GT Sport beta physics discussion - Read the First Post Before Replying

[TurboNindo]

And if so, it will probably cause outrage amongst those that Sony are looking to appease.

By making GT more accessible, PD are in effect making it far less fun and challenging long term for everybody. The biggest problem I see amongst those that drive erratically is they have never learnt the very basic concept of preparation for a corner after a straight. And this is most likely a habit that has been brought about by exaggerated forgiveness in the car replicated, and assists etc. When all assists are switched off, learners soon grasp the concept of getting 90% of the work done before cornering takes place. Anyone can learn to get to a basic level of competence such as what is required to get a national racing license if they have an interest in cars or driving.....and the thing is, they would get much more enjoyment because with practice the sim would change from being demanding to fun and challenging.

I agree there needs to be a race school to show how to and not too because I have lost rating due to being rammed off track my racing was clean also I lost SR due to a player ghosting in front of me it let me pass through but at the cost of SR which is unfair as it was unavoidable as it was mid corner

 

[Johnnypenso]

I agree there needs to be a race school to show how to and not too because I have lost rating due to being rammed off track my racing was clean also I lost SR due to a player ghosting in front of me it let me pass through but at the cost of SR which is unfair as it was unavoidable as it was mid corner

Video tutorials can't hurt, and really should be in a game of this type, but do you really think that players who have crashed and bashed their way through the field for years are going to suddenly start driving responsibly simply because there is a tutorial in the game?

 

[Scaff]

Evora at Brands Indy, AC and GTS.

 

[super_gt]

The grass and curbs may be more realistic in Assetto Corsa than GT Sport Beta but this is what happened to me in AC with Cayman GT4 yesterday:



But in AC the car remained stable.I went into the corner full throttle the car start to understeer and go outside I fully lift off the throttle while the tyres touches the grass and this remained unpunished.
In this regard LFS is the most realistic game IMO.

 

[EDK]

-During the race the car was totaly different, huge understeer under brake and under accel out corner, almost undrivable.
This is the first time i see such a big difference. My connection was ok, 120 ping, no lag..... i really don´t understand what could have happened.

I´m really sorry for some other racers that i have rammed or disturbed in their race , but i couldn´t keep my normal driving line, it was not my intention.

I was a bit of collateral damage in the final turn in my Corvette during that race. I'd just jumped on 10 minutes earlier, so was not totally up to speed.

I think the dirty air wash is worse again, do you think that was part of what you experienced?

 

[PzR Slim]

I was a bit of collateral damage in the final turn in my Corvette during that race. I'd just jumped on 10 minutes earlier, so was not totally up to speed.

I think the dirty air wash is worse again, do you think that was part of what you experienced?

I've defo noticed a dirty air effect but think people are also experience a difference when in clean air.

 

[EDK]

I've defo noticed a dirty air effect but think people are also experience a difference when in clean air.

With the update before this one, they said they minimized the effect of it, but I am wondering if they went back the other way?

 

[sumbrownkid]

So I just got another Toyota FT1 Vision GT...

Is anyone else getting repeats for the driving marathon?

And has anyone dared going above 3.0 degrees for camber? Right now I'm back to the default camber settings (2.8/2.6). The change in the physics is daring me to try.

 

[praiano63]

I was a bit of collateral damage in the final turn in my Corvette during that race. I'd just jumped on 10 minutes earlier, so was not totally up to speed.

I think the dirty air wash is worse again, do you think that was part of what you experienced?

Sorry for this, it wasn´t due to dirty air wash , same problems in low speed corners alone or close to other car.... hge understeer out corner bring the car out of the line, very strange under braking too.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

I have video evidence to pretty much counter every bit of this.

The GTS Evora stops dead straight even with no ABS, full rear brake bias and an abused gearbox.


At 3.54.


You can also attack the curbs at the ring in a manner you simply can't get away with in AC at all.

People can't beat their fastest times in N300 after update so cars appear to have got slower in cornering speed which aligns with what my initial impression was. If you lock the rears, it is unlikely it will go dead straight. Even though moving brake balance more rearward, it is still more forward bias so fronts mainly lock. Game also limits applying full brake pressure so less likely to get into tricky situations but can be done, video below. Going down the gears really quickly in the game doesn't mean it actually engages them, to me it appears as just being in neutral or clutch depressed and full throttle until at the right speed to engage the gear, you can see at 1:30 in my video below what happens when first gear finally engages in the Megane.



