Gran Turismo 7 Physics

[GTalaune]

If David Perrel says it was ****, then it was ****. Dude has RACED actual GT3 Ferrari. But couch experts are going to explain how he is wrong.

The biggest problem GT has is its community which half of it has never played any other racing game and defends every decision to death. Game is never going to progress.

I agree the GTS physics are too understeery and can be abused, but any Sim/game can be abused. Initially I was glad to read that the game is now more demanding, but it was obviously broken. Especially the weight transfer felt so weird, almost on/off and not progressive at all when the car snapped.

People who were happy with 5th gear RX8 wheelpsinning at 2k rpm can't talk about physics because they don't understand what it is.

 

[GTalaune]

Also, TCS has never really been well implemented.

I'm not sure how GT models car behavior, but the built-in driving assist of modern sport car are extremely fined tuned and can be in no way compared to GTs TCS.

I would guess that GT models cars in their respective track mode, which most of the time still contains some level of built-in assist regarding stability and traction

 

[Veinz]

What do the top players think? I’d be interested to hear their insights. After more laps in gr3 with rh tires it feels more or less the same, but with less snaps.

 

[DjeeDjee]

What do the top players think? I’d be interested to hear their insights. After more laps in gr3 with rh tires it feels more or less the same, but with less snaps.

They are already complaining mate. Too much grip.

 

[F30clubman]

I wonder whether the top players have been consulted in the change?

 

[DjeeDjee]

If David Perrel says it was *, then it was *. Dude has RACED actual GT3 Ferrari. But couch experts are going to explain how he is wrong.

The biggest problem GT has is its community which half of it has never played any other racing game and defends every decision to death. Game is never going to progress.

I agree the GTS physics are too understeery and can be abused, but any Sim/game can be abused. Initially I was glad to read that the game is now more demanding, but it was obviously broken. Especially the weight transfer felt so weird, almost on/off and not progressive at all when the car snapped.

People who were happy with 5th gear RX8 wheelpsinning at 2k rpm can't talk about physics because they don't understand what it is.

Well, first David Perel never said it was ****.

Then what I say is that he is probably comparing a real GT3 experience on a car that is built to have TC ON, very well simulated in ACC for example, to Gran Turismo where you have to switch it OFF in order to extract everything from the car. So yes, a GT3 that spins when you put your foot on the floor on corner exit is not lunacy to me.

Once again, today it is ON/OFF, no matter what you do, I bet you can take your old PS1 controller and play with X as throttle it would work. And this is where he opens his reflection with a "?" by saying "have they over corrected?".
The answer is Yes, also according to top players.

 

[GTalaune]

OK, he didn't said it was ****. He said it was terrible.

 

[MarrGuitar]

Kie however is comparing ACC to GT7 which is quite funny because you don't race in ACC without TC (like IRL), it's actually very hard to stay on track without it. He plays GT7 all day long, he should know that as we don't use TC in GT because it makes you slower. It should be the opposite effect actually. So comparing feelings in ACC with TC ON vs GT7 with TC OFF is not relevant.

Okay so let’s compare what it feels like to race on ACC with TC OFF with GT7 TC OFF.

ACC recently got the Porsche 992 Cup car added as DLC, which doesn’t have TC at all. I’ve raced it a few times, and whilst you absolutely have to respect that it has no TC and adjust your driving accordingly, it doesn’t just spit you into the barriers for seemingly no reason. You can feel what the tyres are doing because the FFB is nice and detailed. When it starts to lose traction you can catch the car, it doesn’t just snap and go into a unrecoverable spin. It has plenty of grip. Tyres don’t instantly turn into ice cubes the moment you go over the limit. That was the major problem with GT7 before the physics update, now it’s a lot better.

 

[venancio]

Going through the licenses again I think PD overdid with the adjustment, there is too much grip now, there is no throttle play you can just smash it the car won't step out, too much understeer, feels like the cars have a tail fin forcing them to realign.

I too was of the opinion that, before 1.13 the cars were to sensitive and prone to oversteer at very little throttle inputs and steering angle, but now it's the oposite.

PD is swinging the hammer too hard either way, they can make it hit a sweet spot between over/understeer.

I don't have the means to reach out to PD, but the guys that are GT World Tour finalists could put in a word that they overdid with the adjustment on the algorithm.

 

[GTalaune]

Haven't tried myself yet, only said that is was shocking before. Wouldn't surprise me that PD would overcorrect and say "see we knew we were right before!!" and revert to a terrible state. They are going to kill GT

 

[Fredzy]

Also, TCS has never really been well implemented.

