◆ SNAIL [DriveTrain Challenge - DTC] Racing - Closed
- Thread starter jobyone
- 6,327 comments
- 213,168 views
- 4,280
- Say What Again, I dare you!
- Fastfox400
Its a glitch then because I was definitely in a s2000 at laguna seca.
JLBowler
Premium
- 7,989
- California
- JLBowler
- 4,499
- Tampa, Fl
- Ice_Warden
Teams don't work. Never seen a series last past a month that was based on teams.
Everyone needs to show up every race to make a team format work. If we wanted to explore a team format then maybe try it on a different night to see if it would fly as a Cap Team series.
Lets designate certain people to always get the +1 tires. If they start dominating then we know they are ready to run even Steven.
All we want is good, close racing and everyone to have a good time right? I mean if we wanted to let Ken run better tires so he can be more competitive then it's fine....until he starts to win everything....then it's time to switch back
Everyone needs to show up every race to make a team format work. If we wanted to explore a team format then maybe try it on a different night to see if it would fly as a Cap Team series.
Lets designate certain people to always get the +1 tires. If they start dominating then we know they are ready to run even Steven.
All we want is good, close racing and everyone to have a good time right? I mean if we wanted to let Ken run better tires so he can be more competitive then it's fine....until he starts to win everything....then it's time to switch back
- 3,613
- New England
- jobyone71
Would we be willing to let people go +2 on tires? If they win then they bump to +1. Or we could always -1 you fast guysTeams don't work. Never seen a series last past a month that was based on teams.
Everyone needs to show up every race to make a team format work. If we wanted to explore a team format then maybe try it on a different night to see if it would fly as a Cap Team series.
Lets designate certain people to always get the +1 tires. If they start dominating then we know they are ready to run even Steven.
All we want is good, close racing and everyone to have a good time right? I mean if we wanted to let Ken run better tires so he can be more competitive then it's fine....until he starts to win everything....then it's time to switch back
- 7,711
- Indiana-USA
- OwensRacing
The Tire rule gets goofy under braking. Remove PP from the winners. Keep everyone on same tires. Be my suggestion.
- 1,106
- Georgia
- Kendawg198
The best part was knowing what was going on in the front, middle pack and the back. Letting you know how far guys were behind you and what the good parts of the car was and the bad part (suspension, engine, etc.)
I say from now on Marcus shows up with his bowl and gives play by play..
Handlebar
Premium
- 3,969
- Herndon, VA
- HandlebarMustash
Even on +1 tires, I wasn't close enough to come to work in the morning that tired for a result of coming in next to last most of the time, as much as I enjoy the company.
Since the most frequent vocal reponse is to "just keep it simple" I have no other suggestions.
I know I am not good enough to keep up with D1-D3+ guys, even with +1 tires.
It is what it is.
Since the most frequent vocal reponse is to "just keep it simple" I have no other suggestions.
I know I am not good enough to keep up with D1-D3+ guys, even with +1 tires.
It is what it is.
- 4,280
- Say What Again, I dare you!
- Fastfox400
I'd be elated if I could run 1 compound softer tires. It make thing more even in my opinion, but that would only work in a spec series. When were talking a pp gap of any wher from 60-100pp per race it could really mean a drastic difference in performance.
- 3,334
- NJ
- koszak27
Well said. As fun as this series is for me, finishing (out of 9 cars) 7th, 7th, 8th, 8th is not worth getting only 3 hours of sleep one night each week. Add on top of that the hour or two I try to practice Monday, Tuesday, Thursday and Friday after work and it doesn't add up for me right now. I've been dedicating almost all my free time into trying to get better over the last 6 months or so and I haven't gotten the return necessary to continue that pattern. I was thinking of giving Sunday nights a shot but The Walking Dead starts up in a month.
I'm hoping to get better on my own time and then I'll jump back into the amazing cap racing format. Knowing my luck, it will be right before GT6 drops and then I'll have to learn the new physics...
