GTP NASCAR SPRINT CUP S3 Champs: RFLX_Niop, Joe Gibbs Racing, Toyota

Ah, I get it now.

Still, the point stands. There's not really anything to get worked up about.

But really, Knelly didn't have to follow me across the yellow line. He could have easily avoided the whole thing. Not sure if I'm so eager to give away my point now.

Looked at the replay, and litchi definitely seemed like he was trying to hold him up, though. Definitely odd.

Knelly

Seriously man, have you not read anything. I was happy enough with 5th place considering all the crap that came with Saturday night, even though I felt aggreived. I never made a fuss about it. I never complained or asked for anything to be reviewed and was happy enough to start getting ready for next week.

However, when you get penalised for something that was out of your control, as well as made out to be a filthy driver throughout the race in the summary, I'm not going to stand for that.

Simple point to be made is penalties or no penalties (Consistency). Bring them I gain, don't bring them, I maintain my 5th spot. Either way and I will let it lie, but I never pushed for others to be penalised until I was unfairly treated.

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You were making the same amount of points as the fifth place finisher with the extra point that was being transferred from Mule to you as a penalty to Mule, despite you being placed exactly where you should have rightfully finished: sixth, after Matty.

You weren't satisfied with fifth place points, and you raised holy hell about it right here in the thread for all to see.

You acted like you were a completely innocent bystander to a bunch of reckless idiots on four totally separate occasions, involving four separate drivers and a thick yellow line. Plus, you were the unfortunate victim of terrible brake-checking, as your first post about it made it seem. Your miscalculation on fuel was someone else's fault because you didn't take enough fuel to run a 32 lap stint under any or all possible remaining conditions (two cars or solo), and you should be gifted a spot on the podium because of the inconvenience bestowed upon you during the last 23 laps by everyone else on the track but yourself.

Seriously, that's how it comes across to me, and at least four others that have sent me a PM about this today.

No one is calling you a filthy, dirty driver. We're telling you that if you had chosen to be only slightly less aggressive for a period of about four total seconds, the first two wrecks wouldn't have happened. You were definitely being too aggressive in trying to make those two inside passes in the middle of the corner.

Those incidents didn't need to happen. You still had 23 more laps left to pass Furi. What was the reason that you just had to dive under him right then and there? If you had just let off the gas for a second or two so Furi could come back down, which you knew he was going to try to do, everything would have been fine, and you could have kept saving fuel for at least a little while longer.

You were an entire lap ahead of Litchi with only three laps left in the race when you two spun out. Plus, you and Litchi were all alone, so you could have definitely passed him anytime you wanted with one good slingshot draft on a straightaway. Again, what was the rush? At this point, you should have known you were going to be short on fuel and been in maximum fuel conservation mode any way.

Even if you had been less aggressive, and not wound up in those first two accidents, that still does not guarantee that a completely different accident, that was absolutely out of your control, wouldn't have happened and collected you. So, you still can't assume that you would have been able to make it to the end on your light fuel load that only would have worked in more fuel-saving conditions.

If you had stayed on the apron after pitting, you would have been much more likely to avoid Mule, and the Matty incident wouldn't have happened at all.

The reason Matty was placed ahead of you in the final standings is because your mistake (merging into traffic illegally was the primary cause of your damage) was absolutely the reason that he didn't finish ahead of you. Placing him in sixth would have been a punishment to him.

Mule felt like if he hadn't also made the exact same mistake (illegal merge out of pits) that triggered the first lap 100 wreck, you wouldn't have been in that situation with Matty. So Mule publicly admitted he was wrong, and volunteered a point to be taken from him and awarded to you to help make amends for your situation. That to me was more than a fair compromise for all parties involved, and is still the best option on the table, as far as I'm concerned.

We're reading what you say as you were 100% innocent on all accounts, and you're reading what we say as you were 100% at fault for everything, while neither statement is close to true, or even intended.

We all know the truth lies somewhere very much in between.

