Gran Turismo 7: Latest news and discussion thread

[Strittan]

Can you put me into perspective on why my first suspicion should be (money) greediness when it comes to PD and their decisions?

I thought I just did, but let’s try again then.

Why are normal, fun, challenging races not paying better than they are? Why can’t we sell parts/engines? Why do we sell cars at a huge loss when in reality selling classic cars can be beneficial?
Well, my theory is that it’s because PD wants it to be boring and extremely time consuming to earn credits, so that people go for the easier MTX option. Yes, those who buy credits may be few, but even one is better than no one from PD’s point of view, and if these potential MTX buyers suddenly finds that there’s an “exploit” that easily and quickly earns them credits they won’t spend another dime.

I just got a titanium exhaust for the the Charger SRT Hellcat ‘15 from my daily workout ticket. A car that I’ve never owned and happen to have no interest in whatsoever. I’m informed that the part is worth 10,000 but I can’t sell it. It feels like PD is giving me the middle finger, seriously.

 

[x__myst69__x]

If you find GT7 and its economy an insult, make a different choice.

I did make a different choice, about 9 months ago, I removed myself from playing the game any further until the economy was fixed, and for all of this year I've only logged on to install the monthly updates and do up some engine swaps which I love. The grinding of Sardegna became boring and the other races weren't worth it until they paid. The recent exploit gave me an avenue to do something PD were not willing to, and that was the fix the economy myself by getting the last few cars and stacking the credits up so that now, after 9 months abstinence, I can jump into the game again and enjoy all the races I have left unattempted with complete disregard for the prize money. For me, it was the right choice.

 

[Draggon]

They don't mention the DS4.......I still can't feel the road, the curbs, etc. The only, somewhat, strong vibration I feel is when I crash my car into the guardrail.

Am I the only one on PS4 with this problem

That's been an issue for me too. Some cars are ok, but many are quite bad. I literally have no idea what the front tires are doing. Racing tires make it worse.

I'm on a PS4 slim with the DS4.

 

[AlexWilmot]

If MTX were the focus PD would of developed a secondary credit to earn and then have a time delay to an oil service that can be bypassed by said credit, that in turn would need to be bought through microtransaction due to not earning many of these secondary credits through normal gameplay…

But GT7 is not this, it’s not pushing MTX as some people claim,
Having prices of parts displayed is not an insult, it’s just showing you that you got a part for free and you don’t have to spend that amount.

Really get over yourselves as you’re literally picking at things to complain about for the sake of complaining.

Are there issues with the game? Yes there are.
AI not using full throttle.
inconsistent payout across events which leads to events being one and done while others are grinded away for eternity. This is not a game designed for MTX issue but it’s a game design issue where they tried to prolong gameplay with lower payouts and it failed

 

[Techlet]

Wouldn't be the first time PD stopped short of leveraging a feature/mechanic to its fullest potential.

 

[Dave A]

Need the carrot on a stick in games. Using an exploit to buy everything in an instant would suck the fun right out of it for me.

I agree to a degree, but likewise if the stick is so long that the carrot is too far away, the horse will ignore it. GT7 has that problem for me, it takes too long to reap the rewards of your efforts.

 

[FlaviusButterus]

Good day Gents.
Is there perhaps a Discord channel or is this forum the only platform you guys use?
Would like to enter a team to join here if that's ok?

 

[MatskiMonk]

It feels like PD is giving me the middle finger, seriously.

Gets 10,000 Cr. worth of free parts, gets offended!

 

[benjoi84]

Non-grinder here...

I have run a few of the higher-yielding WTC races to top up my credit balance when needed. I also have run around 30x Tokyo with stock sports cars, but that is as much as an exercise in car testing as it is to get the rewards.

Now, for clarity, my main offline aim in this game is to try as many cars as possible in race conditions but with the caveat that I don't really want to spend 10 minutes of gaming time for 2-3k credits (Sunday Cups etc.). So I mainly like to race decently powerful cars in races that demand some degree of skill to win (and CRB where possible).

