Classic American Muscle Championship - The Dawn of Season 2 In Session
- Thread starter Eric Demory
- 175 comments
- 11,197 views
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
Four more days left everyone! Come on!
Smallhorses
Staff Emeritus
- 7,260
Grrrrr. 
Was running El Capitan 200 miles last night and having a great race, however, on lap 57 out of 66, my brake pedal started to stick at about 1/5 on. Caused a spin and a loss of 30 or-so seconds, especially since it was on an in-lap too. Limped back to pits and finished race after fixing pedals, but unhappy with my time now.
Why does that sort of thing never happen on lap 2 or with just 10 minutes gone when it's no big deal to reset and start again?
Think I'll be going for another shot at this tonight, and then I'll just have the Family Cup short races to get out of the way, meh, maybe just 1 more go at NY200 'cos I think I can do better there too!
*Edit* I amaze myself sometimes.
Better run at El Capitan 200 miles without brake failure was exactly 28.789s quicker. Told you it was 30 or-so seconds, not a bad guesstimate!
Was running El Capitan 200 miles last night and having a great race, however, on lap 57 out of 66, my brake pedal started to stick at about 1/5 on. Caused a spin and a loss of 30 or-so seconds, especially since it was on an in-lap too. Limped back to pits and finished race after fixing pedals, but unhappy with my time now.
Why does that sort of thing never happen on lap 2 or with just 10 minutes gone when it's no big deal to reset and start again?
Think I'll be going for another shot at this tonight, and then I'll just have the Family Cup short races to get out of the way, meh, maybe just 1 more go at NY200 'cos I think I can do better there too!
*Edit* I amaze myself sometimes.
Better run at El Capitan 200 miles without brake failure was exactly 28.789s quicker. Told you it was 30 or-so seconds, not a bad guesstimate!
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- 971
- Sunny Devon
I just found a problem with the endurance races while testing tyres at Laguna Seca. After running 11 stints from 2 to 15 laps using different tyre combos, I then sent Bob out for a stint to see how his time compared to mine. Imagine my surprise when the race ended 5 laps (behind the Saleen S7) from the finish, and my total time given was 3 minutes faster than my teammate who completed the last lap behind a Corvette Z06.
In theory you could run just 1 lap and by crossing the line right behind the fastest possible car as it finished the last lap still have the fastest total race time for the purposes of this competition. Meanwhile, somebody that ran the full race distance against the slowest possible lineup would be penalised for having a longer race time!
...or is this just a bug in the PAL version?
In theory you could run just 1 lap and by crossing the line right behind the fastest possible car as it finished the last lap still have the fastest total race time for the purposes of this competition. Meanwhile, somebody that ran the full race distance against the slowest possible lineup would be penalised for having a longer race time!
...or is this just a bug in the PAL version?
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
25 hours remaining competitors. Send in your times if you have not yet, and I should have the results up by Sunday.
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Smallhorses
Staff Emeritus
- 7,260
Ummm... that's 25 hours away.
So the deadline has been slashed by 19hrs? Without prior notice?
Why?
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
Whoa, thank you for pointing that out. Since I stayed home sick from school today, I thought it was Saturday. Sorry for that misunderstanding.
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Smallhorses
Staff Emeritus
- 7,260
For time submissions should each driver submit all times directly to you and you'll pick the best time for each team, or submit times to the team captain who'll be responsible for picking the best team times to submit?
Will we be ranked as drivers, and as teams (i.e. if a team submitted, for example 2 times and finished 1st & 2nd, the drivers would take 1st & 2nd placed points for the drivers championship, but the team, being a car with more than 1 driver, to make it fair to those cars with only a single driver, would score just 1st place points, but not 2nd, and the car which finished 3rd would get 3rd placed driver points but 2nd placed team points) or just as a team i.e. car type irrespective of driver, overall?
That's probably as clear as Guinness, but you can work it out.
I'm guessing it's just a team score as that's what post #1 implies.
Will we be ranked as drivers, and as teams (i.e. if a team submitted, for example 2 times and finished 1st & 2nd, the drivers would take 1st & 2nd placed points for the drivers championship, but the team, being a car with more than 1 driver, to make it fair to those cars with only a single driver, would score just 1st place points, but not 2nd, and the car which finished 3rd would get 3rd placed driver points but 2nd placed team points) or just as a team i.e. car type irrespective of driver, overall?
That's probably as clear as Guinness, but you can work it out.
I'm guessing it's just a team score as that's what post #1 implies.
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
The team captain will submit the best time obtained by the team member.
