freshseth83
(Banned)
- 8,246
- freshseth83
2014 United Sports Car Championship
- Thread starter Earth
- 6,133 comments
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- 10,276
- Sacramento CA
- cnd01
freshseth83
You're exactly right. You got me red handed. Every race day in grand am, NASCAR officials cut checks to each and every team lining the pit wall. For the teams that had problems, NASCAR comes in at night like the tooth fairy to the team owner's house and slips a cool 20K under their pillow, but NASCAR doesn't stop at teams. In fact, I get paid 6 figures to come on this board and post pro-grand am statement. Im filthy stinking rich right now!!!!!!!
- 22,551
- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
You really haven't proven how, all you've done lately is bloat numbers from the main owners flagship series (NASCAR) as justification for this move. You also seem to support a non-technological archaic system of racing rather than actually do something that helps the consumer end down the road, which seems to be openly saying it wants to stay in America and not have to duke it out with overseas counterparts. If this is surely the case Dodge and Chevy will go international like they did in the early 90s I think.
freshseth83
(Banned)
- 8,246
- freshseth83
You're exactly right. You got me red handed. Every race day in grand am, NASCAR officials cut checks to each and every team lining the pit wall. For the teams that had problems, NASCAR comes in at night like the tooth fairy to the team owner's house and slips a cool 20K under their pillow, but NASCAR doesn't stop at teams. In fact, I get paid 6 figures to come on this board and post pro-grand am statement. Im filthy stinking rich right now!!!!!!!
Typical childish response. You can't deny facts. You have no evidence to refute what's well known to the motorsports world so you try to add humor in your desperate attempt to criticise my post. Funny, because these aren't 'opinions' like you throw out there! It's all backfiring and shows that the things you speak are in fact, fiction.
- 10,276
- Sacramento CA
- cnd01
LMSCorvetteGT2
There isn't too much manufacturer involvement in grand am. Thats what I like about it.
I think a manufacturer's goal in auto racing is to ultimately sell cars. If I took the paint scheme and badge off of the Audi r18 and asked the average human being which manufacturer makes that, and I will put my debit card that unless they follow endurance racing, they have no clue who makes it. Point being: brand identity is key. The likes of srt and Chevy are running factory gt teams instead of prototype because it's easier for the casual person to identify with it and its not a 9 figure budget. If Chevy and srt take their car overseas, power to them. You might be right honestly. We really don't know enough about specs to know for sure what's happening either.
- 10,276
- Sacramento CA
- cnd01
freshseth83
It's not like Michael Shank said on tv that he had to mortgage his house to pay for the damage done to the #6 car so that it would be able to race at Watkins Glen, but since it's a known fact that NASCAR pays teams, he was blatently lying on television and his performance is golden glove worthy.
maybe you would know about grand am if you watched races.
- 3,019
- Essex
Motorsports isn't all about branding.
- 44,185
- Blackburn
- Furinkazen_54
Grand Am DP is just a glorified spec series.
- 3,019
- Essex
I thought it was meant to be a spec series?
- 10,276
- Sacramento CA
- cnd01
Furinkazen
+1 it's the beauty of micromanaging done very well. It's not pretty, but it's fun to watch. You would enjoy the race man. The paddocks are equally friendly. The continental sports car challenge is even more open. I've walked right up to the mechanics while they're working on the cars. Most initiate a conversation.
- 44,185
- Blackburn
- Furinkazen_54
+1 it's the beauty of micromanaging done very well. It's not pretty, but it's fun to watch. You would enjoy the race man. The paddocks are equally friendly. The continental sports car challenge is even more open. I've walked right up to the mechanics while they're working on the cars. Most initiate a conversation.
And that leaves no incentive for people to come in as they can't develop there own cars.
- 22,551
- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
Actually to run a GT team like SRT and VIPER it is higher 7 to lower 8 figures a season, which is pretty expensive still. They have no reason to run Prototype because it isn't a goal of GM or SRT to test hybrid technologies that will be applied to upper end models. However, they do use GTE as a testing bed for their super cars they sell to the general public.