My gaming style is very much "play in a way that you're having fun/challenge, and receive the natural rewards". I'm more than willing to wait patiently for that day when I have ≈9m credits and a unicorn car appears in the LCD at a lower price than it was previously (like the Ferrari recently, but the opposite way around). If that never happens, so be it.

With custom races and quick races now scratching an racing itch & paying somewhat decently, I've always got something to do in the game.

This gaming loop has the dual benefit of providing a distraction for when Sport Mode races don't take my fancy, or I'm playing at less than ideal times of day when the online environment is undesirable, and earning credits for that day that I most need them. I can always dip in and out of online races to keep my skills sharp and when I fancy a REAL challenge.

The real reason I wanted to post this is to illustrate that why seems to me that lot people are playing the game on a different time scale to others. I think some gamers expect to buy a game and be done with it in 12-18 months whereas after my experience with GT Sport, in understand that, personally, I'm again gonna be invested in this one for 5 years or so.

In this regard I get why people are frustrated they can't have it all and are drawn towards grinding, but I feel like I'm viewing the game's ecosystem from a different perspective to many.

PS: Microtransactions suck

 

[Strittan]

Gets 10,000 Cr. worth of free parts, gets offended!

Nope, you’re not getting it. I got nothing basically, for doing something the game encourages me to do, while at the same time there are cars that cost 20,000,000 credits that the game encourages me to get.

If you’re defending this sort of game design you’re part of the problem.

 

[kjeldsen]

delete

 

[gloriousg4]

Gets 10,000 Cr. worth of free parts, gets offended!

It's not really a free prize if you can't bank it.

Otherwise, it's just another infuriating waste of time and space.

 

[MatskiMonk]

I got nothing basically

No, you got something, it just wasn't what you wanted.

for doing something the game encourages me to do

... that at the same time you'd pretty much be doing any way, if you were just playing the game. You're trying to frame it as something the game made you do, and having made you do it, it's then disrespected you so much by giving you something you didn't want. It's pathetic, if you don't want to play the game, don't play it. If you do want to play the game, grow up and accept some days you're going to get 10,000 Cr. or an exhaust for free, and some days you're going to 500,000 Cr. or Red Bull X2019 for free... <waits patiently for "But I wanted moreeee">

while at the same time there are cars that cost 20,000,000 credits that the game encourages me to get.

Again, you're trying to frame this as though it's otherwise against your will! The game encourages you to get a Hellcat as much as it encourages you to get the 20,000,000 Cr. cars (i.e. not much). The fact one of those things leans towards your personal preference doesn't change the fact that is all it is - a preference - and you're getting ****** about it because the prize wasn't for your preference.

If you’re defending this sort of game design you’re part of the problem.

What, getting free stuff in game... oh god, the horror. /s.

 

[hardvibes]

That's been an issue for me too. Some cars are ok, but many are quite bad. I literally have no idea what the front tires are doing. Racing tires make it worse.

I'm on a PS4 slim with the DS4.

Which cars are ok? I tried all kinds, from the Porsche in the first music rally to the Redbull X2014. Their vibrations are all very weak.

 

[Strittan]

No, you got something, it just wasn't what you wanted.



... that at the same time you'd pretty much be doing any way, if you were just playing the game. You're trying to frame it as something the game made you do, and having made you do it, it's then disrespected you so much by giving you something you didn't want. It's pathetic, if you don't want to play the game, don't play it. If you do want to play the game, grow up and accept some days you're going to get 10,000 Cr. or an exhaust for free, and some days you're going to 500,000 Cr. or Red Bull X2019 for free... <waits patiently for "But I wanted moreeee">



Again, you're trying to frame this as though it's otherwise against your will! The game encourages you to get a Hellcat as much as it encourages you to get the 20,000,000 Cr. cars (i.e. not much). The fact one of those things leans towards your personal preference doesn't change the fact that is all it is - a preference - and you're getting ****** about it because the prize wasn't for your preference.



