2017 F1 Constructor technical info/developmentFormula 1

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Not sure where to put it but here are some new Renault designs about the future of F1

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129055/renault-reveals-its-concept-for-2027-f1

Doesn't look bad, but the only future design that looks like a race car and somewhat realistic is the RBR option or McLaren. This looks like a very basic race car proto design

 

[catamount39]

Doesn't look bad, but the only future design that looks like a race car and somewhat realistic is the RBR option or McLaren. This looks like a very basic race car proto design

This one you mean?

 

[-Fred-]

That Mclaren concept reminds me a lot of a 90's CART chassis.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

This one you mean?

No that's not by McLaren...that is a independently made one. I enjoy his ideas though

This was the official McLaren future concept.

 

[catamount39]

No that's not by McLaren...that is a independently made one. I enjoy his ideas though

This was the official McLaren future concept.

Not too bad either. Both seem possible I think, the greenhouse of the non-official one seems a bit more, realistic in a way. What screw me up is how long that wheel base is.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Not too bad either. Both seem possible I think, the greenhouse of the non-official one seems a bit more, realistic in a way. What screw me up is how long that wheel base is.

It seems perfectly realistic, it's easier to understand the unofficial one cause it actually shows how it would work, but I'm sure if they showed the McLaren one going forward and coming up it'd make sense too.

EDIT: the Renault F1 concept actually exists...but is very very ugly

 

[catamount39]

It seems perfectly realistic, it's easier to understand the unofficial one cause it actually shows how it would work, but I'm sure if they showed the McLaren one going forward and coming up it'd make sense too.

EDIT: the Renault F1 concept actually exists...but is very very ugly

Good point, and yeah Renault's concept is terrifyingly ugly.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

First, McLaren couldn't understand why the Honda engine wasn't working properly.

Now they can't understand why it is working properly:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129068/mclaren-confused-by-sudden-honda-reliability

 

[TenEightyOne]

First, McLaren couldn't understand why the Honda engine wasn't working properly.

Now they can't understand why it is working properly:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129068/mclaren-confused-by-sudden-honda-reliability

That's a real nightmare - there'll be lots of part-number checking going on trying to identify a potentially bad batch of grundled-thingumabobs but until Honda figure what the problem is/was then the engine reliability falls into the realms of Murphy's Law.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

That's a real nightmare - there'll be lots of part-number checking going on trying to identify a potentially bad batch of grundled-thingumabobs but until Honda figure what the problem is/was then the engine reliability falls into the realms of Murphy's Law.

It could of been a simple manufacture retooling error.

 

[DK]

That Mclaren concept reminds me a lot of a 90's CART chassis.

I see some similarities between that unofficial McLaren concept and the Jordan 191's nosecone, while the radiator inlets remind me of the Ferrari F310.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

That's a real nightmare - there'll be lots of part-number checking going on trying to identify a potentially bad batch of grundled-thingumabobs but until Honda figure what the problem is/was then the engine reliability falls into the realms of Murphy's Law.

It would be wonderfully ironic if they rebuilt the RA617H, only to discover that they didn't need to.

 

[EDK]

It could of been a simple manufacture retooling error.

What, the one that worked, or those that didn't?

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

What, the one that worked, or those that didn't?

The ones that didn't clearly. Think about it, they went for a brand new design, which usually indicates updating the tools that build the engine via automation. They could have simply re-calibrated their tools and got a fix. It could have been a simple manufacturing error prior, and it was rectified through simple QC. Which makes sense since they go through engines faster than Mazda rotary owners do with oil.

If it was the other way around and they're running with an error in tools and it's causing things to work, then they're worse off then we probably should know . So I can see the humor you found. I didn't even mean for it, good job. 👍

 

[EDK]

If it was the other way around and they're running with an error in tools and it's causing things to work, then they're worse off then we probably should know . So I can see the humor you found. I didn't even mean for it, good job. 👍

Right, I think I knew what you meant. But that they said "We don't know why" is the reason I found it funny and asked which ones.

