Chances of Ferrari, Porsche, Lambo's
- Thread starter SVPieries
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live4speed
Obviously a Ferrari or Porsche is much faster than an Impreza, but I was just trying to make a point that these companies are missing out on a huge advertising opportunity, and PD or Sony shouldn't have to shell out extra money to have them included. Because Subaru has cars in the game, I have already virtually test driven an Impreza and am quite confident that is a great car (much cheaper than Ferrari and Porsche btw).
This was pointed out in a link that jedi gave out earlier where this guy's son now thinks that an NSX is basically the fastest car out there. Whether he eventually comes to the realization of an NSX compared to an Enzo or Carrera GT, he will always have faith in NSX being a fast car.
I also have more respect for BMW as a car manufacturer because they were smart enough to realize the potential that Gran Turismo had several years ago. Without their inclusion in the games, I wouldn't care nearly as much about an M3 or M5.
If Ferrari, Lambo, and Porsche really wanted their cars in the game, they would come to some sort of agreement with Sony/PD, rather than simply telling them "this is what you'll pay and that's that." I mean, that's just common business sense.. if you charge less, at least you make that lesser amount of money. If you charge too much, and they don't buy it, you make nothing. And a little of something is better than a lot of nothing.
Think they might show something at TGS? Polyphony isn't listed as an exhibitor, but they might be lumped under SCEI.
Think they might show something at TGS? Polyphony isn't listed as an exhibitor, but they might be lumped under SCEI.
- 30,021
- Cuddington, Cheshire
- JDA1982
Nope, you guys all forgive the expression, are thinking very narrowly. From a business point, they HAVE to charge what their going rate is. No matter how much they want to be in, it would damage future agreements by handing PD a discounted license. Sure you can look at it like Ferrari ask for xxx ammount, Sony say no, so rather than get nothing Ferari drop the price and get at least something. This is suicide to any major deal that could be made in the future, you're basically telling everyone you'll ask for xxx ammount but you can be bargained with and from that point on you will never get what you were originally getting for that license again because you've already given it at a cheaper rate. Were talking licenses that overall can bring a company such as Ferrari millions, they arn't going to cut thoes profits with all the companys they give licenses to just to appear in GT4. I know I wouldn't, it'd be stupid to, Gran Turismo won't make thoes losses back. So the common business sense is to cut a loss with the odd game that can't afford to fit you in the budget rather than cut a loss with every deal you make from that point on.
I think if GT V had the Ferrari, Porsche, .....ect you would have to ask youreself one question, would the game sell just because of the cars in the game or would it sell because of it's reputation? I wouldnt buy the game for the cars, I would buy the game because I have had all of the other ones and they just keep getting better and better as they come out. Please dont get me wrong, I would love to see Ferraris, Porsches.....ect in the game, but if there not, hey, thats cool I am 100% sure that I will buy the game no matter if they are in there or not.
live4speed
Sounds like you're under the impression that licensing contracts are public knowledge.. they're not, or else we'd already know whether PD had the license or not. There's no reason whatsoever for Ferrari (as an example) to divulge their licensing agreement with Polyphony Digital to anyone, period. EA would have no clue how much PD paid for the license, and vice versa. Especially since you can probably count the people "in the know" about the particulars on one hand.
On the flip side, it would also be silly not to charge more to the people who can pay it. That sort of thing happens all the time, in many different industries. Large companies or individuals are quite often charged more than the "little people" for the same service. That's the second question asked right behind "what do you charge?", is "how much can they pay?" Particularly in the entertainment industry. Fact is, these companies probably don't have a specified "cost" for licensing fees, it would vary from company to company. They might have a "goal" cost that they work as close as possible to, but we don't know how much that is. How much did Atari pay for the Lamborghini license for Test Drive: Unlimited? Was it a blanket license, or a per-car license? Was it ten thousand dollars? A hundred thousand? We just don't know. And neither does anyone else, including other developers.
- 30,021
- Cuddington, Cheshire
- JDA1982
Information leaks, if PD were offered a discounted deal it would get out especially so late in development when the budget is so tight. As for the people in the know, there would be quite a few, most would work fo Ferrari and Sony and maybe two or three from PD depending on how their accounts team is run it could be more. Unfortunately once Ferrari have offered a cheaper deal to Sony, they run the risk of that getting out and having to offer far more cheaper deals, and also they will have little to no chance of getting more than that sort of deal out of a company like Sony again. You have to remember Sony CAN afford the license at any rate, Sony chose not to buy it because they said it was too expensive doesn't mean they couldn't afford it, it means they decided it didn't make business sense to buy a license at that stage for that ammount. Ultimately we don't know the ins and out o the licenses, but when a license has been made certain details of that license become public knowledge to all thoes who ask for it. By compromising your cost once you have to ask where does that stop, how long until you give in to pressure again, also how hard will it be to get that same company to pay full whack next time and how sure are you that no details of the cost will get out or end up being speculated on. It's not worth it.
