Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion

[PzR Slim]

For everyone else, GT literally just appearing on PS4 is enough.

Any company thinking in those terms is a recipe for a bad product and eventual failure.

 

[jm79]

Any company thinking in those terms is a recipe for a bad product and eventual failure.

I was talking about sales figures only, to counter your point about it needing a stellar return.
As for quality, I'm getting no impression they're resting on their laurels - the drastic changes for GTS signal to me the exact opposite. Sticking your neck out and trying something new is a good sign, in my opinion.

 

[NLxAROSA]

Surely they can't delay the game by twelve months??

I'm helping you hoping, but since they didn't mention something more specific like 'Spring' or 'Summer' (I won't say 'early' since that's apparently a difficult concept around here) I'll assume the worst. If it's sooner than holiday 2017 then I'm pleasantly surprised.

 

[DR_SID]

No, they don't. They have a staff of about seventy that are actually T10 employees and they contract the rest as necessary. The total number of people that work on a Forza game is about 300-400, but that doesn't mean that they're all working all the time.

I wouldn't be surprised if the total number of man hours that T10 pays for in two years is roughly the same as Polyphony with their 200 full time staff.

"They got a staff over 300+ people." Staff incorporates both contracted and full time employees. Where exactly did I say all 300 are full time employees?

 

[Imari]

"They got a staff over 300+ people." Staff incorporates both contracted and full time employees. Where exactly did I say all 300 are full time employees?


View attachment 581816

My apologies then, I thought you simply didn't know.

Most people don't consider contractors to be employees of the company they're contracted to. They either work for themselves or the contracting company, and that contracting company is contracted to deliver some product or service.

If I contract Joe's Widget Factory to make widgets for me, generally I wouldn't say that all the people in the widget factory work for me. They work for Joe.

Perhaps in your part of the world it's different, but it seems confusing to say that modellers work for both T10, Microsoft, Glassegg and Playground all at the same time. Much easier to say that they work for Glassegg and the other companies contract work from them.

 

[sems4arsenal]

People saying PD should outsource, they're a 150 man studio. One Hundered and Fifty

 

[Imari]

I don't have two consoles. Many others don't either, and this is more of a divide with paid online subs. Therefore, it doesn't even matter if Forza is 10 or 100 times better, on PlayStation, GT is still the king.

Well now, let's not forget about us plebs with ZERO consoles. Which one is better is very relevant if we're ever to buy a console. That's why console exclusives exist, to give people reasons to buy one console over the other.

It doesn't need a stellar return - that's what the hardcore fans want. For everyone else, GT literally just appearing on PS4 is enough.

Let's be honest, if you got a crap game with a GT sticker on the front you'd be disappointed. Your expectations may be different than some others, but you still have them.

There's the old joke with a BMW badge stuck on a turd. It's funny because it's an exaggeration, but nobody would actually buy a turd with a BMW badge on it just cos they were a fan of BMW. Just appearing on PS4 isn't enough for GTS, not for you, not for anyone. If it was they'd have just rebadged GT6 by now and got it over with, or sold you some broken mess of a game instead of delaying to bring it up to standard.

You want a playable game that's fun and entertaining, just like everyone else. What constitutes a fun and entertaining game for you may be different to others, but I don't believe for a minute that you're silly enough to actually knowingly buy an awful game just because it's GT. Polyphony know that, and that's why they delayed.

 

[queleuleu]

People saying PD should outsource, they're a 150 man studio. One Hundered and Fifty

Kaz said 200 in a E3 interview. But a little bit of outsourcing could help Poly. You don't need a master of 3D modeling for some tasks like some trackside objects missing in the Tokyo track...

 

[jm79]

Let's be honest, if you got a crap game with a GT sticker on the front you'd be disappointed. Your expectations may be different than some others, but you still have them.

There's the old joke with a BMW badge stuck on a turd. It's funny because it's an exaggeration, but nobody would actually buy a turd with a BMW badge on it just cos they were a fan of BMW. Just appearing on PS4 isn't enough for GTS, not for you, not for anyone. If it was they'd have just rebadged GT6 by now and got it over with, or sold you some broken mess of a game instead of delaying to bring it up to standard.

You want a playable game that's fun and entertaining, just like everyone else. What constitutes a fun and entertaining game for you may be different to others, but I don't believe for a minute that you're silly enough to actually knowingly buy an awful game just because it's GT. Polyphony know that, and that's why they delayed.

As i said just before, those quotes - I was talking to @PzR Slim about sales figures. Here is what I thought about actual game quality:

As for quality, I'm getting no impression they're resting on their laurels - the drastic changes for GTS signal to me the exact opposite. Sticking your neck out and trying something new is a good sign, in my opinion.

Maybe that wasn't clear.

 

[sems4arsenal]

Kaz said 200 in a E3 interview. But a little bit of outsourcing could help Poly. You don't need a master of 3D modeling for some tasks like some trackside objects missing in the Tokyo track...

But 150 people is more than enough to get things done, which is why what PD have shown so far makes no sense, how can a studio this big with that much talent have so little to show.

 

[syntex123]

Probably because Kaz is a perfectionist, he never gets satisfied. I wouldn't be surprised if they rework a lot of already done content because he isn't satisfied with it.

 

[C_Raccoon23]

Probably because Kaz is a perfectionist, he never gets satisfied. I wouldn't be surprised if they rework a lot of already done content because he isn't satisfied with it.

