Forza

Maven
Ugh, it's comments like these that ruin someone's credibility. Is it that hard for you to say that GT4's graphics look 'good'? Even if it doesn't match up with what Forza may be capable of, it still will look amazing.

When you say something is 'crap' when it clearly isn't, that's when you show your biases and prejudices.

you totally misunderstood what he posted. He meant that "technically", GT4's graphics are pretty unimpressive compared to the latest stuff, and it's totally true.

Those who know where and how to look will see blurry textures, simple reflections, simple lighting, low poly counts in the environment, and jaggies galore.

Gran Turismo is the best looking game because of skill and craftsmanship, not because of the greatest rendering tech. Though the guys at PD must be some of the most savvy in the industry, they can't magically make an old platform more powerful.
 
un_peacekeeper
i love hardware, just that it's microsoft so i hate it.

By making poor quality product like Windows, Microsoft has kept me employed for the last 14 years. I love them. Everytime they screw up, I make money. I wish them well in their quest because i'll make mo' mo' mo' money.
 
Code and Cobra are opposites. What code talked about GT4, Cobra would say the exact same thing about Forza.

Hell, knowing Cobra, he won't admit there is a better racing sim than GT4. He hardly gives good reasons for why GT4 is better, and when he says its better, he'll say its better in fields like modes, when he doesn't know jack about all the racing modes.


IMO, Forza goes more in depth with its racing modes. Autocross is a big thing for some people.
 
McLaren F1GTR
Code and Cobra are opposites. What code talked about GT4, Cobra would say the exact same thing about Forza.

Hell, knowing Cobra, he won't admit there is a better racing sim than GT4. He hardly gives good reasons for why GT4 is better, and when he says its better, he'll say its better in fields like modes, when he doesn't know jack about all the racing modes.


IMO, Forza goes more in depth with its racing modes. Autocross is a big thing for some people.

I'm going to spend my time doing drag race online with some american muscle car !!!!

It's a shame. i thought we were all car fanatic. How can a car fanatic deny any simulation racing game. Forza, GTR, GT4 and Enthusia just for exemple. All goodies for us.
 
GTR is awesome, and probably the coolest and best racing game I"ve played this year.
Enthusia, Forza, and GT4 are all paid in full reserve, so you can be sure, I'm not taking sides, and will have planety of time next summer racing these awesome games.
 
McLaren F1GTR
GTR is awesome, and probably the coolest and best racing game I"ve played this year.
Enthusia, Forza, and GT4 are all paid in full reserve, so you can be sure, I'm not taking sides, and will have planety of time next summer racing these awesome games.


Interesting read here :

CobratGT :

forza looks great. when I say forza looks like crap, I say that to counteract someone but deep inside, I like how forza looks. foza has some greatness going own for itself with the personal car thing and what not. It's gonna be a great game and if it ended up beating gt4, o well, life is life.

http://forums.gamespot.com/gamespot...2&topic=17863849&message=188757778#M188757778

He finally come down to common sense.

BTW don't forget to leave me your GT, we need to play online sometime.
 
Great! Hopefully, he'll start arguing with us about Forza. If he's a true racing game lover, like us here at GTP, he'll buy as many of these new sims as he can.
 
Ummm I am a racing game fan in general, I think that GT4 will be a superb game, I just said that GT4 graphics wern't exactly the most high tech, that doesn't mean it doesn't look great :P. I think that considering it runs at 60 fps, it's fantastic. If anything, I'm more a PC person then consoles anyway.

Mr p510, grow up you sad man, I'm no longer 13 years old, so the old console fanboy rivalry things kinda means nothing to me. If I was the fanboy you made out I am, I would be on here GUSHING over forza, pretending that it's the best thing ever. I'm not, it wasn't amazing. If ya ask me, GTR is the one out of the 3 that REALLY impressed me.

Don't worry about Code,he mainly only posts negativity towards GT in general.