I like the list and the porsches, lambos, ferraris and all that lot are such a big part of GT racing.
Additions to ur list:
Touring cars - e.g. the British Touring Cars
Rally cars - all the up to date rally cars
F1, 2 and 3 cars - all v improtant for going up the levels
ARIAL ATOM, i agree it is so needed to make a good game
Additions to ur list:
Touring cars - e.g. the British Touring Cars
Rally cars - all the up to date rally cars
F1, 2 and 3 cars - all v improtant for going up the levels
ARIAL ATOM, i agree it is so needed to make a good game
- 4,004
- Croatia
There is a very siimple reason why there is no Ferrari and Porsche in GT series - because Microsoft holds the licence for both Ferrari and Porsche. And I'm not speaking about holding the rights for some particular game, but for the company in general.
As I had an opportunity to speak with developer from Bizzare back in 2001 E3 when first Xbox and PGR were premiered, guy told me that they got a licence for F&P from Microsoft. And he also stated that Microsoft just bought them for Xbox and other M$ usage with ridiculos amount of K. I've told that story many times here.
Only exception about having both F&P on platform other then Xbox after 2002 was F355 game and NFS: HP2. Since the original F355 game was from 1999, M$ could do anything about SEGA's lincecing the whole product to Sony, while during NFS: HP2 launch, both F&P licence were still in EA hadns too. After that, F&P were only Microsoft's.
As that contact will expire, one just have to trust in marketing people from Sony who must have the idea what F&P liceces can do in sales-terms. Accompanied with something unique&spectacular as PhotoMode definatelly is, both licences would sell zillions of GT games to everyday users just by having F&P listed among the manufactorers. And pay-off the licencing. But...
If the F&P licencing has something to do with bidding for the just one final buyer (as this year bidding for WTCC licence has occured), then the winner will be the one who will offer more.
And if we say that Sony and M$ will bid for those licence behind close doors, my idea of what would happen is basically something like this: Both F&P are starting with initial price, Sony offers million more, them M$ offers 2M more the Sony. Then Sony offer million more, them M$ offers next 2M more. Sony steps out because they don't want to pay 7M+ for the bid, M$ wins and happily pays 7M. Why?
M$ knows that without two strongest and most charismatic licences in the world majority of their games would not sell good at all. Having F&P is "teh must" for them because the all the weekend-gamers who will buy a game just because F&P licence. Also, they can spread that licence on various products / franchises such as PGR, Forza or something japanese-maket-important such as OutRun.
Sony's position is totally different since their only first-party racing franchise is by coincidence the world's most influentiall video-market product of all times, and with or without licence it will sell in millions of copies.
As always, time will tell.
As I had an opportunity to speak with developer from Bizzare back in 2001 E3 when first Xbox and PGR were premiered, guy told me that they got a licence for F&P from Microsoft. And he also stated that Microsoft just bought them for Xbox and other M$ usage with ridiculos amount of K. I've told that story many times here.
Only exception about having both F&P on platform other then Xbox after 2002 was F355 game and NFS: HP2. Since the original F355 game was from 1999, M$ could do anything about SEGA's lincecing the whole product to Sony, while during NFS: HP2 launch, both F&P licence were still in EA hadns too. After that, F&P were only Microsoft's.
As that contact will expire, one just have to trust in marketing people from Sony who must have the idea what F&P liceces can do in sales-terms. Accompanied with something unique&spectacular as PhotoMode definatelly is, both licences would sell zillions of GT games to everyday users just by having F&P listed among the manufactorers. And pay-off the licencing. But...
If the F&P licencing has something to do with bidding for the just one final buyer (as this year bidding for WTCC licence has occured), then the winner will be the one who will offer more.
And if we say that Sony and M$ will bid for those licence behind close doors, my idea of what would happen is basically something like this: Both F&P are starting with initial price, Sony offers million more, them M$ offers 2M more the Sony. Then Sony offer million more, them M$ offers next 2M more. Sony steps out because they don't want to pay 7M+ for the bid, M$ wins and happily pays 7M. Why?
