Camber

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I rebuilt the chassis and engine and tested everything from .1/.0 to .8/.4 (my GT5 setup) and while .3/.1 did make the car free in turn 1/2 and almost as fast, it lost grip and time in 3/4. 0.0/0.0 was still the fastest lap I could run (44.652) with a stock (with no downforce) #88 nascar, and it was the most stable and consistent.
 
faceman557
Awesome!!! Best post in this whole thread!!!
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Dude she could take apart your car in an hour.Maybe she would be nice enough to rebuild it for you.Sorry but it is what it is,that's why she flies around the world getting paid the big bucks.
 
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So looking at this thread I have seen this posted
#127 guy thinks we have caster relating to camber in the game.
# 169 tested with picture 0 0 faster.
#170 tested faster
#173 tested faster
#174 tested faster
# 185 tested faster
#234 tested faster
I left out numerous other post's with the same conclusion
I think you get my point,ah but wait, here we have 2 gentlemen that are pretty highly regarded in the tuning community posting their tunes.Notice no camber wonder why?
#296
#298
and Whoosiers post 1 page back.
I guess all these are pretty much not enough conclusive evidence.
 
killerjimbag
So looking at this thread I have seen this posted
#127 guy thinks we have caster relating to camber in the game.
# 169 tested with picture 0 0 faster.
#170 tested faster
#173 tested faster
#174 tested faster
# 185 tested faster
#234 tested faster
I left out numerous other post's with the same conclusion
I think you get my point,ah but wait, here we have 2 gentlemen that are pretty highly regarded in the tuning community posting their tunes.Notice no camber wonder why?
#296
#298
and Whoosiers post 1 page back.
I guess all these are pretty much not enough conclusive evidence.
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.. and the list goes on.
Evidence to the contrary has been unconvincing at best (IMO).
 
faceman557
Awesome!!! Best post in this whole thread!!!
Click to expand...

Eh. Let's not start cannibalizing each other. Jim's got the right idea about how changes to camber should work and that's a good thing in my book.

And his wife is (sort of) right. Most road-going cars in the US are set up to deal with roads that are crowned and will have very slightly asymmetric camber settings as a result (similar to the way that real NASCAR cars will run asymmetric camber on banked ovals). It's less about avoiding head-on collisions and more about avoiding bad wear patterns for tires, but the principal is generally correct. This isn't reflected in the actual specs, but most alignment shops will take it into account once they're within the allowable variance. (OK, technically most alignment shops today will set toe and leave everything else alone, but that's a whole other story.)
 
Well thank you,she test drives them and tears them down every day for the last 24 years and she goes to Toyota's plants to train people.She has a very good understanding and technical knowledge about cars.
 
TireRack actually has a pretty decent explanation of the phenomenon:

Cross-Camber and Cross-Caster

Most street car alignments call for the front camber and caster settings to be adjusted to slightly different specifications on the right side of the vehicle compared to the left side. These slight side-to-side differences are called cross-camber and cross-caster.

For vehicles set up to drive on the "right" side of the road, the right side is aligned with a little more negative camber (about 1/4-degree) and a little more positive caster (again, about 1/4-degree) to help the vehicle resist the influence of crowned roads that would cause it to drift "downhill" to the right gutter. Since most roads are crowned, cross-camber and cross-caster are helpful the majority of the time, however they will cause a vehicle to drift to the left on a perfectly flat road or a road that leans to the left.

Using cross-camber and cross-caster is not necessary for track-only cars.
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They also talk about how negative camber makes a car more "nervous" and less stable:

Negative camber leans both tires on the axle towards the center of the vehicle. Each tire develops an equal and offsetting "camber thrust" force (the same principle that causes a motorcycle to turn when it leans) even when the vehicle is driven straight ahead. If the vehicle encounters a bump that only causes one tire to lose some of its grip, the other tire's negative camber will push the vehicle in the direction of the tire that lost grip. The vehicle may feel more "nervous" and become more susceptible to tramlining. Excessive camber will also reduce the available straight-line grip required for rapid acceleration and hard stops.
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Yes correct,Zenmervolt I guess my wife didn't get technical enough about it,said it was something they had to do in the factory,not that I listen half the time anyway.LOL
 
Zenmervolt an psupepperoni ...you guys owe me $2.49 each for the cost of a pack of adult diapers so I can continue to read this thread..
try as you might there is no convincing those who believe it(caster) is workin correctly.

don't race online(to many jacks in the world) but why not a race with 3 or 4 from either side(thinkin a small and a big track)
or would this just show who's the better driver with the better equipment? kindly don't bash just askin
 
The only thing I agreed to @Zenmervolt is that flat camber was faster in a circular motion. I never agreed with it being better over the course of a track. I'm finding camber has given me more of a stable car along with grip.
 
Zuel
The only thing I agreed to @Zenmervolt is that flat camber was faster in a circular motion. I never agreed with it being better over the course of a track. I'm finding camber has given me more of a stable car along with grip.
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It is impossible to agree that 0/0 camber is faster on the skidpad in GT6 while simultaneously claiming that it is accurate.

The two are mutually exclusive.

In real life, 0/0 camber would be slower around the flat skidpad. If 0/0 camber is faster around a flat skidpad in GT6, then GT6 camber cannot be accurate. Period. End of story.

You can argue with reality all you want, but reality always wins.
 
I agreed that 0.0 camber was faster in a circle @Zenmervolt, I never said it was accurate to any degree. The only thing I stated was being accurate or close was that camber is allowing the cars to be more stable under load for me. I don't encounter any slip mid turn or coming on throttle unless I get happy feet.

