Your thoughts about "standard" vs. "premium"

[Griffith500]

I wonder what percentage of cars in GT5 were featured in previous games; what about GTPSP? GT4?

What does it matter, really? Yes, I'd like some new cars, but I'd also like some of the ones I used before. The problem is, my list probably won't match anyone else's!

 

[MadduckUK]

So you are telling me that 800 cars you have driven already in other GT games wouldn't be showed up by 800 cars never before in a GT game? I dunno if I can believe that...

yes, because the 800 cars i have driven are the staple of GT, and i like GT ta very much 👍

keeping in cars from previous games means more to me than getting new ones, new ones are a bonus - old ones are expected

 

[Traviizter]

Pfft. I like the new ones, a LOT. Just makes a change.. I'm sick of always having a car I will never buy/drive/sell/like.
For example:
Who in GT4 bought the Mitsubishi MINICA DANGAN ZZ? Any takers? Mm, I thought not.

Now, gimme a Mercury Cougar, and I'm fine and dandy! I just don't want the pointless cars to be taking up my HDD space, and 'car space' which could have been used for something better (not necessarily a supercar, sometimes an average car is welcomed).

EDIT: What I should have said was that I am fine with the old (or previously 'featured') cars, just not the pointless ones.

 

[grbmrdj]

In my opinion the should have not make 200 cars with stupidly high details just to have the 80% as improved versions of GT4 cars, i would have choose 600 cars (which is a huge number still) of high detail, instead of having 200 stupidly high detailed cars and 800 stupidly low detailed cars.

Also im dissapointed of them cutting tracks locations. What they have been doing all this time and why they didnt hired a 3d design company for the other 800 cars.

the thing is, the premium cars are good enough for gt6, so the gt5 cars will obviously look worse in front of them. thats not to say they're "stupidly low detailed". just not as detailed as permium.

 

[Griffith500]

Pfft. I like the new ones, a LOT. Just makes a change.. I'm sick of always having a car I will never buy/drive/sell/like.
For example:
Who in GT4 bought the Mitsubishi MINICA DANGAN ZZ? Any takers? Mm, I thought not.

Now, gimme a Mercury Cougar, and I'm fine and dandy! I just don't want the pointless cars to be taking up my HDD space, and 'car space' which could have been used for something better (not necessarily a supercar, sometimes an average car is welcomed).

EDIT: What I should have said was that I am fine with the old (or previously 'featured') cars, just not the pointless ones.

I understand totally, but what exactly does pointless mean in this instance? And how do you determine which cars are pointless? I'm sure that for every car in GT4, there'll be at least one member who would stake a claim to it.

There are plenty of cars I'd rather have in the game over some that are in the game, but that doesn't matter really. So many times it's happened, that I've tried out a random, previously repellent car only to find it has character, or some other charm, or is just downright fun! I'm sure this has never happened for many players, though.

 

[Devedander]

yes, because the 800 cars i have driven are the staple of GT, and i like GT ta very much 👍

While it's comfortable to go with what's familiar, I can't honestly beleive a whole bevy of never before raced cars wouldn't draw a lot of joy from the GT crowd.

keeping in cars from previous games means more to me than getting new ones, new ones are a bonus - old ones are expected

Odd... usually it's considered the opposite... the new is the meat and the old is the bonus.

 

[Omamder5]

The good news is that indeed there are a ton of cars, the bad news is the vast majority of them we have all seen/used before in previous GT games. That doesn't stop them from being fun and it's still nice that your daily driver has a good chance of being in the game, however for those of us who have been through a few versions of GT it's not quite the same level of pop.

For a person who never owned a PS2 and completely missed out on GT3 and 4, however...

This selection of great cars is fantastic, and, premium or not, I'll enjoy them immensely. I will, of course, prefer premium (as any sensible person would), but I'm certainly not going to shirk on the standards, especially since they will include many of my favourite cars.

For the veterans of GT3 and 4, I guess the rehashed selection will be less than staggering. But for the new guys, or for those who might be returning, the thousand cars will be quite a treat indeed.