That's why I said Gt4 had fantastic art direction, and that the nurb demo was really good. Yes..your fricking idiot. I am negative towards Gt3 though, pos. Just because I don't piss my pants over every single thing in GT and pretend that it's TEH UB3R 1337Z0RZ doesn't mean I'm anti GT.
 
code_kev
Ummm I am a racing game fan in general, I think that GT4 will be a superb game, I just said that GT4 graphics wern't exactly the most high tech, that doesn't mean it doesn't look great :P. I think that considering it runs at 60 fps, it's fantastic.

Mr p510, grow up you sad man, I'm no longer 13 years old, so the old console fanboy rivalry things kinda means nothing to me.



That's why I said Gt4 had fantastic art direction, and that the nurb demo was really good. Yes..your fricking idiot. I am negative towards Gt3 though, pos. Just because I don't piss my pants over every single thing in GT and pretend that it's TEH UB3R 1337Z0RZ doesn't mean I'm anti GT.

Any true racer has to recognize the value in GT4. It's definately worth purchasing. Nurb is a great track and I can't wait to race it in is entire lenght (darn time limit). My only pet peeves is the online portion. That was for me the most anticipated feature of GT4. I don't think I will ever play with B-spec or photo mode but I sure would hell race online. We all know how AI are so so in Gt series, this would of bring a infinite replay value for years and years to come

Enough rant for one day.Q1 2005 will help pass those cold day / night of winter we have around here (Montreal, Canada).
 
I'll end up playing with every feature of Gt4, even photomode etc, I'm sure it's quite fun.

Gt4 should end up being the best console racing game, and yes I see the value of it. It's an important game/
 
If Forza turns out to be a hit, I will buy a Xbox just for that.
 
Forza isn't an anything killer. I does look like a decent racer though and comparing GT4 in motion to Forza in motion I still think GT4 looks nicer and more realistic all aroun I think your pics on the system wars are very misleading.
 
fabro_s
How many cars and tracks will forza have?

----> Track List (OXM Demo)

----> Car List

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Just got the demo...

From what I have played so far, about two and a half hours, I can tell you that this game is one of the better racing games I have played for my Xbox!

The gameplay is pretty basic in the demo, just pick a car, tune it if possible (not sure if this affects anything -- performance wise) and race around the Laguna Sequa (SP?) trying to improve your times. There is a slight learning curve, however, it is easily overcome with about 30 minutes of playtime (I have never played a sim before). After that, the game really comes into it's own, and it becomes very fun to try and improve your times. More experienced players are given the option to turn of driving aids, such as ABS, which makes for a more challenging play. Aside from that slight learning curve, the game is very easy to pick and play, although, some more casual gamers may be turned off by it being a racing sim.

All of the cars handle nicely, except that stupid NSX (actually I just suck and racing games :dopey: ), and they each have their own unique feel. This helps differentiate each one and make it a bit more challenging to master each car (which I have in no way done), plus it's just plain cool to check out how each one handles differently from the others. The joysticks work pretty good for controlling the cars, although they can seem a bit touchy at first and still have to try my MC2 on it... can't imagine what that new fangled Logitech wheel they have for the PS2 would be like :drool: The triggers really help with their pressure sensitivity, as it's easy to regulate the pressure on the throttle and brakes, this really seems to help when you have the driving aids turned off. Other than the touchy joysticks and getting used to the pressure sensitive triggers with the aids turned off, the controls are very solid and should be easy enough for anyone to master... with practice!

Vissually, Forza is pretty "good", which really isn't all that great, considering it's one of Xbox's flagship titles for 05! I mean, the textures, lighting, special effects, damage modeling and car details all seem pretty "good", but the frame rate of the cars and their reflections are pretty bad. It looks like the reflections are moving at about 15 FPS or slower :yuck: The two best visual aspects of the demo are the colours (I know, I know, it doesn't look as "realistic" as GT4, but I like the brighter and slightly more vivid colours!) and the damage modeling, which does a fairly good job of showing paint chipping, smearing; bumpers dangling and windows breaking. Each car seems to have been created with a fair amount of care, and they all seem to resemble their real life counter parts, however, I have found that when the suns hits some of the cars at odd angles it gives them and unrealistic looking shine.