By the looks of things in this update, PDI are working on more advanced off-track punishment than GT6 so I think GTS will be really punishing if they enable "Real" settings.

As for Assetto Corsa, video below of my first complete lap on the Nordschleife using Xbox 360 controller, no driving aids with full damage enabled. You can get away with very bad driving in that game even with twitchy controls and damaged car.

 

[Imari]

As a finn familiar with snow/dirt driving - how are they going to simulate that without horizontal tire model..

To be fair, Polyphony's dirt/snow physics model has always been notoriously awful.

 

[Haitauer]

To be fair, Polyphony's dirt/snow physics model has always been notoriously awful.

So true..

 

[Scaff]

People can't beat their fastest times in N300 after update so cars appear to have got slower in cornering speed which aligns with what my initial impression was.

Not the only reason why it could have happened.

If you lock the rears, it is unlikely it will go dead straight. Even though moving brake balance more rearward, it is still more forward bias so fronts mainly lock. Game also limits applying full brake pressure so less likely to get into tricky situations but can be done, video below. Going down the gears really quickly in the game doesn't mean it actually engages them, to me it appears as just being in neutral or clutch depressed and full throttle until at the right speed to engage the gear, you can see at 1:30 in my video below what happens when first gear finally engages in the Megane.

So effectively PD have nerf'd it so you can't screw up!

Oh and I'm interested to know how when the clutch final engages in the Megane why that causes instability at the rear given that a) it's too low a speed to do it and b) it's a front wheel drive car!

By the looks of things in this update, PDI are working on more advanced off-track punishment than GT6 so I think GTS will be really punishing if they enable "Real" settings.

Based on?

As for Assetto Corsa, video below of my first complete lap on the Nordschleife using Xbox 360 controller, no driving aids with full damage enabled. You can get away with very bad driving in that game even with twitchy controls and damaged car.

You seem to have a quite different experience with the Evora in AC than I do.

 

[GordonS]

.. If you lock the rears, it is unlikely it will go dead straight. Even though moving brake balance more rearward, it is still more forward bias so fronts mainly lock. Game also limits applying full brake pressure so less likely to get into tricky situations but can be done, ...

Yes.
I tested the ABS 0 too.
GTS beta gives full brake pressures only if front and rear is equal. Full front brake bias gets slightly limited pressure and full rear brake bias gets more limited pressure. It can be seen in the brake icon bar applying full brake press and altering the bias.
Normal car:
Polyphony offers secured braking even at full rear bias in full panic braking causing understeer. In 50% brake pressure the full rear bias starts to rotate the normal car because the rear bites relatively more at that amount of braking. Edit: The weight shifting included.

Racing car - tested only the GT-R:
It's even more secure. The full rear bias never spins the car at any brake pressure.

 

[super_gt]

Porsche Cayman vs. Lotus Evora and Tiff Needell(very good explanation of the handling)

 

[Haitauer]

The full rear bias never spins the car at any brake pressure.

Reading this brake bias conversation. Correct me if im wrong, but we dont see the actual scale. We dont see the % so "full rear bias" could be f40%/r60% or what else.. We just have these arcade sliders to move it front/back not knowing the actual pressures..

 

[GordonS]

Reading this brake bias conversation. Correct me if im wrong, but we dont see the actual scale. We dont see the % so "full rear bias" could be f40%/r60% or what else.. We just have these arcade sliders to move it front/back not knowing the actual pressures..

That is right. I was talking about full bias as it is offered.

 

[TurboNindo]

Video tutorials can't hurt, and really should be in a game of this type, but do you really think that players who have crashed and bashed their way through the field for years are going to suddenly start driving responsibly simply because there is a tutorial in the game?

I think you're right people won't change so easily. Let's hope this is the game that starts to change the community

 

[diesel97]

Video tutorials can't hurt, and really should be in a game of this type, but do you really think that players who have crashed and bashed their way through the field for years are going to suddenly start driving responsibly simply because there is a tutorial in the game?

The AI would have to be up for the task also, no sense training against bad AI it just teaches bad racecraft.

