Rapid Tire Wear after update

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Any testing for this should be done with a bone stock vehicle with all aids off (except maybe ABS...which in theory might help tire wear by preventing you from locking up the brakes).

I usually race around 450-500pp street cars but I'll find something from the New car dealer to run around a track and log some lap times.
 
tinram
exactly. Softs are for qualifying, unless the track is semi wet and/or your car is light/without power, and the tires would still not last long. There is a video out there where the drift king was test driving a well setup GTR, and the tires lasted a few laps, and he was not drifting. Tire wear is just right.
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Indeed. The problem is that most people are thinking of F1 or other open wheelers where things are quite different.
 
Ok, lets do a little bit of math for those of you shouting "TIRES WEAR TOO FAST!"

Now the way treadwear ratings work is by comparing them to a test tire that is used on a specified 400 mile loop (located in Texas) with regular driving. NOT super-fast, push it to the limits the entire time type driving. Now every company can use a different standard, there-in lies the problem with treadwear ratings. However, that does not effect this comparison for one simple reason, companies will use a tire that can't go as far for their "base tire" (100 treadwear) than another company. Now most of those 100 treadwear tires will last ~5,000-7,000 miles under warm temperature, moderate to easy driving conditions. (mainly formulated by investigating tire wear mileages for higher treadwear tires) Even though most racing tires are not DOT approved, and therefore may not have a treadwear rating, most of them are very low. Some being so close to zero, they are just published as zero. Now let's take a treadware rating of 40 (Hoosier A6's and most other DOT approved R-Comp autocross competition Tires) That means that with warm temperature, moderate to easy driving conditions they will last between 2000-2800 miles. Tires of treadwear 10 would last you between 500-720 miles in warm weather, moderate to easy driving conditions. Now everyone know that when you are really driving the car (pushing it to the limits of the tires grip) tires wear down much faster. I have personally seen a guy go through a set of A6's (40 treadwear) in two season of autocrosses. Now let's suppose 60 second runs, averaging 60 MPH (which is far too high, both in course length, and average speed, but for comparisons sake better to overcompensate) 6 runs each autocross, and 1 autocross per month (December and January are too cold, and autocrosses are not held) that is 10 autocrosses. For all intensive purposes however we will assume 15 autocrosses per year. That is a total driving distance of only 180 miles! That is a reduction in mileage of over 91%! Now this is just a guess, but I would say treadwear 40 is a medium softness racing tire. Is it really any surprise that a racing soft tire (probably a treadwear of 10) would only last a few laps?!
 
erm, there's no such thing as a qualifying tyre in F1 now, they do run the "fastest tyre" and then use that in the race.

Surely the "real driving simulator" would offer the experience relevant to the class/car. Race cars use race tyres, not modified road tyres and no race tyre goes off in a short distance, no one would use them in the race world if they did.

Still, it's giving everyone something to think about !
 
I think it's a good thing to make rapid tire wear possible but I think it's not the right way how PD did it in this update.
It would be a better change if they implement a feature where you can adjust the amount of tire wear with options like "realistic", "2x", "3x".
That would satisfy the guys who are running endurance races because of the strategy gamble but to be honest, it isn't realistic when the RM compound wears out after 12 laps of clean racing around Daytona Superspeedway with a NASCAR. NASCARs can go 30 or even more on one set of tires and it was great until the update.
I also think that the difference between tire wear of RS, RM and RH should be bigger but not regulated by increasing the tire wear of the soft compound rapidly but by decreasing the tire wear of the medium and hard compound. In my humble opinion, that would be the best solution (together with the feature of adjusting the amount of tire wear).
 
CupKonan04
I also think that the difference between tire wear of RS, RM and RH should be bigger but not regulated by increasing the tire wear of the soft compound rapidly but by decreasing the tire wear of the medium and hard compound. In my humble opinion, that would be the best solution (together with the feature of adjusting the amount of tire wear).
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This is the way I thought and hoped they were doing it. This would seem a lot more realistic.
 