What, getting free stuff in game... oh god, the horror. /s.

Jesus H Christ, are you for real?

I just pointed out one little example of how PD bullies us. My main point is that the in-game economy is still extremely bad and unreasonable, and these daily workouts tickets just makes it more frustrating for the most part, but fanboys like you refuse even trying to see it. Good for you.

 

[Terronium-12]

If MTX were the focus PD would of developed a secondary credit to earn and then have a time delay to an oil service that can be bypassed by said credit, that in turn would need to be bought through microtransaction due to not earning many of these secondary credits through normal gameplay…

But GT7 is not this, it’s not pushing MTX as some people claim,
Having prices of parts displayed is not an insult, it’s just showing you that you got a part for free and you don’t have to spend that amount.

Really get over yourselves as you’re literally picking at things to complain about for the sake of complaining.

Are there issues with the game? Yes there are.
AI not using full throttle.
inconsistent payout across events which leads to events being one and done while others are grinded away for eternity. This is not a game designed for MTX issue but it’s a game design issue where they tried to prolong gameplay with lower payouts and it failed

And if MTX weren't the focus, race payouts wouldn't be as low as they are. I can't remember for certain, but I believe GT Sport had better payouts and one could straight up buy a car for real money in that game.

Simply because something doesn't fit in with the more egregious, obvious examples doesn't mean it's no longer a factor or isn't skewed in that direction. Regardless of how "subtle" it may seem. Subtlety is perhaps even more dangerous because, as you're already demonstrating, it disarms and lulls you into a false sense of compliance, "Well, it's only 750,000 credits."

It's even less subtle when you observe the game as a whole. Take the Legends Dealer, for example: if you want the Short tail F1 GTR, that's going to be, at the time of its last appearance, 15 million credits. As a rough, shot in the dark example, let's say 50 people have only 13 million and can't be bothered to acquire the remainder, for whatever reason. If those 50 people alone purchase 2 million credits, that's nearly $1,500 USD for the lot of them alone. That's money that the game otherwise wouldn't have made in such a short amount of time — are you beginning to see the relevance?

The Prize Carousel is another factor in gently pushing someone toward this as well. One, it isn't RNG as it was in previous games (GT3, namely) and is pre-determined either the second it's obtained, or the moment it's used. I don't think we've ever figured out which of the two, but the point is it's 100% pre-determined. You can never get any of the other three prizes shown. Never. More often than not, it's weighed heavily in giving lower credit values. There was a thread sometime ago (I believe it was during the great Engine Swap and NSX-ening) that very roughly provided percentage chances of getting 500,000 and 1,000,000 credit prizes. They were very low, if I remember correctly.

Again, all of this to simply say just because the MTX in this game isn't as in-your-face egregious as something like Call of Duty or whatever game you want to use as an example, doesn't mean the design intention isn't the same. And, again, it being as subtle as it is is one of its strengths, as people continually demonstrate.

 

[Lomic]

I think some gamers expect to buy a game and be done with it in 12-18 months

Well with the current game economy, if you don't grind, good luck to complete the game in 18 months. Even playing everyday.

 

[Keef]

Jesus H Christ, are you for real?

I just pointed out one little example of how PD bullies us. My main point is that the in-game economy is still extremely bad and unreasonable, and these daily workouts tickets just makes it more frustrating for the most part, but fanboys like you refuse even trying to see it. Good for you.

We are not being bullied. You’re trying to blame other people for your own dissatisfaction. You chose to buy the game and you choose to keep playing it. Not only do you keep choosing to play it despite being dissatisfied but you then deflect the reality of the situation, both of which are actually signs of addiction lol.

We actually all agree that the game economy is broken. The difference is that some of us understand why it’s broken and realize that nobody is forcing us to play the game.

Well with the current game economy, if you don't grind, good luck to complete the game in 18 months. Even playing everyday.

