Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion

[TayeezSA]

I wonder if GTS will have Race BGM or if I'll have to use the PS4 media player.

Imagine if PD did a remix of this for the intro of GTS ir GT7 even. I guess it would work, premium cars and all

 

[Soundtrack]

That's not true, and I'll ignore that you're implying that I'm still coming to my opinions based on no facts.

Firstly, that both Polyphony and Sony have not released any information after the release trailer.
Secondly, the Facebook guy has been very, very cagey when asked when the next information can be expected.
Thirdly, we are extremely close to the end of the time period that Polyphony specified for open beta release.

These things, combined with Polyphony's past behaviour on such matters, could very well lead someone to conclude that there's a reasonable likelihood that something is up. On the other hand, someone of a more positive frame of mind might dismiss all these as not important.

Neither is wrong, as we're all here basically speculating, but saying that there's nothing to suggest that they're not on schedule isn't really correct.



It fits into Sony's disclosed timeframe.

It does not fit into Polyphony's disclosed timeframe.



Of course it isn't. But prior performance is the best predictor of future behaviour.

Polyphony have done this twice now. With GT5 they dragged out development for a long time, and released a game that was pretty rocky at release (although by Spec 2.0 it was a pretty impressive thing). With GT6 they released two thirds of a game, and spent the next two years patching stuff in. Even "completed" GT6 is arguably a worse game than GT5 was, depending on how you value certain facets of gameplay and physics. That's the last ten years or so of Polyphony development right there.

I grow very, very wary at any hints that they're going to do the same thing again. I want them to deliver a quality game, and without jerking their customers around. This is 2016, and there are plenty of capable social and communications experts out there.

Sony and Polyphony are wasting the value of their biggest frachise by not using it properly. And I hate to see it because I used to like Gran Turismo. There are still some things I like about GT5 and GT6, when they're not annoying the crap out of me. GT has all the ingredients to be unquestionably the best console racing game, and probably the best generalist racing game period (in the sense of being something that can cater to a very wide range of people). But they're burning their goodwill, and they're making games that are flawed both in execution and design. It's frustrating to watch something that you loved with so much potential squander it.

IMO, both Final Fantasy and Gran Turismo have gone from being kings of their respective genres on PS1 and PS2 to average games that sell well mostly because of the brand. I hope that FF15 turns it around for Final Fantasy, and GTS for Gran Turismo. But both Polyphony and Squeenix need to sell me on it, and Polyphony isn't doing well with their current campaign of nothingness.

One can hope objectivity does not relate to a particular state of mind be it optimism or pessimism.

I see no point into debating this any further as a campaign of nothingness is sterile by nature. Will stick to the bits of information communicated from a get go by the publisher of the game (feel free to consider them second hand), who, IMHO, has the upper hand here, and will accordingly evaluate whether or not the title is in a potentially critical status.

 

[Imari]

One can hope objectivity does not relate to a particular state of mind be it optimism or pessimism.

The objective assessment is that there's plenty of information that can potentially be used to form a negative opinion of the state of GTS development. So, not what you said when this came up:

There is nothing to suggest that they are beyond schedule at this point...

Whether one forms a negative opinion from that information or not depends on how optimistic or pessimistic you are. Your opinion on this matter is subjective. And opinions are what we've got as neither the developer or the publisher see fit to give us direct information about the project, all we have are hints and inferences which can be interpreted many different ways. Depending, as I originally said, on your frame of mind.

 

[Tornado]

I trust what I read: Spring 2016.

99% trust?

 

[Johnnypenso]

99% trust?

Probably the same level of trust he had that PD would be providing regular news on contents after the announcement of the next game.

GT7 will be announced when it's ready, as was the case with Gran Turismo PSP and Gran Turismo 6. After, there will be regular news on contents.

 

[JKgo]

Probably the same level of trust he had that PD would be providing regular news on contents after the announcement of the next game.

...Technically, Zlork's yet to be proven wrong on that prediction though - GT7 hasn't been announced yet!!