Plus, like many mentioned on here, there will be the physics, and that's more important than super-duper graphics.

 

[Akira AC]

Well at least we know that all Italian cars are premium,also the newest Mercedes and so on,but the point is that all cars deserves the same treatment,I just trying to get the image that you start with probably an RX7 or any other cheap mazda(which there is a premium already)and finishing the whole career maybe on F1(premium already)or with the RB.

In any case for some people there is always a favourite car(for me is the jaguar XJ220 which is very likely to be standard)and this lead to disappoint some people,but to create such disappointment out of it to actually don't play the game,at least I don't think so,I'm pretty sure that standards will not be upgrade to premium by DLC(its more likely to be saved to GT6)but in the mid time there is a lot of stuff to do.

The game was develop and planned in that way and I'm pretty sure no racing models in a game will have this level of quality in some time(two years at least,but maybe TDU with 80 cars but that's it).

Having 500 premium (as some people suggested)cars to full fill all classes of racing in the game its quite difficult(you got in example a Ferrari showdown with the same Ferraris 430 or a WRC with the same Citroen and be unable to play with older cars will eventually lead to some boredom),the game its too big to actually be filled up with 500 premiums,and some people know 1000 cars of that quality for 190 people to create them its not very possible and it will discharge some features like tracks and engine,something that everyone was exited about.

 

[Griffith500]

While it's comfortable to go with what's familiar, I can't honestly beleive a whole bevy of never before raced cars wouldn't draw a lot of joy from the GT crowd.

...

Oh, it really would! But if that were to be to the sacrificing of "older" stuff, then many would be disappointed. Look at the "bring back such-and-such" threads that have come and "gone" over the years. People are never satisfied, even with compromise

 

[analog]

Who in GT4 bought the Mitsubishi MINICA DANGAN ZZ? Any takers? Mm, I thought not.

I did but then I did buy all cars in GT4.......and almost all were fully tuned/refurbished including the Minica Dangan ZZ ( or whatever it was actually called ).

 

[Captain Roh]

One thought just occurred to me while I've been reading this debate, and it goes as follows:

Out of all the cars released between GT4 and GT5, how many are actually worthy of being in this new iteration do you think? I mean, how many would you actually want to drive? There cant have been more than 200 can there!?

6 years, 200 cars, thats 33 a year. Is that a lot? There's only one great addition to a manufacturers line up a year isnt there? Maybe two?

 

[Traviizter]

I understand totally, but what exactly does pointless mean in this instance?

By pointless I mean:
1. If the car wasn't in the game, would you know it even existed?
2. Have you driven it before?
3. Have you even seen it before?

Let me explain further.

1. = You would never have heard of it before, therefore making it pointless to have in the game.
2. = If you haven't driven it, it won't seem like it has much use.
3. = If you haven't seen it in the game (not even having one of the AI's driving it) then it means the car is just sitting there, in the used showroom, doing nothing, while another perfectly good car could be put to good use.

However, I do admit PD (or Kaz) seem to have/has a good reason to put certain cars in the game; maybe it mean't something. Pointless is the wrong word. Perhaps,.. underused.

EDIT: Scrap Point 1., it doesn't make much sense. Say I (somehow) hadn't heard of WRC, and so WRC was claimed 'pointless', then taken out of the next game?

 

[Griffith500]

By pointless I mean:
1. If the car wasn't in the game, would you know it even existed?
2. Have you driven it before?
3. Have you even seen it before?

Let me explain further.

1. = You would never have heard of it before, therefore making it pointless to have in the game.
2. = If you haven't driven it, it won't seem like it has much use.
3. = If you haven't seen it in the game (not even having one of the AI's driving it) then it means the car is just sitting there, in the used showroom, doing nothing, while another perfectly good car could be put to good use.

However, I do admit PD (or Kaz) seem to have/has a good reason to put certain cars in the game; maybe it mean't something. Pointless is the wrong word. Perhaps,.. underused.

EDIT: Scrap Point 1., it doesn't make much sense. Say I (somehow) hadn't heard of WRC, and so WRC was claimed 'pointless', then taken out of the next game?

