Gran Turismo 7 Physics

Do you want more detailed and realistic physics on the next GT


  • Total voters
    203
  • Poll closed .
It took a while to dial in the physics in the last few games and with 7 being on 2 consoles, I imagine it's complicating things quite a lot.

On what Praiano said, tuned cars are enjoyable to drive but you lose a lot of the car's original character. Like the the F40 and Stratos in GT5 and 6 were two of the liveliest stock cars in the game but they felt neutered by tuning. Yes, they were easier and quicker to drive but they didn't feel like the F40 and Stratos any more either.
This. I actually just used one of his tunes for one of the 911's for the Porsche Cup menu book. I was having a hard time winning with how much I had to hold the car's hand (although far from as bad as many other RWD cars). As soon as I stuck a tune on, I won easily, but it wasn't as thrilling, although it wasn't exactly dull either. The 996 was overall a good experience, but still has the same RWD issues.
 
I'm serious, I'm going to go looking for threads for where people defend PC3 physics cause that has to be the funniest copium I've ever seen.

Also the more I play the more I'm convinced the issues have less to do with physics and more to do with extremely sensitive steering input.
Oh, you will find them, most of them are denizens of the official forum who came to white knight, not just physics, but how it wasn't SMS's fault how the game was marketed, but the potential audience not getting it.

And my favorite:

the road car handling is sublime in pC3, the slip curve is a joy to play around with.
 
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I'm serious, I'm going to go looking for threads for where people defend PC3 physics cause that has to be the funniest copium I've ever seen.

Also the more I play the more I'm convinced the issues have less to do with physics and more to do with extremely sensitive steering input.


Lack of progression between grip to slip,as Always on gt games (GTS masked It with a lot of understeer),too
 
Pretty sure it had been discussed before... So this is not about race car, but I do not understand why my fully maxed tuned 2020 road supra would suddenly lose traction and spin out at 4/5th gear in acceleration in RH(!), when it was perfectly stable/grippy from 2nd onwards coming out of a corner (such as going up the final section at interlagos). Adding rear downforce (more than doubled) didn't change anything. I wasn't even making a big turn on my wheel. It's like at 4th gear, the car/tires suddenly cannot handle the torque anymore and just give up.

Did more tuning: lessening toe in, LSD (lowering acceleration sensitivity), seem to have helped (still spinning out... But less). Lowering Anti roll bar didn't do anything really

PS: this is with no TCS, and playing with a wheel
 
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Also the more I play the more I'm convinced the issues have less to do with physics and more to do with extremely sensitive steering input.
Hmm... has anyone fussed with the steering setting in the controller setup? It runs from -2 to +7. From what I glean in the few mentions of it, it smooths the controller input towards the lower values. I believe this applies to wheel controllers too because it's available, at least for my G29.

But as Scaff has mentioned a number of times, the tire grip modeling is a bit frooked, and probably a few of the car kinetics. I think the term kinematics is misapplied.
noun: The branch of mechanics that studies the motion of a body or a system of bodies without consideration given to its mass or the forces acting on it.
I hope this discussion continues. The physics will likely change a few times, which will lead to even more debates. Which I do like to read, as some of it is helpful in racing.
 
Hmm... has anyone fussed with the steering setting in the controller setup? It runs from -2 to +7. From what I glean in the few mentions of it, it smooths the controller input towards the lower values. I believe this applies to wheel controllers too because it's available, at least for my G29.
It does nothing. It says in the manual it is for wireless controllers only. Some claim it makes a difference, but I ran a few laps at -2 vs +7 and it felt absolutely no different.
 
I find it wery hard to take you sesiously on this guys. We have all had several weeks now to try out the game. Statements like this
tells me of a frighteningly low skill level. Guess there will allways be some who doesn`t see or are willing to or able to see no matter what. But this threads topic has been outdebated for a long time now, we need to move on.

To your defence; the tire-physics problem does only appear (clearly) on some cars, primarely older FR-cars. There are many cars that behaves quite normally. But realism is not a word that should be used in conjuction with GT7.

The wery first thing I noticed in this game was "Oh, the car has no inertia!!" Cars feels allmost weightless in GT7, and that is what Kaz & co tryes to cover up this by adding on some of their "realism". Their problem is that the carphysics has become so overcomplicated that they have lost the grip on the most eccensial physical parameters. Those of you who has worked with car-physics will probably know what I mean.
My post wasn't in defence of the physics of the game. There are much more qualified people around here who can talk on accuracy of the game physics.