Also

Which makes sense since they go through engines faster than Mazda rotary owners do with oil.

I raced in a first gen RX-7 once. In race applications, they just mix the oil in the fuel, like it's a 2 stroke chainsaw, or something.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Right, I think I knew what you meant. But that they said "We don't know why" is the reason I found it funny and asked which ones.

Also



I raced in a first gen RX-7 once. In race applications, they just mix the oil in the fuel, like it's a 2 stroke chainsaw, or something.

I laughed so hard at the second line, I feel bad now for Mazda owners more than I did prior.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Helmut Marko says that Formula 1 really needs to sort out regulations that would encourage an independent engine supplier to enter the sport in 2021, or else risk losing Red Bull (and, I assume, Toro Rosso):

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129079/marko-f1-risks-losing-red-bull-after-2020

He says that those regulations need to be finalised in the next year so as go give independent suppliers enough time to develop a 2021 engine.

 

[Tyrone B]

How much stock should we put into what he's saying?

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

How much stock should we put into what he's saying?

Not a ton, but considering that red bull seems to be cutting back on future prospects after Max* I wouldn't tempt them. Then again the FIA and FOM shouldn't give into terrorist like demands. Sure a affordable independent engine maker like cosworth or gibson or whatever would be great, for teams that complain like Sauber, but I doubt they'd be able to challenge any better than currently. So at least they would save money being in last place.

*Pierre Gasly seems to be spinning his wheels in place, so it's very unlikely he'll see an F1 seat soon, unless they really get tired of Kvyat or worse Sainz.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Then again the FIA and FOM shouldn't give into terrorist like demands.

I hardly think this is a "terrorist-like demand". For one, Ross Brawn has already touted the idea of accomodating independent suppliers in the 2021 regulations. Secondly, it's not the first time Formula One has tried this - the 2010 regulations were designed to get the likes of Cosworth into the sport, but the failure to agree to all of Mosley's reforms made it impractical in the long run. So I'd prefer to think of this as Marko wanting The Powers That Be to do something more than just talk. Red Bull don't have a long-term supply deal in place, and having an independent supplier would give them options, but they clearly don't want to waste three years working on something, only for the sport to settle on the status quo for another seven years.

Besides, Ferrari (used to) hold the sport hostage all the time. It was Luca di Montezemolo's favourite tactic - threaten to walk and hope that the public backlash against a Formula 1 without Ferrari would cow the FIA into submission. It's one of the reasons why Ferrari get $90 million just for showing up, and they get it before the World Constructors' Champions get their prize money. Marko might be thinking of Red Bull first, but at least an independent engine supplier having a feasible chance at success will benefit the sport, unlike Ferrari's threats to walk away.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I hardly think this is a "terrorist-like demand". For one, Ross Brawn has already touted the idea of accomodating independent suppliers in the 2021 regulations. Secondly, it's not the first time Formula One has tried this - the 2010 regulations were designed to get the likes of Cosworth into the sport, but the failure to agree to all of Mosley's reforms made it impractical in the long run. So I'd prefer to think of this as Marko wanting The Powers That Be to do something more than just talk. Red Bull don't have a long-term supply deal in place, and having an independent supplier would give them options, but they clearly don't want to waste three years working on something, only for the sport to settle on the status quo for another seven years.

Besides, Ferrari (used to) hold the sport hostage all the time. It was Luca di Montezemolo's favourite tactic - threaten to walk and hope that the public backlash against a Formula 1 without Ferrari would cow the FIA into submission. It's one of the reasons why Ferrari get $90 million just for showing up, and they get it before the World Constructors' Champions get their prize money. Marko might be thinking of Red Bull first, but at least an independent engine supplier having a feasible chance at success will benefit the sport, unlike Ferrari's threats to walk away.

It is, just like it was prior in 2015, in all intents and purposes RBR will only stay if they can win or think they can still win. There has never been a real reason for a drinks company to try and play a game like a manufacture and spend just as much at the top contenders.