The beauty of GT has been that it has introduced me to so many cool, interesting, awesome, or simply fun cars. I've learned that my ignorance of a car does not mean it isn't "worth" knowing about.
Points 2 and 3, then, also qualify as "ignorance", in my book.

@ Captain Roh: I think 200 - 250 cars would probably cover all the truly new releases since GT4; how many of them are "pointless" is another question - I for one would probably forego many of them

 

[Traviizter]

As I said, pointless was the wrong word. It it wasn't for GT4, I would never have known about the Mercedes-Benz Daimler Carriage and the Other one with 3 wheels

 

[analog]

Out of all the cars released between GT4 and GT5, how many are actually worthy of being in this new iteration do you think? I mean, how many would you actually want to drive? There cant have been more than 200 can there!?

6 years, 200 cars, thats 33 a year. Is that a lot? There's only one great addition to a manufacturers line up a year isnt there? Maybe two?

First off, I find it amusing this thread now focusses on which cars should or shouldn't be included or replaced as this is in my opinion separate from whether these cars are Premium or Standard in GT5.
If all or most ( as some would indeed be replaced I reckon ) cars included in GT4 were recreated as Premium those who use cockpit view would have experienced them in a new way regardless whether they were previously included and already been driven before.

Secondly, and relating to the above quote, I think it's highly subjective and varying enormously depending on personal preference as to which cars would be deemed worthy ( I know what you mean though but still ) and luckily PD has the first, last and final say in what cars will be included as we couldn't even come close to something resembling a shared consensus on which cars should be included or not ( look at the enormous amount of vehicles populating those wishlists ).

Lastly, a large car manufacturer has multiple new releases each year ( and again what constitutes a great addition is subjective ) and don't forget the total amount of Premium cars also includes quite a few classic cars so the amount of newly released cars added is even smaller.
Then hopefully the ones that are added are indeed the ones you and I would like to drive in the first place.

 

[JohnBM01]

I just got through seeing one of the GT5 drifting videos, and I can say that I'm not overly concerned about interior views. A Datsun 240Z in Gran Turismo 5 is a Datsun 240Z. It's still a great car even if it isn't Premium. And so I'm glad this car returns for its third tour of duty in a Gran Turismo game (GT1 and GT3 were the only major GTs to not feature the 240Z). I am an old-fashioned person. So what's more important to me- racing a certain car in the game, or racing a certain car in the game that is overly detailed and expressive? Right- racing a certain car in the game. It is sad to not have lush and detailed interiors (and even exterior details).

This is where I'm getting my ideas on Standard vs. Premium. This video showcases a Corvette drifting around Indianapolis Motor Speedway (oval):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGzHPwTKsjg

My inclination is to say that this Corvette is a Standard car. Just wait until you see the in-car view, though. Yeah, it's unimpressive, but at least it's not a bunch of all-black bitmaps and textures pretending to look like a proper in-car view. And it's not a one-size-fits-all in-car display. It honestly doesn't look all that bad to me. I'm not going to throw hissy fits just because not every car has as beautiful of detail as a Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG. I don't play racing games jut to enjoy interior details. I don't play racing games to enjoy any details unimportant (from basic and classical standpoints) to whether or not I can race and win successfully. Instead, it's all about the racing.

As a point of emphasis, let me debate on the topic of important and unimportant cars. Because attacking Japanese cars gets boring, let me use my own example. Do you think people would care if a 1999 Ford Focus wasn't a supremely-detailed Premium car? The cars that are Standard may not be extremely beautiful or detailed, but at least this is better than having Gran Turismo 1 or Gran Turismo 2 modeled cars in GT5. One such argument about these cars releates to the fact that since the PS3 is an advanced console, EVERY aspect has to be an evolution from the previous generation and system. EA Sports re-hashes a lot of their graphics from their games, and hardly anyone says a damn thing. But, oh- Gran Turismo 4 car models re-touched for the GT5 isn't good enough for most people? Would you rather this GT5 be released five to ten more years later just to get every last car detailed perfectly? You have to take some shortcuts at times and make some shortcomings. While they may be shortcomings, don't let this be a dealbreaker. GT4 was still a solid game even with its shortcomings (especially with no online play). I see this more as Polyphony Digital trying to work around imperfections as best as they can. And if it means that (and I'm guessing) 80% of the cars in GT5 are Standard models that don't have Premium-level detail, then going this route is almost like (to use fashion examples) wearing slimming black fashion garments and body shapers to hide imperfections. The imperfections are still there, but at least they don't become glaring flaws.

