"Blade Runner" Oscar Pistorius shoots his girlfriend

  • Thread starter DQuaN
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Lets get back to the topic.

Those that take the thread off topic don't have a leg to stand on.
 
It seems the trial isn't until June. Pisto has a long time to think things through with his attorney's/PR men, not to mention time to flee if he's crazy enough to go down that road.

This might end up like the Jeffrey Robert MacDonald case that keeps getting appealed over & over, he could take his pleas of innocence to the grave.
 
He got released on bail. That doesn't mean he's going free. He paid 100k to not have to stay in prison until his trial, and was deemed by a judge not to be a danger to society at large.
 
Reeva Steenkamp's father says that Oscar Pistorius "must live with his conscience" if he lies:

http://www.theage.com.au/world/pist...he-lied-steenkamps-father-20130224-2ezcz.html

Another South African sportsman, Marc Batchelor - who was called as a witness during the bail hearing - has said that Pistorius was "often spoiling for a fight":

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ling-for-a-fight/story-fnb64oi6-1226584941422

Meanwhile, Carl Pistorius - Oscar's brother - is facing an unrelated charge of culpable homicide for his role in a car accident in 2008:

http://www.news.com.au/world/carl-p...ulpable-homicide/story-fndir2ev-1226584544503
 
prisonermonkeys
Another South African sportsman, Marc Batchelor - who was called as a witness during the bail hearing - has said that Pistorius was "often spoiling for a fight":
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Nope, he wasn't. There was a girlfriend-related (Oscars previous gf) incident involving the 2 that was used in tesimony by the then investigating cop, Hilton Botha. He was trying to show that OP has violent tendencies.

There's gonna be SO much of this type of stuff coming out between now & June 4. The media's really going over the top on this case this side of the pond. They're camping outside of the police station where Oscar has to report to today, ffs! Dunno what they're expecting to see...
 
prisonermonkeys
Meanwhile, Carl Pistorius - Oscar's brother - is facing an unrelated charge of culpable homicide for his role in a car accident in 2008:

http://www.news.com.au/world/carl-p...ulpable-homicide/story-fndir2ev-1226584544503
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Such a beautiful place, yet so deadly. :sly: The Booysen rape/murder case is going on concurrently. SA is getting a lot of attention... It seems woman are viewed as sub-servant in their culture, although I'm not completely sure to what extent and to how many men. The Booysen case description:

http://www.beyondblackwhite.com/rape-south-african-teenager-anene-booysen-horrific-world-notice/
 
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Rich S
Such a beautiful place, yet so deadly. :sly: The Booysen rape/murder case is going on concurrently. SA is getting a lot of attention... It seems woman are viewed as sub-servant in their culture, although I'm not completely sure to what extent and to how many men. The Booysen case description:

http://www.beyondblackwhite.com/rape-south-african-teenager-anene-booysen-horrific-world-notice/
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There's no single culture in SA. It ranges from first world in the cities to third world in the rural areas, with many different cultures. The rape & murder problem is predominant in the poorer sectors of the communities. Very sad, because as you said, we have such a beautiful country...
 
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Well I cant find much information on the man who was dragged by the South African police van, he died later in his cell after being dragged all the way to the station apparently but there's not much on the case of if its being investigated at all.

SA always appealed to me because its popular destination for cycling teams to train during the winter, however based on the recent violence I dont think I'd even think about traveling there ever!

Also, the news is not good for athletes in SA, there's a doping probe going on apparently.
 
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For the record, today Oscar Pistorius was formally indicted with premeditated murder.

The prosecution disclosed they have witnesses who heard a woman screaming before and during the shots.
 
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This whole thing has been such a mess, it seems like Pisto's chance of getting off fully is slim though as they can charge him again with some kind of culpable negligent death. I dont remember exactly what that entails. I suppose he could get off completely with enough money & influence.

Anways they amount of evidence in this case that has not come to light is staggering, like the GPS cell phone positioning, the testosterone needles that seemed to never materialize, whether or not pisto put his legs on before shooting her.... its all very hazy. It seems like what's left is the circumstantial stuff, like the scream, and the fact that Pisto loved to wield his gun around like a villain.
 
You do realise that this is the first day of the trial, right? The prosecutors intend to call over a hundred witnesses. The first day of the trial is usually taken up by the formalities of entering a plea, the prosecution and/or defence making their opening statements, and so on. If the prosecution chose a neighbor who heard "blood-curdling screams" on the night of the shooting as their first witness, it was probably intended for dramatic effect. And also because it was a witness that both the prosecution and the defence could examine in the space of an afternoon - some elements of the case, like the GPS positions of the phones, and the testosterone, would require expert testimony to explain their relevance and their function to a jury, as well as witnesses involved in the investigation to explain how the police fit these elements into the investigation. In some cases, it can take days to get through this stuff.
 
@prisonermonkeys , that isn't how it works.

After a 10 minute (partly soft focus) preamble we'll see a line of stuttering, shift-eyed, pock-marked, badly-lit police actors (I mean officers) visibly lie and shift their way through the evidence.

Then Pistorius will be somehow still be destroyed on the stand, and we'll cut to a break, certain that our hero will face a life imprisoned for a Crime He Did Not Commit.