 

[Tornado]

"As was the case with Gran Turismo PSP"

 

[CSLACR]

Needless to say, I'm not surprised to say, a month later, that there is still nothing on GTS

 

[ron86]

I dont know any official definition of "early" in regards of months in a year.

So to say April is the deadline is wrong in my opinion.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

In South Africa, Spring ends mid-October.

Well it's obvious why it does

I probably wouldn't class Rocket League as a racing game at all, but that's just me.

Yeah but when you've had dedicated racing games, do exactly what Rocket league was doing...like top gear soccer in Forza. Then it's not so far fetched. I see your point though.

 

[Samus]

It's amazing how people read what they want to read and ignore what doesn't fit their agenda. I'm certain if it was the other way round people would be telling us only to listen to PD and the PS Blog is not a good source. But because they don't want to believe the game is behind they're clinging to the blog and ignoring PD, or ignoring what words mean.

Early means early. Is Wednesday early in the week? No, it's the middle. Is 11am early in the day? No. If a woman said she was in the early stage of pregnancy would that be 4 months in? No.

Is May early in the year? No, it's in the middle. Anyone without an agenda would believe that.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Personally, i love cars, and i love racing games with no open world or stuff like that. Just quick race with nice cars. What do I got on my PS4? DriveClub, that's all.

I know it's just my personal interest but, there was a lot of games like that.

PS: Hey, I just wanted to say that Gran Turismo never was hyper realistic, and that's obvious. And i honestly think that if GT would be a real sim it will lose a lot of its fanbase and players without wheels etc. The Gran Turismo series sold millions of copies, those millions aren't pro-sim gamers.

No it's not...Drive Club does exist but there are nice cars in PCars and in F1 2015 and the newest iteration of Dirt. I'm pretty sure you could go to the Sony website put genre and you'll get several games fitting this vast description you put of "quick race with nice cars."

Also why would it lose it's fanbase, because of this so called mystique you and others are starting to go on about? Which is something that always tends to happen a few times in these general GT"X" threads. Point is that special feeling you get or any other emotions shouldn't have a bearing on why PD is behind schedule or what people give them an out.

 

[TayeezSA]

In South Africa, Spring ends mid-October.

Heita dah boss.

GTS dead in the middle of Winter I bet.

 

[Soundtrack]

The objective assessment is that there's plenty of information that can potentially be used to form a negative opinion of the state of GTS development. So, not what you said when this came up:



Whether one forms a negative opinion from that information or not depends on how optimistic or pessimistic you are. Your opinion on this matter is subjective. And opinions are what we've got as neither the developer or the publisher see fit to give us direct information about the project, all we have are hints and inferences which can be interpreted many different ways. Depending, as I originally said, on your frame of mind.

I’m baffled, from a campaign of nothingness to plenty of information in the scope of one post. Perplexing. Both the developer and publisher gave us direct information at the October unveil. They have remained mostly tight-lipped on the subject ever since so no further evidence can be objectively considered*. Yes we can speculate, and yes speculations are by nature exclusively subjective; interpreting silence as a bad sign is a perfect example. Still we got “early 2016” and “spring 2016”. Why would you discard one of them?

* with the exception of SIEE President France Benelux/VP South Europe Philippe Cardon suggesting Gran Turismo being on track for 2016, hence on schedule.

It's amazing how people read what they want to read and ignore what doesn't fit their agenda. I'm certain if it was the other way round people would be telling us only to listen to PD and the PS Blog is not a good source. But because they don't want to believe the game is behind they're clinging to the blog and ignoring PD, or ignoring what words mean.

Early means early. Is Wednesday early in the week? No, it's the middle. Is 11am early in the day? No. If a woman said she was in the early stage of pregnancy would that be 4 months in? No.

Is May early in the year? No, it's in the middle. Anyone without an agenda would believe that.

“Early”: strictly taken against its antonym “late” cuts a piece in two. Translating this to a year gives you 2 parts of 6 months each. Agreed, adding a middle to the concept will give you 3 parts of 4 months. In the absence of correlation with other pieces of information, privileging one interpretation over the other is completely up to the individual.

