GT4 WRS Week 50 : "Fighting on the Ring again"

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shockwaveracing
... what tyres are you using?
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N3. Normal, sports.

I just saw a 2:06.849 (with slipstreaming this time) and chucked it in the wall! :banghead:

Also, those times are for T3, T6 and T9 of course, not T1, 2 and 3 like I stated. :dunce:
 
MisterWeary
I've searched the net for a list of cars sorted by capacity or a list of convertibles...no luck. I've scoured the car lots in GT looking for convertibles and found nothing new. If it gets to results time and I find I'm beaten by every man and his dog when they were racing a car I knew about then that's fine...all credit to those people 👍 but if I get to the end and find out there was a car I didn't find or know about...what exactly does that say? I wasn't knowledgable enough on the car list for Gran Turismo? If this was a Trivia Competition then maybe that kind of task would be appropriate but this is a race series. This "hidden-car" thing gets a big 👎 from me.
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Well, well, well. I told you all this would happen! Did you listen to me?! NO!

Like Mr.W, while no expert on the Ring, I'm not the slowest in the field either, and I'm struggling to get anywhere near these times posted by even these D2 guys. I'm sure I've got the 'right' car, but what if I don't?

The way I see it, if you're good enough, you should be willing to put your car choices public. In the same way that the really fast guys, always post their set-ups, give tips and will happily give you their replays during the week.
 
MisterWeary
... but if I get to the end and find out there was a car I didn't find or know about...what exactly does that say? I wasn't knowledgable enough on the car list for Gran Turismo? If this was a Trivia Competition then maybe that kind of task would be appropriate but this is a race series. This "hidden-car" thing gets a big 👎 from me.

Board Updated
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Maybe it would be a good idea if flat-out just posted the number of legal cars there is to choose from this week? This way people will know if they have discovered them all of whether they need to keep looking. I'm really not bothered though because i'm pretty sure i've found them all.
 
ROB 256R
Are you sure about this? I know it's true in real life, but i just wondered if it was in GT4? I honestly can't say i've noticed a difference.
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Just try taking the fast left b4 T3 in the same way as you have been whilst in the draft, and you'll see what I mean!

No downforce!

The car just washes out and it's lawnmower time!

Neil
 
ROB 256R
Maybe it would be a good idea if flat-out just posted the number of legal cars there is to choose from this week? This way people will know if they have discovered them all of whether they need to keep looking. I'm really not bothered though because i'm pretty sure i've found them all.
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Well that would be a start but it's still not "racing". I for one love a challenging combo. No combo will ever scare me away and I'll continue to submit every week regardless of my speed but I do it because I love racing, not solving car selection conundrums.
 
ballstothewall
Just try taking the fast left b4 T3 in the same way as you have been whilst in the draft, and you'll see what I mean!

No downforce!

The car just washes out and it's lawnmower time!

Neil
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Your right. Just tried it then without slipstreaming and i could certainly take a tighter line. I think i must just have got used to it seeing as i haven't really run the first section of the track without slipstreaming. I'm managing to get to T5 before the AI pulls away and i can no longer get a tow off him.
 
MisterWeary
This "hidden-car" thing gets a big 👎 from me.
The car thing doesnt bother me so much, I have checked and checked and there is perhaps 4 manufacturers that offer something suitable, 3 cars that are in contention overall I think.....

The 👎 from me comes with the slipstreaming, sure its a racing technique.....However in real racing slipstreaming or drafting is used by drivers to make overtakes usually after a straight.

Following a quicker car all the way round to bring your time down seems not quite right to me, its been made legal and I must respect that decision but I cant help feeling we wont be seeing Super Aguri slipstreaming Renault this season in the F1 just to get their overall times down..

regards

David
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I think personally it would have been better just to have set this challenge as a Time Trial, but still using the secret car option.

With Single Race, there's either the ability to slipstream most of the way around the track using a faster AI car (which seems wrong to me) or putting the AI all the way to the left so you can get past it at the first corner and after that, it's pretty much a Time Trial anyway IMHO.

I'll get back with my own split times later. :)
 
Quick note to a certain person browsing this thread, you pm'd me but I cant reply til you clear some space.....!
 
Flat-out
You can AI on any kind of tyres, even if you are using a different type.
Yet, I've been asked by PM whether it would be allowed to use AI slipstream to get extra km/h, and I found it "against the spirit of the rules".
I wanted to know if any of you already does this without having mentioned, or if you all think it should be forbidden
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i know for sure this is the technique vexd is using and to very good results!!!
how can slip streaming be against the spirit? its another well needed skill in the game of gt surely???
 
EXelero
i know for sure this is the technique vexd is using and to very good results!!!
how can slip streaming be against the spirit? its another well needed skill in the game of gt surely???
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It depends how you view slipstreaming, I think of it as a technique used prior to making an overtake - In this instance its being used to artificially lower the overall laptime.