@Lomic here’s another simple example of misguided priorities. What’s with the focus on beating the game? Beating the game isn’t a thing that has to happen. There are a lot of sandbox elements to the game and the point of that is to keep playing because it’s fun, not because you have to beat it.

There are some things in life you have to beat, for example doing your taxes or paying your rent. Video games aren’t on that list.

 

[Lomic]

here’s another simple example of misguided priorities. What’s with the focus on beating the game?

I was replying to @benjoi84 who said "some gamers expect to buy a game and be done with it in 12-18 months". In my case I will never be done with GT7 and don't mind. I leave that to those who have the will, the skills and the time to do so. I just want to have fun.

 

[Bazool]

Couldn't find a word in Japanese for "Grind"..........well, not in the context its being used for in here, closest i thought was...................単調な課題 Which our Japanese readers will know as meaning Monotonous task

I hate dark winter evenings !

 

[kjeldsen]

delete

 

[AlexWilmot]

Blaming MTX is the knee jerk reaction to everything in GT7, we have had countless threads and posts of the past 20 months, and it is pretty clear that the "micro" transactions are so expensive that people simply don't buy them. I used real money on GT-Sport and so did many others, i am never going to spend a dime on in game credits, they are simply not worth it, and the vast majority of players think the same. If PD was serious about MTX the price would be much much lower.

To add GT Sport is a worse game for MTX than GT7, it had similar payouts after updates to what GT7 has and still had the option to buy cars.

GT7 includes MTX features and theres no denying that its there and people have used them but to say its designed around it, come on enough tinfoil hat thinking here people.

The race payouts thing is not MTX focused, it's to prolong gameplay and build a bond with a car, other games have tried the same thing, FM 2023, PC3 etc. it's to drive a car lots of times and upgrade it as you go, or atleast what marketing has tried and then the mechanic behind it to develop it.

It's like saying have a Sky TV subscription is designed to get people into a gambling addiction because it has TV adverts that are subtle towards William hill and other gambling sites.

 

[Talon16]

Blaming MTX is the knee jerk reaction to everything in GT7, we have had countless threads and posts of the past 20 months, and it is pretty clear that the "micro" transactions are so expensive that people simply don't buy them. I used real money on GT-Sport and so did many others, i am never going to spend a dime on in game credits, they are simply not worth it, and the vast majority of players think the same. If PD was serious about MTX the price would be much much lower.

Care to convey where you're getting this information? Any financial statistics comparing GT-S vs GT7 microtransactions straight from PD/Sony, or are you just pulling it out of your exhaust pipe? Genuinely curious.

 

[MatskiMonk]

What, getting free stuff in game... oh god, the horror. /s.

Further to this, I've not been logging my Daily Marathon rewards, however, based on GT7 'My Page' and 'Milestones', I've logged in on 451 days, and completed the daily marathon 300 times.

Using the probabilities published at 1.27 for the ticket rewards on GT7info, and only looking at the 277 marathons completed whilst at Collector level 20 or higher (in other words ignoring most of the rewards for the first month), I've most likely accrued the following from the DM rewards...

12,749,000 Cr.
20 cars worth between 30,000 & 100,000 Cr.
10 cars worth between 120,000 & 450,000 Cr.
3 cars worth between 500,000 & 3,450,000 Cr.
25 standard tuning parts
17 'S' Parts
6 Engines
17 Invites.

... all as a reward for playing, which I was doing anyway. As someone that wants at least 2 of each (edit: Modifiable) car in the game the savings on car purchases were potentially >16m Cr., and as far as I can tell the most expensive car I won was the RB X2014 worth 3m Cr.

10,000 Cr. or less tickets would have come up 187 times from 300.

Notionally, on the 151 days I logged in, but didn't complete the daily marathon (most likely days when I was working on liveries only), the Cr. only total would be 20,448,000, and with 53 cars won a potential saving of 28m Cr.

 

[Strittan]

We are not being bullied. You’re trying to blame other people for your own dissatisfaction. You chose to buy the game and you choose to keep playing it. Not only do you keep choosing to play it despite being dissatisfied but you then deflect the reality of the situation, both of which are actually signs of addiction lol.