Well it does force more pitting in short races. You don't have to have an hour long race to require a pit stop now.
 
mavryk_gt
Racing 101:

Racing Soft = Max Grip, Less Life.
Racing Hard = Less Grip, Max Life.

As long as RS have SHORTER life and RH have LONGER life, I and many many many others will be happy.
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Yup, tested all 3 types of RT's on Spa. They work like they should now. 👍
 
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chuyler1
Well it does force more pitting in short races. You don't have to have an hour long race to require a pit stop now.
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Well, that's why they should implement a feature where you can adjust the amount of tire wear so that everybody is satisfied.
 
The tests need to be made acording to the real car tire grip and not with the tyre name that gives GT5. Most racing tyres in GT5 are not meant for realistic gameplay, just to ease the handle giving out of scale unrealistic grades of grip.

The same mistake was made before when some people wanted to compare the peformance and accuracy of GT5 doing real life vs game laps without adjusting the default car grip.

Remember the tyres used in the Coulthard Seasonal Event(comfort softs). The recomended tyres by Polyphony to match the real life performance in the R8 comparison at Laguna Seca(comfort medium). The low grip tyres used for the GT Academy competitions(comfort and sports tyres for race cars). Etc..
 
Regarding the N24h race... My memory is a bit fussy - watched the whole thing on stream and got really tired - but I'm fairly sure most teams pitted when they did due to fuel, not tyres. That's why the Porsche hybrid was going further than the "regular". Also as you can see in the pdf linked earlier in the thread many teams had very fast laps (in some cases fastest lap) on the last lap before pit-in...
 
So I did a test. Online Private Lobby, Nurburgring GP/F. Calsonic stock power, 8 laps.

RS tires, 1 stop: 15min 41 sec
RH tires, 0 stop; 15min 48 sec

RS tires: Best lap time 1'53.3, worst lap 1'53.9 (lap 8)
RH tires: Best lap time 1'56.4, worst lap 1'59.4 (lap 8)

The RS tires had a little more the 50% left on them at the end of each stint, but were still delivering almost as good lap times as fresh. There was probably at least another two laps in them without laptimes going too high.

The RH tires had a little less than 50% left in them and lap times was increasing with each lap. If regulation would have stated RH only, it was probably time for a pitstop fairly soon.

At the last lap, the RS tires was 5.5 seconds faster. At 8 laps, the RS tires was 7 sec faster even if it had to do a pit stop. If the race would have been 2 laps longer, the RS tires would "win" with about an aditional 10-12 seconds, making them nrearly 20 seconds faster for the race. If the race would have been 6 laps, the RS tires could easily make it without a stop. If long races, RS tires will be faster at any lap combination.

Summary: I think RS tires will the best tire (if regulations allow) at any conceivable race lenght, at least for GT500 type cars.
 
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yanaran
Regarding the N24h race... My memory is a bit fussy - watched the whole thing on stream and got really tired - but I'm fairly sure most teams pitted when they did due to fuel, not tyres. That's why the Porsche hybrid was going further than the "regular".
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Exactly, I watched the race, too, and it's exactly like you were saying. The cars pitted for fuel and not for tires because the tires weren't so worn out that they had to pit earlier.
 
chuyler1
Ok, so it is clear tires wear too fast...but the question remains whether you can still be competitive at certain tracks by mixing up tire compounds. Previously it was RS or go home. If that has changed, I would say PD has made an improvement.
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Not if you have to stop more than once.

