Formula 1 Pirelli British Grand Prix 2020Formula 1

[SlowGrayAudi]

Which is fine if you want random racing and aren't concerned with how it's achieved, but personally I find the BoP'd nature of GT racing, and the behind-the-scenes boost medelling in the BTCC, to have tainted the racing somewhat. It's kinda interesting, but not properly enjoyable when it's arrived at artifically.

How would you otherwise go about leveling the field for close racing for all the teams?

 

[Roo]

How would you otherwise go about leveling the field for close racing for all the teams?

I wouldn't. I'd set a rulebook, and a fairly relaxed one at that, with a series that had a varying length of races and weekend formats. Think modern day Can-Am.

It'll never happen, and I fully accept that, because it would price itself out of existence and the tracks wouldn't be able to keep safety levels of the ever increasing pace, but it would be awesome while it lasted.

 

[MatskiMonk]

Which is fine if you want random racing and aren't concerned with how it's achieved

Random's a bit harsh. Generally speaking the cream still rises to the top by virtue of being the best, but the journey to the result is far closer in terms of the competitive element.

but not properly enjoyable when it's arrived at artifically.

I'm not sure it's any more 'artificial' than dominance due to machinery in F1, personally. Do we think Valteri Bottas is genuinely the second fastest driver the sport has to offer, or does it just look that way because he's in the best car on the grid?

 

[FutureF1]

That was the most demoralising end to a session... 6 freaking years for the rest of the grid to catch Mercedes and they’re at the gap they had in 2014. It’s a joke

 

[evldave333]

That was the most demoralising end to a session... 6 freaking years for the rest of the grid to catch Mercedes and they’re at the gap they had in 2014. It’s a joke

The issue isnt Mercedes, its Ferrari and Red Bull who's development has gone backwards they posted slower qualifying times today than they did last year... Ferrari have so much funding and what do they do with it?

 

[FutureF1]

The issue isnt Mercedes, its Ferrari and Red Bull who's development has gone backwards they posted slower qualifying times today than they did last year... Ferrari have so much funding and what do they do with it?

Oh I agree. I can’t fault Mercedes for having intelligent people work for them. Doesn’t change the fact that they have played a major hand in, imo, ruining the sport. I still watch for the hope that the other teams will wake up and I’m a fan for life, but days like today remind me why I started watching other forms of racing a few years back. Hamilton and Bottas just need to show up to the track and they’re guaranteed a front row start. There’s no excitement in the championship battle

 

[GTFan24]

You know F1 is not in a good state when the only way to fight for a title is to have one of the two seats in Mercedes

 

[evldave333]

Gotta say im really enjoying every minute of it, the last few seasons have had superb high quality racing thinking back to last year... Monza, Austria, Canada, Brazil, Hungary and the watersplash wreckfest that was Hockenheim. Ferrari Vs Mercedes has been epic in the last two years, they sadly have dropped off because they were corrupt last year... You should be grateful we have any racing at all this year, really you should. To say that Mercedes just turn up and win is so oversimplified its genuinely funny. We have reached this situation because Mercedes pushed almost to breaking point chasing Ferrari 2019 engine cheat mode, Ferrari get found out and here we are... Credit were credit is due Mercedes are the shining light of F1, they were the kings of unreliability not so long ago...

 

[PeterJB]

I do wonder if there's something in the Mercedes we don't know about. No team has ever been this far ahead of the rest of the grid without some kind of pioneering component such as venturi tunnels or active suspension, and DAS doesn't gain you a second per lap.

 

[evldave333]

I do wonder if there's something in the Mercedes we don't know about. No team has ever been this far ahead of the rest of the grid without some kind of pioneering component such as venturi tunnels or active suspension, and DAS doesn't gain you a second per lap.

I get the feeling DAS isnt just about heating the tyres, with it gone next year with the same power unit we might get a read on it. The Mercs seem really fast through the medium and high speed corners and this might be DAS giving the front wheels more footprint / grip. The worry for the none Merc fans is that with such an innovative team there they may just come up with the best package for the new regs in 2022 as well...

 

[EngieDiesel]

Albon is done at RBR.

