Creation vs. Evolution
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Did we not go over most of this? The flood was highly unlikely. There would be loads of evidence.
If Adam named all species, we wouldn't have to. But we do. That is a big gaping hole right there.
Weren't you the one who didn't want what you said treated as science? Then don't act like it is.
Danoff
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So Swift,
Have I addressed your concerns. Are you on board with me on this notion that those who think evolution is responsible for the creation of the human race do not think that humanity is an accident?
BTW: This isn't some kind of trick. If you say yes, then that's great. I have no follow-up to this.
Have I addressed your concerns. Are you on board with me on this notion that those who think evolution is responsible for the creation of the human race do not think that humanity is an accident?
BTW: This isn't some kind of trick. If you say yes, then that's great. I have no follow-up to this.
Danoff
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Swift
It's not really moot to me because I feel that it's a mischaracterization of my position. To say that evolutionists believe that humanity is an accident is similar to saying that we think that when you throw a ball up in the air it comes down by accident. It makes no sense in my mind why one would think such a thing and I think that misunderstanding may be the root of much of the difficulty in this discussion.
Also, I'm just tired of refuting it since it's one of the main ways that creationists pick at the concept evolution.
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This conversation took place after scanning through this thread:
Mr. DTW: Baby, why do you believe in God even though there is no proof of him or her or whatever it may be?
Mrs. DTW: Because the only way any of us can ever win is by loving God.
Mr. DTW: I dont follow you
Mrs. DTW: When I die if God is real than he will take me to heaven and reward me with love and happiness for eternity. If God is not real than when I die there will not be a spirit of me to remember who I was, or that I had spent a life worshipping a supreme being that was never real. So the way I see it, it is a win-win situation.
As for me I am an Anthropologist so I believe in God, in fact I believe in every God of every culture equally. And yes I think it should be taught in school. To me it has never been a question of who is right or wrong, instead it is a question of freedom of choice, religion, and very much a part of most cultures.
Those who proclaim the ignorance of the Creationist are simply playing the same game as those who proclaim the damnation of the Evolutionists.
Mr. DTW: Baby, why do you believe in God even though there is no proof of him or her or whatever it may be?
Mrs. DTW: Because the only way any of us can ever win is by loving God.
Mr. DTW: I dont follow you
Mrs. DTW: When I die if God is real than he will take me to heaven and reward me with love and happiness for eternity. If God is not real than when I die there will not be a spirit of me to remember who I was, or that I had spent a life worshipping a supreme being that was never real. So the way I see it, it is a win-win situation.
As for me I am an Anthropologist so I believe in God, in fact I believe in every God of every culture equally. And yes I think it should be taught in school. To me it has never been a question of who is right or wrong, instead it is a question of freedom of choice, religion, and very much a part of most cultures.
Those who proclaim the ignorance of the Creationist are simply playing the same game as those who proclaim the damnation of the Evolutionists.
PS
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You just pwned half this thread.
[edit]
Damn, he's been here since 2003, and this is his first post. He must have followed this whole thing!
Wow. That's...just...wow.
I nominate that for best post of 2005.
[edit 2]
Just for resonance:
Those who proclaim the ignorance of the Creationist are simply playing the same game as those who proclaim the damnation of the Evolutionists.
[edit]
Damn, he's been here since 2003, and this is his first post. He must have followed this whole thing!
Wow. That's...just...wow.
I nominate that for best post of 2005.
[edit 2]
Just for resonance:
Those who proclaim the ignorance of the Creationist are simply playing the same game as those who proclaim the damnation of the Evolutionists.
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- Small_Fryz
I said where did god come from and you said where did the mass come from.
Well i then return from where did god create the mass? You cant create something from nothing, though if you found a way please tell!
Well i then return from where did god create the mass? You cant create something from nothing, though if you found a way please tell!
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Um yes first post? I dont care for on-line chat, but this debate was too good to miss. It is after all one of the questions Cultural Anthropology addresses when dealing with any culture that has a religion.
@Danoff: I never said she doesnt think God is real and neither did she. On the contrary she is very devout in her faith. What she said, and you obviously missed, is that her faith is strong enough for her, but if there is no God than in the end it wont matter. Lets try this another way, will taking vitamins help you live longer? Maybe, maybe not, but how does it hurt to take them anyway? Try reading my comment over but this time with a little less predetermined damnation.
@PS: I think you may have missed the point of my last comment. There is no God, and yes we evolved from a common simian ancestor; this is however my personal view. In Anthropology you must always strive to separate your personal view from what you are studying and look at all things in an impersonal third person manner. By saying:
Those who proclaim the ignorance of the Creationist are simply playing the same game as those who proclaim the damnation of the Evolutionists.
That as an Anthropologist (personal beliefs aside) discounting even one belief robs from the whole; and when both sides are doing the same thing nothing can be learned. I hope that clears things up a bit.
Second post and back to the shadows for another two year hibernation
@Danoff: I never said she doesnt think God is real and neither did she. On the contrary she is very devout in her faith. What she said, and you obviously missed, is that her faith is strong enough for her, but if there is no God than in the end it wont matter. Lets try this another way, will taking vitamins help you live longer? Maybe, maybe not, but how does it hurt to take them anyway? Try reading my comment over but this time with a little less predetermined damnation.
@PS: I think you may have missed the point of my last comment. There is no God, and yes we evolved from a common simian ancestor; this is however my personal view. In Anthropology you must always strive to separate your personal view from what you are studying and look at all things in an impersonal third person manner. By saying:
Those who proclaim the ignorance of the Creationist are simply playing the same game as those who proclaim the damnation of the Evolutionists.
