GT Sport have over 5 million players

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That's it: I'm quitting GT Sport and pCARS 2 and I'm going to start playing Mario Kart 8, because better sales = better game. ;)
But what happen to all the complaining at the beginning, haters all on Amazon urging folks not to buy GTS. They were so desperate for GTS to fail in sales and popularity; while Kaz was all up in the clubs celebrating and dancing lol. I mean they were mad at GTS then because concerns of the game not being the game for 'people' and mad a Kaz because they felt he was not doing anything about it. Now that it is obviously a racing game for the 'people' why still mad bros?

GTS it a great game after all and prevailed despite being a victim of some serious gaslighting.
 
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there is zero chance GTS has not made a lot of money, even if we be pessimistic and say its average retail price was $30.

Oh it's certainly made lots of money, but unless we have info on what Sony set as the expectation we have no clue if it's actually a success.

We did get solid numbers.

I'm not aware of any source that has reliable worldwide sales figures. If you know of one I would love to see it.

Thats a silly idea.

Not really. In any business you are expected to at least have fairly similar output to that of your co-workers.

You're comparing a racing sim to AAA SP games.

A racing game that is #2 and #3 on the all time sales list for PS2 titles.

Also, since when is GT not a AAA title? :confused:

Its like me saying Final Fantasy isn't doing that well compared to GTAV.

Nothing is doing well compared to GTAV.
 
But what happen to all the complaining at the beginning, haters all on Amazon urging folks not to buy GTS. They were so desperate for GTS to fail in sales and popularity; while Kaz was all up in the clubs celebrating and dancing lol. I mean they were mad at GTS then because concerns of the game not being the game for 'people' and mad a Kaz because they felt he was not doing anything about it. Now that it is obviously a racing game for the 'people' why still mad bros?

GTS it a good game after all and prevailed despite being a victim of some serious gaslighting.
GT will always sell well just because of its name and legacy. Heck, they were able to make a Prologue (aka deluxe demo) sell almost 20 million copies. That doesn't mean GT Sport is the best game they have ever made compared to its predecessors and the current competition. It also doesn't mean that PD listen to their fanbase, because if that was true GT Sport wouldn't even exist.
 
It also doesn't mean that PD listen to their fanbase, because if that was true GT Sport wouldn't even exist.



I think PD listens to the fanbase but when it comes to applying those business strategies, I think its all up to PD. Im no expert but I think its pretty much how most would approach those matters.
 
GT will always sell well just because of its name and legacy. Heck, they were able to make a Prologue (aka deluxe demo) sell almost 20 million copies. That doesn't mean GT Sport is the best game they have ever made compared to its predecessors and the current competition. It also doesn't mean that PD listen to their fanbase, because if that was true GT Sport wouldn't even exist.

I don't know where you're getting your numbers from but no GT game has ever sold 20 million copies.

GT 5 prologue + GT5 combined is less than 20.
 
Turn 10 don't make any other racing games.
They make a lot of money from other racing games though. Do you think they're worried?

Just play Fortnite, you know, 'cause everyone's doing it.
If we're going outside the racing game genre, then Candy Crush Saga has 2.73 billion downloads.
 
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I think 5 million players is more than most here would expect for a game which is supposedly "a prologue".
 
I don't know where you're getting your numbers from but no GT game has ever sold 20 million copies.

GT 5 prologue + GT5 combined is less than 20.
My mistake, GT5 Prologue actually sold 5 million copies. Still a lot for a demo though.
 
I'm not aware of any source that has reliable worldwide sales figures. If you know of one I would love to see it.

Not WW, you said UK or thats what I was referring to.

Not really. In any business you are expected to at least have fairly similar output to that of your co-workers.

Not when your business appeals to different demographics.

A racing game that is #2 and #3 on the all time sales list for PS2 titles.

PS2 was nearly 20 years ago.
Its like some of you are stuck in the past.

Racing games are not as big as they once were.
NFS is not the monster it was.
Midnight Club is dead.
Burnout is dead.
Ridge Racer is not close what it used to be.
Wipeout is dead.
Driver is dead.
DIRT is dead.
Grid is dead.
Motorstorm is dead.

F1 has been in decline.
Forza has been in decline since Forza 4.
PC2 showed big decline.
Crew 2 showed big decline.

GTS, FH and Mario Kart are the only current racing games capable of selling 5 million+

Nothing is doing well compared to GTAV.

Missing the point: stop comparing different genres as 1 : 1.

They make a lot of money from other racing games though. Do you think they're worried?

What? Turn 10 make no other racing games or money from them. FH is made by Playground.
Yes. When your bi annual game has been in decline for 3 releases, I think there would be concern. Easy way out was more microtransactions and DLC, which is exactly what Forza did.
 
Actually feel comparing this to a game like GTA can ring some truths. Not comparable fully, but much can be.