After a bit of experimentation last night, I don't think I'll ever need to use TC again if they leave it like this

Road cars with comfort and sport tires seem pretty good. Racing tires.. yeah, glued to the road. I wonder if they applied a band-aid with the tire changes made in patch 1.07, and that band-aid should have come off when they fixed whatever the root cause issue was there with 1.13?

 

[DjeeDjee]

Okay so let’s compare what it feels like to race on ACC with TC OFF with GT7 TC OFF.

ACC recently got the Porsche 992 Cup car added as DLC, which doesn’t have TC at all. I’ve raced it a few times, and whilst you absolutely have to respect that it has no TC and adjust your driving accordingly, it doesn’t just spit you into the barriers for seemingly no reason. You can feel what the tyres are doing because the FFB is nice and detailed. When it starts to lose traction you can catch the car, it doesn’t just snap and go into a unrecoverable spin. It has plenty of grip. Tyres don’t instantly turn into ice cubes the moment you go over the limit. That was the major problem with GT7 before the physics update, now it’s a lot better.

Yes, good start. Even if the Porsche is an RR car so it has a lot of traction naturally thanks to the weight on the rear-end.
I suggest you do that on a high torque FR car, like an AMG or a BMW for example.

 

[Emet_PL]

Physics for RWD cars was a bit off before... but now it's off again but in oposite direction.
What's more I have noticed that when playing on gamepad the car is countersteering by itself during a slide even when "steering asist" and all other driving assists are set to "OFF".

 

[DjeeDjee]

Going through the licenses again I think PD overdid with the adjustment, there is too much grip now, there is no throttle play you can just smash it the car won't step out, too much understeer, feels like the cars have a tail fin forcing them to realign.

I too was of the opinion that, before 1.13 the cars were to sensitive and prone to oversteer at very little throttle inputs and steering angle, but now it's the oposite.

PD is swinging the hammer too hard either way, they can make it hit a sweet spot between over/understeer.

I don't have the means to reach out to PD, but the guys that are GT World Tour finalists could put in a word that they overdid with the adjustment on the algorithm.

Too much understeer is probably normal as they apply a default setup to all the cars so they wanted probably to let the simmer able to tune his car like he wants with a certain amount of oversteer available.

 

[Firestone]

Now if they could fix a car like an Evo VI losing grip in a straight line in the wet at less than 70mph, that would be great. Cars don't fall off the road that easily in standing water at that speed with modern tyres, let alone one with 4WD.

Tires can fall off in the wet with AWD. AWD doesn’t make the car some wet weather god. What AWD does is make traction under acceleration more efficient. I’ve driven my rl car in heavy storms and it’s just as sketchy as rwd with standing water. With the game, this is how it should be.

 

[JDMKING13]

I normally use a two tire system in my league street rating and track rating, so if you owned a 350z for example, on the streets/light track events you would use CS… for full blown track day the tires drop down to comfort mediums… but the CS just feel to sticky to me.. when I give the Z the mediums it reminds me of the physics before just with better grip and the ability to catch the car better. I’m thinking of just using my track rating tires as stock. I’m glad the cars are easier to control for everyone now but the grip levels have went up big time…

 

[NevilleNobody]

No idea if this is going to help me or not. I am only interested in race cars for the most part. For all the drama with snap oversteer, most race cars were not half bad. In GT7 I am using TC1, I find it very intrusive in fast corners like the exit of the Senna S in Brazil. However, at a place like Turn 3 in Austria (the super tight, up hill right hander), it was pretty clear that guys without TC were losing it and really struggling as the rubber wore down.

I just tried the vette in Group 4 and my goodness, I don't need TC, like WHAT THE HELL. Keep in mind i use the X button so I am ham fisted at best. I am a little worried this "fix" is going to leave me in no mans land between 0 TC and TC1 and hurt me as other guys spin less LOL .

 

[venancio]

I normally use a two tire system in my league street rating and track rating, so if you owned a 350z for example, on the streets/light track events you would use CS… for full blown track day the tires drop down to comfort mediums… but the CS just feel to sticky to me.. when I give the Z the mediums it reminds me of the physics before just with better grip and the ability to catch the car better. I’m thinking of just using my track rating tires as stock. I’m glad the cars are easier to control for everyone now but the grip levels have went up big time…

They have options, like you said, feels like there is a lot of grip now, maybe they can just reduce the tire grip a little bit, with the suspension geometry algorithm adjusted they tamed the weight transfer, so probably reducing the grip levels on the tires can reach a middle ground between before and after the pacth.