The points will be given to the team, not given separate points to each member of the team. In order to keep the competition fair to the single car competitors.
Smallhorses
Staff Emeritus
- 7,260
Sooooooo...
It's almost an hour beyond the deadline. When do we get the results?
It's almost an hour beyond the deadline. When do we get the results?
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
You shall see the results by tomorrow. I will be putting it together slowly today, as I have much on my schedule.
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
Season 1 Results
Code:
Season 1 Racing Roster
Chevrolet Corvette Stingray L46 350 (C3) 1969 Racing No. Driver Points
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
07 Crooooooow 78
Shelby Cobra 427 1967 Team Racing No. Driver Points
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Map O' Tassie 69 viperin 73
oldmodelt
Plymouth Super Bird 1970 Racing No. Driver Points
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
58 Car-less 51
42 Smallhorses
Chevrolet Camaro Z28 302 1969 Racing No. Driver Points
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
28 thc118 50
Dodge Charger 440 R/T 1970 Racing No. Driver Points
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
05 BH-21 28
Chevrolet Chevelle SS 454 1970 Racing No. Driver Points
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
70 Matej 21
Code:
American Events Hall / Muscle Car Competition
Racers Times - Points
New York
oldmodelt & viperin 3'30.394 10
Crooooooow 3'39.218 7
thc118 3'41.291 5
Car-less & Smallhorses 3'45.903 4
Matej 3'54.627 3
BH-21 3'55.194 2
Infineon Raceway - Sports Car Course
oldmodelt & viperin 3'23.830 10
Crooooooow 3'32.018 7
Car-less & Smallhorses 3'35.844 5
thc118 3'35.883 4
BH-21 3'46.755 3
Matej 3'47.348 2
Seattle Circuit
Crooooooow 3'32.772 10
oldmodelt & viperin 3'33.818 7
thc118 3'36.557 5
Car-less & Smallhorses 3'39.240 4
Matej 3'48.813 3
BH-21 3'51.668 2
Family Cup
Laguna Seca Raceway
oldmodelt & viperin 3'01.760 10
Car-less & Smallhorses 3'06.568 7
Crooooooow 3'07.996 5
thc118 3'09.969 4
Matej 3'14.243 3
BH-21 3'19.796 2
El Capitan
thc118 3'40.849 10
Car-less & Smallhorses 3'42.321 7
Crooooooow 3'45.757 5
Matej 3'48.020 4
oldmodelt & viperin 3'48.128 3
BH-21 4'08.714 2
Clubman Stage Route 5
Crooooooow 1'54.281 10
Car-less & Smallhorses 1'55.592 7
thc118 1'56.882 5
oldmodelt & viperin 1'58.340 4
Matej 1'59.128 3
BH-21 2'03.453 2
Special Stage Route 5
Crooooooow 2'57.642 10
oldmodelt & viperin 2'59.075 7
thc118 3'02.663 5
Car-less & Smallhorses 3'04.004 4
Matej 3'11.797 3
BH-21 3'15.480 2
Endurance Hall
Laguna Seca 200 Miles
Crooooooow 2:18'21.128 10
BH-21 2:20'48.713 7
oldmodelt & viperin 2:21.54.723 5
Car-less & Smallhorses 2:25'17.573 3
thc118 2:28'06.387 2 (141.38min/86=1.64min=1min 40.960sec, 100.960x4=403.840=6min 43.840sec, 2:21'22.547+6'43.840=2:28'06.387)
Matej DNF 0
New York 200 Miles
oldmodelt & viperin 2:13'21.828 10
thc118 2:21'09.248 7
Car-less & Smallhorses 2:21'20.703 5
Crooooooow 2:21'25.341 4
BH-21 2:21'31.424 3
Matej DNF 0
El Capitan 200 Miles
Crooooooow 2:11'48.870 10
oldmodelt & viperin 2:12'20.722 7
thc118 2:12'55.139 5
Car-less & Smallhorses 2:13'46.069 4
BH-21 2:14'50.641 3
Matej DNF 0
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Smallhorses
Staff Emeritus
- 7,260
Quick question: Are everyone's finishing times for Laguna Seca 200 miles for a full 90 laps completed? If not how many did you finish?
Given that the results for NY200 and EC200 are within a minute or 2 of one another for everyone, it seems odd that there's 12 minutes difference at LS200, which equates to 8s faster per lap over 90 laps.
Just curious.
Given that the results for NY200 and EC200 are within a minute or 2 of one another for everyone, it seems odd that there's 12 minutes difference at LS200, which equates to 8s faster per lap over 90 laps.