“Spring”: despite its flaws is completely objectifiable. As long as you put aside the confusion of what hemisphere you have to consider the season; confusion factually resolved by a localized Latin America post stating “autumn”. The vernal equinox is very tangible and is precisely monitored by astronomers. That timeframe should therefore be no subject of controversy.

Now, with one of the two informations indisputably cleared, why would you objectively persist in privileging an interpretation that restricts the convergence between the two? Aren’t these concomitant pieces of informations supposedly addressing the same subject?

Just a thought.

 

[Samus]

In the context of time who only uses early and late without a middle? We use halves and quarters, ie "first half of the year" but I don't know anyone who would call June early in the year or July late in the year. I was born in June, i'd never say I was born early in the year, would you? If it was 12pm are we still early in the day? No, we even have a word for that. Mid-day.

 

[1241Penguin]

I can't say I'm surprised but I find it amusing how some threads in this sub-forum have degraded into a mental gymnastics session.

 

[chrisspeed281]

 

[Scaff]

* with the exception of SIEE President France Benelux/VP South Europe Philippe Cardon suggesting Gran Turismo being on track for 2016, hence on schedule.

I'm baffled that someone who has gone to such great pains to insist that the term early must be used in this case subjectively would then try and bolster that with a misquote (which is neither objective or subjective, its simply wrong).

He did not say 2016, he said this year! Now if you follow your own path you have actually done your own early = spring; as 'this year' could mean either calender or business year.

You have taken a subjective quote and turned in into an objective fact, in a post in which you rail against people doing just that.

 

[cutmeamango]

It's amazing how people read what they want to read and ignore what doesn't fit their agenda. I'm certain if it was the other way round people would be telling us only to listen to PD and the PS Blog is not a good source. But because they don't want to believe the game is behind they're clinging to the blog and ignoring PD, or ignoring what words mean.

Early means early. Is Wednesday early in the week? No, it's the middle. Is 11am early in the day? No. If a woman said she was in the early stage of pregnancy would that be 4 months in? No.

Is May early in the year? No, it's in the middle. Anyone without an agenda would believe that.

And English is your first language.

Wait, a day has 24 hours.

So from 0:00 to 8:00 is early.
8:00 to 16:00 is "middle".
And 16:00 to 00:00 is late.

Woke up at 9am? You woke up at the middle of the day!

But you'll probably say "I'm working with 9 to 5 worker sleep schedules!". Give or take 2 hour window times.

So 20-hour day; 4:00 to 10:30 is early.
10:30 to 17:00 is middle.
The rest is late.



A week has seven days. Do you divide units by 3? Or week hours? Does it go 3-1-3, or 2-3-2, or 2-2-3?

My goodness, at least Imari's theory was an understandable over-read.

I'm baffled that someone who has gone to such great pains to insist that the term early must be used in this case subjectively would then try and bolster that with a misquote (which is neither objective or subjective, its simply wrong).

He did not say 2016, he said this year! Now if you follow your own path you have actually done your own early = spring; as 'this year' could mean either calender or business year.

You have taken a subjective quote and turned in into an objective fact, in a post in which you rail against people doing just that.

2016, une année cruciale pour PlayStation?

Pour beaucoup 2015 devait être le pic dans le cycle des consoles de 8egénération, avant d’entrer sur un plateau, une phase plus stable. Mais nous considérons que 2016 va être encore une année de croissance. Ce sera une meilleure année pour le software et une très grande année pour le hardware. Nous nous attendons à vendre encore beaucoup de consoles. Et puis il y a Uncharted 4: a Thief's End, l’événement de Sony pour cette année. C’est notre plus grosse sortie de l’année avec Gran Turismo et le grand retour de The Last Guardian. Et bien sûr, le PlayStation VR arrive.

You should have just said "He didn't say if it was 2016 calendar or fiscal". Even though the reductive and charitable interpretation is that the reporter asks about the "calendar year" since "fiscal year" is the one that begs qualification in a statement.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

View attachment 541251

Handy.

Unfortunately, folks will soon point out that, as the PS Blog was the source of "Spring" and not PD, it doesn't mean anything.

Besides, even if we blow well into the summer without so much as a hint of the public beta, there's always Sony to blame.