Looks like I'm late to the party. I've uploaded the incidents to Youtube so those that don't have the replay can see.

I am not passing any more comment on this but that is in no way agreeing with your comments and statements, or backing down with my views.

EDIT : Just to remind you all that my point was never about the increasing or decreasing of points. It was about the lack of inconsistency throughout the whole penalty system.

Ok, i understand now. Thanx Reflex for the vid.
Well, I'm off throttle, that's right. But if you look my tyres, they are worn, i just try to save them with no full throttle in turns entries due to my ds3 driving.
And if you look your counter, you dont loose any mph when i slow down.
Plus you push me off track at the end.

So, what's the problem knelly? Are you angry cause you push me off? Are you angry cause you don't loose mph? I don't understand why you're so angry against me when i see this video. I think you should relativize a bit and calm yourself dude.

The amount of time from when Knelly's damage unloads to when Matty tries to pass him is just way too much.

Also, it unloaded when he was on the apron, there's no way his car goes all the way to the top of the track just by unloading, conveniently when Matty is right there.....

But if he doesn't cross the line into the path of my wreck, he avoids the Matty situation altogether, and this discussion doesn't even take place.

Furi wrecking himself was penalty enough for him; especially when after the fact, he waits for Knelly and works with him. Litchi is a newb on ovals, and this can be his lesson; don't get off the gas when there's a car directly behind you, unless you move to the top and let the behind car pass.

Knelly 90% made his own bed with the Matty incident. Matty was going to pass him; he should be placed above Knelly. Whether I still lose a point is up to Drop, but I've come to the conclusion that I don't think it's necessary.

EDIT: Perhaps you can also slot Litchi behind Knelly. He's not in it for points, so it doesn't affect him at all.

Bit of drama....he he he

I'd like to race s4 as a reserve, but I want to do some of the harder oval tracks like Montegi, if its part of the season schedule?

Honestly it looks like this was just a crazy chain of events. The 30th crash wouldn't have happened if the 29th crash didn't happen, and the 29th crash wouldn't have happened if the 28th crash didn't happen......

There's no fair way to penalize in this situation that doesn't favor one driver over another. Let's just throw everything out the window, let the results do the talking and move on to next week.

Niop

Honestly it looks like this was just a crazy chain of events. The 30th crash wouldn't have happened if the 29th crash didn't happen, and the 29th crash wouldn't have happened if the 28th crash didn't happen......

There's no fair way to penalize in this situation that doesn't favor one driver over another. Let's just throw everything out the window, let the results do the talking and move on to next week.

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Two guys getting fifth place points and only Mule being penalized a single point seems more than fair.

Also, litchi's coasting made Knelly run 2.207 seconds slower on lap 97 (49.265) than he did on lap 95 (47.058). I'm not counting lap 96, because Knelly had engine damage from Joe and ran a 48.999. At that point in the race, on old tires, that's essentially a solo lap time. Litchi's coating twice was basically offset by his draft the rest of the lap, resulting in an average solo lap time on older tires.

Rich S

Bit of drama....he he he

I'd like to race s4 as a reserve, but I want to do some of the harder oval tracks like Montegi, if its part of the season schedule?

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You will have to sign up on the Nationwide thread and Mule will add you to the list! Here's the link GTP Nationwide Series S2.

MustangRyan

Two guys getting fifth place points and only Mule being penalized a single point seems more than fair.

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It's way better than some of the other suggestions.

MÜLE_9242;7298859

There was no need to defend yourself in the first place when you were not going to be penalized at all.

That is the crucial point that you have completely missed, and brought the whole situation out of proportion with because of.

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This seems to be the glaringly huge point that was entirely missed by Knelly.

Knelly was NOT being penalized for causing the wreck with Matty (I even blamed Knelly's suspension damage in the explanation post, citing the cause of the wreck as Knelly's "disabled car", which was attributed to Mule's mistake). In no way was Knelly being blamed for the Matty accident in that post.