 

[Coiler]

The two good things that came with 1.05 are more suspension noise and the fact that I can finally drive my R8. The rest is more an downgrade.

 

[Haitauer]

Got to try the ring on gr4 (4C) today. Massive grip, very hard to make errors. Gtr guys look to have insane cornering speeds in long corners - guess the drivers werent so good in tighter ones though..

Only race was a disaster. Most of the grid ramming for fun. Even turning out in curves just to ram people out..  This is a very worrying side effect of the massive grip. People deliberately crashing others out and relying on the grip to keep them on track.

Could be the messed up matching causing the race. Only the first 9 had qualifying time and the gap between 1st to 9th was well over half a minute..

 

[Motor City Hami]

A few pages back I noticed a comment about wishing that PD could go back to GT3 physics. I am currently working on an article where I tune the same car with the same settings at the same track in all six titles of Gran Turismo. The GT3 physics may not be what you remember them to be. They were still very arcade like; just throw it into the corner with a really aggressive entry and save it with a bit of a drift on exit. GT4 is actually the first physics model that came close to real life. In fact, I think that the physics took a large step backward with GT5 and recovered a bit with GT6. I am actually having more fun tuning in GT4 than the newer titles.

Driving all six titles back to back has been really fun and a bit eye opening to the progression, then regression of the physics model.

Well, since I did not win the GT Sport lottery, it's off to tune in GT4 for tonight.

 

[Tornado]

In GT5 a car's rear wheels actually affected car handling. No regression there.

 

[Motor City Hami]

In GT5 a car's rear wheels actually affected car handling. No regression there.

The biggest issue that I have with GT5 is that nearly every car in the game starts with massive understeer. And, there is no way to tune out the understeer in most cars. A Mazda Miata with the softest front settings and hardest rear settings should in no way continue to understeer.

 

[Tornado]

And GT4 was well known for how easily cars rotated?

 

[Haitauer]

Posted this to the general forum by mistake..

Fot me races feel even more grippy if possible.. It is opposite to more common opinion here. One can see 458 gt3 has 🤬 load of grip in the video..And the launch is epic for 2wd - definetely forced tcs there. Alfa 4C wont even spin wheels if floored from grid. Yet I was able to spin 458 on the grass on lap2 which is not that easy to do in v1. 05.. Shoul i be happy if physics are concerned



And one can see that other 458s rear twiching when spinning - lag or skid recovery force?

Video tutorials can't hurt, and really should be in a game of this type, but do you really think that players who have crashed and bashed their way through the field for years are going to suddenly start driving responsibly simply because there is a tutorial in the game?

I think you're right people won't change so easily. Let's hope this is the game that starts to change the community

The AI would have to be up for the task also, no sense training against bad AI it just teaches bad racecraft.

This is a good one.. Though i think its more of an attitude issue than lacking skills..

 

[OdeFinn]

Posted this to the general forum by mistake..

Fot me races feel even more grippy if possible.. It is opposite to more common opinion here. One can see 458 gt3 has 🤬 load of grip in the video..And the launch is epic for 2wd - definetely forced tcs there. Alfa 4C wont even spin wheels if floored from grid. Yet I was able to spin 458 on the grass on lap2 which is not that easy to do in v1. 05.. Shoul i be happy if physics are concerned



And one can see that other 458s rear twiching when spinning - lag or skid recovery force?







This is a good one.. Though i think its more of an attitude issue than lacking skills..

Did you use ABS and SRF? Those lights are showing active use of both. Question is was those switched on by you or just forced by game?

 

[Haitauer]

Did you use ABS and SRF? Those lights are showing active use of both. Question is was those switched on by you or just forced by game?

Only abs. By srf you mean tcs or asc? No option for skid recovery force in gts yet i guess?

 

[OdeFinn]

Only abs. By srf you mean tcs or asc? No option for skid recovery force in gts yet i guess?

That white car icon with skid marks, it blinks on your downshifts, above is from your video, first corner.

 

[Haitauer]

View attachment 646054
That white car icon with skid marks, it blinks on your downshifts, above is from your video, first corner.


Double checked.. Only abs on. Turned all off and still blinking on down shifts. Must be the auto rev matching..