It won't be until the very end of the hour that the young, attractive, untested female lawyer will have a flash of inspiration and recall the judgement of Pretoria .vs. Van Heerden and turn the trial on its head with seconds to go, earning the love of the nation and the admiration of the sharp-shouldered boss.

The credits will cover a lot of the final action but basically it's a wide shot, court steps, ticker tape, a little girl presenting a teddy bear to Pistorius.

Why South Africa thought they'd get away with broadcasting a trial where the legal minutiae of court business are pursued in real-time is beyond me :D
 
On the balance of the facts as they're known it seems likely to me that Pistorius shot his girlfriend, but that's all I'm sure of :)

This trial will be very interesting to watch and, hopefully, it will let people who really do believe in the US TV courtroom-drama model see how the full process of law works (as in achingly slowly at times) and how judgements in law are arrived at.
 
TenEightyOne
On the balance of the facts as they're known it seems likely to me that Pistorius shot his girlfriend, but that's all I'm sure of
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Pistorius has never denied killing her. In fact, he has admitted it - but he has always maintained that it was an accident, that he mistook her for an intruder and shot her without realising that it was her.
 
prisonermonkeys
Pistorius has never denied killing her. In fact, he has admitted it - but he has always maintained that it was an accident, that he mistook her for an intruder and shot her without realising that it was her.
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That's what I was referring to; that's about as far as I can take the facts before all the reports become a morass of the usual media intrigue.

I'm also being pedantic because he hasn't done it until he's done it, his right to define his own guilt or innocence was terminated at the point of charge, although obviously the Judge can still hear (and choose whether to accept) his plea.

It'll certainly be interesting for me, I rarely watch the telly but I'll be catching up on this. Much better than (insert name of most British/US TV shows here).
 
It's been fascinating so far. The defence advocate, Barry Roux, is a real terrier. He just doesn't let go of a point when he latches onto something...
 
TenEightyOne
It'll certainly be interesting for me, I rarely watch the telly but I'll be catching up on this. Much better than (insert name of most British/US TV shows here).
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Yeah, it's a problem consuming quality entertainment.

But, really, true crime has never done it for me. Not even OJ Simpson. :yuck:

I can stand limited amounts of business and politics on TV. For science I go online.

Last year, I discovered Game of Thrones. The zenith of quality TV entertainment. :bowdown:
 
Some text messages between Pistorius and Steenkamp are being read in court today... needless to say, they do not paint Pistorius in a good light at all, with Steenkamp saying that she was scared of him and that she resented his jealous behaviour.

I've never believed Pistorius's cock-and-bull story from the outset, and these texts don't do much to contradict the notion that their relationship was fraught with tension, and that Pistorius is an angry, jealous control freak. Three weeks before Pistorius shot Steenkamp dead, she wrote "I'm scared of you sometimes and how you snap at me". Not quite famous last words, but they may as well have been.
 
Touring Mars
Some text messages between Pistorius and Steenkamp are being read in court today... needless to say, they do not paint Pistorius in a good light at all, with Steenkamp saying that she was scared of him and that she resented his jealous behaviour.

I've never believed Pistorius's cock-and-bull story from the outset, and these texts don't do much to contradict the notion that their relationship was fraught with tension, and that Pistorius is an angry, jealous control freak. Three weeks before Pistorius shot Steenkamp dead, she wrote "I'm scared of you sometimes and how you snap at me". Not quite famous last words, but they may as well have been.
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At the same time I'm sure 10's of thousands of women make the same kind of texts messages everyday, a few men too. Not really evidence of anything other than he has a temper...hardly unusual.
 
Johnnypenso
At the same time I'm sure 10's of thousands of women make the same kind of texts messages everyday, a few men too.
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That is as maybe, but I've never, ever been told by a girlfriend that I scare her - not in any shape or form. And I've never shot any of them either. Perhaps it is not that unusual that men have tempers and are abusive/controlling/angry/jealous etc., but that doesn't mean that it should be disregarded or, worse still, considered as acceptable. It isn't, and it's particularly relevant in this case because Pistorius is on record as claiming that they were 'very much in love' and that everything was rosy between him and his girlfriend. These text messages - as well as a great deal of other evidence from people who knew the couple - suggest a very different state of affairs.
 
prisonermonkeys
And of those tens of thousands, how many end up getting shot?
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No idea...if it were a statistically significant number it might be usable at trial. But one piece of anecdotal evidence that one woman was afraid of her boyfriend is only evidence she's in a bad relationship..hardly an indictable offense.

Touring Mars
That is as maybe, but I've never, ever been told by a girlfriend that I scare her - not in any shape or form. And I've never shot any of them either. Perhaps it is not that unusual that men have tempers and are abusive/controlling/angry/jealous etc., but that doesn't mean that it should be disregarded or, worse still, considered as acceptable. It isn't, and it's particularly relevant in this case because Pistorius is on record as claiming that they were 'very much in love' and that everything was rosy between him and his girlfriend. These text messages - as well as a great deal of other evidence from people who knew the couple - suggest a very different state of affairs.
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Who said it was acceptable? And who's to say what is and isn't the "norm" for someone's relationship? I know couples that fight constantly and consider it "normal" for their relationship. Maybe in this relationship turmoil is the "norm"?
 
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