Official GTP Online Racing Discussion Thread

  • Thread starter Snaeper
  • 358 comments
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No, nothing's forced at all.

But I just want to say, a universal ruling "Racing body" or sanctioning group won't work, it never does, it may work for a small group of series, but not for the many we're aiming to support coming on in GT6.

What I think we should make our goal instead is setting up a solid structure for individual groups to decide on adopting. It would be like the OLR, but instead of it just being a guide for racecraft, we want to make an "OLR" style set of recommendations, suggestions, ideals, and templates for people that want to go by, to run by.

If they're made well enough, eventually they'll become the universal standard, and the whole thing will run itself. It's like a GTP Racing forum Constitution, so to speak, but without a supreme leader or power. Only supporting groups and members that help keep things running smoothly.

Hopefully that makes my vision more clear.
 
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Not sure how much I can bring to the table, but none the less, I'd like to be a part of the Skype Call(s). We're in very different time zones, but as I'm one vacation this week, I'll probably be online a lot.
 
Wardez
No, nothing's forced at all.

But I just want to say, a universal ruling "Racing body" or sanctioning group won't work, it never does, it may work for a small group of series, but not for the many we're aiming to support coming on in GT6.

What I think we should make our goal instead is setting up a solid structure for individual groups to decide on adopting. It would be like the OLR, but instead of it just being a guide for racecraft, we want to make an "OLR" style set of recommendations, suggestions, ideals, and templates for people that want to go by, to run by.

If they're made well enough, eventually they'll become the universal standard, and the whole thing will run itself. It's like a GTP Racing forum Constitution, so to speak, but without a supreme leader or power. Only supporting groups and members that help keep things running smoothly.

Hopefully that makes my vision more clear.
Click to expand...

Essentially a template. This would be a good idea.
 
template's too simple a concept, and brings with it certain negative connotations with different people. What I'm talking about is more like a tool set, motivation factory, and benchmark type deal.
 
Wardez
template's too simple a concept, and brings with it certain negative connotations with different people. What I'm talking about is more like a tool set, motivation factory, and benchmark type deal.
Click to expand...

But surely a new person wants a basic template. Then they can adapt it for themselves and personal use? Perhaps template is wrong term, but thats what I think is good here.
 
That's one of the roles it could fill, yeah, but not just be a template of course.
 
Just another basic idea, but I believe the trading part of the site has a "Traders reputation thread"

Maybe we could do that here? It would really just serve as a place to let us all know if they are (Hard to say this) "good" or "bad" not speed wise, just how they drive, and if they will be more of a problem than a asset.
 
One thing we discussed was opening up the WRS a little, so non GTP_ registered members can set laps and get a division grading, just to see where you stack up against everyone.
 
Wardez
No, nothing's forced at all.

But I just want to say, a universal ruling "Racing body" or sanctioning group won't work, it never does, it may work for a small group of series, but not for the many we're aiming to support coming on in GT6.
Click to expand...

Agreed.

Wardez
What I think we should make our goal instead is setting up a solid structure for individual groups to decide on adopting. It would be like the OLR, but instead of it just being a guide for racecraft, we want to make an "OLR" style set of recommendations, suggestions, ideals, and templates for people that want to go by, to run by.
Click to expand...

Having a set of guidelines people can use in their Series would be a good thing. Having the right information in front of prospective racers is important and if there are tools Directors can use, all the better.

Wardez
If they're made well enough, eventually they'll become the universal standard, and the whole thing will run itself. It's like a GTP Racing forum Constitution, so to speak, but without a supreme leader or power. Only supporting groups and members that help keep things running smoothly.
Click to expand...

Going to quote an old saying that I have no source for, 'The thing about standards is, everyone has one.' Standards are all well and good, but over time they become outdated. Being outdated means someone is going to need to be the keeper of the standard to keep it relevant. If no one champions it, it will eventually fade off into obscurity. Not to mention everyone thinks their standard is right ;)

I'm not trying to rain on the parade, I think this is a good idea. I'm just trying to point out that it will need to be maintained, tweaked and revamped over time. And typically the impetus to do that will come from one or two people.

Thinking back to when I first became aware of GT Planet, one of the things I found difficult was wading through the reams and reams of series, clubs and one of's to find something I was interested in joining. This was mentioned earlier, not sure by whom, but having a way to summarize the plethora of options would be a great help to people new to GT Planet.