So those are my extended views on Standard vs. Premium based on the YouTube video I highlighted on.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

That'd be great if you didn't link to a video of Premium cars.

RE: The "importance" debate: Hugely opinion-based. To cover the the years of 2005 to 2010/2011, I could probably cover 200 cars, easy. That's even taking into consideration cars that I might not personally find interesting, but have a general sense of "importance", going by the various media that covers them. It probably is, as Analog pointed out, a topic best suited to another thread, but yes, the 2005+ portion of the car lineup is the part I'm most concerned about. We're getting all the modern supercars, which is great, but the foundations GT was built on, the more everyday rides, are seemingly less important these days (or at least, we haven't been shown them yet). Where are the Mazda3's, or the 207's, the everyday cars? Heck, the non M or AMG models from zee Germans? We have an abundance of seemingly normal metal from the 90's, like the Civic hatch or any of those other Sunday Cup stalwarts, and I love, love me some M3 goodness, but a 335i, as just one example, would be an interesting addition, seeing how it is, unexpectedly enough, the closest thing sold these days to a modern-day Supra.

 

[cygnus_zero]

This whole only 200 fully finished cars thing bothers me. I'm a patient man, I have no problems with waiting a year or 2 to spend $60 on a FULLY complete game. I have other games to keep me busy while I wait.

Of course DLC is an acceptable option, but we dont even know if they will do that. There's 1000 cars in this game, only a 5th of which are actually done. Seems like they needed more time, but someone told them they dont have it, so they just labeled the ones that are actually done as premium cars. I hate when dev's do that.

 

[Shant J.]

Why does everyone keep saying the Stingray convertible is standard? It's a PREMIUM car. The coupe version is standard.

 

[slipp3h]

This is where I'm getting my ideas on Standard vs. Premium. This video showcases a Corvette drifting around Indianapolis Motor Speedway (oval):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGzHPwTKsjg

FYI that car is premium, it's part of the best buy demo I believe and you can see that it says "premium" in the model selection.

Standard cars have will their windows tinted and we haven't seen standard cars as a part of any demo yet. There will be no interior view on standards. Whatsoever, not even black lines.

If you're disappointed with the quality of that car, the rest of the cars are going to be an even bigger letdown. Personally I think it looks very good. It's an old car, the interior is ugly - pretty accurate to me.

I will say that it's confusing that the convertible is premium yet the coupe is standard. The cars are so similar, why not just make a few minor changes to the convertible premium model and voila now you have a coupe premium model. Doesn't make any sense to me.

 

[shirakawaa]

This whole only 200 fully finished cars thing bothers me. I'm a patient man, I have no problems with waiting a year or 2 to spend $60 on a FULLY complete game. I have other games to keep me busy while I wait.[...]

Also, when one thinks of the development time cannot but feel clueless about what has really been done over all these years. Let's for instance be generous and suppose that the "200+ cars" will actually be around 240.

240 / 6 = 40 cars/year
From GT5P we know that 29 3D car modelers work on them. Maybe for GT5 even more people.
But anyway, with these numbers, that's just about 1.4 car/year per professional modeler.
We're speaking of people who do this job for a living.

And there are plenty of amateurs that are more productive and are able to produce magnificent results far more detailed than GT5 models, with much less source material and of less quality? As it can be seen here for example http://forum.cg-cars.com/gallery/

Once again, I can't help but feel that either
- something went very wrong during the development time; or
- PD are keeping secret the true figures; or
- PD are holding back material for GT6 or DLC packs.

