Forza 3: Leaving A Delayed GT 5 In The Pits

[sejtur]

In retrospect there is a few features that GT seemed to have been "influenced by" FM, the racing line comes to mind.

GT4 had a racing line I thought?

It is more reasonable to say they're a bit pushed by forza to get damage. But then again, PD already said way before forza was born that GT would get damage. Plus, you can say that GT5P pushed forza in respect to the interiors.

 

[Jay]

GT had a racing line from GT1 and GT2 had basic mechanical damage.

 

[Nomino]

Got my 250GB Forza 3 bundle all pre-ordered. All you losers saying that you will never buy an Xbox 360, even if your life depended on it...whatever You go twiddle your thumbs for the next 6 - 9 months.

 

[killanite]

Got my 250GB Forza 3 bundle all pre-ordered. All you losers saying that you will never buy an Xbox 360, even if your life depended on it...whatever You go twiddle your thumbs for the next 6 - 9 months.

Contrary to what you believe, My life and the lives of many members of this forum do not revolve around a single game.. We have many things to do for the next 6 - 9 months .

 

[Gejost]

Contrary to what you believe, My life and the lives of many members of this forum do not revolve around a single game.. We have many things to do for the next 6 - 9 months .

Yup, using our thumbs to play other games.

 

[phil-t]

I think the article is fair, it's not berating GT5 in anyway, it recognises that there are some obvious graphical flourishes in GT that will always make it have appeal to many, but it does underpin the fact that look past the graphics (that have as many obviouos flaws as any other game), and the substance underneath is not looking to be any better then it's rival..

I can't wait for both, having 6 months to enjoy FM is going to be great, then having an equally impressive new game to sink my teeth into will mean I just get more quality time with 2 quality games...

 

[Jay]

and the substance underneath is not looking to be any better then it's rival..

Thats the problem, "looking", thesixthaxis has no idea and neither do we what GT5 has in store. I see this point in time now roughly the same point FM3 was in at E3, roughly 6 months to release (little less with FM3 at E3) and a outline of the basic core elements e.g. car count, online modes etc. So it isn't right to compare a couple games and come to a conclusion when one is close to launch that we know a great deal about and the other game that is only in the starting stages of PR revealing.

 

[phil-t]

Thats the problem, "looking", thesixthaxis has no idea and neither do we what GT5 has in store. I see this point in time now roughly the same point FM3 was in at E3, roughly 6 months to release (little less with FM3 at E3) and a outline of the basic core elements e.g. car count, online modes etc. So it isn't right to compare a game close to launch that we know a great deal about to a game that is only in the starting stages of PR revealing.

I'd say that PD need to step up and release more information, the fact they are not forthcoming with actual 'facts' means that comparisons will be made on what is 'known' so far.

It's as bad to assume they have more as to assume they have less, but either way, comparisons will be drawn, and it's upto PD/Sony to ensure they release enough information to make sure they favour as well as they can.

Why are they not releasing 'some' information, enough 'bullet points' to ensure they don't get represented unfairly?

Bottom line, T10 at 5 months prior to launch gave a ton of bullet point information to allow some comparisons to be made, 400 cars, 20+ tracks, 115+ Variations, Drift, Drag, P2P, Livery, Online and improved physics/AI and some details on the improvements (rammed down our throats in a patronising way of course)..

We actually knew far more, as a leak told us a very detailed list of what was in and out, this was known well before E3, so PD should know exactly what is in/out at this stage, they are far too close to release to work on anything new or unexpected.

 

[AAscooter]

Obviously your a youngster who isn't familiar with the GT franchise.

No, i'm not a youngster.

I own and i've played every single GT.

There is always a chance that GT5 could be atrocious. Yes, that chance is minuscule, but you don't need to be an so naive and ignorant.

Yes which is why GT4 sold 13 million copies and GT5P (demo) sold more copies than FM2!

Seriously its Turn 10 who should thank PD because if it wasn't for Gran Turismo Forza wouldn't excist and Dan Greenawalt has said as much.

You totally missed the point.

I was talking about the quality of the game all post and then you bring sales into it.

I never knew that sales indicated the quality of the game....

 

[Jay]

I'd say that PD need to step up and release more information, the fact they are not forthcoming with actual 'facts' means that comparisons will be made on what is 'known' so far.

They have 6 months to release, thats quite a while, like turn 10 they will probably keep trickling information out until they get close to release. That is assuming PD are taking this date seriously.

Now GT PSP is about to launch, Shift has launched and FM3 is finalised they have the freedom to go about with GT5's PR as they feel fit.

It's as bad to assume they have more as to assume they have less

I completely agree.

