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Over on Camaro5 alot of guys have had the broken CV joints/output shafts snap at a 4000rpm launch...
Zeta News 2.0: New VF Commodore and Chevrolet SS
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McLaren
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Rotary Junkie
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Gimme one so I can break it.
Really it should have a 3" stroke version of the LS3 and still be suck air, just tuned for very high RPM. 400+hp and a rev limiter around 7500rpm = the secks.
But no. Instead it gets what the SS should be and the SS gets what the Z should be :/
Really it should have a 3" stroke version of the LS3 and still be suck air, just tuned for very high RPM. 400+hp and a rev limiter around 7500rpm = the secks.
But no. Instead it gets what the SS should be and the SS gets what the Z should be :/
Keef
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I agree with you, I have no idea why they would switch the models around. Wasn't the Z/28 the version homoligated for Trans-Am racing, where all the cars were high strung and naturally aspirated? And the SS was on top of it, in its street-legal ground-pounder position. The Z/28 is to the SS what the Mustang GT Track Pack is to the GT500. Should be, anyway.
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after just reading the review in a motortrend, where the hot cars were being tested, the Camaro finished dead last in the lineup, citing a lack of power and rather crap handling...in the SS to boot! they better go over the New Camaro again...
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- YSSMAN
- YSSMAN
Hmmm, the on/off nature of the Camaro isn't exactly helping things. Furthermore, I'm still in the camp that suggests that the Z/28 should be the hardened track version of the car. That would mean a slight loss of weight, a tighter suspension, and more importantly the 505 BHP LS7 from the Z06, just for history's sake.
That, and it would probably be cheaper.
That, and it would probably be cheaper.
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- YSSMAN
- YSSMAN
Depends on which Camaro fans you talk to. I know that on Camaro5 and GMI, there was a bit of a civil war as to what the Z/28 and SS branding means. Upset? Maybe. Unwilling to buy? Probably not.
* Side Note: My Dad is dying for a Z/28. He took his name off the list when they started over-charging for the Camaros, but now he's thinking about going back for one.
* Side Note: My Dad is dying for a Z/28. He took his name off the list when they started over-charging for the Camaros, but now he's thinking about going back for one.
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Bolded for emphasis. GM doesn't need any "probably going to buy." They need day-one sales. This idiotic naming tendency GM has been stricken with in the past few years is going to come to a head eventually (see: GTO, only with a more major model), and when it does they likely won't understand way it happened. Its almost as if they are doing this crap on purpose.
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And for probably $20,000 less than the Z06. It'll probably steal all kinds of sales from the base Corvette if they're priced similarly. They could probably pull it off if they bumped the base model to the Grand Sport.
They Z/28 and Corvette are pretty different cars, but I don't think they're different enough for the market that they're going for.
They Z/28 and Corvette are pretty different cars, but I don't think they're different enough for the market that they're going for.
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- YSSMAN
- YSSMAN
The thing is, they already have that with the Camaro. They can't keep them on the lots, and they're selling faster than the (arguably better) Mustang. Something worked. Its going to be anger (if you can even call it that) from the early adopters, who bought their SS thinking it would stay the bad-ass model. But, knowing Camaro fans, they'll be back in a heartbeat ready to drop some fat cash on a new car.
RE: The Camaro and the Corvette --> Z/28 vs GS and Z06
The dynamic of the Camaro and the Corvette has always been a bit of overlay in price and performance, and this really isn't any different. Barring any unforeseen tweaks to the 2011 Camaro, there is still going to be a significant enough difference in the way the cars drive that will keep people on a "one-or-the-other" basis. As it is, the 430 BHP SS is roughly as fast as the base Corvette, the main difference being in the way they handle. Replacing the Z51 with the GS adds a bit of wiggle room in case of a significant performance changes, but there is still a lot of work to be done on the Camaro for it to be perfect.
Otherwise, I totally agree with the power. Having a 550 BHP Camaro just seems like a bad choice when there is a 550 BHP CTS-V Coupe on the way. In theory, their performance figures should be nearly identical. Its going to be easier, cheaper, more historically-significant, and otherwise more sensible to do an LS7-powered Z/28. But, it sounds increasingly reasonable to think that I'm in the minority with Camaro fans on that plan. At least that way, there would be a significant weight difference between the Z/28 and the Z06 to keep the performance stats apart... Let alone the handling differences. Keep the Z/28 off the CTS-V Coupe and Z06, and keep the price in the low $40s and they'll have a winner.
McLaren
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Eh, see, that's my concern. A lot of people who buy Z06s & these new Camaros like to go fast...in straight lines. Why dish out $70K for a 505Bhp Z06 when there's a 550Bhp Camaro at low $40Ks that probably goes just as fast straight out.
At least, that's how it goes down in Dallas.
At least, that's how it goes down in Dallas.
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- gtp_jimprower
eesh. didnt' know the SS was that expensive.
Question on Potential regarding the V6 car then...how much more horsepower does that engine have in it before it breaks? We know a draw of the V8 cars is that they can be tuned to the sky for not much money, but with the LT/RS being the main Mustang GT competitor, How much more power can one get?
Question on Potential regarding the V6 car then...how much more horsepower does that engine have in it before it breaks? We know a draw of the V8 cars is that they can be tuned to the sky for not much money, but with the LT/RS being the main Mustang GT competitor, How much more power can one get?
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It depends on how you look at it, historically at least. Keep in mind that the SS Camaro didn't exist from 1973-1996, and in that time, the Z/28 was the "top dog" for the model. Even then, that stance tended to flutter from time to time. I think the only badge that has stayed entirely consistent has been the RS.