Having things like the following in a table format with links to the each series could help out.

Types of car(s) - LM, Street, Tuner ...
Format - Enduro, Sprint ...
Day(s)
Time(s)
Timezone
Skill Level - All, Alien, Intermediate ...

Sorry, my mind always goes to a solution :scared:

Wardez
Hopefully that makes my vision more clear.
Click to expand...

Yes it did 👍
 
RESHIRAM5
Would this mean we all have to WRS members?

Would I have to use PP to classify cars?

Would I be forced to follow a set a start and finish date and I won't be able to change it during the series?

Would I have to have a restriction on the drivers based on skill?
Click to expand...

No to three of your questions. People class their cars now through the pp system though we don't know if it will work the same in GT6.
 
I looked at your latest gig Wardez but not for the first time was put off by the "Invitation only!" thing never have liked how that comes across as a side point.:'(
 
Furinkazen
One thing we discussed was opening up the WRS a little, so non GTP_ registered members can set laps and get a division grading, just to see where you stack up against everyone.
Click to expand...

Yes it was, and one of the points or issues that was brunt about that was it required to start another account so you can GTP_ in front of your name. And for some that is a real bother for the reason of putting time in your previous, letting all your friends know your new account tag and so on. Oniichan and I suggested of issuing licenses instead. Any way to allow more of the current and a new members to join the WRS with out having to start a new account.

Wardez
But I just want to say, a universal ruling "Racing body" or sanctioning group won't work, it never does, it may work for a small group of series, but not for the many we're aiming to support coming on in GT6.

What I think we should make our goal instead is setting up a solid structure for individual groups to decide on adopting. It would be like the OLR, but instead of it just being a guide for race craft, we want to make an "OLR" style set of recommendations, suggestions, ideals, and templates for people that want to go by, to run by.

If they're made well enough, eventually they'll become the universal standard, and the whole thing will run itself. It's like a GTP Racing forum Constitution, so to speak, but without a supreme leader or power. Only supporting groups and members that help keep things running smoothly.

Hopefully that makes my vision more clear.
Click to expand...

Maybe I shouldn't have used "Racing Body" to describe the idea, now I don't know which phrase to use.:ouch::crazy:

A race craft type of OLR would be great. Though what would be the keep areas
 
Racecraft varies depending on type of racing. Licenses are not required, just open up the entries and let people do there bit. Again, simple but effective.
 
I have enjoyed is discussion I think some good points have been brought up. I would love to see something like this.

An overall guide to how series/leagues are run. Signing up to this would be voluntary but those that do would be listed. This guide would include a guideline on classifying you as a racer and for a series director the series you run.

For classifying the drivers I think we need to capture two things:

1. Speed (having a set time trial will accomplish this). I predict that this could be divided in to 5 levels each covering about 1% time difference from the fastest in the division to the slowest.
2. Experience. This will largely be up to the individual to figure out but we could have some guidelines:
A. Advanced - has taken part in multiple online or real life racing series
B. Intermediate - has some online racing series experience
C. Beginner - has no online series experience

As some examples:
Driver A - D2/C. Fast but with little or no experience
Driver B - D5/B. Not very fast but with some experience
Driver C - D3/A. Decent speed but lots of experience

Now the leagues could have a classification based on the drivers participating and the nature of the experience.

The diver side would simply reflect the range of drivers that take part in the series. For example: if most of your drivers are level 1 and 2 your series would be 1-2. If you had people from all levels the it would be 1-5. If you only had level 5 then you would be 5.

As far as the nature I think you could break it down like this
A. Professional - a very structured and organized event. Likely to have championships and maybe even prizes.
B. Intermediate - this will have structure and organization but will likely have a bit more of a relaxed atmosphere.
C. Casual - This group puts the focus on fun. Good race craft is still expected but there is less emphasis on winning.

So someone just starting out with online racing should probably focus on a casual or intermediate series and move up as they gain experience.

