EA Sports WRC: General Discussion

  • Thread starter xX Jojje Xx
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Second friend who plays it... and second opinion that there is too much grip on gravel. It's easier to over-brake in DR 2.0... Much easier than DR 2.0. Personally, if there is more grip on gravel than in DR 2.0 I will not be happy.
 
ManuBicht
Second friend who plays it... and second opinion that there is too much grip on gravel. It's easier to over-brake in DR 2.0... Much easier than DR 2.0. Personally, if there is more grip on gravel than in DR 2.0 I will not be happy.
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The few I’ve watched have said gravel feels amazing. It’s the tarmac that seems to be divisive at the moment, seems to be universally agreed that it’s better than DR2 but nkt as good as the gravel.
 
ManuBicht
Second friend who plays it... and second opinion that there is too much grip on gravel. It's easier to over-brake in DR 2.0... Much easier than DR 2.0. Personally, if there is more grip on gravel than in DR 2.0 I will not be happy.
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Happy to hear that. Nice if it is more forgivng. More fun.
 
Looks and sounds great in latest videos, seems on pc mostly.
Hope it runs on console at 60fps.., and looks good still, no stutter and distracting pop ups.
Including replays i hope.

Doppler effect seems less cool in roadside replay cams, maybe just the video.

Still not got confirmed if seasons affects grip?
Hope tarmac has some bumps too, not just perfect like spain stages in dr2 often, apart from the small rubble that was added with degradation, and grooves in corners on the dirt beside the tarmac, although that is really cool already in dr2.

Playing wrc10 last day a little, and i like the feel of historic cars in finland.

Anyhow, looks cool overall up to now. 🤞
 
Jtheripper
Looks and sounds great in latest videos, seems on pc mostly.
Hope it runs on console at 60fps.., and looks good still, no stutter and distracting pop ups.
Including replays i hope.

Doppler effect seems less cool in roadside replay cams, maybe just the video.

Still not got confirmed if seasons affects grip?
Hope tarmac has some bumps too, not just perfect like spain stages in dr2 often, apart from the small rubble that was added with degradation, and grooves in corners on the dirt beside the tarmac, although that is really cool already in dr2.

Playing wrc10 last day a little, and i like the feel of historic cars in finland.

Anyhow, looks cool overall up to now. 🤞
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From what I’ve heard so far, in Monte Carlo the seasons have the biggest effect on grip. For the other rallies it’s there but much less noticeable, it does however vary what tyres are available, i.e winter seasons getting super soft and soft compounds while getting medium/hard in summer seasons.

So not hugely extreme but different enough to affect tyre compounds and mildly noticeable grip.
 
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xX Jojje Xx
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Looks good in this, just sounds seem lazy a little, like too slow to react, revs, shifting, doppler effect.
Wasn't like this in dr2, i hope its not a sign of ue4 weaknesses, and adaptation struggles.

Seemed more ok though in cockpit pov, just the driver not turning early enough at each bend in that view 😋.

And 3rd person looks a little un-immersive, which is obvious of course, but i mean the car feel and response looks not as good for visual feedback, i guess that's expected, and i dont use it anyhow, or rarely.
 
I will reserve judgement until I have actually played it, but here are my impressions so far:

POSITIVE:

-Graphics look better than in the promo vids.

-Sounds great, as expected

-Stages look wonderful, if barren at times (low density of foliage and spectators).

-Career mode probably just as deep and engaging (maybe more so) than the KT WRCs.

-Physics look decent, about on par with what we are accustomed to with CM.

-Clubs will probably be just as good as in DR2.0, so a big improvement over the KT WRC Clubs.

NEGATIVE:

-The biggest disappointment for me so far is that dynamic weather didn't make the cut, especially with the 20-30+km stages. So if it's raining, it rains over the whole 30+ km at a constant rate. Too bad as the dynamic weather was one of the best features of DiRT 4 and the KT WRCs.

-It looks like it's very easy to puncture, but very difficult to break the car. Just like in DR2.0. But I haven't been able to see what damage everyone is using yet (standard or hardcore).

-Tire wear looks to be scripted again.

-Monte seems to have lost its ice patches. It now looks no more than an on/off switch from slippy to not slippy at a single point in the stage. No surprise ice patches in the middle of dry tarmac in the shadows like in DR2.0 and KT WRCs.

-Physics still have question marks. I have been seeing and hearing mixed things. Mostly that it feels just like DR2.0 but with a slight improvement on tarmac, with some saying it's like a dumbed-down DR2.0. However I will not pay much attention to this anyway since I've never been a fan of DR2.0 physics, so I feel that these "influencers" and I are starting off on different pages which pretty much invalidates their impressions for me personally. It could very well be that someone who isn't a fan of DR2.0 physics has a different impression. It is what it is so we take what we can get. No one was expecting this to be any kind of pure simulator. Anyone who did is delusional.