In the context of time who only uses early and late without a middle? We use halves and quarters, ie "first half of the year" but I don't know anyone who would call June early in the year or July late in the year. I was born in June, i'd never say I was born early in the year, would you? If it was 12pm are we still early in the day? No, we even have a word for that. Mid-day.

Huh. I was born June 29th. About as close to the middle of the year as possible. Whoops, nope: I'm an early-part-of-the-year baby!

 

[Soundtrack]

I'm baffled that someone who has gone to such great pains to insist that the term early must be used in this case subjectively would then try and bolster that with a misquote (which is neither objective or subjective, its simply wrong).

He did not say 2016, he said this year! Now if you follow your own path you have actually done your own early = spring; as 'this year' could mean either calender or business year.

You have taken a subjective quote and turned in into an objective fact, in a post in which you rail against people doing just that.

It wasn't that painful. Care to explain how a claim of a Sony executive isn't an objective bit of information? And yes 2016 appears in Philippe Cardon interview.

 

[Scaff]

And English is your first language.

Wait, a day has 24 hours.

So from 0:00 to 8:00 is early.
8:00 to 16:00 is "middle".
And 16:00 to 00:00 is late.

Woke up at 9am? You woke up at the middle of the day!

But you'll probably say "I'm working with 9 to 5 worker sleep schedules!". Give or take 2 hour window times.

So 20-hour day; 4:00 to 10:30 is early.
10:30 to 17:00 is middle.
The rest is late.



A week has seven days. Do you divide units by 3? Or week hours? Does it go 3-1-3, or 2-3-2, or 2-2-3?

My goodness, at least Imari's theory was an understandable over-read.

It was quite clearly used in the form of an analogy rather than an exact breakdown.

2016, une année cruciale pour PlayStation?

Pour beaucoup 2015 devait être le pic dans le cycle des consoles de 8egénération, avant d’entrer sur un plateau, une phase plus stable. Mais nous considérons que 2016 va être encore une année de croissance. Ce sera une meilleure année pour le software et une très grande année pour le hardware. Nous nous attendons à vendre encore beaucoup de consoles. Et puis il y a Uncharted 4: a Thief's End, l’événement de Sony pour cette année. C’est notre plus grosse sortie de l’année avec Gran Turismo et le grand retour de The Last Guardian. Et bien sûr, le PlayStation VR arrive.

You should have just said "He didn't say if it was 2016 calendar or fiscal". Even though the reductive and charitable interpretation is that the reporter asks about the "calendar year" since "fiscal year" is the one that begs qualification in a statement.

And I took my quote from the homepage here at GT Planet, which means you should take issue with the author of that piece.

I will however make one thing quite clear, if you can't comment on other members contributions without resorting to an overly mocking tone then you have no place here.

It wasn't that painful. Care to explain how a claim of a Sony executive isn't an objective bit of information? And yes 2016 appears in Philippe Cardon interview.

It doesn't in the English language version reported here at GT Planet, as such I withdraw that.

 

[Imari]

I’m baffled, from a campaign of nothingness to plenty of information in the scope of one post. Perplexing.

Not really. The absence of something can just as easily provide information as the presence of something.

If the sun failed to rise tomorrow, then that absence of an event would give you a certain amount of information from which you could begin to speculate. It's not enough on it's own for you to figure out exactly why the sun didn't rise, but you can start guessing at possibilities.

Traditionally, developers and publishers continue to trickle marketing after their initial unveil. The absence of any marketing is information in itself, as is the absence of the open beta.

Still we got “early 2016” and “spring 2016”. Why would you discard one of them?

I haven't. You're the one who is determined to only accept Spring.

I'm still considering both, but I'm also aware that considering both means that one of them is three days from being over without any information from Polyphony.


I'll remind you of some more information for you to consider. The Japanese version of the Playstation blog doesn't say spring. It uses the same Japanese phrase for "early year" that the Japanese version of Polyphony's site uses. I've copied my analysis of that phrase below for others that haven't seen it, but I know I've already linked it to you.