This is how I feel about this whole premium/standard cars matter.
Of course, in the end I know I'll end up driving them all. The physics engine has been updated, hopefully car specifications/technical data too, so they should at least feel completely different than in GT4.

[...] I will say that it's confusing that the convertible is premium yet the coupe is standard. The cars are so similar, why not just make a few minor changes to the convertible premium model and voila now you have a coupe premium model. Doesn't make any sense to me.

Yes. Extremely confusing I'd say.
This could turn out to be the final pre-determined "surprise" though (although to be honest I wouldn't bet on it), a bit like the "20 tracks" information that circulated until not much time ago. Even speaking about "locations", it's now clear there will be significantly more than 20.

 

[Devedander]

I just got through seeing one of the GT5 drifting videos, and I can say that I'm not overly concerned about interior views. A Datsun 240Z in Gran Turismo 5 is a Datsun 240Z. It's still a great car even if it isn't Premium. And so I'm glad this car returns for its third tour of duty in a Gran Turismo game (GT1 and GT3 were the only major GTs to not feature the 240Z). I am an old-fashioned person. So what's more important to me- racing a certain car in the game, or racing a certain car in the game that is overly detailed and expressive? Right- racing a certain car in the game. It is sad to not have lush and detailed interiors (and even exterior details).

This is where I'm getting my ideas on Standard vs. Premium. This video showcases a Corvette drifting around Indianapolis Motor Speedway (oval):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGzHPwTKsjg

My inclination is to say that this Corvette is a Standard car. Just wait until you see the in-car view, though. Yeah, it's unimpressive, but at least it's not a bunch of all-black bitmaps and textures pretending to look like a proper in-car view. And it's not a one-size-fits-all in-car display. It honestly doesn't look all that bad to me. I'm not going to throw hissy fits just because not every car has as beautiful of detail as a Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG. I don't play racing games jut to enjoy interior details. I don't play racing games to enjoy any details unimportant (from basic and classical standpoints) to whether or not I can race and win successfully. Instead, it's all about the racing.

As a point of emphasis, let me debate on the topic of important and unimportant cars. Because attacking Japanese cars gets boring, let me use my own example. Do you think people would care if a 1999 Ford Focus wasn't a supremely-detailed Premium car? The cars that are Standard may not be extremely beautiful or detailed, but at least this is better than having Gran Turismo 1 or Gran Turismo 2 modeled cars in GT5. One such argument about these cars releates to the fact that since the PS3 is an advanced console, EVERY aspect has to be an evolution from the previous generation and system. EA Sports re-hashes a lot of their graphics from their games, and hardly anyone says a damn thing. But, oh- Gran Turismo 4 car models re-touched for the GT5 isn't good enough for most people? Would you rather this GT5 be released five to ten more years later just to get every last car detailed perfectly? You have to take some shortcuts at times and make some shortcomings. While they may be shortcomings, don't let this be a dealbreaker. GT4 was still a solid game even with its shortcomings (especially with no online play). I see this more as Polyphony Digital trying to work around imperfections as best as they can. And if it means that (and I'm guessing) 80% of the cars in GT5 are Standard models that don't have Premium-level detail, then going this route is almost like (to use fashion examples) wearing slimming black fashion garments and body shapers to hide imperfections. The imperfections are still there, but at least they don't become glaring flaws.

So those are my extended views on Standard vs. Premium based on the YouTube video I highlighted on.

You know I have always thought you were very good about researching and giving an in depth opinion based on your careful understanding of the subject... so I am pretty surprised you have completely missed the boat on this one...

I take it you have been away from the GT scene for a while? Because it's been pretty well nailed down that amongst many other things, standards don't have any interior view.

What I find really interesting is that a vetted and respected GTP member like yourself finds the premium decent looking and the interior is unimpressive and not that bad looking... I have to wonder what you will think when you find out standards don't even have the black border view from GTPSP?

I am not sure what to even say about that...

I am curious what your response will be once you get some exposure to a real standard car.