Overall the positives seem to outweigh the negatives by far.
 
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I'm sure Mr. Broadbent is a superb driver but find his presentation style a little hard to take. Maybe I'll watch his video with the sound muted.

 
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I also have other friends who are playing it, and they say that in dry and wet gravel, it is like DR 2.0 (same) but that in wet there is even more lateral slip. The sections are beautiful. Narrow... and in my opinion with many details :)
 
ManuBicht
I also have other friends who are playing it, and they say that in dry and wet gravel, it is like DR 2.0 (same) but that in wet there is even more lateral slip. The sections are beautiful. Narrow... and in my opinion with many details :)
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I speak Spanish so I have been watching all those videos. It's crazy that about half of the videos released today are from Spaniards. And they have been talking about the physics a lot more compared to the English-speaking videos.
 
Pfei
I speak Spanish so I have been watching all those videos. It's crazy that about half of the videos released today are from Spaniards. And they have been talking about the physics a lot more compared to the English-speaking videos.
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Please share one of those videos.
 
Pfei
I speak Spanish so I have been watching all those videos. It's crazy that about half of the videos released today are from Spaniards. And they have been talking about the physics a lot more compared to the English-speaking videos.
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So what is their impressions on it? If you can/like to summarize it.

What is it that makes dr2 far from a sim?
Just trying to learn what is more realistic etc, not mean to argue what you're saying.

And how is let's say wrc10 and Gen better in real physics and replication of all these cars and responsiveness?

I really like right now the historic cars feel on finland fast bumpy stages.
They feel,,control very reasonably.

But i always felt the historic cars better up to now/recently in dr2, previous to wrc10 at least.

Just seems to still lack in inertia, momentum, and seems a little hand holding for older cars at least, like in landings, and momentum, like when braking, being too stable maybe up to wrc10.

Maybe i just find dr2 more thrilling, in challenge and sound of course.

I admit to playing more wrc10 lately than dr2 though.😁
But cars , especially older ones still in 10 don't seem as well replicated, for power curves, how it revs up on each gear, and on braking, downshift etc. Feels a little faked. I dont know.

Edit: also the clutch on old cars not well done.

I'll probably end up trying generations too when its low enough. Just too bad for the missing skidding sounds. Stil worth it i guess to try the changes from 10.

Broadbent in that last video posted of him, says its super good, but not a sim also.
I give up, i dont know.🤪😋
 
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Pfei
The biggest disappointment for me so far is that dynamic weather didn't make the cut, especially with the 20-30+km stages. So if it's raining, it rains over the whole 30+ km at a constant rate. Too bad as the dynamic weather was one of the best features of DiRT 4 and the KT WRCs.
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It looks like I might be wrong on this, and am very happy to be proven wrong. There seems to be a mid-stage weather change here:

 
Jtheripper
So what is their impressions on it? If you can/like to summarize it.
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In a nutshell Heikki says it's very similar to DR2.0 overall. Slightly improved on tarmac. On gravel grip seems a bit too high. He had some wierd moments on tarmac in a Group B though that left some bad impressions, though. Overall positive, and pretty much what he was expecting, but not sim-level (which can mean different things for different people).
Jtheripper
What is it that makes dr2 far from a sim?
Just trying to learn what is more realistic etc, not mean to argue what you're saying.
Click to expand...
IMO the two things that keep DR2.0 far from the sim realm are:

