Forza Motorsport General Discussion Thread

[PorscheHD]

Well i am very excited!

 

[ImaRobot]

Thats a fancy way of saying their game will be half baked at launch (like every AAA game for the last decade)

It's a true ripoff paying full price for unfinished products.

When will publishers ever learn to actually finish something before release!?

Sounds more like they're focusing on the thing they said they're going to be focusing on from the get go. They're literally saying that it's a possibility that it might not even be added in, though it's just a possibility of it existing later down the line. That should be pretty obvious that it's less half baked and moreso not important to the grand scheme of things.

I don't remember the features ever being prominent, or fleshed out in the first place either. Still, it's not eliminating the fact that you can still perform those feats within game regardless, at least.

 

[meganinja]

The two statements - that there's no scripted or artificial nobbling/boosting of the AI and the fact that certain behaviours can be implemented - do not mesh. It's really not hard to see that they are incongruent, absent further explanation.

I am not condisending, I am explaning with facts why there is no inconsistency in what he is saying

Machine Learning (the tech that is used for the game) can be adjusted to get different results, lets say that the AI ability filter is put on 0 of 5, they can adjust the ML filter, lets say 2 or 3 of 5, to let some extra difficulty happen during the learning process of ML, we can also do it (with minor scale) with the difficulty slider

This is often used for AI to test how AI can use different paths to reach the same objectives (ie. go fast from A to D but without C, go fast from A to D but without B, anbd so on)

Its not hacking, its different from use game physics to make AI drive faster, on this case its only the AI is configured, its similar you changing the player that is playing agnaist you, its not changing the game, just the driver.

I recall spending hours drifting in AC without a drift mode or drift tyres.

they stated that FM2023 will offer their best tyre model so far for grip loss and drifting, so a positive community would be looking forward to drifting normal cars on street tyres - emulating Chris Harris basically.

And surely those will also be able, the only thing is that they wont see their drift points or have drift championships, but they still be above to do their drift runs around some circuit if they want

I wonder how big the FM7 drifting community actually is? I have this sneaking suspicion that nobody currently complaining is actuallly part of that community

Most people that drift (as far i know) play Forza Horizon and probally will continue to do so (for multiple reasons), FH5´s event lab is mostly drift maps and most of Forza Horizon yotubers when showcase the maps of comunity 90% are drift related tracks

Man all are the same, the GT community, Pcars, Ride, Forza, The Crew, TDU and obviously the people of the console war.

People only like to complain and complain, dont know the good side of the things, dont know how is getting harder and harder to make realistic games and definitly dont know that games can focus on a single thing and be good at it, they are more and more growing in need in have everything everywhere all at once

 

[Bogie 19th]

I don't care about drift or drag. I would like to see it return for those that do enjoy it. But please don't make it part of the campaign. Or at least make it optional in the campaign. Also, I am done with bowling in my games, please.

I don't like the off road rally in GT games either. I like the circuit racing.

 

[meganinja]

I don't care about drift or drag. I would like to see it return for those that do enjoy it. But please don't make it part of the campaign. Or at least make it optional in the campaign. Also, I am done with bowling in my games, please.

Its clear (at least on launch) that those things wont have in the game, and that the long-term strategy is to push those things to Forza Horizon
That said, i wish they put special driving missions like GT does or something akin to drive licenses but in a way that dont force you to drive those to get on career events if you dont want to

 

[Stang616]

Thats a fancy way of saying their game will be half baked at launch (like every AAA game for the last decade)

It's a true ripoff paying full price for unfinished products.

When will publishers ever learn to actually finish something before release!?

Except it will be finished, just because it doesn't include features you want it to does not make it half-baked. They aren't including drag and drift and I honestly see no reason to include drifting anyway as most people will use Horizon for drifting.

Neither discipline was a heavy focus for any of the other games it is has first and foremost been a circuit racer, FM23 will continue that tradition and if the first impressions are anything to go by, it will do it better.

 

[SestoScudo]

I dont like drag and drift getting cut since those features were half baked and not done properly.

There was no point in keeping them unless they were done properly.

 

[Tired Tyres]

Proper racing against AI. Sign me up.

 

[skazz]

I'm glad they are taking a broader look at the franchise to be honest.

Let's assume FH6 (2024?) will get the better physics underlying the additional grip and reduced car weight transfer which it always has - that is by far the better place for off road, drifting and drag, especially with Eventlab to let you build custom drift events (just think about those drift tracks and touge roads made by the community in FH5).

