Your thoughts about "standard" vs. "premium"

[shirakawaa]

I don't understand why premium wheels can't be fitted on standard cars.
I was hoping "at least their wheels would look great".

 

[Shoogar]

Since GT5 is only coming out for Playstation, and Sony have developed a very well working Playstation Store, which allows you to buy DLC, PD should bring out GT5 with the Standard Cars, and if it doesn't work as well as they hope for it to, then release an update which allows more modifications to the Standard Cars.

Just think about it, I can understand that Gt4 took a while to come out since there is no update system like there is now, so I don't see why PD don't release the game as soon as they can, so then consumers can play and I guess 'help' them. If something goes wrong, or there is a bug, they can just release a patch, we can download it, and then the problem is solved.

I know, im sure it's a lot harder then it sounds, but it would really be nice to just have the game and proudly say 'I own a copy of GT5, '

 

[Rossticles]

This no custom wheels on standard cars is a little disheartening. One of the reasons I would have multiple copies of a car in previous series would be because I liked different car color/wheel color combinations.

 

[YourCarInHD]

This no custom wheels on standard cars is a little disheartening. One of the reasons I would have multiple copies of a car in previous series would be because I liked different car color/wheel color combinations.

Agreed. And your avatar is awesome. Completely clarifies that I have a dirty mind.

 

[TT3AZ]

Well, i was thinking about the ps3 and gt5 since it would be so awsome, but im really dissapointed since 800 cars wont have cockpit view or be customized, for example no aftermarket wheels for standard cars. For the ppl who really enjoy cruising and make your car unique, the gt5 wont be anything to them.

Forza 3 has like 450 cars, and u can modd all of them, at least with aftermarket wheels etc.

I mean 5 years, and 800 cars that wont be customized in such extent that they would be unique, brrr very bad. The whole point of the new generation sim racing is to build/mod ur car like you can do in real life. No many ppl driving 800 hp supras and skylines that has original wheels or parts.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

But I do recall a little game called Forza, in which the bot cars all look like puffy inflatomobiles, and much worse to me than the Standards. And despite the glaring differences, we didn't know it until a sharp eyed player took some pics of them in their misshapen lack-of-glory. For some reason though, that doesn't matter, go figure.

(citation needed).

Luminis raises an excellent question; what's with the constant Forza stuff? That isn't the topic, but even since you bring it up; it's unacceptable from any game. If FM3 doesn't get a pass from you because of modeling errors and quality inconsistency, GT shouldn't either. I'm actually slightly amazed you didn't mention Vietnam yet again in this post, but for me, farming out production of models isn't any worse than recycling decade old ones. I really would be interested in an example of these "puffy inflatomobiles" though, because every single shot I've seen over in the FM3 section shows cars that are readily identifiable to me. Genuine interest here; maybe I'm missing something.

You know, Luminis' post (that I quote after this one) highlights the differences in the arguments here. Nobody is arguing whether you're allowed to like Standards and think they're "good enough". That's well and good. I still think SMB3 is a fantastic platformer, so graphics aren't the be-all end-all. But we were pointing out the problem of people saying "they'll look as good as Prologue". No, they won't. Or the cockpit fiasco. Or hell, most other racing games compared to Standards. That and how people argue that they haven't been carried over from GT4. Yes, they have, and it should be clear as day. The lighting and reflections =/= a new model.

We can all enjoy GT5 in our own way, but I'd be missing some pretty sweet rides, like a Lamborghini or two, if I stubbornly insisted that the Standards were beneath my dignity level. Not to mention some 240s, Sileightys, Skylines, Subies, some American muscle cars... but then I won't be missing them, I suppose because I lack that kind of dignity.

Dignity?
It's a video game. I'm not terribly interested in GT4.5 six years later, so the fixed physics, while nice, are definitely on the backburner for me because I'd rather focus on actual new content. I'll play with them once I'm done exploring the new stuff, or if they are forced on me for completion's sake.

So yeah, up to this point, it does bear a certain 'Told ya!' feel to me. It totally does. And it was to be expected. For the simple reason that those few people just went with simple logic.
And in my opinion, Devedander is right. There were a lot of people claiming a lot of stuff and now that it's obvious they were wrong, they're nowhere to be seen or heard.

I know it may come off as hating on the game. But what was said was obviously spot on, one way or another.

And I'll just say this: They'll be quite limited in terms of body modification as well.

