Zeta News 2.0: New VF Commodore and Chevrolet SS

[YSSMAN]

"I Aint Dead Yet!!!"

Automakers are gnashing their teeth over how to deal with the second malaise era looming over us like an 800 lb gorilla with a stolen banana. The General's combatting the murky fog by playing switcheroo with some of its product plans — specifically plans for rear-wheel drive. Originally, the 2011 Buick Lucerne was to shift to rear-wheel drive, in an attempt to move Buick slightly out of stodgy territory and into crotchety. Speculation's been that the plan was nixed due to all the doom and gloom lately, but it seems that may be less than true as we're now hearing the next Lucerne's rear-wheel plans are still quite "Fred." As in not-yet-dead.

Motor Trend's Motor City Blogman, Todd Lassa, is reporting the news of the RWD Buick Lucerne's demise may have been greatly exaggerated. Along with a lot of background info, Lassa says the Buick will be staying rear wheel drive, but moving off the 118.5-inch extended wheelbase Zeta platform and onto the smaller "midsize" 114.8-inch wheelbase Zeta — the same as the Pontiac G8. So it'll stay rear-wheel driven, but shrinking a bit in the process.

Enthusiasts will hate the idea of a rear-wheel powered Buick, sure. Want to know what they'll hate even more? The Blogman's also reporting GM's plans for a rear-wheel drive 2011 Chevy Impala is still dead in the water. The world is a crazy mixed up place sometimes, ain't it?

Odd that they can't seem to make up their minds... Either you do, or you don't. Or you go about doing it in the "greenest" way possible. My guess is that it'll happen, and it will be the Chinese Park Avenue like we've always thought it'll be.

 

[The Vanishing Boy]

-> ...

Odd that they can't seem to make up their minds... Either you do, or you don't. Or you go about doing it in the "greenest" way possible. My guess is that it'll happen, and it will be the Chinese Park Avenue like we've always thought it'll be.

^ I think the rising gas prices are affecting their brains, they're concentrating that 40mpg I-4 engine for the Coblat. And recently the F-150 was recently got defeated by the Civic, they must be hustling developing that engine pronto.

ROC-Buick-> Looks like the LWB G8 will arrive here after all. But I would think the design would be a bit more unique (resembling the design cues from the Enclave) compared to its Asian sibling. In which its not a bad thing, I like GM's from down under.

 

[Jim Prower]

WILL G.M STOP THIS!!! IT'S GIVING ME A HEADACHE!!!!

Ugh. bait and tease, why dont'cha? Make up your damn minds on this...

 

[Tornado]

This is nearly annoying as when they changed there mind every other day as to whether the Zeta would be introduced at all. And the answer to this is just as obvious.



@ The V6 Camaro: They could put the DIG V6 in it and tell Hyundai to go screw, if they are smart. Plus it would have better mileage. Bean counters may not like it, though.

 

[buickgnx88]

Read: VE Commodore SV6. SS V8 body kit, less tail pipes (still dual), and no SS badges. V8 remains exclusive, V6 still looks bad-ass.

Great example, this is pretty much what I was thinking. Have the V6 and different (but sporty) wheels, and have dual pipes with the dual stripes as an option.

 

[MustangSVT]

I think they're making these cars too heavy. By the time it comes out, the V6 one probably gets only 27mpg highway, not "average", that'd be my guess. I got an average of 22mpg today in my I4 Lancer in full rush-hour traffic on my return trip from work for a ~20km trip. On the other hand, I get 30mpg in the morning rush hour because it's not anywhere near as bad. With the rising fuel prices, I wouldn't mind having a small lightweight car if I wanted a sports car. Something like a Golf Mk2 gti, or an older celica gt-s.

 

[buickgnx88]

Well with safety and comfort comes weight, and with weight comes more power and less mileage (generally), thus creating a vicious automotive circle which is where we are today.

 

[Jim Prower]

I can really only think of one time weight took a significant drop: the 80s. We were recovering from the automotive stupidity of the '70s at that time, and Front-Drive became the buzzword.

I don't know...Americans are really starting to panic and go for small cars. They're not as small as they once were, though, the aforementioned safety and lux-ree doing that in.

I guess decontented cars these days are for enthusiasts obsessive about weight...

 

[YSSMAN]

It seems like the magic number is about 27 MPG for most people, particularly those who are used to larger cars and trucks. If they can get the Camaro, the G8, the Park Avenue, et al in that same range there won't be a problem with fuel pricing going up. But that being said, we're still too early in the game to know for certain.

Either way, the Zeta chassis will be used to replace the BOF GMT900s, so its going to be used no matter what.

 

[Philly]

Looks like a G8 with a Buick badge on the front. Sounds like a much easier solution for GM than what a FWD car might require.

I don't know...Americans are really starting to panic and go for small cars. They're not as small as they once were, though, the aforementioned safety and lux-ree doing that in.

Small cars really aren't that much lighter either. The GTI is pretty much on par with the much larger Passat. And I would guess that the Rabbit is lighter, showing that the engine is going to be the biggest player in fuel economy. That's a shame because the lightest cars were both incredibly fun to drive and very fuel efficient compared to today's behemoths.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

Looks like a G8 with a Buick badge on the front. Sounds like a much easier solution for GM than what a FWD car might require.

That's what it is. That Buick is a rebadged Holden Caprice which is in essence a LWB Commodore.

 

[YSSMAN]

The word is that we'll get a short wheelbase version to "save on gas," which I suppose makes sense. The G8 is already HUGE as it is...