Which is also a logical follow on for the current FH5 community which has found a good home for drag and drift there.

This leaves FM2023 to focus on recreating proper racing circuits and offering road and race cars in high visual quality. But most importantly, they will be really good to drive with a controller, unlike Forza's PC competition.

 

[meganinja]

Except it will be finished, just because it doesn't include features you want it to does not make it half-baked. They aren't including drag and drift and I honestly see no reason to include drifting anyway as most people will use Horizon for drifting.

Neither discipline was a heavy focus for any of the other games it is has first and foremost been a circuit racer, FM23 will continue that tradition and if the first impressions are anything to go by, it will do it better.

This need to be said out loud more

FH6 (2024?)

First rumors say 2025, and likely they dont want nothing to stop the first year hype of new motorsport so i think it credible that will be 2025 indeed

 

[SU_Tempest]

Thats a fancy way of saying their game will be half baked at launch (like every AAA game for the last decade)

It's a true ripoff paying full price for unfinished products.

When will publishers ever learn to actually finish something before release!?

Setting aside the fact that the one thing Gamers™ are united in doing is complaining, this argument holds zero water.

Firstly, in what way is the lack of dirt/offroad, drag racing, or drift making a racing game primarily about circuit racing "half-baked?" Especially considering we're being given plenty of warning — months in advance, even 0 — of what the game will and won't contain at launch? This is a smaller loaf of bread, not a half-baked one. You have the option to just not buy it until they add the features you want, if they ever do.

Secondly, I dunno if you noticed, but "paying full price" is no longer the expectation. The business model is "Most players will use Game Pass to try this, maybe buy it if they like it that much." You absolutely do not have to pay full price anymore these days to get your Forza fill.

I will probably buy it, because the Game Pass model doesn't work for me, but for most people, it's not like anybody is getting a bad deal here.

 

[meganinja]

I dunno if you noticed, but "paying full price" is no longer the expectation. The business model is "Most players will use Game Pass to try this, maybe buy it if they like it that much." You absolutely do not have to pay full price anymore these days to get your Forza fill.

I will probably buy it, because the Game Pass model doesn't work for me, but for most people, it's not like anybody is getting a bad deal here.

I have GamePass but I pre-orded the game beacuse the All-Acess that lets you have a copy for PC (via Windows Store but still the PC port)

 

[PJTierney]

The car Chris drove during the demo lap with the wheel, the 991 RSR, handles like a real "widow-maker" in FM7. Any attempts to trail-brake or lift off the throttle mid corner results in a violent and sudden snap of oversteer.

That's important context that should have been highlighted on the stream.

 

[PJTierney]

Thats a fancy way of saying their game will be half baked at launch (like every AAA game for the last decade)

It's a true ripoff paying full price for unfinished products.

When will publishers ever learn to actually finish something before release!?

Define finish.

Something not being in their current creative vision doesn't mean that a game is half empty.

They've been very clear that their stated goal with the game is to create one based on modern circuit racing.

Drift and Drag are, by definition, not "modern circuit racing", they're sub-categories relevant to wider motorsport/automotive culture.

Personally, I feel both are better suited to Forza Horizon 5, and I would appreciate them in that game with suitable gameplay options on top of the already excellent build and car variety that game has.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Having no drifting and drag racing in the game doesn't make it "half-baked", so one should't even go there if they themselves aren't into that kind of stuff or pretend to. Besides, let's not forget that dirt racing is not even good in GT7 either, all the while drift mode is a mode that's "there" and drag racing is just a misson. Than you have Sport mode which barely even has dirt racing, and drag racing and drifting are non-existant in it.

FM is going to focus on circuit first and foremost, as it should. You don't want to go all over the place like FM7 did, trying to please all audiences and yet pleasing no one.

At the very least it's pleasing to know that drag racing and (you could literally still do even without the mode) drifting is planned to make a come back in the future. But honestly I couldn't give a damn about those two because Horizon exists. If I want that stuff I'd go to that. Although it is a good thing T10 aren't telling their fans "FM is back" when it lacks all of the past features. That'd be lying to them.

 

[MonoTonouS]

So Forza ms can get away with being gutted because "Horizon has it" .