 

[Nielsen]

So many comments implying tires have changed for the better…

If you feel improved improved traction on a specific tire compound, then it’s because of the changes to the “geometry calculations algorithm for the suspension”. Tires weren’t mentioned in the patch notes, and grip is the same as before.

 

[Firestone]

I spent a lot time last night with the production cars and was pleased with the update. Over driving can still punish you hard, but now you can push harder on exit with RWD cars which makes them a lot more fun to drive. Before I said I felt the moved sideways, but now I feel this is an improvement. FFB is better and the road feeling feels improved.
As far as lap times goes, I think they conditioned us to be better drivers with the past physics. Max be this was PDs plan all along. lol.

As far as race cars go, I’ve only tested the Gr.3 cars and feel they overdone the grip. I can basically mash the throttle anywhere with no consequence. Tires feel like they are magnetized to the surface of the road and don’t get unsettled for anything. I find it interesting people complaining about the R8, but wasn’t it the fastest car at release during the Daytona race with proper tuning? I used the tune that was floating around and it was very nice to drive. I just think the base tune was crap and didn’t work for BoP. I feel that they approached a cheap way to fix BoP some since people hated tuning.

 

[F30clubman]

Too much understeer is probably normal as they apply a default setup to all the cars so they wanted probably to let the simmer able to tune his car like he wants with a certain amount of oversteer available.

I'd agree 100% for that, but only for race cars. Cannot be you have to buy a race suspension for a road car for it to drive realisticly, but you'd probably agree with that too.

 

[F30clubman]

People, remember the guy who asked us early in the game: "are you familiar with the concept partial throttle? It is not to consider the throttle pedal as an on/off button".

Sounded a bit weard that it had to be said to the players, but I'm starting now to understand why. Looks like PD gave in and made GT7 suitable again for on/off throttle drivers ...

Not the right direction imo.

 

[I-Runner]

Looks like PD gave in and made GT7 suitable again for on/off throttle drivers ...

No they don't, due to some limitation to my left hand I can't use R2/L2 to accelerate or braking (and I'm not used to R3 too), so I have to use X and square and some cars are impossible, for me, to drive without TCS .

IR

 

[JDMKING13]

If anyone has the Supra Rz 97 Can you please do me a favor.. can you try to get a time at Tsukuba with CM tires with just ABS weak on. I’m at a 1:10.7

I am actually really enjoying the driving with downgraded tires 🛞 it’s not going to be everyone’s cup of tea but for me it’s a sweet spot!

Edit: sorry I forgot to put the track 😂

 

[Tenacious D]

can you try to get a time with CM tires with just ABS weak on

A time where? Deep Forest? I'm about to fire up GT7 after another tea and try out some sports cars and different tires. I need to see what the fuss is after spending yesterday with Tomahawk.

 

[JDMKING13]

A time where? Deep Forest? I'm about to fire up GT7 after another tea and try out some sports cars and different tires. I need to see what the fuss is after spending yesterday with Tomahawk.

I’m sorry I just edited the post.. it was at Tsukuba it’s not my best track… just wanted to see some times.. it would greatly help me for league play… you can also PM your time if that makes anyone more comfortable thank you!

 

[Td04]

If anyone has the Supra Rz 97 Can you please do me a favor.. can you try to get a time at Tsukuba with CM tires with just ABS weak on. I’m at a 1:10.7

I am actually really enjoying the driving with downgraded tires 🛞 it’s not going to be everyone’s cup of tea but for me it’s a sweet spot!

Edit: sorry I forgot to put the track 😂

I tryed It at Laguna seca, with Cs,and my best lap was 1.46.625..
I am not really fast

 

[Terronium-12]

Interesting discussions about what the top players think and whether or not they've been consulted.

I mean this will all due respect, but am I alone in not caring what they think? I want a console sim to get as close to real world racing as feasible with the use of real-world datasets, not what the top players think the car should behave like.

 

[Veinz]

Interesting discussions about what the top players think and whether or not they've been consulted.

I mean this will all due respect, but am I alone in not caring what they think? I want a console sim to get as close to real world racing as feasible with the use of real-world datasets, not what the top players think the car should behave like.

I just trust the opinions of players who know how to get the most out of whatever they use, especially guys like Fraga who raced professionally irl.

 

[RedRockValley]

Interesting discussions about what the top players think and whether or not they've been consulted.

I mean this will all due respect, but am I alone in not caring what they think? I want a console sim to get as close to real world racing as feasible with the use of real-world datasets, not what the top players think the car should behave like.

Yeah, atleast Igor Fraga has had plenty of real seat-time.

As for those top players saying that the physics are for the worse, I have no idea, but I'm going to assume they've only really been involved in esports.