Also the same could be said for NASCAR, I could take the badges off and the average person wouldn't know for sure. This season might be more easy if they pay attention to road cars. The average person doesn't know most car around them so...
Which is why teams want more flexibility in Nascar, and why IZOD will probably be the more interesting American auto sport come next year.
- 10,276
- Sacramento CA
- cnd01
Furinkazen
Wolf is developing a DP chassis for next season. That makes 4 active chassis constructors.
Not only that, but also Ford has the ecoboost DP with Ford bodywork next season. Bmw ran it's 4.5L engine at Indy for the first time. Manufacturers are involved just no full tilt factory progames
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- 44,185
- Blackburn
- Furinkazen_54
^Again proof it's NASCAR Road Racing essentially.
- 44,185
- Blackburn
- Furinkazen_54
- 3,585
- Phoenix, AZ
- GTP_Snaeper
While I understand this is a forum meant for discussion, the mentality that plenty of people seem to be taking about the future of USCR is starting to get old. Let me debunk some of the perceived myths I'm seeing:
Tires: Let's cut Continental some slack. They're supporting this whole operation heavily and really, only the true die-hards seem to care about what tires the cars are running. Tires are tires, quit making a big deal about them. As for P2 cars with Continentals, they believe they can make a Le Mans winning tire so I say give them a chance. But ultimately, quit acting like LMP2's on Continental's is going to ruin their chances at a class win. The last team to run at Le Mans from the ALMS was Level 5, outside of that.... there really isn't many occasions where P2 teams from the states go to Le Mans, so it's not a big deal what tires they run here. GTE/LM consistently continues to see the most teams make the trip over to France, and they still have open tires, so that should be the end of that. (And because I can see someone misinterpreting what I mean, I'm talking about P2 teams that race in ALMS normally.)
Restrictive Rules: Afraid the rules will scare away teams? I say good. How many teams do you really think this series needs to be successful anyways? If you add up the grids from both series right now, you have easily 70 cars for the big races, and around 60 for the smaller ones. That's before you add in the teams that want to race in the new series (as well as the current series if you're TRG-AMR). To think that restrictive rules will limit class sizes and competition is silly. Sure, I'd love to see full-on GT3, but considering people were willing to build, buy and run heavily modified GT3 cars for Grand Am says to me that we'll have no problem seeing lightly modified cars. You might also consider the fact that Corvette, SRT, BMW and the other GTE factory programs don't want to have to worry about a fast GT3 car ruining their day. Doesn't look good to invest in developing a car when you're beat by the the "slower" class.
NASCAR: Will not ruin this series. NASCAR is successful and USCR will be successful. If you don't like NASCAR, I get it, but all of these unsubstantiated theories of NASCAR people pulling all the strings is myth until proven otherwise. Every reasonable article I've read, many of the reactions from the teams, and most of the buzz from the press says that both sides are getting along well and that the decisions are diplomatic.
Global Relevance: Really doesn't mean a damn thing, but from what it sounds like, the unified strength of the series has an even greater presence in global discussions. The U.S. still has a WEC race for P1 fans, we still have some of the best cars and teams racing in our series, and we're part of the discussion for 2016 Prototype and GT specs, which will remove all of the perceived barriers that would hinder European teams from racing in the U.S. Also, the FIA/ACO has their own agenda going with the WEC, and if that series is to grow (assuming it does at all) we most likely would've seen a greater decline in WEC teams participating in races like Sebring and Petit Le Mans anyways. Considering the fact that I want COTA to be successful, I'm glad they've chosen to race there instead and I hope they continue to do so.
Just what I think of this whole situation.