  1. Braking distances. They are way too short in most rally games. WRC5-10, DR1-2.0, SLRE, DiRT4, V-Rally4 (to name the "modern ones") have braking totally nerfed. Braking distances are probably less than half of what would be needed IRL. And the weight shift of the car does not seem to affect the car stability or your ability to set up the car for turn-in. Exceptions to this that I have experienced are RBR and WRCG where you need to make slight lifts off the brake at times to decompress the suspension and upset the stability, so that you can better position the car for the turn that you are approaching.
  2. Inertia and weight transfer. I feel the cars are too easy to rotate, lack mass & inertia, and have a "powerslide on demand" mentality that, while it can be fun, is not entirely realistic.
Keep in mind that these previous two points are what I would like to see addressed and I am not claiming that if a game does not simulate that correctly then it can't be good, however they would make the games more difficult, which is something the devs are probably trying to avoid. DR2.0 despite its simplistic and often odd physics is a very enjoyable game to drive but I always needed a lot of adjustment when going back to it after RBR/WRC10/WRCG sessions. It has a particular way of driving the cars fast which does not seem entirely intuitive to me and requires some "relearning" of how I think a car should handle.
Jtheripper
And how is let's say wrc10 and Gen better in real physics and replication of all these cars and responsiveness?
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Basically what I wrote above. Braking distances, inertia and weight transfer feel more intuitive and realistic to me in WRCG than in DR2.0. WRC10 was also good but still had the ridiculously short braking distances.
Jtheripper
But i always felt the historic cars better up to now/recently in dr2, previous to wrc10 at least.
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Historic cars are garbage in the KT WRCs.
Jtheripper
Just seems to still lack in inertia, momentum, and seems a little hand holding for older cars at least, like in landings, and momentum, like when braking, being too stable maybe up to wrc10.
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Historic cars are garbage in the KT WRCs. For the more modern ones I think I covered this above.
Jtheripper
I admit to playing more wrc10 lately than dr2 though.😁
But cars , especially older ones still in 10 don't seem as well replicated, for power curves, how it revs up on each gear, and on braking, downshift etc. Feels a little faked. I dont know.
Click to expand...
Historic cars are garbage in the KT WRCs. (can't say this enough LOL).
Jtheripper
Broadbent in that last video posted of him, says its super good, but not a sim also.
I give up, i dont know.🤪😋
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It is definitely not a sim. But who cares. We will all criticize it for various things (too easy, too hard, too arcade, too sim, too much of a compromise, graphics suck, stages are repeated, no this, no that...). There will always be complaints about things. While I would have hoped for deeper simulation value, I was not expecting it, therefore I am not disappointed and feel no need to get on a RBR high horse yelling "your rally game sucks, mine is the best" like so many juvenile and elitist sim racers do.

EA WRC has all the ingredients that point to a great game: semi-realistic handling (realistic enough for most "serious" racers, approachable enough for most "casual" racers), lots of content, great sounds, endless multiplayer replayability, photo mode, career. Overall it will be an engaging and enjoyable experience, I am sure of that. Am I disappointed it's not more on the simulation side? Yes. Will that prevent it from being a good rally "sim"? No. Not at all. Enjoy it for what it is, everyone. Rally is probably 100x more difficult to simulate than track racing, and budget constraints likely make a deep dive into rally physics an impossibility (yes, even for RBR which lacks lots of simulation elements even though the core handling model is excellent).

Just think of what would need to be done to properly simulate a rally car's behavior:

  • The core physics (the car's center of mass and how it moves and affects the rest of the dynamic model)
  • The suspension simulation
  • A complex tire model, modeling each tire individually.
  • Tire temperatures and its effect on grip and tire wear
  • Road surface type and temperature and its effect on grip and tire wear
  • Modeling grip levels that change constantly throughout a stage, depending on the surface type, camber, humidity, size and type of gravel, etc.
I doubt we will ever see anything like that. People asking for EA WRC to be like that are delusional. It's not a sim. But that's not necessarily a bad thing. Only the most elitist and arrogant of "sim racers" refuse to play a rally game because "muh arcade crap".
 
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If DR 2.0 is far from the simulation... I don't know what could be closer. If you have a cars that brakes badly, like in RBR... that is not realistic. It's hard. The urban legend is still alive... almost 20 years later. Is incredible. Because the Rally is difficult, you usually go at extreme speeds...but not there, not in those eg. not in RBR, in those permanent U-turns (it seems that is the only "difficulty" with which they were able to provide it...)

That is why we will always see that they climb on the edges of the pedestrian paths, they draw badly, they turn worse... they zigzag without rhyme or reason on the straights... all very crude... all very "RBR style". ..
What a score...then how much Dirt3 should have according to Monaco, Monte Carlo, Physics, Realism, Sound, Graphics...if they give that 86.6...and 14.1/15 in Physics...Graphics 8.3/10 ....HA HA HA...prisoners in their own trap...not even they themselves can recognize the truth amidst so much invention, exaggeration and lies...
Once they entered that, they can no longer get out, they have thousands of young people waiting for everything new that they can think of inventing.

Because let's say what it is: that is pure Hype paid for by who knows who, surely who benefits from the famous RSRBR 201....(one per year)
Let me guess...Community Host...online host....Notices and more commercial notices...Sponsors...Moders..."

Because...we don't even want to know what could happen to a REAL CAR that jumps with the rear axle like they do in RBR...irrefutable proof that these people only see what they want to see, they see a simulation where there is only Arcade Physics and see a simulator where there is only an old unfinished game from 2004. Because let's say what it is: in a real Simulator, realistic and credible Physics are as important as CONTROL!! Without this there is no realistic simulation."

Sorry xD. It just burns me to always see the same comments hahaha. It's not about anyone in particular or anything. And I have a PC. I know what I'm talking about. You can't continue covering the Sun with a finger, that's for sure. DR 2015 was a success... and DR 2.0 was a great goal for the entire squad (except on asphalt, that is).
 