Matty was the only driver in the race that was absolutely a 100% innocent bystander to an accident. That accident happened with about 10 seconds left in the race, when you are actually able to be certain how the end results would have played out if not for circumstances. Matty did everything he could reasonably do to avoid a disabled car that was driving directly into his path. The car that struck him was damaged, and that damage was in no way the result of something done by Matty. Matty would have rightfully finished 5th, with 100% certainty, if not for an accident that was truly ZERO percent his fault. Placing Matty in 6th for something that was 100% completely out of his own control would have been a penalty to Matty, and that is not fair.

Mule was receiving the ONLY penalty in the entire race. He was being penalized a point because his illegal merge out of the pits triggered the accident on lap 100. Mule rightfully accepted 100% of the blame for that accident, and even accepted blame for causing the damage to Knelly's car (and thus, he claimed full blame for causing Matty's accident), even though Knelly's damage could have been easily avoided had he simply followed the same pit exiting rule that Mule had just violated.

It was only after I posted that Matty was going to be placed in 5th that Knelly went off the deep end, and started accusing everyone else in the race of taking him out, brake-checking him, and ruining his perfect pit strategy, through no fault of his own whatsoever. Nothing that was posted was personal or attacking, before Knelly made it so by accusing everyone else of being at fault for everything. He loudly complained about being penalized, and how unfair that was, even though he was not actually being penalized. He wanted other drivers to be penalized, because they were all at fault.

I think if Knelly would have taken a deep breath and objectively looked at everything from a dispassionate point of view, he would have been OK with the end result. Knelly getting 5th place points for a 6th place finish after 4 wrecks and one unscheduled pit stop for fuel was a very fair deal for Knelly.

As for penalties, you guys are right. I don't like handing them out. I feel like we have a very clean group of intelligent drivers that are more than capable of running an entire race without trying to cause accidents. I know that no one here is intentionally trying to cause accidents, and it's the reason I've always given you guys the benefit of the doubt when it comes to incidents.

I also feel like all of you guys are honest. It's the reason I believed Knelly and Litchi when they both told me that they in no way meant to cause any incidents, even when the other party in both matters felt it was obviously intentional from what they saw. If you guys want me to believe your side of the story when you tell it to me, you had better be willing to openly listen to what others say when it's their turn to explain themselves. All parties need to be subject to logic and reasoning.

To me, penalties are only handed out for two things. The first is blatant dirty driving, none of which was seen anywhere in Saturday's race. The second thing is an obvious violation of rules. This reason is why Mule received a penalty. He clearly merged too high and too early out of pit road. His illegal merge was enough to warrant the penalty, but the resulting crash guaranteed the penalty. Mule accepted his penalty with grace, and even volunteered his penalty point to go toward helping another driver that he felt he wronged.

Two guys getting fifth place points and only Mule being penalized a single point seems more than fair considering all of the circumstances.

This is how the race is going to be scored, and that's final.

Niop

Looks like I'm late to the party. I've uploaded the incidents to Youtube so those that don't have the replay can see.

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Its fun to sit back and read all the controversy.

Thank goodness I decided not to race this weekend.

It's like

Knelly

It's like

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We all agree.

Does this mean we can finally move on now?

I hope so.

OFFICIAL Daytona 250 Results:

1. #20 Droptop2001gt (66 laps led) - 20 points, +2 bonus points
2. #11 Furinkazen (1 laps led) - 18 points, +1 bonus point
3. #43 JoeOfTheFire (13 laps led) - 16 points, +1 bonus point
4. #18 GTP_Litchi - 0 points (Nationwide Driver), +9 points for ACDCROCKS123
5. #99 MattyMc1996 (3 laps led) - 12 points, +1 bonus point, +8 points for Tom_97_COD
6. #42 Knelly (5 laps led) - 11 points, +1 bonus point, +1 penalty point
7. #24 Chqr (6 laps led) - 0 points (Nationwide Driver)
8. #88 Carbonox (3 laps led) - 0 points (Nationwide Driver)
9. #83 MULE_9242 (1 lap led) - 8 points, +1 bonus point, -1 penalty point
10. #83 RedPartyHat (2 laps led) - 7 points, +1 bonus point
11. #14 RFLX_Niop (Pole Position) - 6 points, +1 bonus point