Joby,
I've been trying to think of new ways for handicapping for a while and it is really tough for this series, as we have all seen. I gave the BTR a shot on Laguna with these settings:
Arcade Mode
Expert Level
RUF BTR '86 (no assists except ABS 1)
Sports Medium
14 laps
Then I switched my tires to Sports Hard before the race and used lap 1 as a warm-up with no passing.
It was a lot of fun with the BTR, which has always been one of my favorite cars since GT2 or 3 whenever it showed up (when tuned). In GT5 I always found it too twitchy stock, but here I took on the challenge and after 2 or 3 restarts from spinning out I had the hang of it. I did this after watching all the replays from Monday so I gave myself a few things to try out and overall I think it worked well. I'll downgrade to Comfort Soft next chance I get and put the AI cars on SH.
I also changed my G27 to the O setting (670 degrees?) and I really enjoyed that. My default settings that I had been running were FFB - 5, no steering assist and whatever the third setting on the list is which isn't arcade or simulation. I changed my FFB to 3, turned on the steering assist (which I later turned back to off) and simulation mode. Thanks for all the help Joby.
So in summary, I'll do this when I can. If you guys are practicing one night/afternoon and you see me on, let me know. If I have a Tuesday off or I'm itching to race, I'll sign on for the night. Thanks again for all the tips and great racing.
- 3,334
- NJ
- koszak27
I would give it a try Joe, but probably not next Monday. I had missed the last 2 weeks and I have been exhausted the past two days since our last race (apprently 29 is the new 67). The problem is we end around 12pm (here) then by the time the adrenaline runs out it's at least 1am and I'm up for work around 4-4:15am. Not much we can do about that, but this race is the most fun thing I've done in GT5 and you guys are all awesome.
It's not something that I want to stop, especially because it has been the single biggest factor in making me faster. It is just like Handlebar said and I think Goat had the same thing happen too, all the hours we put in and the lack of sleep are just getting to us. No matter how fun it is, we put in a ton of effort to come in last place.
I'm not one to just give up, so don't take this as "I might be back when I improve..." I will race again and I'll be gunning for that French, white Knight Rider (or is it black now!?! And red wheels!) You've all seen my signiture here and this is easily the best group of guys doing a weekly racing series. My issue is I'm physically in the way when I'm racing you guys.
Example, one thing I learned from watching our replays (laugh if you'd like, this is completely true):
You can slow down without the brake.
Sounds simple right? Well on corner entry I was braking (in a straight line) then turning the wheel, then straightening out, then accelerating. Almost like an exaggerated training video. What was the car next to me doing? On corner entry, let off throttle, turn wheels to scrub speed, slowly apply throttle while straightening out. Where's the slap my head smiley face? Oh right, quick reply window...
If you want me to test out any handicaps let me know. I'll run laps in whatever car with whatever tires you need and work with you guys. I'm sorry for the long posts and rambling, but bottom line: this series is a blast but I feel like I'm in the way right now.
I can't commit to next Monday for many reasons, mostly the lateness of the event which we can't change but I'll be on here and I will be practicing. If anyone wants to race tomorrow or Friday afternoon I'll be on around 4pm EST and we can try out some handicaps.
It's not something that I want to stop, especially because it has been the single biggest factor in making me faster. It is just like Handlebar said and I think Goat had the same thing happen too, all the hours we put in and the lack of sleep are just getting to us. No matter how fun it is, we put in a ton of effort to come in last place.
I'm not one to just give up, so don't take this as "I might be back when I improve..." I will race again and I'll be gunning for that French, white Knight Rider (or is it black now!?! And red wheels!) You've all seen my signiture here and this is easily the best group of guys doing a weekly racing series. My issue is I'm physically in the way when I'm racing you guys.
Example, one thing I learned from watching our replays (laugh if you'd like, this is completely true):
You can slow down without the brake.