It, more or less, depends on your definition of what an SS, Z/28 and RS model should be. A bit of a civil war broke out among Camaro fans before the car arrived, and I don't think there was ever a clear answer. Historically, the SS had been the "luxury" model for the Camaro, adding a lot of standard equipment, along with the power. The Z/28 had typically be the "track" model, obviously based on its Trans-Am development history.
I'd say the SS is in the right spot, and putting the Z/28 on top makes more sense. Only problem is that it goes against the previous mentality at GM that the SS models were at the top... But that apparently ended a year or two ago.
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I'd agree. The fourth gen SS/Z-28 really mixed things up IMO. People looked at an SS with its sexy hood scoop and spoiler and thought it must be the better model. I personally don't think that the SS cars from '97-'02 had anything up on the Z's other than the appearance. Nothing that a driver mod or an intake/exhaust could not fix mechanically.
If GM brings back the Z, that's cool. I really can't say I'm as into the new Camaro as I am with the 4th generation cars. Maybe I drooled over it too much once the concept was shown, now I've seen it too long and don't like things about it now. With the 2010 GT-500 weighing 3900+ and the SS weighing the same, I wonder how heavy the Z-28 will be. It's too bad cars have gotten so heavy these days, aside from the 3,500 pound GT Mustang. The fourth generation cars were not exactly light, but I didn't really want much more than that. I guess it will compete nicely with the GT-500, just when I first saw the Camaro concept I was hoping it would walk all over the top trim Mustang. Now I don't think that will happen. I am now more in to the 2010 Mustang more than the 2010 Camaro. I like the '03-'04 Terminators more than any of the GT-500's as well.
If the Z does ever materialize, I hope it does not get any fatter, but at the same time, I want it to have all kinds of stuff; like new front and rear fascia, ducktail spoiler, racing style seats, front splitter, 18 inch rims and all kinds of other look good things. I don't think both are possible, but I could be wrong. Even with CTS-V level horse power, the only place it will keep with a Z-06 is perhaps in a straight line, I don't think that's very direct competition.
IMO People that buy Corvettes will buy them because they want to go fast or own a Corvette, the same goes for CTS-V. They wanted to go fast, yet wanted something nicer than the Camaro with more room than a Corvette. People that buy the Camaro want to go fast and get a bargain, or could only afford so much "go". Would they not cross shop other sporty 2 door RWD cars? SRT-8/GT-500? I don't think most people would cross shop a Corvette or a Camaro. Maybe people looking at a CTS-V would because IMO that is the middle ground. Your paying Corvette money for perhaps less than Z-28 performance. Then again aren't they getting a bargain over German sports 4 doors which they may be cross shopping? I have nothing to really base this on other than what I think, all may be invalid.
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GM's garden-variety engine is becoming the 3.6L mill and its various spin-offs. Although, I believe it is going to be replaced by the new 3.0L and 2.8T units respectively. But, that 2.4L I4 is going to be in everything sooner than later. Just like Toyota's unit.
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The Screamin' Chicken Lives!
Well, the Lingenfelter 455 T/A will have to do for now. The full debut will happen at SEMA, but I can already imagine that Pontiac fans are lining up to get their hands on conversion kits for their Camaros. This one runs a modified LS7, done up to 7.5L, producing 655 BHP. Talk about a kick in the pants!
The Z/28 Lives? Again?
That showed up on Facebook earlier today, according to Autoblog. That being nearly identical to the Z/28 concept drawings spied much earlier this year, as well as matching the bodywork shown off on Bumblebee in the new Transfomers film. No word on what it is exactly (note the lack of badges), but it is likely pretty safe to assume that it is a working concept that will morph into the Z/28 next year. Unfortunately, it probably won't have the LS7 (damn!), but the LSA instead.
Well, the Lingenfelter 455 T/A will have to do for now. The full debut will happen at SEMA, but I can already imagine that Pontiac fans are lining up to get their hands on conversion kits for their Camaros. This one runs a modified LS7, done up to 7.5L, producing 655 BHP. Talk about a kick in the pants!
The Z/28 Lives? Again?
That showed up on Facebook earlier today, according to Autoblog. That being nearly identical to the Z/28 concept drawings spied much earlier this year, as well as matching the bodywork shown off on Bumblebee in the new Transfomers film. No word on what it is exactly (note the lack of badges), but it is likely pretty safe to assume that it is a working concept that will morph into the Z/28 next year. Unfortunately, it probably won't have the LS7 (damn!), but the LSA instead.
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The front end on that T/A does not work, for me anyways. It's not that it doesn't look like what it should, it's just so boxy, with rounded shapes. Just weird. I like the ducktail spoiler, but I can't get into that front end, yet anyways, maybe it will grow on me, who knows.
That Z concept? Looks pretty good, haha yeah, that would have been great if it were or will be an LS7. I'm not sure about the hood, I hope it gets a ducktail spoiler. Or just ends up looking similar to this.
Just with the same front fascia it has in that shot you posted, can lose the two tone job. JMO though.
That Z concept? Looks pretty good, haha yeah, that would have been great if it were or will be an LS7. I'm not sure about the hood, I hope it gets a ducktail spoiler. Or just ends up looking similar to this.
Just with the same front fascia it has in that shot you posted, can lose the two tone job. JMO though.
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The Screamin' Chicken Lives!
Well, the Lingenfelter 455 T/A will have to do for now. The full debut will happen at SEMA, but I can already imagine that Pontiac fans are lining up to get their hands on conversion kits for their Camaros. This one runs a modified LS7, done up to 7.5L, producing 655 BHP. Talk about a kick in the pants!
Impressive. Looks pretty damn good. I don't care what engine it has just make it fairly affordable so we see some driving on the streets. But with Lingenfelter's name on it expect some stupid Shelby-esque high prices.