Do me a favor, skim over this and give me your thoughts:

http://www.playstationuniversity.com/gt5s-standard-cars-just-upscaled-gt4-models-4028/

 

[Omamder5]

I am curious what your response will be once you get some exposure to a real standard car.

Do me a favor, skim over this and give me your thoughts:

http://www.playstationuniversity.com/gt5s-standard-cars-just-upscaled-gt4-models-4028/

Up close, I will admit, those models do not quite stand next to Forza 3's. As it was said, in motion, the cars look far from bad, and, in my opinion, quite fine. However, in high-res screen captures from the video that you can't get just from pausing the youtube video, those jagged edges do start to show up.

To be honest, I was startled at the similarities complete sameness between the models. At first, I was quite disappointed to find that the lighting and wheels were worse in GT5 than 4. I was bit stunned; how could Polyphony have gone backwards? I soon realized that I had mixed up the pictures, and found that GT5 does indeed have great lighting, and interesting wheel effects.

Despite the obvious shortcomings of the standards compared to the premiums, I will most certainly enjoy driving both. The sheer diversity between the standard models compared to the premiums makes them just as enticing. Remember, this is just how the cars look. They will all drive just as well, and racing them will be just as fun, as long as people don't start being boneheads and nitpicking over something as insignificant as graphics in a racing game.

Speaking of graphics, people who complain about a game solely based on its graphical shortcomings compared to other games are the same people that judge books by their covers. (Me trying to be deep. I know, I'm really good.) I recently replayed and finished Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time on my Gamecube, for something like the eighth time, and you know what? That was a damn fine game. It didn't have the mind boggling graphics of Crysis. It didn't have the ridiculously detailed cockpits of the premium cars. What it had was gameplay and storytelling. That was a game that affected me deeply, and the ending almost brought a tear of joy to my eye. While it was one of the best looking GC games I had played, its graphics did not make it. It was a good game in its own right, Gamecube and 480p tube TV or not.

What I'm getting at is that if you don't like driving the standard cars at all just because they're not premiums, try to enjoy the game for what it's good for. You're overlooking the many, many fine things this game has to offer. Don't let the standard cars be a deal breaker.

A final reminder, to those of you who aren't convinced; there are still 200 premium cars. That's a lot of cars; take the time to scroll through them and you'll realize just how many that really is. Now take the time to drive those 200 cars, perhaps just one lap of the 'Ring, and you will really, really
understand what 200 cars is. Remember, that's 200 ridiculously detailed cars. Be happy. This game, by all means, will rock, just like Prince of Persia did for me.

 

[JohnBM01]

Well, this is why I stayed away from the Standard vs. Premium debate- I just don't know. And also, I'm an organism called a human being. In no way am I perfect. I actually couldn't tell if the 'Vette was Premium or not. It just LOOKED standard to me. That's why I made the prediction that I did. Not the first time I've professionally stated something... then end up missing the mark. If you expect perfection in my posts, don't. Regardless, even teachers need to be taught lessons themselves (metaphorically speaking). So thanks for clearing up some of those details.

As for the PlayStation University link deal you posted, I can sense some of the differences between the GT5 Standard and GT4 models. Like I stated earlier, re-hashed graphics from EA Sports games doesn't bother most people because the games still remain solid for their gameplay aspects. That's the same way I think GT5 will be. Let me go back to a phrase I remember while GT4 was in the works- "useless tat." So are the Standard cars "useless tat" just because they aren't all premium cars? Were the "Special" cars in GT4 "useless tat" because you could only race them alone (or maybe in certain two-player races? I don't want to look at the Standard Cars as Premium cars... then everything else. I think the magazines may even start complaining that more work could have been done to make every car Premium and that more time could have been spent to make them Premium-quality.

Even the 170 or so cars from the first Gran Turismo was enough to satisfy a lot of gamers. Name me any other racing game in GT1's time that delivered so many cars for gamers to choose from. And yes- 200 Premium cars is nothing to laugh at or mock. At least it's better than... just 50 of them. I'm just saying to still enjoy Gran Turismo 5 even if there are only 200 premium cars. Just don't neglect the other 700 or 800 Standards.