I play it as a racing game quite a lot. That game allows me so much freedom there to just enjoy my/our game of it.

And, obviously. They're both videogames. This GT is less a game today, more a niche part of what gaming is these days. Online racing (at its core, naturally they've added single player bits since - Again, like a GTA, it has both now). The whole 'for a modern sim game' doesn't work either, all GT's were sold as such. It's in the title, lol. They're all sim's. Videogames too. And that's the problem. (GT the sim racer, once sold 3 times this, with far less of a mass appeal/acceptance even that gaming has today).

Any game that can offer racing as freely as a GTA does, is the same as this really. (In future, a GTA might have the racing part drastically grow to be as detailed as other racing only games - Even bigger potential now with the money R* made off GTA V/O to invest if they want to basically take over, lol. I'm being facetious but it could open doors too). It's a game that offers racing though. Of course, GTA has so much more to offer too, so I can 'GT it' or 'COD it' and I can do that however I wish (for lack of better phrases, lol). Aggressively against, passively with, or anything in between. This is where GT will fail with the masses, it's a 'one trick pony' in a era when that's proving 'old hat' I believe.

I mean look at it. Racing crews thrive on GTA. So many do/did little else in the game but race. Broughy/NODO has a fair following on the tube also. It's such a social friendly racing game for so many there if we want. (Or you can go it alone, genuinely anything). Tuning, meets, racing, drifting, rallying, hotlapping. Demo derbies are frequent too, lol. Anything a racing game can/should offer. (Just need proper racing leagues like this FIA stuff to compete with this too - Not that the FIA will with the other content available there, lol).

And that game is so flawed - The catch up feature is an absolute joke, slipstreaming drastically overpowered, full of cheats, glitches, the lot. Anything bad a game can have, GTA has it, lol. Even back with old GTA IV or even RDR online, we could race blooming horses online, lol. (Still racing at its core, but of course, not the same as burning rubber mind). There's no penalties and an abundance of bad form. But it's all avoidable if in a community like this that can work together to create our game of it.

They make the platform/arena. Set the rules. But we make the games now.

I feel a game like GTA can be compared in ways. But accept there's just so much more to that game too that see's it really on its own level. And I firmly believe its a game changer. Other games need to find ways to have this much flexibility and such. Trouble is, can't ever see us doing anything other than race on GT (Aside liveries/photo's - But GTA has photos down pretty well too, and creator tools, so a livery editor isn't off limits one day there either). So GT gets left behind.

If R* play their cards right with GTA, that game has just so much potential now. I'm sure many developers are sweating over that game/companies potential to draw.

Sorry for the longer post. Just feel 'gaming' is at a real moment where things are changing so much. The whole recurring spending and microtransactions nature to things with how these games are being made to last far longer than older, campaign or even story based gaming is just so open right now, and with GTAV's huge financial success, and free to download games like Fortnite doing well. It hampers many games, and this I feel is one that feels that impact too.

I praise them here for the free DLC (Though feel much should have been base game content) and persisting to fix that penalty system, and for avoiding the microtransaction route. But I feel that's the way forward for success these days. Though I'm yet to succumb to paying extra, I feel I'll have to one day, or miss out/pass on things.

I'm not against microtransactions, but cautious of their impact on my gaming style is all. So long as I can earn 'it' I'm good, you know?

I love GT and the racing offered here is stunning. Has always delivered in those terms. Beautiful game. But so very limited in today's world.

If GTA did racing this detailed in future, and we could use VR/steering wheels and the like that only enhances things for those keen. That'll about do it, IMHO. (Of course, noting that game's often controversial nature. In short, I can see a GTA clone far suited to players that don't want to be subjected to that type of content - Or worse, GTA itself being watered down).

Meh, probably just a load of rambling, lol. My bad.
 
GTS sales are 5 million+

Interesting, this is news to us. We'd really appreciate a source so we can run an article on this. 👍

You also act like 10 million was sold immediately, when in fact it was over several years. GTS hasn't even been on the market for one year.

Traditionally, with only very few exceptions, games sell the bulk of their total units within the first two months:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/gt6-sales-discussion.292590/page-59#post-10948165

Sport may buck that slightly, as FH3 did too. We'd know if we got more solid figures.

Or maybe tracking sales and showing sales will enlighten some people on a more objective reality of racing games and their popularity rather than hearsay

Hearsay like making up sales figures?

Except that microtransactions are only a minor feature in the game.

Or, in FM7, precisely zero part of it. Though MT inclusion in the game is a particularly consistent bit of hearsay to this day, almost a year after T10 first announced intentions of including them. I wonder why that is...

