops with a ten second lead, or the other car will just randomly slow and I'll just feel like the game is handing it to me, and it's just so frustrating.

For all its foibles, a game like F1 23 or ACC offers a consistent challenge. Ofcourse it's not as wide ranging and varied as GT, it's a different type of game entirely.

Maybe all this thread shows is that we're all looking for something slightly different from these games? Nobody's actually wrong, just coming from a slightly different angle.

 

[MagpieRacer]

It might be. My main issue with the F1 game is this: it is released as a Beta product in May/June, has a life-span of 6-8 months for most people, it costs premium and it is more or less stable by Dec when the F1 season is over.

I mean, I dunno, beta product? Nah I don't think that can be levelled at '24. Had a few bugs that were fixed quickly and some which were clearly trickier to negotiate (new track models etc) but beta? Not a chance. I've played F1 games in beta stages before and, that ain't it. Again, could be your lack of experience or GT7 seemingly setting an unrealistic bar for you (and let me tell you, that game did NOT have a smooth launch period.

I agree with the lifespan stuff etc, but as F1 fans and F1 gamers, we all know this, every year, and buy it anyway, perhaps if sales start dwindling sharply, the price point or selling format will shift but I can't see that happening for a while. I also don't think there's a solution to that side of it that would appease everyone. You could see it launch just before or at the start of the season and have a live service update model with paid yearly expansions and whatnot, but FOM probably won't be happy with that and selling expansions for less money, i.e. not premium, probably wouldn't cover the license and ongoing development costs. A chunk of fans might not get behind a live service model and yearly expansion due to lack of room to grow within the confines of a single title effectively.

Release later in the season will work once before ending up on the same cycle again, gives one title the chance to accelerate ahead with 6 months extra Dev time. Fans would bemoan it came too late in the season, F1 is over and it'll be out of date in 2 months but hey we got a relatively bug free game.

F1 games ultimately will always carry a premium price tag, annually, until the series completely falls flat on its face, F1 '24 commercially has had a huge stumble, but hasn't quite hit the deck. Even if CM did fall flat on their face and 2025 is the last title they release, the next Dev will just go into the same cycle of probably lower quality and we won't have an F1 game for 2 years again and miss the 2026 regs, new team, new tracks etc.

Unless milestone did it, but, yeah.

 

[Lightpilgrim]

Again, a matter of words. Until a certain patch, probably 1.14 I was able to race normally…but then something happened:
1. Ferrari engine sound got broken
2. Tires lasted 2-3 laps and then it was an abrupt loss of grip, not gradual. I was able to easily win races early in the game, but after a certain patch I had no idea how to preserve tires

It almost was launched in a better shape then it became after patches.

Imagine you purchase a real car like this:-) You would not call it a final product. Or imaging you purchase an iPhone and it never takes a single consistent picture. Or imagine you purchase an espresso machine and time after time get a very different coffee taste and quality even though each time you do precisely the same thing.

I do not know. I was not able to learn anything because things were changing all the time. I am able to learn a lot in GT7. I was just thinking I am useless when I played F1. I see that I can actually progress and be solid one day with GT7.

I tried to like it, but it did not work for me. I purchase PS5 only for F1. I was not even planking to get GT7. But I ended up in a different place than I thought.

People can do what they want with their money. If folks are happy, they will purchase F1 2025 and it will sell well. I am not going to have the same experience again. Just not a good quality product for me. And no feedback is heard. So if they do not care, what we can do:-)

I mean, I dunno, beta product? Nah I don't think that can be levelled at '24. Had a few bugs that were fixed quickly and some which were clearly trickier to negotiate (new track models etc) but beta? Not a chance. I've played F1 games in beta stages before and, that ain't it. Again, could be your lack of experience or GT7 seemingly setting an unrealistic bar for you (and let me tell you, that game did NOT have a smooth launch period.

I agree with the lifespan stuff etc, but as F1 fans and F1 gamers, we all know this, every year, and buy it anyway, perhaps if sales start dwindling sharply, the price point or selling format will shift but I can't see that happening for a while. I also don't think there's a solution to that side of it that would appease everyone. You could see it launch just before or at the start of the season and have a live service update model with paid yearly expansions and whatnot, but FOM probably won't be happy with that and selling expansions for less money, i.e. not premium, probably wouldn't cover the license and ongoing development costs. A chunk of fans might not get behind a live service model and yearly expansion due to lack of room to grow within the confines of a single title effectively.

Release later in the season will work once before ending up on the same cycle again, gives one title the chance to accelerate ahead with 6 months extra Dev time. Fans would bemoan it came too late in the season, F1 is over and it'll be out of date in 2 months but hey we got a relatively bug free game.

F1 games ultimately will always carry a premium price tag, annually, until the series completely falls flat on its face, F1 '24 commercially has had a huge stumble, but hasn't quite hit the deck. Even if CM did fall flat on their face and 2025 is the last title they release, the next Dev will just go into the same cycle of probably lower quality and we won't have an F1 game for 2 years again and miss the 2026 regs, new team, new tracks etc.

Unless milestone did it, but, yeah.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Again, a matter of words. Until a certain patch, probably 1.14 I was able to race normally…but then something happened:
1. Ferrari engine sound got broken
2. Tires lasted 2-3 laps and then it was an abrupt loss of grip, not gradual. I was able to easily win races early in the game, but after a certain patch I had no idea how to preserve tires

It almost was launched in a better shape then it became after patches.

Imagine you purchase a real car like this:-) You would not call it a final product. Or imaging you purchase an iPhone and it never takes a single consistent picture. Or imagine you purchase an espresso machine and time after time get a very different coffee taste and quality even though each time you do precisely the same thing.

I do not know. I was not able to learn anything because things were changing all the time. I am able to learn a lot in GT7. I was just thinking I am useless when I played F1. I see that I can actually progress and be solid one day with GT7.

I tried to like it, but it did not work for me. I purchase PS5 only for F1. I was not even planking to get GT7. But I ended up in a different place than I thought.

People can do what they want with their money. If folks are happy, they will purchase F1 2025 and it will sell well. I am not going to have the same experience again. Just not a good quality product for me. And no feedback is heard. So if they do not care, what we can do:-)

Can't speak for the tyre wear thing or grip, I haven't noticed that as an issue.

What did you think about the 3 or 4 physics changes there have been in GT7?

 

[Lightpilgrim]

Can't speak for the tyre wear thing or grip, I haven't noticed that as an issue.

What did you think about the 3 or 4 physics changes there have been in GT7?

I started playing GT7 on Dec 31. I do not know if there was a physics change since then. I did not notice anything. For me it is a very consistent experience so far. I am genuinely a bit shocked how much you get and for how long for the same price as an F1 game. If GT7 was 150$, it would be worth every penny for me