This is the blog page in question.

https://www.jp.playstation.com/blog/detail/1776/20151028-gt.html

To me, this sort of increases the probability that the divergent English is a case of mistranslations, although it's always possible that it's not. But for me, there's the Japanese and English Polyphony sites and the Japanese Playstation blog all sending the same message, January to April. And the English Playstation blog is an outlier with spring.

Spring may be correct, but it's certainly odd. Especially when you consider that it's fairly likely that the original version of that press release is probably the Japanese.

============

View attachment 541251

I'm going to copy a post that I made earlier because I think it got skipped over by a lot of people. It contains relevant information for the early/spring debate, if one is consider them as two different ways of saying the same timeframe.

Let me take us a little more into the mind of what Polyphony think. Because Polyphony didn't write those English pages, someone translated them from the Japanese. So let's take a look at the source.

The official gran-turismo.com site and the Playstation blog both use exactly the same phrase in Japanese, 初旬. I've never seen it used with years before, it's usually used with months but in that situation it denotes the first third (or ten days in the case of a month). It's part of a natural system of dividing into thirds, and there's no real way to interpret it as half at all. That would be written completely differently.

By the Japanese text, the intention would be for the beta to start somewhere from January to April. May would be beyond what they've written. This is not vague, this is simply a poor English translation.

 

[Samus]

Days are different because we have two uses, the full 24hr day and day/night. Yes, in the context of a full day we do wake up in the middle of it at 9am but in terms of daylight hours it is early. My point was time usually has an early, middle and late. We all use the phrases "Middle of the week", " Middle of the year", we don't just go by early and late in that context.

 

[Soundtrack]

My bad for not understanding Japanese, google will however translate 初 as "first" and 旬 as "season". It is probably due to google having a biased/subjective view on the matter, so I will not try to elaborate how this could be remotely linked with the concept of spring. Symbolics of seasons are indeed subjective.

It's official, I'm out.

 

[GTEFGHA]

Days are different because we have two uses, the full 24hr day and day/night. Yes, in the context of a full day we do wake up in the middle of it at 9am but in terms of daylight hours it is early. My point was time usually has an early, middle and late. We all use the phrases "Middle of the week", " Middle of the year", we don't just go by early and late in that context.

I like how someone said the same thing like 100 pages ago

 

[Losco]

No it's not...Drive Club does exist but there are nice cars in PCars and in F1 2015 and the newest iteration of Dirt. I'm pretty sure you could go to the Sony website put genre and you'll get several games fitting this vast description you put of "quick race with nice cars."

Also why would it lose it's fanbase, because of this so called mystique you and others are starting to go on about? Which is something that always tends to happen a few times in these general GT"X" threads. Point is that special feeling you get or any other emotions shouldn't have a bearing on why PD is behind schedule or what people give them an out.

I bought Dirt and I'm loving it. I sold Project Cars after a couple of weeks, it's too much realistic. I didn't like it.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I bought Dirt and I'm loving it. I sold Project Cars after a couple of weeks, it's too much realistic. I didn't like it.

...I'm so confused, "too much realistic"...yet you are talking and arguing for a game that strives and markets itself as the most realistic driver and racing sim.

 

[Samus]

I like how someone said the same thing like 100 pages ago

Probably me to be honest, we've been doing this for months for the precise reason that we have no beta and nothing else to talk about. It's all rather pointless but hey, it fills the procrastination hours of the day.

Mind you it'll be interesting how things turn if we get beyond Spring and still no beta. I imagine we'll be arguing about hemispheres.

 

[RACECAR]

If the sun failed to rise tomorrow, then that absence of an event would give you a certain amount of information from which you could begin to speculate. It's not enough on it's own for you to figure out exactly why the sun didn't rise, but you can start guessing at possibilities.

Who would I lay blame on if the Sun were not to rise? Would it be Helios? Apollo? Wadjet? Sekhmet?

I bought Dirt and I'm loving it. I sold Project Cars after a couple of weeks, it's too much realistic. I didn't like it.

You sold a game that you thought was "Too realistic", yet you stuck with a game that, from what I've heard anyway, its pretty realistic (or at least is the best Rally sim since Richard Burns Rally).