 

[Robin]

Of course, Turn 10 have been bullish from the start – Forza Game Director Dan Greenwalt is on record saying that they “have taken the genre to new levels and [Polyphony] have stopped evolving the genre… I’d say the differentiator is they’re old school,” backing that up with the sentiment that “no game competes [with] us right now.” Regardless of visual fidelity or willy waving amounts of cars, he’s now absolutely right – if you want an in-depth racing simulation on a console this side of next Spring you’re going to have to plump for an Xbox 360 and a copy of Forza 3, which has played so nicely in the hands of Microsoft it’s like a dream come true.

Regarding the comment that GT hasnt evolved the genre I slightly agree. The reason why is because GT seems to have always been a 'play it yourself' game which has never really embraced the community element. Now you could place some of the blame on the PS2's poor online system but if you look at even Forza 1 it still has more community features than PD has shown now at TGS!

As is stands we cant say that in the next 6 months PD wont equal F3 but from the angle PD is taking it seems like they are not going to attempt that level of community features and it will be another traditional GT game, this time with online. I really dont see things like the livery editor, marketplace etc etc equaling F3, I really dont. Only time will tell.

What is more amazing is that Turn 10 has managed to do all this in 2 years which begs the question what has PD been doing for 5 years, I hope the answer isnt mostly GTPSP! Yes GT5 looks great but I can just see the mainstream gaming market saying 'whats the new feature'?

Saying GT finally has online and damage might not cut it for the non fan market.

Robin.

 

[seinfeld]

well it seems like they like Forza's AI from all the GT vids over last month or so I have always found all the AI does in GT is stay on preferred racing line they don't block, and if ur slow out of a corner they just bump you like they arnt really there

so I give forza a big thumbs up if the AI in the full game blocks, and will almost run itself off a cliff to beat you that will be a major major tipping point for me to buy forza instead. because I found in GT4 all the licenses and races got quite boring because of the lack of challenging drivers (AI) so Poly stuff me around Digital would want to get the AI right in this installment. I am this close to kicking Sony and GT out of my house, all they have to do is stuff 1 thing up , that is how thin the ice is between them and me at the moment, and I wont lie the lack of communication and now the push back of the release date has put me into this defacto state.
I mean look at turn 10, Microsoft/ Forza, I haven't even been searching for info on it, yet I see an add here and there, I see features being released without anyone asking them. I mean this is the way a game with die hard fans needs to be ran, that is ultimate respect right there
Microsoft's stock just went up a notch in my book, its now at 3
1 point for great Public Relations
1 point for on time and having a game full of features
1 point for really giving it a good crack at making a awesome game

 

[phil-t]

They have 6 months to release, thats quite a while, like turn 10 they will probably keep trickling information out until they get close to release. That is assuming PD are taking this date seriously.

Now GT PSP is about to launch, Shift has launched and FM3 is finalised they have the freedom to go about with GT5's PR as they feel fit.

I guess GT Mobile has been a possible cause for lack of information..

Like many developers, T10 did a reasonable job of PR at the start (ignoring idiotic 'claims'), they did release all the bullet point information up front, and trickled the 'detail' later.. they did this 5 months prior to release, PD are at the 6 months prior to release stage, TGS was where we expected the information, it's actually quite odd that they where so guarded releasing only car/track count which people are still arguing over translation..

 

[Shaggy Alonso]

To be honest, although MS obviously have an advantage over Sony with the release dates, everyone's talking as if most PS3 owners are actually going to go out and buy an Xbox just to play Forza 3. Sure, some people will but surely the vast majority of people stick to one console. The xbox is great, but there's no way I could justify going out and buying one when I already have a PS3. But equally, if some people do this, there will undoubtedly then be people who buy a PS3 just to sample GT5.

 

[Jay]

Like many developers, T10 did a reasonable job of PR at the start (ignoring idiotic 'claims'), they did release all the bullet point information up front, and trickled the 'detail' later.. they did this 5 months prior to release, PD are at the 6 months prior to release stage, TGS was where we expected the information, it's actually quite odd that they where so guarded releasing only car/track count which people are still arguing over translation..

As you say, GT has 6 months to go and forza started PR at the 5 month mark. The news that leaked on the official website was clearly for Gamescom which I assume they where going start the PR train but changed their minds as the date probably got pushed back then at last minute.

In my eyes it is a little too early to be throwing too much info, it seemed fine when we expected a 2009 release but now we will have to hold tight a bit longer as the game isn't competing in FM3's timeframe anymore so direct comparisions are never going to be accurate yet.

 

[Blitz187]

Got my 250GB Forza 3 bundle all pre-ordered. All you losers saying that you will never buy an Xbox 360, even if your life depended on it...whatever You go twiddle your thumbs for the next 6 - 9 months.