So now with a unclear future for F1, it's now time to make demands because it may be very likely that in a near future a customer team like RBR will be finishing behind Renault. And other manufactures wont want to sell engines to the once four time consecutive champs, due to their attitudes and potential to win. So what's left, make a demand early on and then add pressure as the deadline gets closer, nothing new for a team that's done this many times.

Also why bring up Ferrari, you can look back and fine many posts from me stating my discontent with Ferrari doing this, just cause they did it doesn't mean RBR should. No one team should give this ultimatum to the sport as if they're bigger than the sum of Formula 1.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Speaking up now is better than the alternative, because keeping quiet means the sport will likely just move to appease the manufacturers because they have all the power.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Speaking up now is better than the alternative, because keeping quiet means the sport will likely just move to appease the manufacturers because they have all the power.

They're already appeasing manufactures, with the most recent summit. If RBR cared about freedom of choice in an independent that wasn't interested in a factory effort, then I could sympathize that for all independent teams. However, it could easily be argued they don't care about that and they've probably found a group that is willing to build them engines that isn't a manufacture but need the FIA to give more equalization for it to work.

If I had to guess, I'd say jumping the gun and shoving their foot down Renault's throat in 2015 turned off more business than just Renault's shaky foundation with them.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Autosport analyse the RS27 concept and what it might mean for the future of car design:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129105/what-does-renault-2027-concept-say-for-f1

 

[prisonermonkeys]

The Strategy Working Group are considering how to intervene to help Honda:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129136/rules-breaks-to-help-honda-set-to-be-discussed

 

[Rossell2]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129141/sauber-close-to-sealing-2018-honda-deal

Err.

 

[[Nor]MclarenF1]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129141/sauber-close-to-sealing-2018-honda-deal

Err.

This could be good news for Honda and McLaren. The more PU's out there racing and producing data the better.

And it looks like Stoffel and Nando might have chance of finishing in Sochi.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129143/mclaren-gets-honda-reliability-update

The Strategy Working Group are considering how to intervene to help Honda:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129136/rules-breaks-to-help-honda-set-to-be-discussed

I'm guessing if they decide to step in, it'll be in the form of giving them a bigger quota of engines, maybe even giving them a season long free pass. If Honda can bring updates to the engine for every GP, they could be in with a chance of catching up before the end of the year.

 

[catamount39]

This could be good news for Honda and McLaren. The more PU's out there racing and producing data the better.

And it looks like Stoffel and Nando might have chance of finishing in Sochi.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129143/mclaren-gets-honda-reliability-update



I'm guessing if they decide to step in, it'll be in the form of giving them a bigger quota of engines, maybe even giving them a season long free pass. If Honda can bring updates to the engine for every GP, they could be in with a chance of catching up before the end of the year.

The reap reason McLaren want Honda to supply Sauber is so that there is always somebody slower than them/somebody who will retire first.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/129141/sauber-close-to-sealing-2018-honda-deal

Err.

What's the "Err" about? This has been a discussion for a couple months now. And considering that Sauber is probably paying close to full price for a year old Ferrari unit, they may be getting a better rate on the Honda engines. Despite the fact that Honda is having troubles. Also as PM posted, Honda may not be in dire straights for long. All one must do is look at how easy it was for Renault to turn it's troubles around back in 08/09 and have one of the better performing V8s once the FIA stepped in and say they can develop further.

The problem is we're in a engine development freedom currently, not a freeze and yet the FIA is still looking to see how to help, that's more confusing to me. Honda may have troubles now, but they did have a good testing which shows it can perform, they also have the ability to develop all season long and have a solid unit for when Sauber gets them and perhaps even before that later this year.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/force-india-expects-new-floor-to-fix-aero-problems-895449/

Force India will be bringing a new floor in (as url indicates) for the Spanish GP which should help the aero issues they've been having and potentially bring them back to where they were at the end of last season. However, they're currently not that far off of 4th place anyways since they're sitting in fifth, so perhaps they'll be mixing it up for podiums again.