Sounds simple right? Well on corner entry I was braking (in a straight line) then turning the wheel, then straightening out, then accelerating. Almost like an exaggerated training video. What was the car next to me doing? On corner entry, let off throttle, turn wheels to scrub speed, slowly apply throttle while straightening out. Where's the slap my head smiley face? Oh right, quick reply window...
If you want me to test out any handicaps let me know. I'll run laps in whatever car with whatever tires you need and work with you guys. I'm sorry for the long posts and rambling, but bottom line: this series is a blast but I feel like I'm in the way right now.
I can't commit to next Monday for many reasons, mostly the lateness of the event which we can't change but I'll be on here and I will be practicing. If anyone wants to race tomorrow or Friday afternoon I'll be on around 4pm EST and we can try out some handicaps.
- 1,106
- Georgia
- Kendawg198
Koszak,
You are a great racer. I've seen you race really good and I've seen you race like you were sleepy. I have done the same thing...lol
One of the best ways to improve is to do some bonzi laps. If you think you can go through a turn without lifting. Then try it when you are practicing. Try braking a little farther each time through a turn until the car doen't make the turn. Then you will know the limits of the car in each turn. Once you find the limit then work on being consitant.
It is something that takes time and alot of heart..
You are a great racer. I've seen you race really good and I've seen you race like you were sleepy. I have done the same thing...lol
One of the best ways to improve is to do some bonzi laps. If you think you can go through a turn without lifting. Then try it when you are practicing. Try braking a little farther each time through a turn until the car doen't make the turn. Then you will know the limits of the car in each turn. Once you find the limit then work on being consitant.
It is something that takes time and alot of heart..
- 4,499
- Tampa, Fl
- Ice_Warden
So I have a stream of thought going here so bear with me...
I went through some old replays to find a solution to the leveling issue.
The main difference between the consistent top finishers and the consistent bottom finishers is car control. I initially thought I would try to figure out a way for the top guys to use harder tires, so I was going to try and duplicate some of the times of the bottom guys by using the same car but harder tires. BUT what I found was (and we talked about this before) that no matter what the situation, the bottom guys could benefit more by having more car control, IE getting softer tires, rather than the top guys using harder tires.
I watched several old replays and always saw the same thing. The main problem was keeping the car from sliding off the track or spinning out. I could feel the frustration level rise every time it happened. Most of the time the driver ended up pulling off the track and not even finishing the race due to multiple instances of loss of car control.
I hope I am making sense...trying to finish before the laptop battery dies...
So I say we put a label on the drivers based on what we know about the drivers who have raced with us so far.
Do it like this...
Level 1 drivers: The D1 and D2 guys. Or the most consistently fast guys.
Level 2: The D3 and top half of D4 guys. Or the middle finishers.
Level 3: Mid D4 and D5. Or the consistent bottom finishers.
Here is what I propose:
Level 1 guys gets no adjustments. Business as usual. These guys are the baseline.
Level 2 guys get +3 tire points to use as they wish throughout the night.
Level 3 guys get +6 tire points to use as they wish.
Tire points work like this....1 tire point gives you the ability to choose a 1 step softer set of tires for one race. You can use these all in one race if you like.
Example...PP for the night is 1600. We are all running on SH tires. Someone with +3 tire points could use them in these ways: They could give themselves up to RH (+3) on one race and run SH the rest of the night. They could run SM (+1) on three races; they could run SS (+2) in one race and SM (+1) in one race.
We could all probably come to a consensus on who belongs in which group.
I'm spewing random thoughts... sorry.
In conclusion I think the top guys don't need to be hindered. The slower guys need something to give them more car control and consistency. The more they are on the pavement the more fun they are having and the better they finish.
We can tweak it as we go of course but this is pretty simple and easy to keep track of without calculating PP bonuses blah blah.
I went through some old replays to find a solution to the leveling issue.
