Why no one is talking about how ridiculously expensive the Jaguar XJ13 is?

[Gt79]

Atm the only cars should probably matter are gr1 or whatever racing cars, i drove that f40 for 1.3 mil and it's horrible, compared to f8 which is only 350k, in fact after racing gr4 and 3 everything handles like crap
Those overpriced cars only make sense if you wish to upgrade them, tune them etc, now like every other game with supposed end game scenario this should be obvious getting a thing that is better than the thing you got, gun or a car in this case, now I'd assume gr1 for example, which are easily accessible and available already would be an end game vehicles to acquire , here is the thing there is not a single race or championship available atm where you can race them, unless you make custom race etc, which is strange to say the least, well maybe it's a bug or a feature or in 6 month update, who knows with pd, it's not like they have a road map or anything

 

[Strittan]

I don't give a damn what Sony or PD want me to do...I will not put a single penny into microtransactions and I don't have to, to enjoy this game...and i also don't really care about those unicorn cars for 20mio credits, there is plenty of cheaper cars around that I am more interested in...

Some people do care about those “unicorn” cars though. Can you empathise with them?

And yes,it sucks that you can't sell cars you don't like and the credits they payout for custom races are way to low, and I hope this will get changed-you should get twice or three times as much as you get now...

So you basically agree with us who criticise the in-game economy, and just like us, you want changes. Why do you think we’re addressing these things?

but that dosen't leave me frustrated or question the game as whole...

Good for you, but just because you’re not bothered doesn’t mean no one else is, and why should those who are keep quiet?

And once again, just because I don't agree wholeheartetly with you viewpoint it doesn't make me a fanboy-because it's not up for you to decide that...you are just somebody who doesn't like the game...ant that's totally ok, but stop downgrading other people who don't share your opinion...

I like the game, I actually love some aspects of it, but that doesn’t mean I have to ignore the obvious flaws, like some.

 

[UnkaD]

Atm the only cars should probably matter are gr1 or whatever racing cars, i drove that f40 for 1.3 mil and it's horrible, compared to f8 which is only 350k, in fact after racing gr4 and 3 everything handles like crap
Those overpriced cars only make sense if you wish to upgrade them, tune them etc, now like every other game with supposed end game scenario this should be obvious getting a thing that is better than the thing you got, gun or a car in this case, now I'd assume gr1 for example, which are easily accessible and available already would be an end game vehicles to acquire

Just like in real life, a car's value isn't based on its performance compared to other cars, and the value an individual sees in a car isn't exclusively tied to performance either. I'm not chasing cars so I can win a specific race. I'm chasing cars because I want those cars.

 

[Gt79]

I like some cars that not only look good but drive good as well and none of them are expensive, so you basically chasing a carrot

 

[kjeldsen]

Oh you're a PD insider now, nice. Can you tell us what exactly will be in these monthly updates, the names of the events? Since you clearly know the plans for the next few years.

When the effort and time required to get something out of the economy is not equal to what you put in, then yes, it's broken.

If you complete all content available in a game once, you should have access to all, or nearly all, of the content. That isn't anywhere close to being true in GT7.


Yes, and you've still not once said how you plan to fund this activity. Because everyone else is having trouble, forced to grind the same event over and over unless they want it to take 12 years to be able to drive them all.

Hahaha, i can almost promise you that you won't be satisfied so there will be enough to complain about the coming years

The idea of completing all content once and getting everything handed to you would break the game for the vast majority of players, if there is nothing to gain from playing the game, then why bother. The idea is usually that as you get better you get more rewards, it's a tried and tested formula that works. But the low effort hand me down method would have saved me months of playtime in MC and BWL

There's literally been no confirmation that the cars will come back once they're "sold out." Logically they should, but PD's made plenty of design choices in GT7 that defy logic.

Killing off so many cars so fast would not defy logic, it would be stupid, so naturally they will return.

I'm struggling to understand what you mean here? What has the 25th anniversary got to do with anything?

It does feel like people forgot that games aren't supposed to be easy and that you have to earn you rewards.

 

[Johnnn]

It does feel like people forgot that games aren't supposed to be easy and that you have to earn you rewards.

???

I wonder why I played Assetto Corsa or Project cars 2 then. Maybe you should tell them your ***** ideas about racing games. OMG, it's so weird to see it... Is it even real?