That as an Anthropologist (personal beliefs aside) discounting even one belief robs from the whole; and when both sides are doing the same thing nothing can be learned. I hope that clears things up a bit.
Second post and back to the shadows for another two year hibernation
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I almost forgot another of your flawed points Danoff, how can you believe in contingency? In the simplest example I can think of at the moment (I am sure others can give better) and I will admit this is very oversimplified:
How do you know your car will start in the morning? You dont, you just believe it will. So by your own reasoning that is belief in contingency
Third post, now I am one year in the hole!
How do you know your car will start in the morning? You dont, you just believe it will. So by your own reasoning that is belief in contingency
Third post, now I am one year in the hole!
Danoff
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DadtheWheel
I don't really know how you missed it in there. Let me point out specifically where she doesn't have enough faith to go to Heaven.
DadtheWheel
BAM!!! RIGHT THERE! IF God is real. That's not faith, that's doubt. There should be no question in the mind of the faithful that God is real. If there is, then you do not truly believe. If there is not, then you do not need to make the statement that Mrs. DTW was making.
Try reading THIS one over with a little less predetermined damnation. I know you're close to the subject here since this is your wife, but surely you can see how what I'm saying is true. One is either faithful or not, there is no half way.
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PSAsking me?
It's been done in labs. Famine said something about it a while back. Too lazy to find where tho.
I was actually asking swift or pako
Pako
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danoff
Sorry to jump right in on a response to your post DTW, but I couldn't help it. danoff, how can you make a statement like that? It is common for people to question their faith, which I think is healthy. This thread alone has strengthened my faith in God and I'm grateful for this forum and thread for making that possible. It sounds like Mrs. DTW was hedging her bets on God's existence. I'm sorry but you are very wrong on this one danoff. I think you need to calm down just a little. There was no BAM or RIGHT THERE...
Take a deep breath and relax now.
PS
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PakoSorry to jump right in on a response to your post DTW, but I couldn't help it. danoff, how can you make a statement like that? It is common for people to question their faith, which I think is healthy. This thread alone has strengthened my faith in God and I'm grateful for this forum and thread for making that possible. It sounds like Mrs. DTW was hedging her bets on God's existence. I'm sorry but you are very wrong on this one danoff. I think you need to calm down just a little. There was no BAM or RIGHT THERE...
And smoke a [super]joint and chill, like any self-respecting Pastafarian.
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Just saying I get PS's humour also. Only stupid people wouldn't. We should burn those stupid people, maybe crucify them, that would be fun.
I can't believe how many dead-horses need to be flogged, its really quite cruel.
BTW we can make matter out of "nothing". Just as matter can be turned into energy, energy can be transformed into matter. I believe there was an experiment where this was achieved, proving the validity of much conceptual physics work. Can Famine (or someone smart) please verify this?
I can't believe how many dead-horses need to be flogged, its really quite cruel.
BTW we can make matter out of "nothing". Just as matter can be turned into energy, energy can be transformed into matter. I believe there was an experiment where this was achieved, proving the validity of much conceptual physics work. Can Famine (or someone smart) please verify this?
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I will verify it with an equation.
E=mc^2.
Pako & DTW: DTW's wife sounds agnostic - the hedge-better of the world of faith. "I believe in "x" because if I do I'll get "good thing y" if it's true and nothing bad if it isn't. If I don't believe in "x" and it's true, I WON'T get "good thing y", but "bad thing z" instead. So I'd rather believe in "x" because that way nothing bad will happen if I'm wrong."
DTW - I drive a Mazda...
Swift - That's exactly what I said, dictionary definitions aside. He had to name an animal/plant/fungus/bacterium/virus(/prion?) every 3 seconds, so didn't have time for it anyway. Out of interest, which minister performed the ceremony?
E=mc^2.
Pako & DTW: DTW's wife sounds agnostic - the hedge-better of the world of faith. "I believe in "x" because if I do I'll get "good thing y" if it's true and nothing bad if it isn't. If I don't believe in "x" and it's true, I WON'T get "good thing y", but "bad thing z" instead. So I'd rather believe in "x" because that way nothing bad will happen if I'm wrong."
DTW - I drive a Mazda...
Swift - That's exactly what I said, dictionary definitions aside. He had to name an animal/plant/fungus/bacterium/virus(/prion?) every 3 seconds, so didn't have time for it anyway. Out of interest, which minister performed the ceremony?
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"Hedging your bets" is the worst possible reason to believe in God.
If you die, and there is a God, He will not be happy you didn't believe in Him with Faith. And if there is no God, you have wasted your life in devotion to a master that doesn't exist.
If you die, and there is a God, He will not be happy you didn't believe in Him with Faith. And if there is no God, you have wasted your life in devotion to a master that doesn't exist.
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Famine
Well, sort of, but by definition, an agnostic says its impossible to know whether or not God exists:
Web definitions of agnosticism
Basically, if you're an agnostic, you're formally shrugging your shoulders and saying "Who knows?"
Pako
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Duke
1.) There no way that you can know how God "feels" in that situation. You are saved by the grace of Jesus. Nothing more, nothing less.
2.) Dedicating your lifestyle to a God that teaches love and forgiveness for others is not wasting any ones time. If it was, I wish more people would waste their time that way, the world would be a better place with all that wasted life.