However rules are rules:indiff:

David
 
Dave_George
It depends how you view slipstreaming, I think of it as a technique used prior to making an overtake - In this instance its being used to artificially lower the overall laptime.

However rules are rules:indiff:

David
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I agree - you're using slipstreaming another vehicle to the advantage of your laptime, not just as a natural physical aid to overtake. I myself prefer to not do that, even if it does mean getting a slower laptime than everyone else.

I remember on Top Gear when Richard Hammond and Sabine Schmidt had a go at driving a Ford Transit around the Nurburgring. At first, Sabine tried it normally - the van on it's own, with Richard in the passenger seat. Then they emptied the entire van and they used a Dodge Viper to clear the air in front of the Transit, and she got a quicker laptime.

That's absolutely fine because it was an experimental demonstration, but in a competition about pure driving where hopefully all drivers would prefer to drive cleanly and fairly, technically it shouldn't really be allowed because A. it doesn't demonstrate the TRUE skill of the driver and B. it doesn't demonstrate the TRUE capabilities of the car they have chosen.

/rant :)

Suzie
 
I disagree with that to some extent suzie (btw, nice to meet you, my name is Kent :cheers: ).

A) The driver can easily mess-up slipstreaming and either rear-end the lead car or simply fall off and not keep up (so picking ai also comes into play with this).

B) The gearing of each car is different obviously. However, some cars carry 5 gears to shorter lengths and get better acceleration in the process. However, in a car like what I am driving, 5 gears can carry me to much higher speeds than the stock power will allow.
So, with that in mind, slipstreaming allows me to fully use the gears I have and therefore take full advantage of my selected car's potential.

👍

At the same time though... :lol:

I think that with this format we should have been doing two laps.
One lap racing is for hotlaps. 👍

One lap racing as we are doing it brings up several new issues (such as slipstreaming) and makes it possible for a driver's skill to be over-shadowed by their in-ability to design a race as well as they can actually drive.

Finally I just want to mention that my car gained 14mph on the back straight thanks to slipstreaming.
 
So, I'm racing against a car that has a 3-4 length headstart; a far better PWR than me; with tyres that have 3 levels more grip than mine; i have to contend with poor visibility; a variable level of downforce; and the ever present risk of making contact. I'm sorry, but if i can manage to stay in his slipstream despite all of this i think i fully deserve to reap the benifits. And believe me, i'd overtake him if i could. :lol:

Edit: Anyway, i'd like to think what i'm doing is more in the 'spirit of racing' than setting the AI to -10 and putting him on N1's is :rolleyes:
 
I just totally shook the AI out of its shoes. :dopey: It so fantasticly fun to make them crash into walls.
 
Ok, I take it back.

I just did a lap with the AI set to +10 and despite the slipstreaming, I realised I was trying harder as the bar had been raised. I got a faster overall time, but my sectors weren't much different from when I was racing against a 0 rating AI car.

Which brings up a new question: if it's supposed to be a race (ok, you don't have to win) but for ultimate competitiveness, maybe the AI rules should have been set to +10 for everyone? Then everyone experiences the odd bit of slipstreaming (plus racing in my +/- 1800cc bath tub vs a Mitsubishi 3000gt was a hell of a lot of fun), and ultimately there's more to to race against, rather than just beating a Dihatsu at the first corner.

I'm just trying to see if there's a way we can have an even playing field, that's all. Hope you guys understand. :)

Suzie
 
Dave_George
It depends how you view slipstreaming, I think of it as a technique used prior to making an overtake - In this instance its being used to artificially lower the overall laptime.
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There is a Driving Mission (can't remember which number it is, offhand...) which requires you to do exactly that. Slipstream as much as possible to lower your overall lap time, so you can pass the final car at the very end and succeed in the mission... So, if there's a mission that's trying to teach that exact skill, why should it be illegal in a normal race?

And the skill involved in slipstreaming is not trivial. It's MUCH harder to stay back there and NOT hit the AI driver than it is to pass him on the first turn, in my opinion... I've left the AI settings at their default for all my races so far, and can easily pass on the first turn, which kind of defeats the purpose of having a "race" instead of a "time trial." I might increase the AI's abilities and give this slipstreaming thing a try -- it'd be nice to be able to pick up an extra 10 to 15 mph down the long straight near the end... But it's not going to be easy to follow the AI for the entire track-length, just to get to that point... Anyone who can do that without screwing up and bumping the AI is an excellent driver, in my opinion, and deserves the faster time...
 
Some info about car choices, from the 36 PM that I received over the past 2 days.
  • 7 racers are using car 'A'
  • 2 racers are using car 'B'
  • 2 racers are using car 'C'
  • 1 racer is using car 'D'
  • 1 racer is using car 'E'
  • 1 racer is using car 'F'
  • no racers are using other cars as far as I know

This includes different versions of similar cars, having different weights and powers.