SilverArrow
I really wouldn't mind if they just made the hard tires last longer than normal, but making the softs degrade this much is ridiculous, I was in an online race on the Nurburgring and the tires were completely gone after half a lap(this was on race mediums which is even worse), how does this add to strategy? You're guaranteed to cause a crash with another driver. In short 3 lap races aswell, there doesn't need to be any strategy decisions because there shouldn't be any pit stops.
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All they needed to do was make the harder compounds last more, not make the Soft compuond wear faster! Tire wear was already ridiculous before the update! Now it simply is a joke!
I can understand a high super high HP street car on DOT R Compound tires wearing tires down quite fast but this is plain stupid!
Slick tires do last way longer than a handfull of laps. In the last days(1995-2003) of Trans Am those cars would go for an entire race lenght without pitting for new tires or fuel. This were 1-2hr races on a dynosaur of a car! Overweight and huge amounts of powered with outdated chasis geometries!
The LMP/GT1/GT2/GT3/GT4/TouringCars cars of today can easily double and triple stint a set of tires, no we are talking about 3hrs of racing on a set of tires. Now I'm not asking for that in GT5, all I'm saying is that the old tire wear model for the RS tires was acceptable, all they needed to do was increase the life of the RH and RM tires, not make the RS wear faster!
This is just a plain dumb move by PD!
 
Jav
Slick tires do last way longer than a handfull of laps.

This is just a plain dumb move by PD!
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You can't expect realistic wear without selecting first a realistic tyre grip. Both are linked in the tyre selection just don't select by name and do some lap tests before to confirm that you are in the right tyre for the expected real life wear. You need to understand that tyre grades in GT5 are not equal in names to their real life counterparts.

For example the Zonda-R in GT5 has by default RH compounds but the lap record at Nurburgring can be achieved with sport medium tyres. That car mount slicks in real life so if you want realistic grip in that car SM is the right choice, not RS and not RH. And then the tyre wear will be also more accurate.

Actually more grip = faster wear, and R compounds in GT5 are nowhere realistic, grip wise, so their wear would be always faster than the softer available real life compounds.
 
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Best Motoring did an endurance race type of test on Stock cars and stock tires to see what kind of abuse they could take. It was on tsukuba on a very hot day. The cars were driven for 2 stints of 20 minutes each. By the end of it the front heavy cars had chewed through their street tires. These are equivalent of comfort softs. So I would expect comfort softs to last 30 laps of tsukuba in an Mistubishi Evo 8.
 
Zer0
You can't expect realistic wear without selecting first a realistic tyre grip. Both are linked in the tyre selection just don't select by name and do some lap tests before to confirm that you are in the right tyre for the expected real life wear. You need to understand that tyre grades in GT5 are not equal in names to their real life counterparts.

For example the Zonda-R in GT5 has by default RH compounds but the lap record at Nurburgring can be achieved with sport medium tyres. That car mount slicks in real life so if you want realistic grip in that car SM is the right choice, not RS and not RH. And then the tyre wear will be also more accurate.

Actually more grip = faster wear, and R compounds in GT5 are nowhere realistic, grip wise, so their wear would be always faster than the softer available real life compounds.
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Explain this to me then: In real life a Super GT car can do 30 laps on Suzuka on a set of tires that can put down lap times that require RMs to get near. Shouldn't the slicks in GT be more durable?
 
Zer0
You can't expect realistic wear without selecting first a realistic tyre grip. Both are linked in the tyre selection just don't select by name and do some lap tests before to confirm that you are in the right tyre for the expected real life wear. You need to understand that tyre grades in GT5 are not equal in names to their real life counterparts.

For example the Zonda-R in GT5 has by default RH compounds but the lap record at Nurburgring can be achieved with sport medium tyres. That car mount slicks in real life so if you want realistic grip in that car SM is the right choice, not RS and not RH. And then the tyre wear will be also more accurate.

Actually more grip = faster wear, and R compounds in GT5 are nowhere realistic, grip wise, so their wear would be always faster than the softer available real life compounds.
Click to expand...

Read my post again, I am nowhere in my post asking for realistic tire wear. All I'm saying is that the Soft compound tires should've been left alone and the harder compounds made last longer.
Now, not even the grippiest tires on earth desintegrate in 3 laps! That's just plain silly! Yes I agree the race tire model in GT5 is not the best arround far from it, but it is what we have. Obviously the stupid amounts of grip where needed to cope with the games physics engine wich is not perfect.
Now back on topic and please read this time:
"I am nowhere in my post asking for realistic tire wear. All I'm saying is that the Soft compound tires should've been left alone and the harder compounds made last longer."

For a realistic tire model I pay a monthly subscription to iRacing.
 