What I was getting at was, I believe there is a consistency to the physics in the game, there must be a reason as to why some players were having trouble. So I was trying to offer an explanation and therefore, potentially, a solution to their troubles. As I said in my post, whether it is real or accurate is up for debate, but in the context of the game physics, I was explaining my understanding of the situation which may help someone enjoy the game more.
 
My post wasn't in defence of the physics of the game. There are much more qualified people around here who can talk on accuracy of the game physics.

What I was getting at was, I believe there is a consistency to the physics in the game, there must be a reason as to why some players were having trouble. So I was trying to offer an explanation and therefore, potentially, a solution to their troubles. As I said in my post, whether it is real or accurate is up for debate, but in the context of the game physics, I was explaining my understanding of the situation which may help someone enjoy the game more.
Your name seems really familiar. Did you qualify for an early Oceania regional tour event?

Edit: Google remembers you, too.
 
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It does nothing. It says in the manual it is for wireless controllers only. Some claim it makes a difference, but I ran a few laps at -2 vs +7 and it felt absolutely no different.

Much debated but depending on the wheel and how much baked in dampening there is can mask it. Belt and gear drive for example.

On my DD1 with no dampening on it was apparent in GTS and now with GT7. The effect is more on initial turn in than through angle range albeit subtle. I've driven each setting a week at a time using my same style and notice the difference.

Running higher sensitivity In GTS was the difference of going flat through the cod or lifting and finally breaking into the 1.34's

In GT7 dropping it down a touch has helped. Especially in daily race C at Brands. It's not as darty coming off the brake and a bit more fluid on turn in.
 
No it`s not, even if some wery unskilled players still can`t figure it out
It is, as evidenced by this thread. There isn't a black and white answer to the physics other than does it equal real life yes/no? But no game does. Not even the best F1 simulators the all the top teams are running are 1 to 1 with real world physics.

There are improvements over the previous games from PD and there are some things that don't hit the mark, and how players interpret them in different ways means everyone will have their own opinion on how good or not good something is.

Your name seems really familiar. Did you qualify for an early Oceania regional tour event?

Edit: Google remembers you, too.
Yeah, the first year. Missed out narrowly on the 2nd year and committed to Ferrari for the Manufacturers championship which brought me a lot of joy, although not much success :D

Google never forgets.
 
Why no one is talking about the ridiculous grip some cars have? I was doing Le Mans (circuit experience) with the 908 and thought I was playing a GTA game. Just for the sake of comparison, the entry of the Porsche Curves can be done at 310km/h, while the correct speed would be around 250km/h. Seriously, I want to believe it's a glitch somehow.
I had a serious issue with the rear end snapping suddenly on that challenge in particular. Hbu? Not sure if it’s my wheel settings that aren’t helping the issue or what, but the car is basically undriveable at the limit I found.
 
I am one who forgives most of the unusual handling displayed by some of the cars in game, and tends to stick to those that "drive well" or I have tuned into sedation BUT...

Today trying the Ford GT, stock besides SS tires, and the thing is simply not driveable. It doesn't matter where you are at on throttle... at Blue Moon Bay in the Pan-American race it WILL NOT hold a corner at speed no matter what. It's done. Lift throttle, done. Keep in it. Done. Try to modulate through, and you're sitting there sawing at the wheel []i]trying[.i] to maintain a balance between over and understeer that just isn't there, all the while losing momentum. The GT is lauded for being an excellent car to drive, and though I have driven two examples in the real world, I never had the opportunity to push one near the limits of handling. With that said, it is a completely broken car in game, and very indicative of the issues with some others. This includes the GT based Mach 40, which I can only assume is the same model. Breaking traction with zero steering input past 130mph is just insane nonsense.

Same race, same track in a stock (other than SS tire) Camaro ZL1, and the thing is a million times more planted and confident, even though it'll murder you if you let it. Pretty damning that a wild ass Camaro with 700hp, and some other crazy cars, are a peach to drive next to the GT. This is not reflective of reality at all.

I am only putting this out there for others to chime in as well. While I'm still happy with the game as a whole, I CANNOT WAIT until something is done that brings the whole of it back down to the real world.
 