Christian Horner doesn't seem to think that way.

Albon joined Red Bull midway through last season as a replacement for Pierre Gasly - who was slotted back in to Toro Rosso after his own struggles in the senior team - and Horner was asked this week if he was happy with the Thai driver, given he has so far failed to match his team mate for pace or results.

"I think there has been criticism of Alex, which in some ways has been unwarranted and unfair," he said.

"If you look back to the first race in Austria, through strategy he was in a position to arguably win that race and was taken out by Lewis Hamilton and he finished fourth in the next race and fifth in the next race.

"We know the car we have provided our drivers with this year isn’t optimised and it has had some difficult characteristics and for a driver that doesn’t have experience, he’s only just had over a year’s worth of Formula 1 experience, that’s a tough call.

"But the way he has handled the situation, the way he has handled the pressure has been impressive. And I think he just needs time and we’re doing our best to support him as much as we can and things like the experience of the race engineer he’s now working with will only compound that."

So they acknowledge that the car has fundamental issues this year, which we've certainly been seeing evidence of lately.

 

[GTFan24]

I do wonder if there's something in the Mercedes we don't know about. No team has ever been this far ahead of the rest of the grid without some kind of pioneering component such as venturi tunnels or active suspension, and DAS doesn't gain you a second per lap.

If RB and Ferrari dare to even protest the Merc, the entire F1 fanbase will call them "Crybabies"

 

[BrainsBush]

Russell 5 place grid penalty... was not told by his team to abort a lap.

 

[evldave333]

If RB and Ferrari dare to even protest the Merc, the entire F1 fanbase will call them "Crybabies"

We've already had a RB DAS protest.

 

[evldave333]

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/...verstone-pole-and.3TSkcnVzldV9GkiVv5K45L.html

Comparison of 2013 / 2020 Hamilton Silverstone qualifying laps, crazy how much extra speed there is now after 7 years development...

 

[Dreadmed]

The worry for the none Merc fans is that with such an innovative team there they may just come up with the best package for the new regs in 2022 as well...

That there is. I'd already written off this year and next as a Lewis/Mercedes cakewalk and that was only reinforced over the first 2 weekends in Austria, that car is just untouchable. I wouldn't even mind if they came up with the best package come 2022, just as long as it's by 1 tenth instead of 1 second...

There's a bit of hope however, Ferrari seem to be putting their eggs in the 2022 basket as a return to competing for wins and development team leaders at Merc have started to drift away to pastures new. Coupled with Bottas possibly being swapped out and it starts to look a bit more interesting again (imo).

 

[Jimlaad43]

Ferrari's cheating engine last year forced Mercedes to work harder to stay ahead. They did, and Mercedes were suddenly left miles ahead of Ferrari and everyone else when the FIA did what they did.

Mercedes aren't just winning because they're outspending the rest, they are truly the best team on the grid. They have the best driver and team galvaniser in Lewis Hamilton and the winning mentality. Even in today's interview, Toto Wolff is still saying "we don't think we've won the championship. We take every race as it comes and try to win the race, rather than focusing on the bigger picture." That's the same mentality that Liverpool have used to great effect in the Premier League - taking it one game at a time. Ferrari are a championship focused team which is why they keep bottling it.

Mercedes dominance is all on merit. This is nothing like the Ferrari dominance at all. That was a company bullying the FIA to make the rules so they could win, partnering with Bridgestone to make tyres that only suited them, and a team that spent their entire time pounding around their private test track with a star driver and a contracted whipping boy.

Mercedes are using spec tyres, fighting against Ferrari's veto, can't test anywhere and have always had two drivers allowed to fight that only use team orders when absolutely necessary, and are always embarrassed about having to do it.

Mercedes got the car design philosophy correct - long wheelbase and low rake - at the start and keep developing it. Stable regulations should converge at the end - which the midfield are doing - and this is exceptional engineering from Mercedes to keep ahead.