Did a small test today concerning NASCAR cars at Daytona and all I can say is WOW!! Pretty sure the days of 50 laps with no pitting are gone. The test was short and not too involved but soft tires wear way quicker than before. I did 12 hard laps and they were almost half way gone. Hard tires did seem to be lasting a little longer, but not much. Won't have time to give this a good test for a few days so I was wondering if any of my NASCAR friends on here have done any extinsive testing on this. Looks like the longer races are gonna get interesting.
 
Sail IC
So I did a test. Online Private Lobby, Nurburgring GP/F. Calsonic stock power, 8 laps.

RS tires, 1 stop: 15min 41 sec
RH tires, 0 stop; 15min 48 sec

RS tires: Best lap time 1'53.3, worst lap 1'53.9 (lap 8)
RH tires: Best lap time 1'56.4, worst lap 1'59.4 (lap 8)

The RS tires had a little more the 50% left on them at the end of each stint, but were still delivering almost as good lap times as fresh. There was probably at least another two laps in them without laptimes going too high.

The RH tires had a little less than 50% left in them and lap times was increasing with each lap. If regulation would have stated RH only, it was probably time for a pitstop fairly soon.

At the last lap, the RS tires was 5.5 seconds faster. At 8 laps, the RS tires was 7 sec faster even if it had to do a pit stop. If the race would have been 2 laps longer, the RS tires would "win" with about an aditional 10-12 seconds, making them nrearly 20 seconds faster for the race. If the race would have been 6 laps, the RS tires could easily make it without a stop. If long races, RS tires will be faster at any lap combination.

Summary: I think RS tires will the best tire (if regulations allow) at any conceivable race lenght, at least for GT500 type cars.
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Thanks for sharing, mate 👍

Now if the race was 12 laps it will be combination of RH and RS between pitstop, right.? interesting
 
Im sat in the middle of this one, i wished they had reduced the life of the softs by only a small amount ( nearer 50% less life now ) and made the mediums and hards last longer, but at least we have a ratio of tyre grip/wear from RS to RH that is more workable now instead of RM and RH's just giving less grip like they used to, the other thing to remember is that regardless of the fact you cant finish races as quick as you used to, everyone is in the same boat with the new grip levels. As long as we see multiple tyre/pit startagies other than racing softs only that actually pay off it will be a good thing.

I guess I just need to do a few endurance races with my team mates to settle any of the doubts im having at the moment.
 
PAPPACLART
Have you guys actually used race softs with a GT500 car. 6 laps of a large track and there is no rubber left...0 rubber, hardly like real life.

Even hot lapping on a large track is not possible as half way through the first hot lap and your tyres are past there best.

Maybe racing 5 lap online races is ok, but for us that race in clubs and do 40-50 lap races, race softs are good for 3 laps pushing it before you have to pit.

Race hards will be the new race soft, but actually lasts less then race softs prior to the update.
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This, it just means the game got a whole lot more stupider

dr_slump
It's nice that they will no longer have the same tire wear, but the lifetime is just way too short.

PD should rename the tires:

Race Hard ---> Race Soft
Race Medium ---> Race Supersoft
Race Soft ---> Qualifier
Click to expand...

I think more like

Race Hard---> Cheese
Race Medium----> Popsicles
Race soft------> Jello
 
Funny, first people complain that RS tires lasted too long, now it's the other way around. RS tires are supposed to be one shot qualify tires, meaning you drive one lap about 70% peak to warm tires up, then lap two to go for a time. RS tires shouldn't be lasting 20+ laps anyway, depending on driving style they should get 10 - 15 laps. This should see who actually drives and learns to conserve and tune for the race. instead of balls to the walls driving style 500PP on RS. lol. I've been using SS and SH not bad even up to 600PP.
 
I'm pretty sure Racing Supersofts should last that little.

Soft tires usually can run into the 10 lap range. GT4 had it around that area. I'd go with the rectifying the Racing Hard tire solution instead. The reduction of usage time across the board is frankly ludicrous.
 
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