The physics, although I am no car expert, convincingly convey the way a car moves during sharp turns at high speeds and how when they break and accelerate their body weight shifts. Another good example of the physics at work, is when coming to a complete stop on a hill the car will roll down backwards, as if it's weight and center of gravity has been changed by the incline in the slope. Other than those aforementioned things, I do not feel fit to comment on things I do not really understand, such as how the physics cause the car to over-steer / under-steer etc.

The A.I, for the most part, is okay and displays some intelligence when tying to over take you or when blocking your path, but other than that it seems they are just driving on a rail and will do anything to stay on it. I have tried driving in reverse along the track and from what I have seen the A.I. will do a pretty good job at avoiding you, however, their have been some odd instances when the A.I. just seemed to drive straight into me on purpose, which is kind of odd :dunce: Other than the couple of problems found in the demos' A.I, which will most likely be fixed by release, it really isn't all that bad!

In summation, the OXM demo of Forza MotorSport demonstrates that Forza is a good console racing sim, although I don't think it will be better than GT3: A spec of GT4: The real driving simulator, and that with improvements could become one of the Xbox's best racing games and one of the best on any console... save maybe GT3 and GT4.

Demo Rating: 8.7/10

Holt
 
FozzyFan116
Forza isn't an anything killer. I does look like a decent racer though and comparing GT4 in motion to Forza in motion I still think GT4 looks nicer and more realistic all aroun I think your pics on the system wars are very misleading.

Wait a minute here. I took some of my free time to grab some picture and video out of good will of both Forza demo and GT4 demo . I did not act on purpose on any of the previously mention game to make them look bad. All capture or picture were taken in the same condition with the same equipement.

Of cours, I though the GT4 demo has a better track choice and portait more of the capabilities of the game. Laguna Seca is a track full of sand with so little environment compare to Nurburgring. The only thing missing from GT4 is more anisotropic, Anti-aliasing and higher texture resolution (blame it on PS2 hardware limitation). Other then that, the artistic direction of the game is great.
 
kinigitt
online is a big deal to a lot of people. But in this case, ignorance is bliss. If you haven't played online, you don't get why people think it's so great, and it won't bother you to have it excluded from a particular game you like.

But once you start playing online, the lure is too strong to stay away. In many games, it eclipses the single player experience, however solid, because the thrill of playing other people anytime just kicks the crap out of playing A.I.

And as far as engine swaps go, the devs mentioned that they were taking it seriously, meaning no unrealistic modding, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt.

To clarify; I've played GPL, the old F12k2/F1C mods, and NR2k3 a fair amount online. I know it's a great thing to do, but I personally don't see how not having online can kill a game for people. That's almost as rediculous as the people who whine and bitch about there being no Ferrari.

Perhaps I'm not too worried about Online because a) it's apparently on it's way, and b) I've done OLR for five years. Sure, it's not the same, but I'm not going to largely ignore the game simply because I won't be racing everyone in real time for a while.

Also, I've noted that the most glowing reviews of the Forza demo so far are from people who were most upset about the online portion of GT4 being removed? Coincidence?
 
Also, I've noted that the most glowing reviews of the Forza demo so far are from people who were most upset about the online portion of GT4 being removed? Coincidence?

You mean the people who arnt in denial about online
 
New Forza interview (click on more news for complete interview)

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/front_index.php?

Did you want to avoid targeting one specific aspect of the car community too heavily since, for instance, Need For Speed Underground is heavy into the boy racer culture and Midnight Club 3 is going for the DUB culture?

Kiki Wolfkill: I think it's more that we've built a very robust physics model, we've got a very strong collection of over 200 cars with all the modifications that go with them. That's what performance driving is about. Forza's not just about making your car look fancy and getting around the track.

Modification and customisation is universal - individual aspects of car community like street racing are not. What we've done is given everyone the tools to indulge their motorsport passion and display their personality in whichever way they choose, and we've made it a very enjoyable driving experience.

Primarily we want people to go in and have fun racing. They don't ever need to touch the modification if you don't want to. You can keep racing, earning credits, and upgrading to better cars without getting your hands dirty. If you do want to get deep into the simulation there's plenty to keep you busy. We have 150 aftermarket brands offering parts specific to each make and model of car.