 

[Samus]

Hahaha, i can almost promise you that you won't be satisfied so there will be enough to complain about the coming years

The idea of completing all content once and getting everything handed to you would break the game for the vast majority of players, if there is nothing to gain from playing the game, then why bother. The idea is usually that as you get better you get more rewards, it's a tried and tested formula that works. But the low effort hand me down method would have saved me months of playtime in MC and BWL

How would it break the game? That is literally the tried and tested formula of pretty much all games. You finish everything it has to offer, you're done. Yes there are online persistent MMO games, but GT is not one of those. I have no idea what those acronyms are.

People are done with the game. They've got no more unique races left to do, but they're still a long, long way from being able to afford all the cars. There isn't anywhere enough unique content. Nobody finished GT4 within 30 hours. Nobody wants to be just handed everything. I don't know why this has to be explained over and over and over.

It does feel like people forgot that games aren't supposed to be easy and that you have to earn you rewards.

Earning credits in GTS is not hard. It's time consuming. Again, this has been explained countless times. In other games you earn things through rewarding gameplay, challenge, fun. In GT7 to earn things you drive around a dirt track for days on end.

Besides, games can be easy, if that's what the player wants and the dev offers it.

 

[Techlet]

Killing off so many cars so fast would not defy logic, it would be stupid, so naturally they will return.

Unless PD introduces other ways of getting these cars, perhaps through in-game purchases.

 

[Johnnn]

Getting any paid car is not stupid. It's how racing games work. Blocking content is stupid and should be illegal. Imagine you buy "real racing simulator" to your kids and they have to play with 1 car only. Or waiting on some virtual offer. That's stupid!!! Come on...

 

[kjeldsen]

How would it break the game? That is literally the tried and tested formula of pretty much all games. You finish everything it has to offer, you're done. Yes there are online persistent MMO games, but GT is not one of those. I have no idea what those acronyms are.

People are done with the game. They've got no more unique races left to do, but they're still a long, long way from being able to afford all the cars. There isn't anywhere enough unique content. Nobody finished GT4 within 30 hours. Nobody wants to be just handed everything. I don't know why this has to be explained over and over and over.

Earning credits in GTS is not hard. It's time consuming. Again, this has been explained countless times. In other games you earn things through rewarding gameplay, challenge, fun. In GT7 to earn things you drive around a dirt track for days on end.

Besides, games can be easy, if that's what the player wants and the dev offers it.

This is not the first GT game that didn't hand you the keys to every car in the game, the way it works can't be a surprise.
Are we getting paid enough for the races, that is a valid question and the answer differs for every player. but if you need to do something you don't find fun to earn credits then you are playing the wrong game.

 

[Samus]

This is not the first GT game that didn't hand you the keys to every car in the game, the way it works can't be a surprise

Read the whole thread. I'm not going to explain yet again how the old games were not this bad.

. but if you need to do something you don't find fun to earn credits then you are playing the wrong game

What do you suggest people do? There are only a handful of events that give a decent number of credits. Online doesn't either.

For me custom races would be fun, but with the rate they pay out it could be 12 damn years before I could get enough credits to get all the game content.

Or like the old games, where many late game events all pay out well so you had a variety to choose from and have fun.

This has all been explained countless times but still people repeat the same falsehoods to try and explain why this is ok.

 

[Johnnn]

Oh, man, I would love custom races. 15 mins yesterday, amazing race, 9k. There is no point in launching this game.

 

[Gt79]

I remember NFS shift had this thing when you buy any car you can sell it for the same amount, this makes you not to grind for races but just sell the cars you don't need/want anymore and get another one you need/want, imagine that, ea used to not care about money, good times

 

[Johnnn]

I remember NFS shift had this thing when you buy any car you can sell it for the same amount, this makes you not to grind for races but just sell the cars you don't need/want anymore and get another one you need/want, imagine that, ea used to not care about money, good times

Yeah, but that would be fun and you would not need to buy another money from Kaz. Why is it still legal? Loot boxes are illegal but this ***** is not? I don't understand current world, I guess.

 

[Gt79]

Yeah, but that would be fun and you would not need to buy another money from Kaz. Why is it still legal? Loot boxes are illegal but this ***** is not? I don't understand current world, I guess.

It's a grey area and they getaway with it, loot boxes is something you can buy in game with real currency, in this case you just buy credits to buy anything else in the game, now if they would sell roulette tickets that would be considered as gambling

 

[Johnnn]

It's a grey area and they getaway with it, loot boxes is something you can buy in game with real currency, in this case you just buy credits to buy anything else in the game, now if they would sell roulette tickets that would be considered as gambling

Yeah, currently it's just a scam and we would need to sue them.