First of all I’m blaming PD and Kaz, I think that’s obvious. And secondly, you have no idea how much or little I play the game, and throwing addiction out there? Now who’s judgemental?

We actually all agree that the game economy is broken. The difference is that some of us understand why it’s broken and realize that nobody is forcing us to play the game.

Clearly you’ve not been in the same sort if debates that I have if you think “we all” agree on that. Even less so on the why. It got quite heated when I said it’s because of micro transactions.

 

[Tired Tyres]

Blaming MTX is the knee jerk reaction to everything in GT7, we have had countless threads and posts of the past 20 months, and it is pretty clear that the "micro" transactions are so expensive that people simply don't buy them. I used real money on GT-Sport and so did many others, i am never going to spend a dime on in game credits, they are simply not worth it, and the vast majority of players think the same. If PD was serious about MTX the price would be much much lower.

To me that sounds like the whale's are being targeted. They spend thousands of money on their favourite game. Numerous free to play games exist because of them. Some openly crow about how much they spend. It's a given that PD/Sony are earning more from them that more normal users in GTS.

 

[Lomic]

To me that sounds like the whale's are being targeted.

Japanese fishing whales ? That's tradition !

 

[kjeldsen]

delete

 

[MatskiMonk]

To me that sounds like the whale's are being targeted. They spend thousands of money on their favourite game. Numerous free to play games exist because of them. Some openly crow about how much they spend. It's a given that PD/Sony are earning more from them that more normal users in GTS.

Out of interest, can you link to some of these people spending thousands on GT7 MTXs?

Also, if the flex is how much they've spent, all PD need to do is have expensive MTXs, they don't need to dramatically negatively affect the economy of the game. People say they want more races that pay out the same as the big 4 - okay, that's still 15-20 hours... surely a whale spending thousands isn't go to miss out on the flex in favour 15-20 hours work, especially when the trinket they get isn't required for progression, is not pay to win, and many people won't give a **** about, that's functionally inferior to assets everyone has easy access to in the game. GT is a 4 to 5 year life span game, with only a trivial number of things that are close to unobtainable... it's not like there'll be a new game every year, or massive updates you need to buy assets for every few months... there's literally no rush that requires you to spend on MTX's aside from the not-at-all-justified FOMO in the LCD (because everything comes around again).

Whales may exist, that doesn't mean they have any bearing on the economy of GT7.

If I had to guess I'd say PD priced the MTX's to give sport mode players a chance to skip the offline portion of the game and still buy a load of cars, tyres, ballast etc. for a one-time fee comparable to an iRacing subscription, without at the same time giving people an easy way to massively cheese the offline collector element of the game. That's the only way I can make sense of the pricing, personally.

 

[McLaren]

Blaming MTX is the knee jerk reaction to everything in GT7, we have had countless threads and posts of the past 20 months, and it is pretty clear that the "micro" transactions are so expensive that people simply don't buy them. I used real money on GT-Sport and so did many others, i am never going to spend a dime on in game credits, they are simply not worth it, and the vast majority of players think the same. If PD was serious about MTX the price would be much much lower.

Unfortunately, this can't be proven. The closest one can get is seeing PD immediately alter pricing to make it more enticing, but I don't think they have. And they're not going to lower the prices with the way it's currently setup where $20 for 2,000,000 Cr. is the "best deal". Lowering that means everything else has to be lowered below it & PD isn't going to give away 100,000 Cr. for something more appealing like $1.50.

They seem overly expensive, but the industry shows a significant amount of people accept them. If people are still dumping money on Shark Cards (where the value doesn't go very far given the costs of items released into the game in the last 2 years) yet Rockstar continues to report massive amounts of money made, I have no doubt PD has seen an acceptable amount of money spent on their Credit Purchases.

I don't think MTX can be blamed for everything in GT7, but it definitely has some influence on car prices & pay outs to drive some interest its way.