Tires: Let's cut Continental some slack. They're supporting this whole operation heavily and really, only the true die-hards seem to care about what tires the cars are running. Tires are tires, quit making a big deal about them. As for P2 cars with Continentals, they believe they can make a Le Mans winning tire so I say give them a chance. But ultimately, quit acting like LMP2's on Continental's is going to ruin their chances at a class win. The last team to run at Le Mans from the ALMS was Level 5, outside of that.... there really isn't many occasions where P2 teams from the states go to Le Mans, so it's not a big deal what tires they run here. GTE/LM consistently continues to see the most teams make the trip over to France, and they still have open tires, so that should be the end of that. (And because I can see someone misinterpreting what I mean, I'm talking about P2 teams that race in ALMS normally.)
Restrictive Rules: Afraid the rules will scare away teams? I say good. How many teams do you really think this series needs to be successful anyways? If you add up the grids from both series right now, you have easily 70 cars for the big races, and around 60 for the smaller ones. That's before you add in the teams that want to race in the new series (as well as the current series if you're TRG-AMR). To think that restrictive rules will limit class sizes and competition is silly. Sure, I'd love to see full-on GT3, but considering people were willing to build, buy and run heavily modified GT3 cars for Grand Am says to me that we'll have no problem seeing lightly modified cars. You might also consider the fact that Corvette, SRT, BMW and the other GTE factory programs don't want to have to worry about a fast GT3 car ruining their day. Doesn't look good to invest in developing a car when you're beat by the the "slower" class.
NASCAR: Will not ruin this series. NASCAR is successful and USCR will be successful. If you don't like NASCAR, I get it, but all of these unsubstantiated theories of NASCAR people pulling all the strings is myth until proven otherwise. Every reasonable article I've read, many of the reactions from the teams, and most of the buzz from the press says that both sides are getting along well and that the decisions are diplomatic.
Global Relevance: Really doesn't mean a damn thing, but from what it sounds like, the unified strength of the series has an even greater presence in global discussions. The U.S. still has a WEC race for P1 fans, we still have some of the best cars and teams racing in our series, and we're part of the discussion for 2016 Prototype and GT specs, which will remove all of the perceived barriers that would hinder European teams from racing in the U.S. Also, the FIA/ACO has their own agenda going with the WEC, and if that series is to grow (assuming it does at all) we most likely would've seen a greater decline in WEC teams participating in races like Sebring and Petit Le Mans anyways. Considering the fact that I want COTA to be successful, I'm glad they've chosen to race there instead and I hope they continue to do so.
Just what I think of this whole situation.
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- 5,551
- Controls set for heart of sun
- GTP_RogerTheHors
Bravo.
- 22,551
- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
delete
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- 22,551
- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
I agree with this the tires shouldn't be an issue, there was a time people didn't think a japanese manufactured tire would win in F1 or finish on the podium compared to Goodyear tires.
The GT3 car isn't slower, which I think you know and there really isn't tons of development into the GTE. All they do is alter the rules create a wider body and wheel base or aero parts and that is what they call "development". The rules I agree are necessary for some teams to leave, the issue is that it seems much easier to retain GA teams, thus the take over instead of merger people are talking about here and other forums.
NASCAR has an influence it's not like they are sitting back, you could also do a favor to all you are trying to prove wrong by showing articles you've read. The problem is that this will be solely American based, with IZOD being the only series that attempts to be International.
The U.S. was always going to have one due to the FIA, not really anything with U.S. based promoters. Why exactly would we have seen a decline in WEC? An F1 purpose built track with other FIA series running their seems obvious, if it wasn't there the likelihood of a North American race would probably drop.
Because you said that it was BS that nascar is funding and helping GA be alive, yet it was further proven to you. Now you acknowledge it and we are back full circle. It's not so much a problem as it is just proving to you, you were wrong. That's what I'm getting from all that.