If you don't like it, we could always go back to there being too much COVID around and F1 not racing. The choice is simple - Mercedes dominance or no F1. Choose. Be thankful it's back and at least enjoy the fact that this car is breaking lap records again and again. The onboards of the W11 are extraordinary and its a glory to watch. It's quick and its driveable, enjoy the lap times while they last. It's not ideal and a Barcelona 2016 moment wouldn't be met with much derision, but you've just got to accept its happening and try to find something to enjoy about it, because there is plenty else this season that is spectacular.

 

[evldave333]

Coupled with Bottas possibly being swapped out and it starts to look a bit more interesting again (imo).

Its unlikely to happen, but a Seb Vs Hamilton in team battle would be tasty next year (I do miss the intensity of the Rosberg / Hamilton battles)

 

[McLaren]

I do wonder if there's something in the Mercedes we don't know about. No team has ever been this far ahead of the rest of the grid without some kind of pioneering component such as venturi tunnels or active suspension, and DAS doesn't gain you a second per lap.

Wasn't it originally attributed to their turbo system?

If RB and Ferrari dare to even protest the Merc, the entire F1 fanbase will call them "Crybabies"

Have you seen the Ferrari fans at the biggest online Ferrari community? They are cry babies who dog on Lewis for anything he does & call him Elton; there's a 141-page thread called, Lewis 'Elton' Hamilton sucks. "It's the car, Lewis couldn't race anywhere else." "Lewis racing for Ferrari? I'd rather die, he'd tarnish the name". If they're not dogging Lewis, they're accusing Mercedes of buying off the FIA.

The only time they reflect on Ferrari's own lack of success is by piling on Vettel even when ****ing Charles creates the mistake. Everything else? Mercedes' cheats & Lewis only good b/c they cheat.

 

[Jimlaad43]

Everything else? Mercedes' cheats & Lewis only good b/c they cheat.

 

[PeterJB]

Wasn't it originally attributed to their turbo system?

Like Red Bull in the V8 era, they seem to have the advantage in cornering speeds rather than outright power.

 

[McLaren]

Like Red Bull in the V8 era, they seem to have the advantage in cornering speeds rather than outright power.

You're right. I was thinking of their split-turbo design that got a a lot of praise, but forgot that's quite old now by F1 tech.

 

[TenEightyOne]

If they're not dogging Lewis

I'm curious about what this means in the US. I can't imagine it means the same thing as in the UK - it would be tremendously difficult to get a private jet into a layby on the A34, especially in darker mistier weather.

 

[McLaren]

I'm curious about what this means in the US. I can't imagine it means the same thing as in the UK - it would be tremendously difficult to get a private jet into a layby on the A34, especially in darker mistier weather.

Needlessly criticize.

Although the amount of folks who dog pile Lewis & repeat each others' insults, the UK definition might still be applicable.

 

[PzR Slim]

Maybe you and Dave can get your panties wet together over Hamiltons new jeans and ride the MB bandwagon straight to his house

I want F1 to be entertaining. It is not at the moment. The slimmer of entertainment there is, is only because the midfield teams are somehow close in performance. The top TEAM (yes theres only one now) is NOT entertaining to watch

 

[-Fred-]

Ferrari's cheating engine last year forced Mercedes to work harder to stay ahead. They did, and Mercedes were suddenly left miles ahead of Ferrari and everyone else when the FIA did what they did.

Mercedes aren't just winning because they're outspending the rest, they are truly the best team on the grid. They have the best driver and team galvaniser in Lewis Hamilton and the winning mentality. Even in today's interview, Toto Wolff is still saying "we don't think we've won the championship. We take every race as it comes and try to win the race, rather than focusing on the bigger picture." That's the same mentality that Liverpool have used to great effect in the Premier League - taking it one game at a time. Ferrari are a championship focused team which is why they keep bottling it.

Mercedes dominance is all on merit. This is nothing like the Ferrari dominance at all. That was a company bullying the FIA to make the rules so they could win, partnering with Bridgestone to make tyres that only suited them, and a team that spent their entire time pounding around their private test track with a star driver and a contracted whipping boy.

Mercedes are using spec tyres, fighting against Ferrari's veto, can't test anywhere and have always had two drivers allowed to fight that only use team orders when absolutely necessary, and are always embarrassed about having to do it.