Unpopular opinion: I don't have a blanket all-MTs-are-bad stance, but it very much depends on how they're implemented. If PD introduced a reasonable way to simply pay for the 20M cars instead of mindlessly grinding for at least a dozen hours each, I probably would be willing to throw a few dollars at it. Though admittedly, I'm less likely to in Sport than a more traditional GT game, as I see less "value" in owning cars limited to Gr.X.

MTs are another revenue stream. Games aren't getting any cheaper — Sport may have saved a fair amount of licenses versus GT6, but that very likely was negated by the increase in the team's size (and it being a lot of senior employees). As is, the only approach to earn money with GT Sport is, well, the game.

It makes you wonder what would've happened had the game originally launched in 2016 as planned...
 
Have a look at this one, interesting numbers from a few months ago :

"Overview

The goal of this thread is share the profile data extracted from www.gran-turismo.com to show how the users playing the game are divided across the globe.

Notes

  • All the data were extracted from the API URL https://www.gran-turismo.com/us/api/gt7sp/profile/ (yeap GTS is called GT7SP internally) where I make a basic POST call calling Job 1 that returns 4 data: psn_id, status, profile number and country.
  • I use the most basic call to get the data called Job 1. There are others Jobs that returns more data like hours player, cars owned, races won, etc... all activity data can be extracted.
  • There are others sites with similar data but they just extracted 10% of the base and extrapolated to get the full picture. My data will divert from them a lot because mine is exactly what you have on GTS site without any extrapolation or estimations.
  • Status are divided in two numbers: 1 - Profile that played GTS final game and 2 - Profile that played only the Beta. If a profile with status 2 (Beta only) play the game today then it changed to status 1. I will try to track these Beta only profiles to see if they changed to 1 regularly.
  • Some profiles numbers can't be extracted because the API returns error while the GTS site works fine, it is about 700 profiles that I will try to cover manually in the future.
  • The country is determined by the PSN location (I'm from Brasil but my PSN is US so I'm counted in US numbers).
  • Profiles are PSN users that played the game and not game sales. Used games and family sharing can increase that number even when you had only one copy sold.
  • All the data extracted can be checked in this csv file (comma separated values): https://1drv.ms/u/s!AsRlMSDzwvw8g3OPhbR6SzdjVjqq
  • I will try to update the file and thread at least once per week. That way you will know how many profiles where created in GTS since the last time.
The data
  • Latest profile number: 5793135
  • Total profiles: 4,792,514
  • Total GTS profiles: 4,088,249
  • Total Beta only profiles: 704,265 * Beta profiles turn in GTS profiles after play the final game"
From March 2018.

Source : https://www.resetera.com/threads/number-of-gran-turismo-sport-profiles-statistics-by-country.18614/

Someone said there that GTS profiles increase at about 60-70k per week and also interesting trivia that GTS is called GT7SP internally.
 
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I bet the GT Prologues are among the best selling game demos ever... since most games don't have paid demos.

Back then no, nowadays you buy an extra dlc pack or pay some amount over the normal $60 to get the "beta" access these days.
 
Welcome to gaming.
It's funny, you used to jump on this kind of point usually implying that the decrease isn't as large as we expect, insinuating how strong the userbase is after it being out for so long. Wonder what's changing your mind.

GTS, FH and Mario Kart are the only current racing games capable of selling 5 million+
GTS also part of that decline, actually. FH and Mario Kart seem to be the exception to that rule.

Missing the point: stop comparing different genres as 1 : 1.
Not directly 1:1, but I think they can be compared somewhat, especially considering the huge budget these AAA console-exclusive titles get. I would imagine that PD would have the biggest budget of most any other Developer on PS. With such a large budget for a niche title like this, it makes sense that they game dropped in price so fast. They're trying to take in as much cash to try to make a profit off of it, and selling it at full price didn't seem to move it as fast as they predicted, is my guess.

What? Turn 10 make no other racing games or money from them. FH is made by Playground.
Even if the assets that are provided from an outsourced company, they are still owned by T10. They are provided to Playground. What we don't know is the past relation between the two developers. Does T10 charge them? Or is it giving in good will through Microsoft as they're both produced under the "Forza" moniker.

Yes. When your bi annual game has been in decline for 3 releases, I think there would be concern.
What about a game that has double that development time, that is also seeing constant decline with each title released? One going so far as practically losing half its sales compared to its prior iteration.

Easy way out was more microtransactions and DLC, which is exactly what Forza did.
What microtransactions are you talking about? Also, lots of games make compromises to make a profit they think they should be making. One game chooses to make DLC, another chooses to lower it's prices shortly after release, all to try to accumulate as much money as they can. You can't rag on a game for having DLC, as if it's an issue for some reason.
 