Fortunately, unlike you it seems, I have a life in the real world and I have plenty to do for the next 6-9 months, my life doesnt revolve around consoles and games, even though it is a BIG hobby of mine... I have a console already as well so I dont need an Xbox... which again gives me reason to say this:


I will never, ever, ever, ever buy an Xbox... at this point in time, EVEN IF MY LIFE DEPENDED ON IT...

Have fun playing FM3 though.. maybe give us a review in the FM3 section 👍

 

[Nomino]

Contrary to what you believe, My life and the lives of many members of this forum do not revolve around a single game.. We have many things to do for the next 6 - 9 months .

Contrary to what I believe?! My statement was general, not targeted.

In direct response though, quite evidently, neither do mine, given that I'm getting a 360 to play Forza III while we wait for GT5. That's two games right there. Two > singular. Such ill-thought out responses like that just show how childish most people are being about it all. Is it a crime to buy a competitors sim-racing game because you haven't really got one in your collection, and expected better news from PD? Grow up. Also, since when does playing a racing game imply that I have nothing else to do with my life for the next 6 - 9 months?

If GT5 is so unimportant to you, what are you doing on these forums in the first place, and worse, bothering to make posts?

 

[killanite]

Contrary to what I believe?! My statement was general, not targeted.

In direct response though, quite evidently, neither do mine, given that I'm getting a 360 to play Forza III while we wait for GT5. That's two games right there. Two > singular. Such ill-thought out responses like that just show how childish most people are being about it all. Is it a crime to buy a competitors sim-racing game because you haven't really got one in your collection, and expected better news from PD? Grow up. Also, since when does playing a racing game imply that I have nothing else to do with my life for the next 6 - 9 months?

If GT5 is so unimportant to you, what are you doing on these forums in the first place, and worse, bothering to make posts?

Never said that GT5 is not important to me, I said my life didn't revolve around it.. There is a big difference between the two.
Ill thought-out response? You were the one trolling by calling people who refuse to buy a 360 losers, Especially when the reason they don't want to buy a 360 is not Forza 3 but rather the crapness of the xbox itself and the fact that they alredy have consoles. People don't dislike Forza, They dislike the xbox, some don't even dislike the xbox but rather don't want to have another console.

It's you who should grow up... This isn't about buying competitor sims, I buy all the sims I can on the PC (and I don't have either console atm because my xbox(s) fried ages ago and waiting to buy a PS3 in the near future)

Also I never said you had nothing better to do for the next 6 - 9 months so I don't know what you're reading. I believe I said I have other things to do

 

[ST-2]

Contrary to what I believe?! My statement was general, not targeted.

In direct response though, quite evidently, neither do mine, given that I'm getting a 360 to play Forza III while we wait for GT5. That's two games right there. Two > singular. Such ill-thought out responses like that just show how childish most people are being about it all. Is it a crime to buy a competitors sim-racing game because you haven't really got one in your collection, and expected better news from PD? Grow up. Also, since when does playing a racing game imply that I have nothing else to do with my life for the next 6 - 9 months?

If GT5 is so unimportant to you, what are you doing on these forums in the first place, and worse, bothering to make posts?

Nomino, you instigated it by saying:

Got my 250GB Forza 3 bundle all pre-ordered. All you losers saying that you will never buy an Xbox 360, even if your life depended on it...whatever You go twiddle your thumbs for the next 6 - 9 months.

Now, really, this topic should be in the other games section of the forum, and its fairly obvious it would turn into a flame war from the title.

Now Nomino, I'm not sure if you've noticed, but you are actually in a Gran Turismo forum, and most of us don't give a rats ass if you're getting Forza. It won't make me loose any sleep... And calling us all losers? Yeah, your the one of a Gran Turismo forum, telling us how great you think Forza is... just think about that for a while...

 

[phil-t]

Now Nomino, I'm not sure if you've noticed, but you are actually in a Gran Turismo forum, and most of us don't give a rats ass if you're getting Forza.

it's worse then that, he's not noticed he's in a very fanboy orientated Gran Turismo forum that shows a huge dislike of anything non-GT or Sony related.



Of course this thread is going to in-cite.. Of course it shouldn't, if people can't accept that FM3 is a good alternative to GT5 despite the blinding 'facts' and testimonials, what do you expect...

Liking both for different reasons I spend far more time having to 'defend' sillyness about FM on GT forums then I do sillyness about GT on FM forums...

So I often get called a fanboy/troll by both sides at times.. I'm not interested in which side of a 'war' I am fighting for, I do my own fighting for my own causes, not Sony or MS's..