The main difference between the consistent top finishers and the consistent bottom finishers is car control. I initially thought I would try to figure out a way for the top guys to use harder tires, so I was going to try and duplicate some of the times of the bottom guys by using the same car but harder tires. BUT what I found was (and we talked about this before) that no matter what the situation, the bottom guys could benefit more by having more car control, IE getting softer tires, rather than the top guys using harder tires.
I watched several old replays and always saw the same thing. The main problem was keeping the car from sliding off the track or spinning out. I could feel the frustration level rise every time it happened. Most of the time the driver ended up pulling off the track and not even finishing the race due to multiple instances of loss of car control.
I hope I am making sense...trying to finish before the laptop battery dies...
So I say we put a label on the drivers based on what we know about the drivers who have raced with us so far.
Do it like this...
Level 1 drivers: The D1 and D2 guys. Or the most consistently fast guys.
Level 2: The D3 and top half of D4 guys. Or the middle finishers.
Level 3: Mid D4 and D5. Or the consistent bottom finishers.
Here is what I propose:
Level 1 guys gets no adjustments. Business as usual. These guys are the baseline.
Level 2 guys get +3 tire points to use as they wish throughout the night.
Level 3 guys get +6 tire points to use as they wish.
Tire points work like this....1 tire point gives you the ability to choose a 1 step softer set of tires for one race. You can use these all in one race if you like.
Example...PP for the night is 1600. We are all running on SH tires. Someone with +3 tire points could use them in these ways: They could give themselves up to RH (+3) on one race and run SH the rest of the night. They could run SM (+1) on three races; they could run SS (+2) in one race and SM (+1) in one race.
We could all probably come to a consensus on who belongs in which group.
I'm spewing random thoughts... sorry.
In conclusion I think the top guys don't need to be hindered. The slower guys need something to give them more car control and consistency. The more they are on the pavement the more fun they are having and the better they finish.
We can tweak it as we go of course but this is pretty simple and easy to keep track of without calculating PP bonuses blah blah.
- 7,711
- Indiana-USA
- OwensRacing
How about Skid Force Recovery, Active Stability, and Traction Control allowed for some. As well give the extra PP. Then if needed allow Joe's tire mixer. Which btw I like.
- 4,280
- Say What Again, I dare you!
- Fastfox400
How about Skid Force Recovery, Active Stability, and Traction Control allowed for some. As well give the extra PP. Then if needed allow Joe's tire mixer. Which btw I like.
I think the tire mixer is a better idea really. I know my self I cant stand the aids as they are not realistic in any way. TCS doesn't cut the same way as it does in real life. SRF is just a crutch.
- 4,499
- Tampa, Fl
- Ice_Warden
Not sure anyone want to use Aids since they don't really let you feel the car and therefore learn how to better control the car.
I was just throwing one possible solution (or part of a solution). If the results were still not what we want, we could have the level 1 guys take a 10% PP hit off the top.
Anyways...just throwing spaghetti on the wall and seeing what sticks.
I was just throwing one possible solution (or part of a solution). If the results were still not what we want, we could have the level 1 guys take a 10% PP hit off the top.
Anyways...just throwing spaghetti on the wall and seeing what sticks.
- 4,280
- Say What Again, I dare you!
- Fastfox400
Owen picked 2000pp. Brando Picked Motegi full.
- 7,711
- Indiana-USA
- OwensRacing
Handlebar
Premium
- 3,969
- Herndon, VA
- HandlebarMustash
I think I shall abstain from spending time generating ideas ideas that are not simple enough. Learned my lesson.
Simplly having +1 tires didn't do much, even when I practiced and had time. I thought it was pretty clear in the results, guess I was mistaken.
Thinking tires = enough...
Isn't.
Imho.
Simplly having +1 tires didn't do much, even when I practiced and had time. I thought it was pretty clear in the results, guess I was mistaken.
Thinking tires = enough...
Isn't.
Imho.