 

[VinylRichie]

Thats a fancy way of saying their game will be half baked at launch (like every AAA game for the last decade)

It's a true ripoff paying full price for unfinished products.

When will publishers ever learn to actually finish something before release!?

You can’t say that for sure before you haven’t played the game, it’s not automatically unfinished because it doesn’t have this or that mode in it.
DIRT also isn’t unfinished just because it’s just rally, the same goes for the F1 series etc.

 

[UKMikey]

This is the discussion thread for an article on GTPlanet:

Forza Motorsport Will Focus On Modern Circuit Racing: No Dirt, Drag, or Drift at Launch​

Turn 10’s creative director Chris Esaki has confirmed during the Forza Monthly stream that the Forza Motorsport reboot will be exclusively focused on circuit racing and not feature drag or drift modes or any offroad racing — at least at launch...

While it’s still not entirely clear what the “machine-learning” process involved here is (and T10 has been using the same phrase regarding the AI since the original game), it is obviously faster. Esaki states that the way in which the AI uses vehicle inputs — the “AI controller” — is improved, along with 16 ideal driving lines compared to just three.

I thought Chris talked about nineteen different driving lines (20'53" on the video)?

 

[lilcat89]

So Forza ms can get away with being gutted because "Horizon has it" .

What you called "gutted", is what I called focused. T10 clearly lost that focus in the last two Motorsport games. There is no need to have repeat cars and features that Horizon already has and especially in areas where Motorsport is not focused on. So, yes, get rid of all the chaff that has built up over the years and refocus, just like PD did with GT Sport.

 

[NotThePrez]

So Forza ms can get away with being gutted because "Horizon has it" .

No, they can "get away with it" because they've been saying from Day 1 that FM '23 has been focused on modern circuit racing with a focus on race cars and higher-performance road cars, and everything going into the game has been done with that creative goal in mind.

If drifting and drag isn't part of that equation, that's fine by me. As someone who does quite a bit of drifting in Horizon, I'd rather them spend the time it would take to implement those modes and use that to refine the core focus of the game instead, and all the features and mechanics that come with it, so that FM '23 is a more complete package come launch.

 

[ctdc67]

Sometimes I think T10 is an AI company that uses a game platform for their testing and then I see all the people wanting better AI. If people want to drift they can do so but don’t change the game physics. IRL drifters can’t change physics.

 

[Ryan81]

Very pleased that it will be devoted only to circuit racing with race cars and high performance road cars.

 

[skazz]

In FH5 at least, the drift suspension and tyres bring considerable changes to car handling and let drifters hold more angle (drift suspension brings a much higher maximum turn angle for the front wheels). Furthermore FH5 has drift zones which calculate drift points based on staying on track, speed, angle, etc...

So from that point I understand that not having drift upgrades or drift scoring means you are going to be drifting cars much closer to their stock performance and effectively just for fun instead of completely tuning them up for optimal drift scoring. Which is a very different kind of experience.

But yeah, no big deal for me. The guys who want to tandem drift through race tracks can still do so, just without drift upgrades or drift scoring. Or stay on FH5 if they can't live without that stuff.

 

[slthree]

I feel for those who like drifting and the like. Hopefully, down the road they'll add that

For me, I heard what I wanted to hear. It's a definite buy 👏

 

[Hasse 86]

I thought Chris talked about nineteen different driving lines (20'53" on the video)?

That must be a typo. He did indeed say nineteen and not sixteen.

 

[Hasse 86]

This need to be said out loud more

First rumors say 2025, and likely they dont want nothing to stop the first year hype of new motorsport so i think it credible that will be 2025 indeed

If this statement from Matt Booty is anything to go by, it seems like we can expect Forza Horizon 6 to arrive somewhere between 2025 and 2027.

 

[Mirai]

I did one drift lobby on FM7 and hated it because T10 decided it was a good idea to have collisions turned on
The whole point of drifting is everyone has their own style, so if you have approx. 20 other cars all taking different lines into the same corner then it’s only gonna end in tears
And I don’t think I even touched drag racing
Horizon does both of those things better, so the bigger the emphasis on circuit racing the better, imo
Focus is exactly what this series needs right now

 

[Beebo]

What are you all hoping to see for post-launch track additions?

 

[Tired Tyres]

Real world tracks that are not usually in race games.

 

[masterrawad]

Darn. If only there was a Forza game where you can drive Dirt, Drag, or Drift...