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Pfei
In a nutshell Heikki says it's very similar to DR2.0 overall. Slightly improved on tarmac. On gravel grip seems a bit too high. He had some wierd moments on tarmac in a Group B though that left some bad impressions, though. Overall positive, and pretty much what he was expecting, but not sim-level (which can mean different things for different people).

IMO the two things that keep DR2.0 far from the sim realm are:

  1. Braking distances. They are way too short in most rally games. WRC5-10, DR1-2.0, SLRE, DiRT4, V-Rally4 (to name the "modern ones") have braking totally nerfed. Braking distances are probably less than half of what would be needed IRL. And the weight shift of the car does not seem to affect the car stability or your ability to set up the car for turn-in. Exceptions to this that I have experienced are RBR and WRCG where you need to make slight lifts off the brake at times to decompress the suspension and upset the stability, so that you can better position the car for the turn that you are approaching.
  2. Inertia and weight transfer. I feel the cars are too easy to rotate, lack mass & inertia, and have a "powerslide on demand" mentality that, while it can be fun, is not entirely realistic.
Keep in mind that these previous two points are what I would like to see addressed and I am not claiming that if a game does not simulate that correctly then it can't be good, however they would make the games more difficult, which is something the devs are probably trying to avoid. DR2.0 despite its simplistic and often odd physics is a very enjoyable game to drive but I always needed a lot of adjustment when going back to it after RBR/WRC10/WRCG sessions. It has a particular way of driving the cars fast which does not seem entirely intuitive to me and requires some "relearning" of how I think a car should handle.

Basically what I wrote above. Braking distances, inertia and weight transfer feel more intuitive and realistic to me in WRCG than in DR2.0. WRC10 was also good but still had the ridiculously short braking distances.

Historic cars are garbage in the KT WRCs.

Historic cars are garbage in the KT WRCs. For the more modern ones I think I covered this above.

Historic cars are garbage in the KT WRCs. (can't say this enough LOL).

It is definitely not a sim. But who cares. We will all criticize it for various things (too easy, too hard, too arcade, too sim, too much of a compromise, graphics suck, stages are repeated, no this, no that...). There will always be complaints about things. While I would have hoped for deeper simulation value, I was not expecting it, therefore I am not disappointed and feel no need to get on a RBR high horse yelling "your rally game sucks, mine is the best" like so many juvenile and elitist sim racers do.

EA WRC has all the ingredients that point to a great game: semi-realistic handling (realistic enough for most "serious" racers, approachable enough for most "casual" racers), lots of content, great sounds, endless multiplayer replayability, photo mode, career. Overall it will be an engaging and enjoyable experience, I am sure of that. Am I disappointed it's not more on the simulation side? Yes. Will that prevent it from being a good rally "sim"? No. Not at all. Enjoy it for what it is, everyone. Rally is probably 100x more difficult to simulate than track racing, and budget constraints likely make a deep dive into rally physics an impossibility (yes, even for RBR which lacks lots of simulation elements even though the core handling model is excellent).

Just think of what would need to be done to properly simulate a rally car's behavior:

  • The core physics (the car's center of mass and how it moves and affects the rest of the dynamic model)
  • The suspension simulation
  • A complex tire model, modeling each tire individually.
  • Tire temperatures and its effect on grip and tire wear
  • Road surface type and temperature and its effect on grip and tire wear
  • Modeling grip levels that change constantly throughout a stage, depending on the surface type, camber, humidity, size and type of gravel, etc.
I doubt we will ever see anything like that. People asking for EA WRC to be like that are delusional. It's not a sim. But that's not necessarily a bad thing. Only the most elitist and arrogant of "sim racers" refuse to play a rally game because "muh arcade crap".
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Thanks Pfei, appreciate the detailed reply.👍

Well, i agree on most things.
As i said too, lack of inertia, momentum, and weight transfer and instability on braking etc, are what i find as well in most of these games.

But that's what i felt seems a little better in dr2, better need of controlling the imbalance when braking, especially when not going completely straight ahead,

and on landings,

and when veering into a curve,
and braking distance, etc.

Wrc10 gets it better than previous wrc games, while being not out of whack physics i guess.
Cars seem more stable, weighty in a way, but maybe too easy to control in general.

I do like the sideways sliding in 10, especially on loose gravel.

Glad if Generations has improved on all this, looking forward to trying it.

As you said, as long as it's a fun, well done challenge, although i personally too, want good dynamic physics without hidden aids under the hood, especially if on a wheel.

And replicate each car's basic character reasonably well.
And feel of road.

That's what i mostly mean when i say hardcore sim i guess. Not mean it has to have all minute aspects super implemented.

Cheers.
 
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