 

[Com Fox]

It's kind of weird seeing people compare the price to GT5s 20 million.

First off, the XJ13 was a prize car for the Indy 500. Don't know why you would buy it?

There was a GT5 Seasonal Event at the Nurburgring that earns you 500,000 per win. 1,000,000 with all the bonuses and basically became a grind saving haven (also lasted until the end of GT5s life cycle and never rotated out). Not sure if GT7 has a prize this generous as I can't get the game yet so if someone wants to correct me here, be my guess

 

[AutumnalGlow]

It's kind of weird seeing people compare the price to GT5s 20 million.

First off, the XJ13 was a prize car for the Indy 500. Don't know why you would buy it?

There was a GT5 Seasonal Event at the Nurburgring that earns you 500,000 per win. 1,000,000 with all the bonuses and basically became a grind saving haven (also lasted until the end of GT5s life cycle and never rotated out). Not sure if GT7 has a prize this generous as I can't get the game yet so if someone wants to correct me here, be my guess

GT7 doesn't have any races that can get you over 100k even with the clean race bonus, and custom races won't reach 300k.

 

[Lain]

Hot take: I actually like the rotating and high prices, makes these cars feel all the more special when you do finally get them. And the FOMO element is pretty light, since the cars will definitely come back around eventually. If it’s not a car you wanted bad enough to grind for it before it became unavailable, you probably won’t be suffering with having to wait for it to become available at a time when you’re flush with credits. And if it’s a car you do really want, the grind is generally fairly feasible.

That said, we do need more diverse ways to grind. The payouts of custom races is far too pitiful to be worth it, for instance. And it’d be nice to earn at least a little bit of money for doing time trials, too.

 

[Gt79]

Yeah, currently it's just a scam and we would need to sue them.

i talked to my lawyer friend about it, he said you would lose, simply because they not violating any rights and money is obtainable in the game, despite slow, basically you dealing with sharks who know where to sweam 😏

 

[CJ7]

Made like 15 mil grinding and I can't even buy a freaking normal WRX GC8 or an AP1 S2000. This game...

 

[Pizzicato1985]

People seems to be blinded by being cheaper instantly makes it easier to obtain. Its not. Jaguar Xj13 requires a lot more grind to obtain then earlier games. This pricing seriously needs to require some attenton. Its a clear sign of pushing MTX.

It's not the pricing I find off-putting, it's the fact that the only viable way to make credits at this point is one dirt race. If this update that is alleged to be dropping tomorrow brings us the rest of the single player that they couldn't be bothered to include at launch we might have some ways to have actually have fun while grinding credits.

Couple the poor pay-outs (due to no IB/IA/S races) with the predatory micro-transaction generator, err... I mean "Hagerty" and there is plenty to complain about, I just don't think the pricing is the problem.

 

[Johnnn]

Pricing is OK, Horizon has similar and you can earn many cars per hour with hundreds of thousands by having real fun. Not here.

i talked to my lawyer friend about it, he said you would lose, simply because they not violating any rights and money is obtainable in the game, despite slow, basically you dealing with sharks who know where to sweam 😏

They are good in it...

 

[Samus]

That said, we do need more diverse ways to grind. The payouts of custom races is far too pitiful to be worth it, for instance. And it’d be nice to earn at least a little bit of money for doing time trials, too.

That is really all anyone wants.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with making certain items or content in a game harder, or, more time consuming to acquire. Despite straw men arguments to the contrary, nobody wants all these rare and prestigious cars handed to them on a plate.

The whole problem is what the developers use as the barrier to the content. There are many games where content is behind a skill barrier.

Hollow Knight as a random example. There are a handful of endgame bosses and areas I'll never experience because I'm not good enough to beat the preceding bosses. That's fine. It's optional content not part of the main game designed to test the most skillful players. I'm not, so I won't get it. Fine.

In past GT games they have also done this, certain cars could only be acquired through Golding license tests or beating the hardest championships at the end of the game. The latter were not that hard, but still, it was a skill barrier all the same, and that was fine.

GT7 is not that. The only primary barrier they've put in is time. You can easily grind the same event over and over with little skill and eventually the barrier is broken and you get the car.

Time barriers are also fine, but the crux of the whole matter is what you do in that time. Right now PD do not respect the players time, because they are not offering anywhere near enough variety and choice to pass that barrier. It's either grind the same event over and over or play naturally, doing what you want, and the barrier is increased by a lot.

We just want to see a whole variety of ways to gain credits. Let's say PD want the rate to earn 20 million credits at 8 hours, end game.