So a series could look like this:

Series 1 - I/2-4 Intermediate series with level 2-4 racers
Series 2 - P/1-5 Professional series with all level of racers
Series 3 - C/1-3 Casual series with drivers in levels 1-3

So if you look back at the drivers:

Driver A could be a good fit for Series 1 or 3
Driver B could be a good fit for Series 2 or 4
Driver C could be a good fit for Series 1, 2 or 3

Now this does not take in to account the type of racing (tuned, race car,streetcar spec, etc...) or the time/day. But it could be a quick way for a driver to see what series may fit there current skill level while also helping series attract the right type of racer to there series/league.

As always this is just my $0.02
 
That's only a GTP official league really. Everything else is up to series organiser.
 
Furinkazen
Licenses are not required, just open up the entries and let people do there bit. Again, simple but effective.
Click to expand...

What option or feature you suggest that will be able to identify a fellow GTP WRS or league driver? This is why the GTP_ tag is in place, so members can identify at a glance online or in the forms. People want to join the WRS or any of the racing series under the "GTP league" but rather not make another account. Which in turn will only allow the members to identify with in the form buy either looking through the mass amount of name, or having note in your signature or looking at the persons profile etc. To me that just as much as a bother as changing your profile name and starting over. Though in some cases people may not car due to GT6 is around the corner, but for the people that do mind its a bear.

Having a license icon included in the profile window or in the user window so people can see at a glance that you're a WRS driver. I for one would like to know the drivers at glance rather than reading through a 1000 names, remembering the name of people whom around my times and such. Plus if you have a driver that came up through one of the series in the "GTP racing division or league" to your series you'll know you be getting a well developed driver/team who be able to perform, not cause any unnecessary issues on the track, build up the reputation on the series you're working to grow, which in turn will attract more sounded drivers to any of the series.

We know as of now that the GT6 lobbies have a tier system. And with that in place there will be a mass about of new drivers wanting to race. And there is no reason for driver (s) or team to come join a series that well structured and it falls apart because the organizers has to take the time to remove, add people and so on. If you have a issue that continues to show its ugly root your series will fall apart due to it's known to have troubling drivers, the organizer is unable to operate their league properly etc.

Addition..

There's a series within the forms that went through a major restructure due to the high turn around on the drivers. And the reason for the high turn around due to driving issues on the track happening over and over again. And this is why there are so many series that are ran with people just on you list. SO you don't have any of those issues. Pending on how you want your series to go then your friends on your list is your limit. For some others they may want a larger depth of drivers rather than the people on their list.
 
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Personally I think the whole thread is overcomplicating things to the N'th degree.

If it is not broke...................
 
We're discussing ways to evolve the on-line racing aspect of GTP, better for series organizers, current members and new members. A better way to find a series of liking, promote events in a much clearer form, improving race quality for all the series which will increase participating drivers.

People are going to get revamped about racing, drifting, rally, time trails, sport car track (SC) days/ racing or find a series that off ball. A number of new series and old series alike are going to resurface. People are going to be joining GT Planet after GT6 in released for that GT Planet is the #1 form to find out almost everything there is to know about the Gran Turismo title. And a large number of those new members are going to be looking to race. And if the racing thread portion along with the series involved things may not work out to well. This is why Snaeper went to Jordan to open this discussion.

Jordan and the board members are going to make sure things will be ready. We must do our part to give suggestions to make it a easier transition. As well make sure we're ready for the influx. We only got a few good suggestions to make the thread better, we need more though. We also need to find away to make the race quality more inviting so all the series can grow. You can form or have group of people form and develop a series, and it turn out to be one of the most sot after series to join. But if you can't keep drivers in slots it may or may not fall apart. Just because fine work was done, it wont flourish if people don't stay. GT5 should have evolved along with other things, though it didn't happen. GT6 should be this evolution if we allow it happen the correct way. The matter is which series will be while to stay in the days of GT5P/GT6 or evolve with a new outlook with GT6?
 
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I don't see much issues with what we got now.

...and these new ways, sound complicated and restrictive to me.
 
Or in plain simple language, improve GTP online.

We have to listen to people like Ross and Fox, they are racers. Without racers there is no series.

We are over complicating certain things. Why use 100 words when 10 sometimes does the trick?
 
No one here is saying its "broke". This is a contribution thread on ideas to better this site in the racing series section. I think showing a few different things in the thread title or having those options when opening a new thread is a good idea. It'll help newcomers and regulars determine what kind of racing, members and cars are in a certain series.
 
Yes but there is at same time no need to alter vastly a already workable and highly effective system.
 
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