M$ knows that without two strongest and most charismatic licences in the world majority of their games would not sell good at all. Having F&P is "teh must" for them because the all the weekend-gamers who will buy a game just because F&P licence. Also, they can spread that licence on various products / franchises such as PGR, Forza or something japanese-maket-important such as OutRun.
Sony's position is totally different since their only first-party racing franchise is by coincidence the world's most influentiall video-market product of all times, and with or without licence it will sell in millions of copies.
As always, time will tell.
Young_Warrior
(Banned)
- 2,285
Audi vw seat bentley was in gt4. Lets expect lambo skoda and bugatti in the next.
- 4,004
- Croatia
I have a pretty few leads that what I'm saying is correct. From 2002 we haven't seen any F&P car or even Lamborghini on any other platform then Xbox. Multiplatform Lambo title that was in development during 2003 has been cancelled, no matter that game even came to beta.
No PS3 or any other platform game that I know for has announced F&P&L cars in it, and it goes up to late 2006.
As for Test Drive Unlimited, so far it has been only confirmed as Xbox360 title, so it is far from appearing on PS3, even from rumours point - none of the credibile sources said a word about TDU being an PS3 title, while Atari is listing it as X360 title only.
No PS3 or any other platform game that I know for has announced F&P&L cars in it, and it goes up to late 2006.
As for Test Drive Unlimited, so far it has been only confirmed as Xbox360 title, so it is far from appearing on PS3, even from rumours point - none of the credibile sources said a word about TDU being an PS3 title, while Atari is listing it as X360 title only.
- 30,021
- Cuddington, Cheshire
- JDA1982
KY doesn't pay for the licenses, Sony does. It's Sony who would put the cash forward, Kaz might negotiate the contract since he's going to e in charge of how the cars are represented in the game but it's Sony's cash. As personally, no I wouldn't spend an extra $10 just for Ferrari and Porsche in GT5.
- 26,911
- Houston, Texas, USA
- JMarine25
But like I said, don't say that it's inexcusable to have Ferrari and such not included. It's not like a mom-and-pop video game company can get an actually Porsche License and come up with a certain game. If they aren't included, what can you (or anyone else for that matter) do about it? I'm sure PD and Sony make more money than almost all of us as individuals. This is even if you're rich and spoiled. I don't know how much such car companies are offering for asking prices, but I bet you have to be real fortunate to have them.
The only thing why I'd say that it would probably be an excuse to not race things like Mini Coopers and Skylines. Either that, or just wanting to be able to race fast automobiles. All I can say is, if you want fast cars, let it be Need for Speed. I think in terms of appreciation, a Ferrari or something isn't for the casual car person. Cars like Ferraris and Porsches are mostly for those who respect automobiles. I'd want to race a Ferrari if they were in the game, but I'd want to step up from a ragged machine to wonderful European exotics. To me, I wouldn't blast straight out at a Ferrari, I'd want to EARN being able to own and successfully race a Ferrari. I think it would be pretty boring to have a Ferrari or Porsche and race just those. Yeah, I'll enjoy the rush of speed, but I don't think a game would be so boring if I can't race the fast cars. You work your way up to the bigger and better cars and races, so should you going from Used muscle to pure sports cars and sensational race cars.
My issue on this- if they were included in the game, would this be an excuse to play Gran Turismo 5, or just another car company to use in Gran Turismo competition? It all depends on the gamer, but you already know my answer.
The only thing why I'd say that it would probably be an excuse to not race things like Mini Coopers and Skylines. Either that, or just wanting to be able to race fast automobiles. All I can say is, if you want fast cars, let it be Need for Speed. I think in terms of appreciation, a Ferrari or something isn't for the casual car person. Cars like Ferraris and Porsches are mostly for those who respect automobiles. I'd want to race a Ferrari if they were in the game, but I'd want to step up from a ragged machine to wonderful European exotics. To me, I wouldn't blast straight out at a Ferrari, I'd want to EARN being able to own and successfully race a Ferrari. I think it would be pretty boring to have a Ferrari or Porsche and race just those. Yeah, I'll enjoy the rush of speed, but I don't think a game would be so boring if I can't race the fast cars. You work your way up to the bigger and better cars and races, so should you going from Used muscle to pure sports cars and sensational race cars.
My issue on this- if they were included in the game, would this be an excuse to play Gran Turismo 5, or just another car company to use in Gran Turismo competition? It all depends on the gamer, but you already know my answer.
👎 WHY PORSCHE?!!!
- 30,021
- Cuddington, Cheshire
- JDA1982
Theres Lamborghini's in opther games too, including the new NFS and MC3. Microsoft certainly do not have an esclusive deal with Lamborghini. They have a deal with them, but it's not like the deals people think they have with Ferrrari.
