Fanatec CSW/CSR Elite Modders Thread *UPDATE February 2014*

[fatkrakr]

Where do they not recommend? Maximum is generally 100% (even tho you can dial some things more) and this is something wheel should be capable of any day of the week. Lowest value is of course 0 or off. There is no point in dialing it down to not have as much fade, because then FFB is already weaker than with the fade. But if you would like, you can turn it down as much as you like. You can feel the air coming out of the wheel whether it is hot or not and can dial it according to that. Every motor fade, even these Bühlers. eKretz is just using better cooling, so it is probably not noticable. If you would use it with stock motors, you would get less fade too, but of course Fanatec can't implement such cooling in the wheel because its probably over half the size of the base.

I would like to know what settings people use. I have generally FF and For at 100 and in-game usually 60-80. Even then I have to dial it down in the wheel (in AC) sometimes, because it is still too strong. I want to feel FFB normally but not fight with it every corner. I don't understand how others drive. It seems that most want wrist breaking FFB.

On the wheel I run everything off except for 100 FF, FOR and SHO. In AC I use between 50 and 60 FFB with dampening at 5 and I think like 10 on the others. That's pretty much the same amount of FFB I use in all games.

 

[eKretz]

No there's no pump small enough to fit in the wheel base that will have enough flow and pressure to work worth a darn.

 

[ultimate]

picture of that pump?
i am currently building DIY rig and see how big is air pump if i decided to go on your mod

 

[eKretz]

I think there's pictures from others all over the last 20 pages or so. The pump itself is around 6" x6" x6" and there is an even quieter one that was discovered by @geg1020

 

[ultimate]

thx, nice concept with pump system inside box that being able to absorb noise.

 

[Cote Dazur]

When did you buy your wheel by that way?

I have my wheel since Dec 2012

 

[superslowme]

No there's no pump small enough to fit in the wheel base that will have enough flow and pressure to work worth a darn.

Ok thanks, I know the membrane pumps are big but was not sure about those piston driver air pumps, looks quite small in some pics but probably an illusion. Smart to use quick release for the wheel base though, did not know that until I read some page further back.

 

[vittorio]

Is it possible to get the cooling tubes out through the small gap on top of the wheel so there is no need to drill two holes on the back? I'm thinking of maybe selling my CSR-E later on ebay (better there are no holes) and buying a CSW (with broken motors) later on ebay and mod this.

 

[eKretz]

Not likely unless you install longer spacers to make the gap bigger but that part you would handle at home. The holes ordinarily need to be drilled by you since I won't have your wheel. If you want to try something else go for it! Just be careful not to pinch the tubing and reduce airflow.

 

[Blue028]

after a late night last night i got my paddle shifters all wired up and running well, but today....



pretty sure one of the motors is cooked

 

[eKretz]

More details! Is this the same set of motors you were running without cooling for a while? Are you running your new power supply or the stock one? Did you test these motors for stall and no-load current before you installed them? Time to check them again and see if they're different/excessive.

 

[Blue028]

they are the same motors i used without cooling yes, its running on the 10A PSU but im not sure how to test the current of the motors. one thing i noticed when i had the wheel apart lastnight was that one of the airlines inside the wheel was slightly kinked reducing the air flow to one of the motors. i trimmed it back a little to try avoid more kinking. is there a way you make sure that yours dont kink once you put the cover on?

 

[Blue028]

after letting the motors cool down for a bit i started driving on lfs again with the FF on 20, then cranked it up to 100 for a few laps and didnt cut out. strange, would the heat inside of the motors affect how much current they draw?

i know either my PS is dodgy or the motors are burning up (im leaning towards the later), in the wheels property page if i hit the tedt FFB button while holding the wheel it will shut down every time.

 

[eKretz]

I supplied your tubes a little longer than I use them so you could cut them to fit after you installed in case you wanted to put them in another area than I did. If you haven't already, cut them so they're just long enough to reach but long enough you can still install them. If you have a multimeter you can test them for stall current that way. They are just a little bit over 4A when in good condition. If you overheated yours at any point you could possibly have burned the insulation and gotten a short in the armature. It's also possible that the power supply is dodgy, but without an electronic load you probably won't be able to test that.

 

[Blue028]

i did trim the tubes down quiet a bit when i first installed them but still wasnt enough, i can only just push them on atm. ill have to read up on how to measure the A, i only know how to measure voltage and temperature, will post the results up when i get them

 

[eKretz]

Just put your multimeter inline with one of the motor wires to test the amperage. One lead to the power supply and one lead to the motor. The other motor wire directly to the other power supply wire. Make sure your multimeter leads are in the right jacks to measure amperage and set your dial on the multimeter to measure DC amperage, then hold the motor shaft stationary and apply power long enough to get a stable reading.