- 3,585
- Phoenix, AZ
- GTP_Snaeper
Comparisons: Let's take stock of what we have on our hands here. The USCR's 12 events gives it one of the longest schedules in sports car racing. Couple that with the fact that we'll likely see grids of 60+ with a minimum of 40-50 for all of those races raises the question that, outside of the WEC, what series comes even close? The USCR is on track to be one of the biggest Sports Car racing series in the world and here you guys are damning it like it's the bastard step-child of the racing world. Double the events of the WEC with more marquee endurances races. Double the events of the BES with comparable grid counts (and greater diversity, as much as I do love seeing a massive field of GT3 cars). It will make the ELMS pale even more in comparison than the series already looks when compared to the ALMS with it's greater schedule and grid counts and more innovation and independence (do you think the ELMS organizers have as much of a say as IMSA does right now?). I'd love to compare it to the Asian Le Mans Series, but as you all know, that model-of-racing-stability hasn't even started it's 4-race season yet. (And have you seen the first race's entry list?)
The USCR is the biggest sports car racing series in the world behind only the WEC.
- 3,585
- Phoenix, AZ
- GTP_Snaeper
I never said the GT3 car was slower. I said it was "slower". The GTE teams have the better drivers and the bigger budgets, they want to be finishing ahead of the GT3 cars. And if recall correctly, development was one of the issues AJR stopped running the Evora, and that Mr. Job was sore over merging with Grand-Am, since they don't like developing cars as much as the ALMS does.
You can call it a takeover, I call it ALMS "surrendering", since they are the ones who put up the "For Sale" sign. The tone "takeover" seems to imply that Grand Am pulled some economic coup to buy out their competitor and put them out of business. OR we can not spin it either way and call it exactly what it was reported to be: A mutually agreed buyout of ALMS by Grand-Am after agreement of terms.
And so what about ALMS teams having a harder time. Some of the GTC teams are hardy and will likely be able to suffer the change (Flying Lizard, AJR, TRG won't be going anywhere), and the same can be said for the P1 teams. And really, to all of you crying foul over the loss of P1, remember that the ALMS seems to be the only other racing series in the world that supported it outside of the WEC. It's a dying breed when it comes to regional racing. So what good teams are we really losing from the ALMS?
EDIT: Also, the two P1 teams (Not counting Deltawing) were going to have to buy new race cars next year anyways, and GTC can sell their race cars quite easily, since they're Porsche GT3 Cup cars. If you asked a Grand Am team to sell the GA-Spec Porsche they had invested $450,000 USD into, you'd get the response "To who?". The point is, the common specs that ALMS uses allows their cars to come and go easier than Grand-Am's, so it's easier for them to ask to change.
It does, but it's not nearly as much of an influence as everyone seems to be making it out to be. Grand-Am, in my mind, grew to be the way it was because you couldn't feasibly have two racing series in the same country racing the same cars for different organization bodies at the level IMSA and Grand-Am were, so Grand-Am implemented cost-effective formulas for American teams since IMSA already had the European racing cars segment cornered off.
And I'll find my source articles if you can find me source articles saying NASCAR is actively developing the series around Stock-Car racing interests. The only connection NASCAR has is that they share some employees.
So the WEC and other major FIA/ACO series visit all of the other F1 tracks too?
Ultimately, I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here. I never suggested the WEC would decline, only that it would expand. I said WEC teams would decline in participating in events outside of the WEC's schedule (like Sebring and Petit Le Mans) if the Series' schedule expanded. If Audi, Toyota and Rebellion have the budget for extra-curricular activities like that, then they could easily agree to more official races... at the cost of extra-curricular activities.
Ultimately, Sebring and Petit Le Mans will live on and the racing will continue to be good, even if the Europeans stopped coming here (since they were probably going to stop coming here with or without this merger, which might explain why the merger happened in the first place).
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freshseth83
(Banned)
- 8,246
- freshseth83
It's not like Michael Shank said on tv that he had to mortgage his house to pay for the damage done to the #6 car so that it would be able to race at Watkins Glen, but since it's a known fact that NASCAR pays teams, he was blatently lying on television and his performance is golden glove worthy.
Wuh wuh, cry me a river. I have watched Grand Am for a long time. Probably before you even knew what it was. It's bs to think a guy has to mortgage a house to repair a race car. I thought they were so affordable? He wouldn't be in that situation if the driving was clean, but "boogity boogity" "rubbin' is racin'" "argy bargey"; isn't that your GA modo?