Just curious.
- 157
- Pennsylvania
I finished 86 laps with a time of 2:21'22.547, behind the Shelby and ZR-1.
The huge amount of body roll ate up my tires, while the Cobra and Corvette could benefit much more from the extra grip and stiff chassis. Both in lap times and tire wear. That's my guess. As for the Charger's finishing time... ???
The huge amount of body roll ate up my tires, while the Cobra and Corvette could benefit much more from the extra grip and stiff chassis. Both in lap times and tire wear. That's my guess. As for the Charger's finishing time... ???
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
They are for a full 90 lap time. If they did not finish the full 90 laps, they do not receive any points.
I was suspicious about that outcome. But since the muscle cars have far separated performance than others, it seems about right for his situation.
Smallhorses
Staff Emeritus
- 7,260
Cool 
.
Just checking given Car-less' odd findings the other day.
I can well believe with the extra number of laps, that the lighter Cobra and 'Vette benefited from one or two less stops than my 'Bird, that or they were able to make softer tyres run as long as I could go on the RSHs that I had to run to stand any sort of chance!
Given that in a bone stock Arcade Mode Shelby Cobra 427 '67 on SM tyres I was able to run a 1'30.573 lap in shotamagee's Weekly Arcade Time Trial Challenge recently, it makes sense that a Cobra tweaked to almost 500HP and with the benefit of Full-Custom Transmission & RSH or RH tyres will probably pull consistent 1'26-1'28 laps, maybe faster, as my 'Bird's fastest lap was 1'34.251 my average laptime over the 90 was 1'36.862 as I had to pit every 15 laps!
Anyway, congratulations on a well run series Crooooooow! 👍
Will there be a season 2?
.Just checking given Car-less' odd findings the other day.
I can well believe with the extra number of laps, that the lighter Cobra and 'Vette benefited from one or two less stops than my 'Bird, that or they were able to make softer tyres run as long as I could go on the RSHs that I had to run to stand any sort of chance!
Given that in a bone stock Arcade Mode Shelby Cobra 427 '67 on SM tyres I was able to run a 1'30.573 lap in shotamagee's Weekly Arcade Time Trial Challenge recently, it makes sense that a Cobra tweaked to almost 500HP and with the benefit of Full-Custom Transmission & RSH or RH tyres will probably pull consistent 1'26-1'28 laps, maybe faster, as my 'Bird's fastest lap was 1'34.251 my average laptime over the 90 was 1'36.862 as I had to pit every 15 laps!
Anyway, congratulations on a well run series Crooooooow! 👍
Will there be a season 2?
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
Cool
Just checking given Car-less' odd findings the other day.
I can well believe with the extra number of laps, that the lighter Cobra and 'Vette benefited from one or two less stops than my 'Bird, that or they were able to make softer tyres run as long as I could go on the RSHs that I had to run to stand any sort of chance!
Given that in a bone stock Arcade Mode Shelby Cobra 427 '67 on SM tyres I was able to run a 1'30.573 lap in shotamagee's Weekly Arcade Time Trial Challenge recently, it makes sense that a Cobra tweaked to almost 500HP and with the benefit of Full-Custom Transmission & RSH or RH tyres will probably pull consistent 1'26-1'28 laps, maybe faster, as my 'Bird's fastest lap was 1'34.251 my average laptime over the 90 was 1'36.862 as I had to pit every 15 laps!
Good little examination you gave.
Anyway, congratulations on a well run series Crooooooow! 👍
Will there be a season 2?
Thanks. I am planning a sequel within the dusk of the month or the dawn of the next.
Smallhorses
Staff Emeritus
- 7,260
Cool!
Just one suggestion though, given the out-performance of the not-so-muscle-car-ish 2 seater sports cars such as the 'Vette and the Cobra, can we stick to the real Classic muscle car definition, such as is laid out here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_car
to bring a little parity to the series?
It's a shame we didn't get to see any times from the Super Bee and 'Cuda, the Super Bee was going to be one of my picks originally, but I laid off it when it was already taken by tricd04.
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
I will work on that for season 2. Now since I know more about muscle cars from your given information, there shall be more exciting opportunities lying within the essence of round two.
You may reserve the Super Bee if you would like. Too bad tricd04 could not finish the season. He has not been lurking around the forums since the prologue of Christmas. Sadly, we could not receive his results to add additional tension to the heart pounding moment of examining the race outcomes to see what location we were placed at on the leader board.