Mercedes got the car design philosophy correct - long wheelbase and low rake - at the start and keep developing it. Stable regulations should converge at the end - which the midfield are doing - and this is exceptional engineering from Mercedes to keep ahead.

If you don't like it, we could always go back to there being too much COVID around and F1 not racing. The choice is simple - Mercedes dominance or no F1. Choose. Be thankful it's back and at least enjoy the fact that this car is breaking lap records again and again. The onboards of the W11 are extraordinary and its a glory to watch. It's quick and its driveable, enjoy the lap times while they last. It's not ideal and a Barcelona 2016 moment wouldn't be met with much derision, but you've just got to accept its happening and try to find something to enjoy about it, because there is plenty else this season that is spectacular.

As I said in the Hungarian thread, the team structure and stability is, IMO, the biggest difference between Mercedes, Ferrari and RedBull. Look at the team structures since 2014

Ferrari: Domenicalli, Mattiaci, Arrivebene, Binotto... Raikonnen, Vettel, Leclerc, Alonso, Sainz*

And at Redbull: Vettel, Ricciardo, Kvyat, Gasly, Verstappen, Albon... Renault, Honda.

Meanwhile at Mercedes: Wolff has been there since the start, Paddy Lowe left the team in 2017, to be replaced by James Allison who's been there ever since... Hamilton's been there since 2013, Rosberg retired at the end of 2016 and has been replaced by Bottas, who's still there and most likely will stay at least another season.

It's hard to get a good recipe when you keep on switching the ingredients around.

Edit: Mercedes(duh) and Mclaren(!) are the only two teams to have both their cars in Q3 in every round so far this season.

 

[Dreadmed]

The onboards of the W11 are extraordinary and its a glory to watch.

I'm not going to argue with that whatsoever. Kobayashi going through the Porche curves a couple years back like they weren't even there was one thing, but seeing the W11 tearing around the Hungaroring... what I would give to see that thing going full tilt in person this weekend.

If you don't like it, we could always go back to there being too much COVID around and F1 not racing. The choice is simple - Mercedes dominance or no F1. Choose.

Or the third option, just disengage. People tune in to watch for different reasons, I'm among those who would just like to see a genuine fight for the title (or failing that, race wins) which in all likelihood won't be happening this year. You just had to listen to Horner during Quali this afternoon on C4 after Bottas posted his first lap in Q2, he was flabbergasted. Yes, the midfield is entertaining enough at present, but at the end of the day the overall goal of a race is to finish first. I imagine it's what a good chunk of viewers out there with no real affiliation look out for, and when it's the same team/person winning again, and again, and again (a la Schumacher '04, Vettel '13) that viewer base is going to get bored with the proceedings. The screeching from those who DO have affiliations though... eugh.

Its unlikely to happen, but a Seb Vs Hamilton in team battle would be tasty next year (I do miss the intensity of the Rosberg / Hamilton battles)

I was thinking more of when Russell's contract expires he might be parachuted into the second car, that would be 5 years for Bottas as a solid #2 at Merc unless Lewis has another epiphany and jumps ship before '22.

 

[numbnuts70]

Norris besting Sainz by, nigh on, 2 tenths moves him into the rarefied air of Hamilton, Ricciardo and Verstappen on raw pace.

Strulovic needs more love as a driver too.

Leclerc smashed Vettel

Ocon is doing a damn sight better than other understudys' that I could mention.

Race results tomorrow should be....gotta consult that crystal ball but,

I'd rather not too much political 'kneeness' tho, keep that for Parliament.

 

[evldave333]

I was thinking more of when Russell's contract expires he might be parachuted into the second car, that would be 5 years for Bottas as a solid #2 at Merc unless Lewis has another epiphany and jumps ship before '22.

Agreed Russell would be a better rival for Lewis competitively he's been driving the wheels off the williams every time he gets in it. That combo would also have the nice transition going on as Lewis inevitably wanes and Russell develops further...

 

[numbnuts70]

Russell's not had much top spec F1 competition yet but yes, it's looking like he's maybe on the elite level, like Alonso in the Minardi.

Ch4 interview with M Webber and S Vettel was a bit cringy to say the least.

Both come across as top blokes though.