Program the game so I can earn that racing four 2 hour races in GT3 cars, 8 races that last an hour in VW Samba Buses if that is fun to someone. Maybe someone else would prefer to do a whole lot more short races, 3 laps, each with a different car and track.

It makes no difference to PD, we've still played the game for the same eight hours and "earned" the credits but damn if we've had a lot more fun than pounding round a dirt track for 8 hours.

Someone else can correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty certain that is all anyone wants.

 

[Pizzicato1985]

allowing people to buy credits as the 'easy way out'...but only enough credits where you ultimately have to spend more money in order to get anywhere, thus repeating the cycle.

This is probably the scummiest thing of all. $20 or whatever the highest one is for 20mil credits is still predatory, but at least one would be able to buy the most expensive car(s) in the game with it. But at $20 for 2mil?! You ****ing kidding!? This is set up specifically to go "whaling" and is so wanton as to make many f2p developers blush.

Really makes me wonder if the entire point of that price/credit ratio is a "big ask" knowing it will get backlash, so that they can adjust it to be $20/20mil cred and look like the good guys to those that aren't paying attention. It's a strategy to appear to be meeting the consumer half-way without actually doing the right thing that many other devs have done, which is to remove to MTX system altogether. It just feels very psychologically calculated to me. Time will tell, I guess...

 

[RedRockValley]

In past GT games they have also done this, certain cars could only be acquired through Golding license tests or beating the hardest championships at the end of the game. The latter were not that hard, but still, it was a skill barrier all the same, and that was fine.

Exactly Samus, I just want more events where I unlock cars via my skill, not playing the same event over and over for hours to get that one car I want. That's not testing my skill, that's just testing my patience!

 

[Johnnn]

Exactly Samus, I just want more events where I unlock cars via my skill, not playing the same event over and over for hours to get that one car I want. That's not testing my skill, that's just testing my patience!

And one car is nothing. We should get 400+ cars. This is artificial scarcity on a completely crazy level. Can you imagine you add to your game some used car dealership or new car dealership? You would be fired immediately for this non-sense.

 

[HyperSpeeder]

I just don't get it.

People wanted a Gran Turismo experience that GT Sport did not provide. They wanted progression and the grind.

Now that they have it in GT7, they're complaining that they never wanted it in the first place?

The grind defines the genre. It's there in Gran Turismo and its clones (Forza above all). I grinded in GT, NFS, Forza, TDU, you name it. There's just no other way to do it unless you start padding out the progression and forcing people to play badly designed events to earn cars like Forza and The Crew do. Kaz simply copied PokéForza from FM7/FH5 and made it GT7's main focus, so people would actually have something to do after finishing the Café.

Besides, if you know how to pick your cars, there's little skill involved in this game. If you were smart enough to buy the Alfa 155 when it was available, the WTC 700 was a joke. Easier than the starter races.

 

[NotThePrez]

I just don't get it.

People wanted a Gran Turismo experience that GT Sport did not provide. They wanted progression and the grind.

No, they wanted an actual single player experience, which GT Sport didn't have initially. Grinding by no means is an automatic given with that.

Now that they have it in GT7, they're complaining that they never wanted it in the first place?

Can you point out anyone in this thread specifically saying that they didn't want actual progression? Otherwise, this tells me that you haven't actually been reading people's posts in this thread.

The grind defines the genre.

The whole of the racing game genre...is defined by grinding?

It's there in Gran Turismo and its clones (Forza above all).

Forza Horizon says hi, as do the more recent Forza Motorsport games. And I can name out a very long list of noteworthy racing games that didn't require grinding to the level that GT7 does, clones or otherwise.

I grinded in GT, NFS, Forza, TDU, you name it. There's just no other way to do it unless you start padding out the progression and forcing people to play badly designed events to earn cars like Forza and The Crew do.

So that confirms that you haven't been reading people's posts on this topic, since a major part of the issue is that there's only one event in GT7 that actually pays out a decent amount of credits.

Kaz simply copied PokéForza from FM7/FH5 and made it GT7's main focus, so people would actually have something to do after finishing the Café.

Do you actually know this as a fact? Because if that is the case, he has failed spectacularly.

Besides, if you know how to pick your cars, there's little skill involved in this game. If you were smart enough to buy the Alfa 155 when it was available, the WTC 700 was a joke. Easier than the starter races.

Totally irrelevant to the topic at hand.

 

[Samus]

I just don't get it.

Read the whole thread, it's been explained countless times where people have an issue and how it's different to the past games. Or just read post #234 if you want a summary.