Also please be ready to remove ferrari_chris' split times since his car was IMO breaking one of the rules (He PM'ed me about it, and I answered but after he had posted his split times). He'll confirm if his times need to be removed from the leaderboard or not. (Better find this out before submission)
 
Laurence5905
There is a Driving Mission (can't remember which number it is, offhand...) which requires you to do exactly that. Slipstream as much as possible to lower your overall lap time, so you can pass the final car at the very end and succeed in the mission... So, if there's a mission that's trying to teach that exact skill, why should it be illegal in a normal race?

And the skill involved in slipstreaming is not trivial. It's MUCH harder to stay back there and NOT hit the AI driver than it is to pass him on the first turn, in my opinion... I've left the AI settings at their default for all my races so far, and can easily pass on the first turn, which kind of defeats the purpose of having a "race" instead of a "time trial." I might increase the AI's abilities and give this slipstreaming thing a try -- it'd be nice to be able to pick up an extra 10 to 15 mph down the long straight near the end... But it's not going to be easy to follow the AI for the entire track-length, just to get to that point... Anyone who can do that without screwing up and bumping the AI is an excellent driver, in my opinion, and deserves the faster time...
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Ok I never said it should be illegal - or that the skill involved was trivial, just to make that clear:tup:

I appreciate your point on the slipstreaming missions, however..... what are they trying to teach you exactly?

Are they,

A) Trying to teach you how to lower you whole lap time by drafting a faster car all the time?

Or....

B) Trying to teach you how to draft to add another layer of skill to your overtaking abilities??

Or maybe a bit of both??

The issue for me is that there is an element of the unknown in this weeks race and everyone is searching for anything to make them faster, most weeks with AI present the aim of the game is to get past cleanly and as soon as possible, this week its the opposite!! Funny that......

I just feel that drafting is great when used to strategically pass cars at certain points on a given track, this seems different to me somehow, Flat-out was the first to ask what we thought about it and Im just voicing my opinion of the matter. I would rather we all raced with the only mystery being what cars people are in, not how much of a tow they might have picked up into Schwedenkreuz.....

Good luck to those who use it though:tup:

regards

Dave
 
Flat-out
... Also please be ready to remove ferrari_chris' split times since his car was IMO breaking one of the rules (He PM'ed me about it, and I answered but after he had posted his split times). He'll confirm if his times need to be removed from the leaderboard or not. (Better find this out before submission)
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Yes, that's correct. The split times I posted earlier in this thread (this post) are indeed gained with an illegal car. Please remove them from the Leader Board.

I apologise to all for unintentionally misleading the WRS community like this. :O

So, it's back to the drawing board and a do-over for me. I was very surprised the way my times stacked up, that's what caused me to PM Cyril to check my car. Better to get this sorted before the deadline though, rather than being DQ'd after the finish...

I'm all set now though - back to the racing!
 
Got some ludicrusly slow splits for the board.

T3 2'12.496
T6 4'39.346
T9 6'56.079

Then right in the middle of the mini karusell, the 266HP RX-7 I was tailgating lost the rears and did a fishtail right in-front of me!
His rear kissed the front of my car very lightly and we carried on regardless. Managed to slipstream him for the whole of the final staight and got up to 148 mph. Only spotted the tap in the replay, didn't feel it at the time.

Bugger!:grumpy: :grumpy: :grumpy:
💡
Any chance of relaxing the no contact rule to allow AI screw-ups Cyril?
(You never know?:odd:)

Neil
 
Yup I've had plenty of those, plus the AI car seems partial to shunting me right off the track most of the time :dunce:

Perhaps it should be changed to "no deliberate contact"? :dopey:
 
No way. I've abandoned soooo many hot laps because I nudge the back of the AI!

I vote for sticking with No Contact.
 
hey guys ive got a noob question. This is the first time ive messed around in arcade mode and im just curious as to how to set the race length. I cant find it anywhere. Any help would be appreciated.
 
soad8806
hey guys ive got a noob question. This is the first time ive messed around in arcade mode and im just curious as to how to set the race length. I cant find it anywhere. Any help would be appreciated.
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At the screen where you select to start the race, select Options (available next to the Quick-tune icon) and then Race. There you can set the laps. Set it to 1 for this race. :)
 
I finally got some time to try this combo. It's interesting how no one knows what car is actually the best car. For me, I'm not even sure I found all of the eligible vehicles. But none-the-less, my crappy T9 time is 6:55.xxx.

I wish we could use real vehicles because the one in my garage meets the requirements.
1781cc
94bhp
hefty at more than 2500lbs (not exactly sure)
will above the 6.00 pwr

But I'd love to drive it around the "Ring" :cool:
 
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