GTP Sprint Cup Chase for the Championship - After 1 of 5 Chase Races:






Owner's Championship:






Manufacturer's Championship:

I'm still upset at my power.
99% of my gaming life I am not really do anything important.
But the 1% I am, power decides to go out for 5 seconds.
Sigh

I just realize this was my ever "engine failure" in a cup race, and also results in my first finish outside the top 7 for the series. I knew I should have done an engine swap after qualifying. 💡

I like the tables, Drop. 👍

Niop

I just realize this was my ever "engine failure" in a cup race, and also results in my first finish outside the top 7 for the series. I knew I should have done an engine swap after qualifying. 💡

I like the tables, Drop. 👍

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You disconnected as the race countdown began so you couldn't even get your car started.
My engine failed on lap 34.

Hopefully this crap doesn't happen to us or anyone this Saturday.

One question. If Dowhat doesn't make the next race, will RPH have his points transferred into the Chase?

I believe they should so we effectively have 8 drivers in there.

Great to see non chase drivers in there as well supporting their teams and brands etc.

Niop

I just realize this was my ever "engine failure" in a cup race, and also results in my first finish outside the top 7 for the series. I knew I should have done an engine swap after qualifying. 💡

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Just so you know, you do get points for the result. But, the finish doesn't go on your official stats record, as you did not actually start the race (I did the same thing for Joe in his season 1 non-starts). Technically, you still have not finished a race worse than 7th. 👍

Niop

I like the tables, Drop. 👍

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Did you notice the red, white, and blue theme to the main table for July 4th?

RedPartyhat

You disconnected as the race countdown began so you couldn't even get your car started.
My engine failed on lap 34.

Hopefully this crap doesn't happen to us or anyone this Saturday.

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It sounds like the #14 car in our GTP series had the same EFI troubles that hit the #14 car in the real Sprint Cup race at Kentucky this past weekend.

As for RPH, he must be getting the leftover TRD engines that were being supplied to Kyle Busch for the last month or so.

Knelly

One question. If Dowhat doesn't make the next race, will RPH have his points transferred into the Chase?

I believe they should so we effectively have 8 drivers in there.

Great to see non chase drivers in there as well supporting their teams and brands etc.

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No. The eight drivers that got in are in, and the rest are out. If we do it once, it will set a precedent and the same treatment will be expected in the future. We will however be changing the rule for the wild card next season, so that a limited part-time entry doesn't take a single race win and get a place in the Chase.

Plus, it looks like Furi is going to make the race for the 9th place in points (and 12th draft pick) pretty interesting down the stretch. 👍

Well you know, red, white and blue are also colors of the Russian flag...

Carbonox

Well you know, red, white and blue are also colors of the Russian flag...

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Dah, comrade.

I thought I was giving dowhat 2/3 points?

Not to worry if it wasn't the case.

Chqr

I thought I was giving dowhat 2/3 points?

Not to worry if it wasn't the case.

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Can't multi quote as on phone but there are three posts questioning it on 30 June. But I don't believe there was any official word from Drop.

It was a suggestion that was agreed while Drop was on hiatus so he may have inadvertently overlooked the topic.

What Drop says stands though, I presume.

Chqr

I thought I was giving dowhat 2/3 points?

Not to worry if it wasn't the case.

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Each Sprint Cup driver is only allowed to take 2/3 points from a substitute driver once per season. Dowhat has already received his 2/3 points once this season, during race number 7.
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?p=7169057#post7169057

Other drivers have also already used up their once-per-season substitution, including RedPartyHat (week 6), Mudd (week 7), ACDC (week 9), and Tom (week 9). Look for the red numbers in the main standings table to see when substitute points were used.

EDIT - As a side note, you would need to be driving the #48 to give substitute points to dowhat13, had he been eligible to receive them.