Not only graphics, gameplay stuff as well.

We looked at PD's past and came to what's looking increasingly like an accurate conclusion. It does come off as hating to some folks, because the thought of anything critical in the direction of PD or Kaz is often seen as that around here. But really; I love the series and I know I'll play the crap out of it, I just wish certain things were done differently.

As for Standards being limited...

Aftermarket wheels cannot be fitted to "Standard Model cars".



EDIT: what does that mean for the wings that could be fitted before? Unless the wheel fitting has been expanded / enhanced and the standard cars haven't been updated to deal with this?

Welp, there's one thing we know Standards can't do. And that one was expected as a "given". It definitely doesn't add up, as wheels have always been treated separately from the bodies. I guess this means the likelihood of a return of the "Daily Special" section is probably gone.

One bright light of possibility; Racing Mod says "some cars", not "Standard cars". So we might still have a surprise left...

 

[maxpontiac]

Well.

When it comes to the standard cars, something has finally disappointed me.

Changing and painting the wheels on the standards was something I looked forward to doing.

Oh well, I am over it now and life moves on.

EDIT - Just re-watched the video again. It seems the Race Mods can be done on some standard issue cars. Need some clarification on that please!

 

[5Liter]

So really, the standard model cars are just there for them to say they have 1,000 cars lol

 

[happycorey]

Exactly. I don't even know why they wasted time with Standards. If you could change the wheels, it would have been something I could deal with, most of the cars I actually wanted were standards. But now that I've found out you can't even change their WHEELS ?! What's next, you won't be able to paint a Standard, won't be able to upgrade a Standard... They should have just focused their efforts on making more Premiums if this was going to be the case.

 

[dmj958]

I don't understand why premium wheels can't be fitted on standard cars.
I was hoping "at least their wheels would look great".

yeah!...it's kinda pointless to really have the "standard cars" in there

 

[JDMKING13]

Aftermarket wheels cannot be fitted to "Standard Model cars".



EDIT: what does that mean for the wings that could be fitted before? Unless the wheel fitting has been expanded / enhanced and the standard cars haven't been updated to deal with this?

This has to be the case man, If you looked at everything else It did not say that standard cars could not have only for the wheels. This hurts.

 

[MadduckUK]

so much for a liver editor and more personalization.. now we cant even get a bit of character into the vast majority of cars with some aftermarket wheels

 

[shirakawaa]

The screenshot above mentions that lightweight rims improve driving performance.
Could this be the reason why they can't be mounted on Standard cars? If yes, that's worrying. It might imply less detailed driving physics for them.

 

[Ubiquitous]

Lack of aftermarket wheels on standards is a massive blow to this game.

I'd trade any amount of damage modelling for the customisation of Forza.

I don't care what happens when I crash as long as my car is mechanically damaged, but I do care what my cars look like.

Forza is the runaway king in this area, however much some people may rage at the statement.

Customisation does matter and not being able to change the wheels on 80% of the cars in this game is a really big blow.

 

[Spagetti69]

Tenacious D.

I know how you love photo mode so what your saying about Forza bot cars intrigues me.
When I watch a Forza replay the cars look good in my opinion.
When I enter photo mode the LOD is up on all cars and some real good photos can be taken.

After seeing a standard door handle, which other than the fact it was on a door I wouldn't have known what it is.
How are your feelings towards photographing the standards now.

 

[Luminis]

Heh, seems like this threat will be getting busier than it ever was in the days to come...

 

[Chapman2424]

The more I see these videos the more disappointed I become - 6 years waiting and we've lost some of the basic modifications from GT4. GT4 never had a huge benchmark in modifications but wheels & wings were great to play around with to personalize your ride. Standard cars should at bare minimum have the ability to change the wheels & colour, let along internal modifications.

Chapman

 

[Sapphire-Wolf]

I'm gonna take the good with the bad but no custom wheels on standard cars has serverely reduced my desire to drive them.

 

[Strittan]

I'm so glad I've never been fond of the standard cars right now.

 

[Ubiquitous]

It would be more tolerable if we didn't wait so long for the game.

I don't understand how in all this time they've managed to remove a feature we were already used to, especially one as popular as aftermarket wheels.

I was expecting to not only be able to change the wheels on all cars, but to finally be able to change the size of the wheels. To find out neither will be possible on 800 cars is really harsh.