- 26,911
- Houston, Texas, USA
- JMarine25
I've seen a few Cayennes on the road before. It's not a bad automobile. It may be a weird deal because it is anything but a regular car. It has driven up Pikes Peak in a Porsche-sponsored deal, so obviously it is a mean machine.
I'd see the Lamborghinis in the next GT if PD were to secure licenses. In fact, the biggest benefactor would be the Super GT series (formerly the JGTC). I can recall the sexy Murcielago racing in Super GT. Then too, it would be interesting to see the old JLOC Diablo GT-R from the older days of the JGTC. Remember that old Diablo ripping up Japanese tracks?
I think those old Diablos were quite popular in black. I normally don't like yellow colors, but the gold-like color of the Murcielago and Gallardo are pretty sweet. In fact, I remember at the Houston Auto Show one year that I seen a Murcielago in red, but just seeing one in person... 👍. You dig me, GTP? Anyhow, I haven't hated seeing either of the three car companies mentioned. My only thing is, I'd like to see them too, but I'm not petitioning or demanding to see them in the game. As I said earlier, the main reason people would want them in the game is just to race them and not race anything lower than these three companies (meaning, almost any other auto make, probably except Koenigsegg and McLaren).
I stated in the GT4 forums that there was a disappointment because racing supercars in GT4 was pretty disappointing. You tune them up really well, they kind of oversteer a lot, especially with more horsepower. That's the lesson I learned the hard way modding up a Ford GT or a Callaway C12. Henceforth, my other concern is, will supercars and exotics handle like crap? I think racing on anything that isn't racing tires just completely KILLS racing such autos. So let's say the Ferrari Enzo is in GT5, and granted you will be prohibited from racing on Racing Tires, if you mod up the horsepower and all, will the car be crap to drive considering the Enzo's capabilities?
Of course, if there was one exotic maker I'd really want to see in a GT, let it be McLaren.
I'd see the Lamborghinis in the next GT if PD were to secure licenses. In fact, the biggest benefactor would be the Super GT series (formerly the JGTC). I can recall the sexy Murcielago racing in Super GT. Then too, it would be interesting to see the old JLOC Diablo GT-R from the older days of the JGTC. Remember that old Diablo ripping up Japanese tracks?
I think those old Diablos were quite popular in black. I normally don't like yellow colors, but the gold-like color of the Murcielago and Gallardo are pretty sweet. In fact, I remember at the Houston Auto Show one year that I seen a Murcielago in red, but just seeing one in person... 👍. You dig me, GTP? Anyhow, I haven't hated seeing either of the three car companies mentioned. My only thing is, I'd like to see them too, but I'm not petitioning or demanding to see them in the game. As I said earlier, the main reason people would want them in the game is just to race them and not race anything lower than these three companies (meaning, almost any other auto make, probably except Koenigsegg and McLaren).
I stated in the GT4 forums that there was a disappointment because racing supercars in GT4 was pretty disappointing. You tune them up really well, they kind of oversteer a lot, especially with more horsepower. That's the lesson I learned the hard way modding up a Ford GT or a Callaway C12. Henceforth, my other concern is, will supercars and exotics handle like crap? I think racing on anything that isn't racing tires just completely KILLS racing such autos. So let's say the Ferrari Enzo is in GT5, and granted you will be prohibited from racing on Racing Tires, if you mod up the horsepower and all, will the car be crap to drive considering the Enzo's capabilities?
Of course, if there was one exotic maker I'd really want to see in a GT, let it be McLaren.
Young_Warrior
(Banned)
- 2,285
Lambo was going to be in GT4 they even mapped and recorded the cars. What happened in the end I dont know.
- 127
Hell get me my civic and im ready to go!!!lol j/k
the only cars that really matter to me are
1.Aston Martin DBR9/DB5
2.Ferrari 250 GTO
3.Mitsubishi Galant VR-4(95-00)
4.johannson R8's
5.E46 BMW's(330ci)
6.The new Porsche LMP race car debuting next year in ALMS and LM
the only cars that really matter to me are
1.Aston Martin DBR9/DB5
2.Ferrari 250 GTO
3.Mitsubishi Galant VR-4(95-00)
4.johannson R8's
5.E46 BMW's(330ci)
6.The new Porsche LMP race car debuting next year in ALMS and LM
- 127
if you remember after online was gone a large portion of cars were also done away with......sniff...goodbye beautiful cars...Young_Warrior
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