- 1,274
- Chicagoland, IL USA
- oldmodelt
I checked my records from the private message bank that I sent Viperin and copied below because I did the enduros. But he may have run it again himself. Or typed wrong.
Laguna Seca 200 -------------- 2nd place
14 - 22'05.350/1'31.881
28 - 44'15.816
39 - 1:01'40.666
Screwed up and needed fuel. Still only 6 pits
53 - 1:23'55.733
67 - 1:45'48.333
82 - 2:09'20.450 - one extra lap then switched to RM/RM
90 - 2:21.54.723/1'29.660
Shelby 1 was 1st @ 2:21'03.682. Damn thing never seemed to pit.
Laguna Seca 200 -------------- 2nd place
14 - 22'05.350/1'31.881
28 - 44'15.816
39 - 1:01'40.666
Screwed up and needed fuel. Still only 6 pits
53 - 1:23'55.733
67 - 1:45'48.333
82 - 2:09'20.450 - one extra lap then switched to RM/RM
90 - 2:21.54.723/1'29.660
Shelby 1 was 1st @ 2:21'03.682. Damn thing never seemed to pit.
- 451
Just checking in after waiting for oldmodelt to post as I did not want to pre empt anything.
As you will see an obvious typo in the results for LS Enduro. I can confirm the info provided above by oldmodelt is as he sent to me before Christmas. Mistake likely due to a transcription error by Crooooooow.
I apologise for not noticing myself as I did the sprint races and left the Enduros to my partner ( could not find enough time to do them, so I am grateful to oldmodelt for saving me the effort).
No biggie though as it will not alter things too much.
Good fun and we will certainly enter the next series.
As you will see an obvious typo in the results for LS Enduro. I can confirm the info provided above by oldmodelt is as he sent to me before Christmas. Mistake likely due to a transcription error by Crooooooow.
I apologise for not noticing myself as I did the sprint races and left the Enduros to my partner ( could not find enough time to do them, so I am grateful to oldmodelt for saving me the effort).
No biggie though as it will not alter things too much.
Good fun and we will certainly enter the next series.
- 1,274
- Chicagoland, IL USA
- oldmodelt
- 157
- Pennsylvania
I ran a crude test consisting of a single practice lap around El Capitan in each of the cars basically to see which I wanted for next season. With the exception of the Corvettes and Cobra, every car finished with a time of 2'00 +/- 1.5s. They were all low-mileage, bone stock, no aids, and AT except for the 'Cuda. Why you redline a 440 at 6000 rpm is beyond me. The Chevelle set the best time and the majority of cars finished above 2 min. The weakest car is probably the z28, but I knew it well enough to be competitive. I also took the Jensen for a lap since it is also powered by a Chrysler 440, and it finished spot on with the rest.
In addition to these implied suggestions for season 2, I'd also like to see a 1/4 mile event and 4 hours at the 'Ring brought back. With both finishing time and number of laps, it wouldn't be too difficult to figure out proper placement of the competitors. Whether or not the game will let you finish an entire lap if you cross the line at 3:59.999 and 1st place crosses at 4:00.001 is another issue entirely.
In addition to these implied suggestions for season 2, I'd also like to see a 1/4 mile event and 4 hours at the 'Ring brought back. With both finishing time and number of laps, it wouldn't be too difficult to figure out proper placement of the competitors. Whether or not the game will let you finish an entire lap if you cross the line at 3:59.999 and 1st place crosses at 4:00.001 is another issue entirely.
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
- 971
- Sunny Devon
I'd be up for a round 2, but preferably without the longer races. I'm still not convinced of the relaibility of any races where contestants finish on different laps and where a full replay is not recorded.
That said, I can see what's happened with the endurance times - you've mixed them all up! You might want to double check all the submissions against the posted results to make sure the right times are put against each race, and a total for each driver/team wouldn't go amiss either.
Looking at my extensive testing data, if the 2 fastest and 2 slowest cars were ommitted then there is just a 3% gap in performance across all of the muscle cars as stock. Dropping the Cobra and Corvettes has got to be the way to go.
That said, I can see what's happened with the endurance times - you've mixed them all up! You might want to double check all the submissions against the posted results to make sure the right times are put against each race, and a total for each driver/team wouldn't go amiss either.
Looking at my extensive testing data, if the 2 fastest and 2 slowest cars were ommitted then there is just a 3% gap in performance across all of the muscle cars as stock. Dropping the Cobra and Corvettes has got to be the way to go.
- 6,694
- Dallas, TX
- 1,274
- Chicagoland, IL USA
- oldmodelt
My typing error. My apologies to you Croooow. I'm not a smart man.
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