 

[Cote Dazur]

Question about the amperage. I think I understand that to be on the safe side wheel manufacturer will use a lower amperage power supply than the maximum stall of the motors. So if the total a stall A for both motor is 8 amp should the max amperage of the power supply be less?

 

[eKretz]

If you go less there is the risk of pulling the voltage down and shutting off the wheel. That is what it appears is happening to Blue028. The amperage can always be limited by dropping the FF setting if you want to limit it. Again, I have run a pair of these motors unlimited for over a year with no issues and a second pair for the last few months, along with several pairs of motors other guys are running with no limit, often for hours-long races, with no issues. One area that may be of concern I'd say is running with no cooling, which I've already noted. Especially it seems with games from the GT5 and possibly GT6 series, as they seem to run the motors hotter for whatever reason.

Steve - should have thought of/mentioned this earlier - why don't you just unplug your motors from the PCB and check the resistance across the motor terminals. That will give you a rough idea of the stall current you're reaching using I=V/R. Plug in your 24 for V, the resistance in ohms for R, and solve for I to get your theoretical stall amperage.

 

[Blue028]

im not sure how to do that either think i figured it out, top motor is measuring 5.5, bottom motor ar 4.8 ohms. so theoretical stall amperage would be for the top motor 4.36 and bottom motor 5

 

[Blue028]

the ohms readings seemed to be quite unstable in the first measurment i took, and the motors were still warm after use.
letting them cool down for a bit i measured it again; top motor seems to be holding around 4.6 ohms (I=5.21)and bottom motor still seems to be about 4.8 ohms. (I=5)

one of the terminals was broken of in transit on the top motor (hence why they where sending me replacements) but i managed to get some solder int the remaining peice of it and got a conection, maybe this cased a bit of a dodgy read the first time because i didnt get a good contact?

 

[eKretz]

Those are pretty close to good to go. It looks like you're just probably approaching the limits of your power supply. The ohm readings will always be a little iffy, since you're measuring resistance across the brushes - any little movement at all will change the reading. That's why if you want a really precise number you need to actually measure the amperage. But it gives you a ballpark number to check for any major issues. So it looks to me like your motors are OK. Your power supply just might not be able to keep up.

 

[Blue028]

would having the volts cranked to 27.5 affect the stall current?

 

[eKretz]

Yup! Drop it back to 24 and it should work again. That would definitely cause your problem. The power supplies are rated in overall power - watts. So if you have a 240 watt supply you are going to run out of power if you're pushing it at 27V. At 24V u have an available 10A before voltage will be pulled down, but at 27V you only have 8.9A. When the voltage gets dropped too far your wheel's electronics are starved and it's shutting off.

Try it out and let us know what happens!

 

[Blue028]

so if i switched to a 36v 10a PSU and dial the volts down i should get even more amps?
i really preffer the feel with a bit more voltage than 24, i would even like to test 36v as you seem pretty happy with it.
im just putting the wheel back together and turn the volts down and see what happens

edit: its still cutting out under high load i think i might just upgrade the psu, the one i have was only a cheap china one so im starting to think its not very good quality

 

[eKretz]

Yup in many cases. Crapper supplies might not be able to keep up - check the ratings. Some are rated as 36V OR 10A and some are rated with some headroom in their wattage window. That would be a 360 watt supply. But the "more amps" would just be in headroom - your motors will only draw what they draw at stall. So even if you had a supply capable of 500A your motors would only ever draw their stall current, not 500A. If you want to run 36V I suggest adding some extra cooling or sticking to short stints - don't try to run any endurance races without at least an extra heat sink on the back side of the board (be careful you don't get a short here or you'll cook your board like I did!) and possibly chilling the air going into the motors. And absolutely limit your FF to 80 or 90 maximum. If you want to try 36V you'll need to get more like a 12-15A supply though. Make sure you have your temp sensor on and functional also to act as insurance for your motors.

 

[ultimate]

FF from in-game setting?

 

[Blue028]

yeah i only wanted to have that extra bit of amp as headroom, just so im not pushing it to the limit like i am atm.
hopfully with a 36 volt supply ill be able to drop the volts to 30 or a tad lower

just had an idea to make sure it is the power supply not keeping up, ill hook my stock one back up and see how that goes and see if its more consistent

are you asking me ultimate?

 

[ultimate]

yes both of you, dunno if you both talked about wheel settings or in-game settings

 

[Blue028]

i think Eric was refering to the wheel settings when he suggested 80 or 90 ff max on 36V.

i found a meanwell 27v 13a power supply that shoud do me perfectly. i think my problem is with the cheap power supply, it seems to be once it gets hot it wont operate properly, once its cooled down it seems to work again, and there is no fan or anything to keep it cool or to help regulate the temperature.

 

[eKretz]

Yup wheel settings. And I'm glad to see that the possible motor issue was a false alarm. Now you know why I recommend the Meanwell supply in most cases.