5/1 in-game FFB (that's max with no clipping) and 100% FFB strength in your wheel. If you got a weak wheel and still don't feel the limit, try to hold the wheel looser (no manly death grip). Also, stop sawing and jerking around for no reason - aim for small, precise and smooth inputs. On the limit, steer with throttle/brake, not your wheel. Use the wheel only to correct when the rear breaks away. If you look at the fastest drivers, like Igor Fraga, he's super smooth and gentle.
Be more sensitive, less fierce.
Less issues?

Why can't this thread be more constructive? 95% of all posts is just whine. It's an interesting topic but you're killing it.
 
5/1 in-game FFB (that's max with no clipping) and 100% FFB strength in your wheel. If you got a weak wheel and still don't feel the limit, try to hold the wheel looser (no manly death grip). Also, stop sawing and jerking around for no reason - aim for small, precise and smooth inputs. On the limit, steer with throttle/brake, not your wheel. Use the wheel only to correct when the rear breaks away. If you look at the fastest drivers, like Igor Fraga, he's super smooth and gentle.
Be more sensitive, less fierce.
Less issues?

Why can't this thread be more constructive? 95% of all posts is just whine. It's an interesting topic but you're killing it.
Because while this is good advice in general, the handling model is still incredibly flawed, and everything you just said doesn't apply. I'm a fast A driver, and there are still cars that are flat out bad. They are terrible to drive in game when this isn't true in real life. The R8 GR3 is in the same boat, loosing traction at 150+, being incredibly unstable in corner entry, and even worse back on throttle. Not realistic in any way. All because of the model.

Lamenting the "thread not being constructive" and then not contributing to the actual conversation might be an issue. With that said, take the Ford GT40 on SH tires and do a FAST lap on Blue Moon Bay, hell any track, without having an issue, and post it back up in here.
 
5/1 in-game FFB (that's max with no clipping) and 100% FFB strength in your wheel. If you got a weak wheel and still don't feel the limit, try to hold the wheel looser (no manly death grip). Also, stop sawing and jerking around for no reason - aim for small, precise and smooth inputs. On the limit, steer with throttle/brake, not your wheel. Use the wheel only to correct when the rear breaks away. If you look at the fastest drivers, like Igor Fraga, he's super smooth and gentle.
Be more sensitive, less fierce.
Less issues?

Why can't this thread be more constructive? 95% of all posts is just whine. It's an interesting topic but you're killing it.
oh I thought I was only supposed to swing back and forth with hand over hand steering and stomping on the pedal

thank you for your constructive feedback and commentary to the subject at hand
 
Statements like this
tells me of a frighteningly low skill level. Guess there will allways be some who doesn`t see or are willing to or able to see no matter what.
I don’t think our or my skill level has anything to do do with my Statement.
I just tried to explain what it feels to me driving the Cars.
With my way of how I approach GT7 I’m having tons of fun and don’t think that GT7 needs an overhaul to its Physics. Some minor tweaks to some default LSD Settings are it needs, at least for me.
Maybe I’m just more flexible in adapting and tricking my mind to make me believe that the Driving Physics are very natural and intuitive.
I always try to find parallels to my real World Driving Experience and from that point of View, my Statement was meant to be.
But realism is not a word that should be used in conjuction with GT7.
Define realism.
For me it’s the perception of recreating the “feel“ of something I define as real. It doesn’t necessarily has to “be real to make me believe it actually is real.
As Long as I can “make“ it make me believe it’s real, I’m fine with it.

first thing I noticed in this game was "Oh, the car has no inertia!!" Cars feels allmost weightless in GT7
Not true for me at least.
I‘m playing with a Fanatec GT DD Pro and I can 100% Guarantee that the inertia can be felt.
Very precise and very accurate.
 
So I'm finally on the bandwagon that the tire model is not progressive enough at the limit. I'm not sure why this seems to effect rear tires so much more strongly than front tires. Steering response, trail braking, and overall front end feel seems pretty accurate. It's only the limit of the rear tires that seems to be a problem. Even weirder, tuned road cars seem to be operating on a completely different physics model than Gr4 cars.
 
No, it is just that i agree that oversteer is exaggerrated on the game. But even some complains here are exaggerrated too.

People played for years GTS, that sucks for real, or stuff like Fm6 that Is even worse,without trying to complains about everything.
Gt7 It Is not accurate as Acc,and It has its problems,as other racing games.
This does not mean It doesn't do a nice job overall,in physics regards.

Personally i find Just traumatic to drive Fwd Road Cars with many hp without TCS.
Not the miata, gt86 or stuff like that as some people wrote here
I like some things about GT Sport, the physics needed a little more work and the penalty system always sucked but right now it's almost more fun to play than GT7. The problem with GT7 physics is they're too unpredictable for cars that especially IRL should be predictable.