 

[XEPEGTP]

The screenshot above mentions that lightweight rims improve driving performance.
Could this be the reason why they can't be mounted on Standard cars? If yes, that's worrying. It might imply less detailed driving physics for them.

I was thinking that too, but it would be hard to prove...

There's no car that is both standard and premium.

But its starting to show that Standard and Premium are worlds apart albeit living on the same planet.

But Kaz did say they rebuilt the whole physics engine from the ground up, but at the same time, in PD dev videos, its been noted that the way they model a cars physics is by taking down all the data from the manufacturer and inputing that in their system, but since the Standards have only been slightly optimized\graphically rebuilt, maybe the Data they are using is also less "detailed" from the old system than the new data for premiums.

For example Standards have 70 parameters to simulate its characteristics while premiums have 140.
Confusing...

 

[Spagetti69]

Heh, seems like this threat will be getting busier than it ever was in the days to come...

Where's our resident host Deve. He better start flexing the old typing fingers.

 

[gtracedriver]

Sounds are great from SSR7 video

Tenacious D.

I know how you love photo mode so what your saying about Forza bot cars intrigues me.
When I watch a Forza replay the cars look good in my opinion.
When I enter photo mode the LOD is up on all cars and some real good photos can be taken.

After seeing a standard door handle, which other than the fact it was on a door I wouldn't have known what it is.
How are your feelings to wards photographing the standards now.

At least GT models are accurate.

I was thinking that too, but it would be hard to prove...

There's no car that is both standard and premium.

But its starting to show that Standard and Premium are worlds apart albeit living on the same planet.

But Kaz did say they rebuilt the whole physics engine from the ground up, but at the same time, in PD dev videos, its been noted that the way they model a cars physics is by taking down all the data from the manufacturer and inputing that in their system, but since the Standards have only been slightly optimized\graphically rebuilt, maybe the Data they are using is also less "detailed" from the old system than the new data for premiums.

For example Standards have 70 parameters to simulate its characteristics while premiums have 140.
Confusing...

It is using brand new physics engine and sounds have also improved

 

[nzbmxr]

This whole thing about custom wheels on standards certainly is dissapointing, i just hope we get some confirmation that other mods can still be carried out, i am hopeful.

Another thing, and im sorry if it is a stupid question, and i havnt seen it asked earlier, but what exactly is a "paint item"? it just seems strange having that in the descriptions in the vid...just the body of the car? or paint gun? what?

 

[Luminis]

At least GT models are accurate.

Yeah, that sure beats having changeable wheels, cockpit view and whatnot...

 

[XEPEGTP]

It is using brand new physics engine and sounds have also improved

Sounds, check they are tony the tiger grrreat.

Physics system IS new im not disputing this, im questioning wether the same amount Parameters were inputted for Premiums and Standards.

Since Standards were modeled before the physics system renewal, do they use the same number of parameters as GT4, or do they have upgraded (higher number) parameters to match Premiums?

However this is not an easy question to answer.

 

[E28]

Why can't they just have no standards, a few more premiums, and then DLC? Here's hoping for DLC standard to premium packages!

 

[B13POS]

Why can't they just have no standards, a few more premiums, and then DLC? Here's hoping for DLC standard to premium packages!

Because it's not that big of a deal.

 

[Spagetti69]

I love this thread, really gets the old blood circulating.

I'm just waiting for someone to post:

I glad we can't swap wheels I don't care about that option. I rather see the stitching in my samba bus thank you very much.

 

[Tornado]

You know, if this "No wheel changes at all on Standard cars" thing pans out, I'm going to seriously start questioning what the hell Kaz was smoking every time he talked about "perfection."

I knew the Standard cars were going to be problematic in some ways (differences in quality from Premiums), and I suspected that they were going to have problems in others (modeling errors, padding, etc.), but I never even imagined that they were going to start hacking away features that the Standards had already had in previous games. If something as fundamental to the series at this point as that has been excised from the Standards roster, why the hell did they even bother with them (aside from the obvious, cynical reason)?

Because it's not that big of a deal.

Bull. When (at least) 80% of the cars apparently cannot have any visual customization at all, not even to the same extent that some of those cars had enjoyed twice prior, it is a pretty damn big deal. I was expecting at least the same amount of quality for the Standard models that they had in GT4/GT3, and now we're being told that they probably didn't even put enough effort into them to accomplish that?