A problem arises when you work on something too much and don't know when to say, "Okay, this is done."

 

[syntex123]

In Kaz's head - it's never done.

 

[NLxAROSA]

In Kaz's head - it's never done.

Which is ok, just release it as a continuously improving title. Like basically any MMO, Destiny, etc. etc.

 

[DonZonda]

When I did the TT at Sydney Motorsport Park, I mentioned about the sense of speed(I was defaulted to bumper cam for qualifying). To me, there was none.

Same for the Gamescom Demo I tried. The problem is pretty clear for me though, an extremely narrow FOV which kills the sense of speed and lack of advanced motion blur like in Pcars, Dirt Rally and Forza for example.
Shiny razorsharp textures repeating over and over again wont benefit the sense of speed either.

 

[Samus]

But 150 people is more than enough to get things done, which is why what PD have shown so far makes no sense, how can a studio this big with that much talent have so little to show.

Well in terms of cars it's presumably primarily because of the insane detail that goes into each one, the individual stitching and so on. I mean sure it's amazing detail that you notice in photomode but is it worth it, when all that detail means less cars overall?

 

[Heavyduke]

After seeing a SF-R, I expected a Race version.

 

[sems4arsenal]

Well in terms of cars it's presumably primarily because of the insane detail that goes into each one, the individual stitching and so on. I mean sure it's amazing detail that you notice in photomode but is it worth it, when all that detail means less cars overall?

For me no. But even then the car count is acceptable but they've shown 3-4 tracks and none of them seems finished yet.

 

[Zlork]

Same for the Gamescom Demo I tried. The problem is pretty clear for me though, an extremely narrow FOV which kills the sense of speed and lack of advanced motion blur like in Pcars, Dirt Rally and Forza for example.
Shiny razorsharp textures repeating over and over again wont benefit the sense of speed either.

In reality, there is no blur effect.

For me no. But even then the car count is acceptable but they've shown 3-4 tracks and none of them seems finished yet.

For me, these tracks was finished.

 

[TokoTurismo]

Are you 99% sure of it?

 

[Samus]

In reality, there is no blur effect.

No, there is natural blur when things move too fast for our eyes to fully detect. That is what the video effect is trying to replicate.

 

[GTEFGHA]

In reality, there is no blur effect.

Try waving your arm really fast and tell me that there is no blur... Or try driving a gokart, there is gonna be a lot of motion blur

 

[sems4arsenal]

In reality, there is no blur effect.



For me, these tracks was finished.

Not when they showed them at the reveal even they were not.

 

[Zlork]

Not when they showed them at the reveal even they were not.

I talk about Gamescom's build.

Try waving your arm really fast and tell me that there is no blur... Or try driving a gokart, there is gonna be a lot of motion blur

They put motion blur in GT6 and they removed after criticism.

I hate motion blur, personally.

 

[queleuleu]

In reality, there is no blur effect.



For me, these tracks was finished.

At full speed, have you ever looked at your car side windows? A subte blur is far better than nothing, even more when a game looks a little dull.

 

[sems4arsenal]

I talk about Gamescom's build.

.

Even the gamescom event had flickering on the Ring so nope not finished either.

 

[queleuleu]

Even the gamescom event had flickering on the Ring so nope not finished either.

It's like night and day when you compare a GTSport track with the same one from Forza 6. They are clearly not finished, if they are, I'm disappointed^^

 

[Zlork]

At full speed, have you ever looked at your car side windows? A subte blur is far better than nothing, even more when a game looks a little dull.

When I drive to 140 km/h, I have the impression to drive at 50.

Even the gamescom event had flickering on the Ring so nope not finished either.

Nothing to do with modeling. You talk about technic.

 

[sems4arsenal]

It's like night and day when you compare a GTSport track with the same one from Forza 6. They are clearly not finished, if they are, I'm disappointed^^

Turn 10's output compared to PD is a different league.

When I drive to 140 km/h, I have the impression to drive at 50.



Nothing to do with modeling. You talk about technic.

It's a graphical glitch on a track, so they need to work on the track, so the track is not finished. They've shown 3-4 tracks you'd think atlleast these would be perfect by now.

 

[05XR8]

Same for the Gamescom Demo I tried. The problem is pretty clear for me though, an extremely narrow FOV which kills the sense of speed and lack of advanced motion blur like in Pcars, Dirt Rally and Forza for example.
Shiny razorsharp textures repeating over and over again wont benefit the sense of speed either.

Maybe it was that sharpness. I can only describe it like GTPSP(that was my first visual memory when the race was starting).

Speculation time.
PD are going to wind up adding a few things. Not things that are supposed to be in game at the original November date. I feel Kaz is giving "the team" the green light to add some things(GT Awards cars, track creator, Pikes Peak, as examples) because they have a new window. It's going to make the game GT7.

What else would be PD do for a 20th Anniversary?
Release GTS let's say, March. All's good. The game will be in homes for 9 months. Are PD just going to have a gala in December with an "old" game? Some new seasonals? An eSport festival and the winner gets a GT-R?

If the game stays as GTS, will it be a missed opportunity if not released in December. At this stage, I don't care about waiting that long. Thing is, they couldn't finish the game when they started at the end of GT6's release. They couldn't finish in the next 2-3 months. A further 3 months seems unrealistic. Might as well release on the Anniversary.