Are you running 7 wheel sensitivity? Turn it down then give another go.
 
http://en.intraxracing.nl/techniek/camber,-caster,-toe-intoe-out/
Read up gentlemen. There is no castor adjustments in this game,therefor camber is wrong.I'm pretty sure if you go to their homepage and do some searching or click on the tabs above you will see.There is nothing "real world about GT6 period" it's broke GT5 was broke and guess what here we go again.I don't know what to say anymore test after test after test after lap after lap have proven 0/0 is faster.Maybe it's me but I guess the fairy dust I just bought is not real either.Scammed again.
 
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killerjimbag
Well thank you,she test drives them and tears them down every day for the last 24 years and she goes to Toyota's plants to train people.She has a very good understanding and technical knowledge about cars.
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No offense, and all due respect to your better half, but it means almost squat in terms of what cars do a race circuit at the limit and for sure squat with what happens in GT6. I'm sure she's quite knowledgable in her field as most of us are, but as has been pointed out so often, real world is great for understanding what "should be" in the game, not what is.
Zuel
I agreed that 0.0 camber was faster in a circle @Zenmervolt, I never said it was accurate to any degree.....
Are you running 7 wheel sensitivity? Turn it down then give another go.
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I've only tested cars with 4 wheels so far:lol:
 
I totally agree with you Johnny,it's like a cat chasing it's tail,soon enough they either stop or fall over from the dizziness.
 
@Zuel

Face it, you are wrong. It has been shown countless times that 0/0 camber does give you more grip. Most of the things you say are wrong, and you act like you some insider at PD.

You once claimed in an online lobby that there was currently DLC cars available. Nope

You one claimed that you had heard the new sounds that PD were producing, and that "the C7 sounds amazing". Yeah, right:rolleyes:

You once claimed (sometime back in early January) that there would be a major update coming in a few days that would fix camber, and add a bunch off things. Nope.

I could keep going on. The point is, stop saying things when you don't know what your talking about.
 
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Zuel
I agreed that 0.0 camber was faster in a circle @Zenmervolt, I never said it was accurate to any degree. The only thing I stated was being accurate or close was that camber is allowing the cars to be more stable under load for me.
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So:
  • You agree that the camber settings in GT6 are not accurately reproducing what happens with camber in the real world.
  • You say that camber settings in GT6 still have an effect on the car.
  • You say that this effect suits you better.
Congratulations, you're now saying exactly the same thing that the rest of us have been saying for the past several days.

We all agree that camber settings in GT6 do something. We all agree that whatever it is they do, their effects can create results that some drivers prefer. All we're saying is that the adjustments don't have the same effects, nor even approximately the same effects, than camber adjustments would have in the real world.
 
I never said 0.0 gives you better grip @Ittybitty Stigy, I stated that is was faster in a circle. Camber has shown me better grip than flat camber though out the course.

Yes I do agree that camber to a point is in accurate @Zenmervolt "I already stated that" but as to the point as making the car more stable in a turn at speed, camber is better, more so than flat camber. The effects and feel I'm getting through my wheel with the force feedback being at 10 and the wheel sensitivity -1, I'm not getting the same effect as you all are. After working on the set, I have very little mid-turn slip in under steer or over steer. I can enter the turn with out worrying about the front end washing out, under steering or pushing or the rear coming out on hard throttle.
 
If you know how the pp system was calculated @Tornado then you should be able to work out a chart in half time. Mine is almost done.
 
@Zuel

Typo on my part.

Originally I said "0/0 camber does not give you more grip" I meant to say "0/0 camber does give you more grip".

If camber provides more grip throughout the course, why does it increase lap times?
Placebo effect is wonderful, isn't it?
 
Yes 0.0 does give you more grip @Ittybitty Stigy in the case of a flat track from what I'm finding now. I'm finding for me, camber is allowing me to have more of a stable car through the turns. I can always set the rear to go flat to give me the drive coming out of the turn on throttle pending on track layout. I'm not going to waver on my view about the camber setting in GT6 are making the cars stable in the turn and can be faster than flat camber no matter what track or condition "Besides running on dirt or snow" is the set is truly sound.

I've been able to pick up a half second from my previous times posted along while keeping the same camber setting. The changes I've made allowed me to go through the turn faster buy keeping the car at apex throughout the turn. I'm looking at every aspect of the tune, not just one portion of the tune.
 
Zuel
If you know how the pp system was calculated @Tornado then you should be able to work out a chart in half time. Mine is almost done.
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Yours was "almost done" nearly two tears ago when you spent literally dozens of posts saying nothing but buzzwords that lost what little meaning they had when you later (accidentally) started agreeing with those people you had been arguing with in your haste to get the last word in (which certainly explains the Deja Vu everyone is experiencing in this thread). I remember well the constant allusions to "testing" that you never really quantified. You're not nearly as hard to figure out as you put on.



I mean, you're free to continue wasting your time constructing some sort of table that everyone will automatically ignore because you will transparently present it as if it supports your premise regardless of if it actually does (then just throw around completely made up buzzwords because clearly you are the only one who knows anything about entry level tuning); but since how PP is determined is now pretty much known exactly following the proliferation of hybriding in GT5 (I remember some truly detailed guides on the subject by Johnnypenso before the kill patch) and GT6's is calculated seemingly near identical even when it blatantly shouldn't be, I won't even pretend that I'd read it either.
 
How many laps and posts showing 0 0 camber as faster do we need to produce in this thread?
 
If GT6 is calculated the same as GT5 @Tornado work on your chart. Do the math and get every car even within class, not de-tuned 100% power.

Edit:
Every street car @Tornado
 
killerjimbag
How many laps and posts showing 0 0 camber as faster do we need to produce in this thread?
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I'm ready to go.
Keeps me driving and away from this innuendo. :odd:

Oh yeah - I'll agree with anyone who votes for Ouninpohja.
 
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