No, it wasn't perfect (no game is) but it was pretty good. The poor controller implementation I mentioned has little to do with the overall game physics so I'm not sure what you're getting at.

That's not a name I would use for it.
I can agree AC got some things right and is still fun to play today with the mod support being simply massive and active to this day, where it goes horribly wrong is the default setups on all the cars. Without tuning, most are just bad. Then there's the weak aerodynamic model, far from realism there but does the job I suppose. I won't mention the tyre model all that much since that's a problem with every single sim on the market, as usual.
 
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Lsd is the way.

Start simple, all factory, sport medium/soft tyre

Only Buy lsd full custom.

Start with all value at min 5 5 5

Lsd acell is evil.. keep it VERY low, 5 is fine, more only if the car want it after try and try other solution.

Lsd dec is the stability force.
Balance it value when relasing trottle.
(Low value oversteer, high value more control on brake and trottle release)

I like a little control force (30/50 depending on car and tyre)

Lsd initial torque, instead, can go very high.
It can help a lot to stabilze traction and trottle release
I always prefer rise torque value than touch lsd acc.

If you well balance lsd setting magically tyre response became smooth and pleasant also in comfort tyre.

Give it a try
It can trasform a car behave
 
I had a serious issue with the rear end snapping suddenly on that challenge in particular. Hbu? Not sure if it’s my wheel settings that aren’t helping the issue or what, but the car is basically undriveable at the limit I found.
Yes, same here. I'm using the controller. I realised I had to be very smooth, otherwise the car spins out and is impossible to recover. I managed to get a 3:16,9.
Lift off before the very fast right hander at Indy if you want to be safe.
Through the Porsche Curves, be very gentle on the steering. If you lose the apex, don't try to put the car back into the line; be smooth, you have insane grip, won't lose too much time.
 
I like some things about GT Sport, the physics needed a little more work and the penalty system always sucked but right now it's almost more fun to play than GT7.
In some ways, GT Sport is a lot more fun to play than 7. Not more realistic, but it feels grand to be in command of a racing machine and doing pretty much what you want with it.

So listen. We're all / most of us getting used to GT7's physics. But there is this matter that the cars in some aspects just don't feel or behave right. Some of us use real world racing experience with the same cars, some of us - Scaff - are involved with the technical side of the autoverse, and they're trying to get into the weeds to explain that something is definitely off with some aspects, mostly that elusive bit of code handling the edge of grip, but a few other culprits are likely involved.

And many of us are fairly well steeped in racing game experience. Many if not most of the non-race cars, and a bunch of them, need some help to allow us to race the darn things. Either assists, tuning - which many stock tunes just aren't right - or both. In video games and real life, it's usually fairly intuitive and self-instructive to get behind a wheel, push a car, and learn its personality. GT7 cars are just frooky enough where it counts, pushing the limit, that it makes racing stock unassisted cars kind of a pain because they will bite you without a split second's warning. And often leave you without a clue why.

I love this crazy thing, most of us seem to at least like it, but the "grumpy" side has one big point. The cars need the physics finessed some, and need to communicate these physics better, because it's eluding most of us on the Planet. I expect some action on that stuff very soon, maybe April, and then hopefully we can all have a pizza party in here.

:gtpflag:
 
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4WD cars in this game are really good, too good to be honest. The Focus RS is particularly impressive because it seems to have a trick differential and torque-vectoring system that allows for playful handling on the limit, whilst also providing all-wheel-drive grip when needed. It's a similar story with the Genesis G70 which is a complete revelation after you tune it. I though it'd be a dog but the chassis is shockingly good considering the size and weight. I've basically made it an "N" model with 503 HP, a widebody kit, upgraded suspension, upgraded brakes, upgraded tyres and a new exhaust which sounds ridiculous. What started out as a joke turned into an unlikely hero that drives with the poise of a European sports sedan. Some cars in this game are absolutely brilliant, and I really hope we get the BMW M5 CS because if my modified Genesis is any indication, it will be a monster.
 
I'm serious, I'm going to go looking for threads for where people defend PC3 physics cause that has to be the funniest copium I've ever seen.

Also the more I play the more I'm convinced the issues have less to do with physics and more to do with extremely sensitive steering input.
I wonder what kind of effect it would have if they just took the GTS throttle curve and reversed it.
 
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