 

[The Vanishing Boy]

^ Not compared to the 300C, the G8 looks a lot leaner. Its size is in between the Camry and the Avalon, so its not really that huge.

 

[Tornado]

^ Not compared to the 300C, the G8 looks a lot leaner.

Looks can be deceiving, as I believe the 300C is the lighter car.

 

[Joey D]

Looks can be deceiving, as I believe the 300C is the lighter car.

The 300C has a curb weight of 3700lbs, not sure how that compares to the G8.

 

[The Vanishing Boy]

^ According to Inside Line, the G8 is 4,106 lbs.

-> But hey, it is still 'lighter' than the Charger SRT-8 Super Bee, weighing 56 more lbs.

 

[YSSMAN]

Looks can be deceiving, as I believe the 300C is the lighter car.

Not quite right...

The Dodge Charger R/T weighs in at 4160 lbs (I'd expect the 300C to be more), the G8 GT comes in right at 4020 lbs. I'd expect the Buick to be a little more (with the upgraded interior), but performance wise, it'll likely ride and handle better than the Chrysler... Not to mention accelerate better with less power. Thanks for the extra cog Mr. Lutz!

 

[buickgnx88]

Actually the Charger is only 3728 lbs and the 300 is 3725 lbs, according to my Consumer Guide.

 

[Tornado]

Okay, I looked it up: The 300 3.5L V6 weighs a hundred pounds less (3762 pounds versus 3885 pounds), whereas the 300C weighs a hundred pounds more (4096 versus 3995). Oddly enough, the 3.5L V6 Charger weighs more than the V6 300 (3800 pounds) and the V8 Charger weighs less (4031 pounds).

 

[MustangSVT]

Not quite right...

The Dodge Charger R/T weighs in at 4160 lbs (I'd expect the 300C to be more), the G8 GT comes in right at 4020 lbs. I'd expect the Buick to be a little more (with the upgraded interior), but performance wise, it'll likely ride and handle better than the Chrysler... Not to mention accelerate better with less power. Thanks for the extra cog Mr. Lutz!

Here is according to CanadianDriver website:

Curb weight 300 1708 kg (3766 lbs)
Curb weight 300 AWD 1829 kg (4034 lbs)
Curb weight 300C 1844 kg (4066 lbs)
Curb weight 300C AWD 1938 kg (4273 lbs)
Curb weight SRT8 1888 kg (4160 lbs)


http://www.canadiandriver.com/overviews/2006/chrysler/300.php

Charger

Curb weight SE 1696 kg (3740 lbs)
Curb weight SXT 1733 kg (3820 lbs)
Curb weight SXT AWD 1858 kg (4096 lbs)
Curb weight R/T 1860 kg (4100 lbs)
Curb weight R/T AWD 1945 kg (4289 lbs)
Curb weight SRT8 1887 kg (4160 lbs)


G8 GT

Curb weight (lb / kg):
Base: 3885 / 1762
GT: 3995 / 1812
GXP: 4095

Personally I think they ALL weigh far too much. I think my 3100lbs Lancer weighs too much, let alone these 4000 pound sedans.

 

[YSSMAN]

Both the G8 and the CTS weigh too much in the GM size segment here... Thank the lord above that GM says they're shedding 400 lbs for the Camaro, but I don't know where they're cutting it from.

 

[Philly]

Is the chassis going to be shorter? That would be a few pounds. The lack of rear doors should help. And maybe GM will use more aluminum for construction.

 

[YSSMAN]

Should be shorter by quite a bit, but I have no idea how much aluminum is being used. Not much I'd guess, especially if they're keeping pricing low.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

200lbs lighter means the Camaro will still be in the range of 1700kg. Not nearly light enough, not even close.

 

[YSSMAN]

*400 lbs lighter than the Commodore/G8. Roughly 1630 kgs or so is the target weight last I recall. That's still quite a lot more than your comparable Mustang, but with more cogs in the transmission and more power (most-likely), the Camaro will end up being faster... More fuel efficent... Not to mention handling and riding better due to the IRS out back.

 

[nd 4 holden spd]

*400 lbs lighter than the Commodore/G8. Roughly 1630 kgs or so is the target weight last I recall. That's still quite a lot more than your comparable Mustang, but with more cogs in the transmission and more power (most-likely), the Camaro will end up being faster... More fuel efficent... Not to mention handling and riding better due to the IRS out back.

And the genius Aussie designed Zeta platform underneath. So is that the V8's weight? That'd be pretty good for a V8 in this day of people actually worried about a crash. Don't crash, simple.

 

[YSSMAN]

...And now we know what the Camaro SS looks like, fresh from the Transformers 2 set...

I'm not completely sure how I feel about the air ducts, but its actually kinda cool. The HUGE ram-air hood is pretty awesome, which kinda makes you wonder whats hiding under there (likely just the LS3). Furthermore, now that I think about it, I do wonder if this is just another GTO-based prototype, or if GM was nice enough to give Mike Bay the "real deal," ie, a working Zeta-based SS prototype?

Come to think of it...

The movie and the Camaro will be coming out around the same time. Sweet!

 

[V1P3R]

lol, I could just see the convo they had for the SS...

- Hmm... We need to do something "different" for the SS.

- I know I got it, we'll slap on the CTS-V bummer!

- Nice...

 

[Jay]

which kinda makes you wonder whats hiding under there (likely just the LS3).

Just.......just! A LS3?

Am I the only one that thinks expectations are getting a little high these days?

 

[McLaren]

I'll take a SS in black w/ grey or white stripes, please!