Most everything else I stated outside of that video are still words I stand by. I'm tempted by the Premiums, but I don't want to use just the Premiums. There's still lots to love about GT5.

 

[Devedander]

This post

And This One

While graphics aren't the end all and be all of a game, in some games they play a bigger roll than others... and I don't think anyone can argue GT doesn't sit heavily on it's looks...

And as for the standards John Marine, it's not just looks that are different... they get a much more limited damage model, they don't have any interior views (so no cockpit view) and will probably not have visual hinderences like rain on the windshield effects. Possibly missed some things there too...

I was playing Dirt 2 the other night at a buddies house and we were racing bumper cam becuase he finds cockpit view a little too challenging. It was a lot of fun by them I switched to cockpit view and it was SO much better... it felt like actually being in the cab, I loved how when the trucks nosed in after a jump my view was severly limited, when going through puddles the (admittedly over the top) water on the windshield effect really cranked the tension up a few nothches. Cracked windshields and crumpled hoods blocking the view are all huge additions to the challenge in my book.

I'm just saying that while I agree graphics aren't all that matters, they are far from unimportant (especially in GT) and even so they are far from the only differences in premiums and stanards... some of which are truly experience changing in terms of gameplay experience.

 

[DoctorFouad]

I want to drive a bugatti veyron at 400km/h straight

 

[Griffith500]

While graphics aren't the end all and be all of a game, in some games they play a bigger roll than others... and I don't think anyone can argue GT doesn't sit heavily on it's looks...

And as for the standards John Marine, it's not just looks that are different... they get a much more limited damage model, they don't have any interior views (so no cockpit view) and will probably not have visual hinderences like rain on the windshield effects. Possibly missed some things there too...

I was playing Dirt 2 the other night at a buddies house and we were racing bumper cam becuase he finds cockpit view a little too challenging. It was a lot of fun by them I switched to cockpit view and it was SO much better... it felt like actually being in the cab, I loved how when the trucks nosed in after a jump my view was severly limited, when going through puddles the (admittedly over the top) water on the windshield effect really cranked the tension up a few nothches. Cracked windshields and crumpled hoods blocking the view are all huge additions to the challenge in my book.

I'm just saying that while I agree graphics aren't all that matters, they are far from unimportant (especially in GT) and even so they are far from the only differences in premiums and stanards... some of which are truly experience changing in terms of gameplay experience.

Don't forget the possibility of wheel / shell painting, body / aero kits (?) and "racing mods".
The damage "model" is the same, i.e. how it affects the car's performance. The physical / graphical deformation effects are different: Standards get "dents and scratches" whilst Premiums get that and body panel dislocation, and certain Premiums may lose bumpers / doors / other panels altogether (probably race machines only). Rain effects could be a disappointment with Standards, though, from what we've seen.

There could be more yet.

 

[DoctorFouad]

it is clearly disappointing to get used to cokpit view than switch to bumper view...but thats GT5, those who dont want to buy the game because of this they are free to do so...lol

 

[Khaddar]

This whole only 200 fully finished cars thing bothers me. I'm a patient man, I have no problems with waiting a year or 2 to spend $60 on a FULLY complete game. I have other games to keep me busy while I wait.

If that is entirely honest then you have a very simple solution - don't buy GT5 and wait for GT6.

It seems a reasonable assumption that GT6 will be to GT5 what 4 and 2 were to 3 and 1 respectively - fundamentally the same game, significantly enlarged. I remember being somewhat disappointed when GT3 was released that it lacked so many of the cars I'd enjoyed in GT2. Maybe PD didn't have the option of re-using models from GT2 or maybe it hadn't occurred to them at that stage, but they've chosen to do it this time instead of giving us the limited car selection.

I understand that some people will feel they've been sold something more than this, but to me it's as clear with GT as it is with any other games franchise - if the new release offers value to me then I will buy it, if it doesn't I'll skip it and wait for the next one.

 

[Ryan81]

So it looks like we'll be getting at least 250 premium cars if there are exactly 756 standards? If that's the case, VERY GOOD NEWS