We've got so many options that people can really choose where to enhance their performance, be it in the engine, the suspension, the aerodynamics and so on. If you add to that the tyre tuning and camber tuning you can tune every single aspect of your car - springs, compounds, pressure, gear ratios, alignment, rollbars, downforce. And everything affects performance. A big wing will give you extra downforce but it'll add drag, hurting your acceleration and top speed. Of course, you can always have someone else do it for you and download it...



The modification and tuning interface in a lot of racing games can be quite intimidating for people who don't know a lot about cars. How have you presented it in Forza?

Kiki Wolfkill: We've kept it pretty simple. When you go into the modification screen your car's stats are displayed in bars along the top of the screen that change as you tune it or add modifications. As you spend money on your car you're told how the weight is changing and if a mod will push you up into the next of the six classes in the game. You can either continue modifying a car to push it through the classes, or just go out and buy something that comes with more power as standard - it's up to you and what kind of car you care about.

With the tuning itself, everything's pretty much simplified to adjustments on a slide bar that gives immediate and simple visual feedback while still offering a lot of depth. Then you can hit the track instantly to try out your adjustments, tweak them a little more, and head straight back out. The online side is a real help too - if you're not sure how to do something you can ask for help from others or even get them to do it for you.

The important thing is that you can race and be successful without using the tuning options, but if you want to get in deep with the modification



The same goes for the actual racing - how are you ensuring that more casual driving game fans won't be put off by the realistic physics and handling?

Kiki Wolfkill: There are a bunch of driving assists you can turn on or off, you can set damage to be entirely cosmetic or affect your performance, and you can switch tyre damage on and off. You can totally tailor the racing experience to be as realistic or forgiving as you want.



Racing games all seem to be featuring the same race tracks these days. Does it frustrate you that you're creating yet another reproduction of, say, Laguna Seca or Tsukuba?

Kiki Wolfkill: It's hard because these are really good tracks and really valuable driving experiences, so it's difficult just to ditch them because someone else has done it before. The thing is, you can always do them better. Take our Laguna Seca, for instance, which is a much more accurate representation of the real track than ever before in a game, and certainly feels much more accurate than ever before.

You can really sense every dip and camber change. The same is true of our versions of the Nurburgring and Tsukuba, and we've got more that we haven't announced yet. When you combine that with Forza's level of car physics giving you a lot more feedback than ever before, it becomes a completely new experience.

We've also got a number of specially created tracks in real life cities designed to exploit a particular racing style, and a number of fictitious tracks just because it lets us be a little more creative with what we're offering.


With such a realistic physics and handling engine a force feedback wheel would be great for Forza. Any plans?

Kiki Wolfkill: There's definitely things in the works that we haven't solidified yet. We appreciate that a force feedback wheel is the best way to experience a game like Forza and it's certainly something we're working on from a partnership standpoint.




You've talked about Forza as the first instalment in a major franchise for Xbox. What plans do you have for the future?

Kiki Wolfkill: We're already thinking about Forza 2, but we're still extremely focused on getting Forza finished and starting production on downloadable content.

The site also has some new Enthusia screens
 
"This means that the tracks in GTR will "age" throughout the course of a race, just like they would in real life. Certain portions of their areas will become slicker, for instance, as the racing lines start to form on them"

taken from Gamespy GTR preview.

Hmmmmm... a lot of people shrugged it off as a gimmick when it was announced for Forza, I wonder if they'll say the same when tied into context with GTR?
 
That interview is good news. The makers will be working on some d/l content which should give Forza owners new cars, tracks, and more.
 
Yes, but at a price. Who's to say they don't hold a few cars back just to charge us more money in a couple months. GT4's shipping with 700+ cars, $50.

d/l content isn't always a good bargain. Hopefully it will be in this case.
 
8400RPM
Yes, but at a price. Who's to say they don't hold a few cars back just to charge us more money in a couple months. GT4's shipping with 700+ cars, $50.

d/l content isn't always a good bargain. Hopefully it will be in this case.

but PD is holding on for more buck for the Online Expansion. Who's the more evil here ?
 
I made a little movie showing the AI of Forza. Does anyone want to see it?

I still have to find a dull mp3 to fit with the avi tho.
 
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