 

[El Drifto]

it's worse then that, he's not noticed he's in a very fanboy orientated Gran Turismo forum that shows a huge dislike of anything non-GT or Sony related.

Wrong.
If it was a fanboy orientated forum why is there a whole topic regarding Forza 3 and a whole section dedicated to NFS: Shift?

 

[KENJIusa]

I will never, ever, ever, ever buy an Xbox... at this point in time, EVEN IF MY LIFE DEPENDED ON IT...

I really hope that my life won't have to depend on something undependable like the 360.

I would be willing to upgrade my PC and get forza3 if it's coming out on PC, but buy an 360, no, too much trouble.

 

[Pierced Lead]

it's worse then that, he's not noticed he's in a very fanboy orientated Gran Turismo forum that shows a huge dislike of anything non-GT or Sony related.

Supporters of something will undoubtedly oppose its competition, you could say so for some members of this forum, but its no different from any other forum of a particular topic. But I think thats different from 'dislike'

 

[H3avyM3tal]

Does allegiance means nothing anymore in this world?

I have a problem buying an xbox or forza (ideal problem), and fortunatly there will be plenty more good games between now and march

 

[phil-t]

Supporters of something will undoubtedly oppose its competition, you could say so for some members of this forum, but its no different from any other forum of a particular topic. But I think thats different from 'dislike'

I support GT5, I also support FM3, I see them as 'games', games that I like to play, I have absolutely no loyalty to any of these companies..

As soon as you 'oppose' the competition then thats when you cross into the realm of Fanboys IMO.

Does allegiance means nothing anymore in this world?

If you like to follow a crowd irrespective of what is best for you, then sure, it's very much prevalent..



[edit] I was being slightly sarcastic..

I do agree that some loyalty to a product/manufacturer is natural, if they consistently give you what you want at the quality you want it, then I can see why this has occurred in the past. But quite frankly, the world is a different place, companies are all corporate investor driven whores who are just looking out for themselves... (all IMO)..

 

[Sele1981]

Good article from an pissed off GT fan... I think 90 from 100 GT fans are pissed off too and I agree that article...

T10 copyed GT and inserted some many more new features... I like the livery editor and I love to have an marketplace too in GT5...

I still believe that we get an GT4 with GT5 graphics with no improvement...

They only implement things wich are the minumum standard for an game since 2005... And then write it on the feature list...

Private rooms,damage,online racing,livery,reverse lights!,donuts and much more are standard things...

Do we really need this eye toy feature? They should spent their time on better things... An online championship would be nice... An online race with warm up,qualifying and the race would be nice... (for private rooms)

Forza is ready to rockn roll how he writes in his article and we still know nothing about GT5... 6 months to release and i´m sure PD begins to bring one or two screenshots or infos in february and not earlier... So just wait another 5 months without any info...

 

[Simple SIM]

Does allegiance means nothing anymore in this world?

I have a problem buying an xbox or forza (ideal problem), and fortunatly there will be plenty more good games between now and march

There's no such thing as allegiance in the console world. There were like 120+ million people who bought a PS2. Where are most of them now? Not buying a PS3. Going by the sales numbers this gen it looks like most of them bought a Wii instead

 

[H3avyM3tal]

I support GT5, I also support FM3, I see them as 'games', games that I like to play, I have absolutely no loyalty to any of these companies..

As soon as you 'oppose' the competition then thats when you cross into the realm of Fanboys IMO.

That is a very wrong statement. Being a fanboy does not equal oposing something. I am sure you have something you oppose to in our lives, but does that mean you are a fanboy?

Being a fanboy means that you just hate on something without any reason.
If you have a good enough reason, than you are just not a supporter, and you may well be an opposer, but you are in no way whet-so-ever a fanboy.

 

[eastley]

Afraid to say, i agree with article.

 

[hugo24]

I bought an XBox elite pretty much solely so I could play Forza once I learnt it was beating GT5 to the production line.

I have to say I'm pleasantly surprised with the XBox, I like the market place and the set up of it, and I love the audio player which is supported by every game and demo I've played so far, also I love the iPod support (eg. track names, playlists etc).

Add in GTAIV Lost & Damned and Ballad of Gay Tony and the upcoming Splinter Cell I think it's been a good purchase. But had GT5 hit within a month or so of FIII I wouldn't own one so that's a blessing. The fact the XBox straight out of the box doesn't support optical audio out is a big disappointment on the down side.

I'm goign to play both for sure but given the huge discrepency in release date I can't help but feel that GT5 has to hit back with something unique other than 2nd rate damage, such as weather or day/night to compete, it can't hit back with more of the same. It's great hope a superior track count appears to have been the exact opposite less tracks and more cars which I'm sure almost everyone would rather see the opposite.