A desperate page taken straight from the Microsoft playbook. What next? 10 billion miles driven? 65 trillion laps completed? 80 quadrillion pitstops made? Embarrassing. 5 million players have "participated". Tells me that at SOME point since the game's release that amount of players have played the game. I have zero doubt this game didn't sell 5 million copies. Seems to that a few million bought this thing on release, a big chunk of them decided the game wasn't for them and then traded or gave it away resulting in another new player playing it if only for a few hours. If this game has crossed 4 millions sales I'd be genuinely surprised.
 
It's funny, you used to jump on this kind of point usually implying that the decrease isn't as large as we expect, insinuating how strong the userbase is after it being out for so long. Wonder what's changing your mind.


GTS also part of that decline, actually. FH and Mario Kart seem to be the exception to that rule.


Not directly 1:1, but I think they can be compared somewhat, especially considering the huge budget these AAA console-exclusive titles get. I would imagine that PD would have the biggest budget of most any other Developer on PS. With such a large budget for a niche title like this, it makes sense that they game dropped in price so fast. They're trying to take in as much cash to try to make a profit off of it, and selling it at full price didn't seem to move it as fast as they predicted, is my guess.


Even if the assets that are provided from an outsourced company, they are still owned by T10. They are provided to Playground. What we don't know is the past relation between the two developers. Does T10 charge them? Or is it giving in good will through Microsoft as they're both produced under the "Forza" moniker.


What about a game that has double that development time, that is also seeing constant decline with each title released? One going so far as practically losing half its sales compared to its prior iteration.


What microtransactions are you talking about? Also, lots of games make compromises to make a profit they think they should be making. One game chooses to make DLC, another chooses to lower it's prices shortly after release, all to try to accumulate as much money as they can. You can't rag on a game for having DLC, as if it's an issue for some reason.

Not loot boxes, lol. (Sorry to refer to GTA again here, I have no other reference other than reading of things, lol).

Paid DLC (Like what GTA used to do, Undead Nightmare too). Or cash for cash and exclusive to that person (No sharing), but with the freedom to buy what they choose. I feel they are the less invasive ways, and it still leaves 'the gaming' for gamers, while appeasing the payers too, you know? Of course, it can have an impact in terms of 'the grind' which I've grown cautious of. (Basically, because GTA became that, I just can't with GT sport after learning this tactic. Those 20m cars would have had to be pot luck if I got them, lol).

And RE price drops, again with the GTA, lol. But that game has commanded a fair fee for an awful long time, new or second hand, and just kept on selling. Good games, big games, varied games, these are where the big bucks are now, and as you said here, it's niche now with GT, it's a part of what other games are, and just a small part at that, with full respect to the racing genre of course. Games are growing so vast.
A desperate page taken straight from the Microsoft playbook. What next? 10 billion miles driven? 65 trillion laps completed? 80 quadrillion pitstops made? Embarrassing. 5 million players have "participated". Tells me that at SOME point since the game's release that amount of players have played the game. I have zero doubt this game didn't sell 5 million copies. Seems to that a few million bought this thing on release, a big chunk of them decided the game wasn't for them and then traded or gave it away resulting in another new player playing it if only for a few hours. If this game has crossed 4 millions sales I'd be genuinely surprised.
Yep, paid little for mine, and that was only because offline content was added more and more to a point I felt it was worth the gamble to see if I could enjoy what was on offer. (No tuning part really just put me off too). I enjoyed it for a little while, but then those two cars came, and after learning of the mess of sport mode and growing so frustrated I feared I'd throw my control pad. Game over. (I tried after the latest change, and it's good to see them try. But I'm spent).

Racing on GTA is just so much more fun. Simple. So I live in hope that this franchise can re-invent itself in future. 20 years with this game, lol. It'll take more than one bad game, for me, to see me give it all up just yet.
 
n association with Turn10 who do additional work on the title.

Minor. 1st parties often help each other out like this.

Forza Horizon is still a Playground title while the declining Motorsport is all T10 have.

Except that microtransactions are only a minor feature in the game.

Sorry meant lootboxes

Traditionally, with only very few exceptions, games sell the bulk of their total units within the first two months:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/gt6-sales-discussion.292590/page-59#post-10948165

Sport may buck that slightly, as FH3 did too. We'd know if we got more solid figures.

Thats not true at all. Your GT5 example had its LTD be 2x its 2 weeks sale figures.
As many have noted GTS had 50-70k new profiles made every week. During the summer sale it was 100k+ in one week.

We will no doubt get sales figures eventually from PD.

MTs are another revenue stream.

Which is fine if they didn't seriously affect the gameplay.

Have a look at this one, interesting numbers from a few months ago :

"Overview

The goal of this thread is share the profile data extracted from www.gran-turismo.com to show how the users playing the game are divided across the globe.

Notes

  • All the data were extracted from the API URL https://www.gran-turismo.com/us/api/gt7sp/profile/ (yeap GTS is called GT7SP internally) where I make a basic POST call calling Job 1 that returns 4 data: psn_id, status, profile number and country.
  • I use the most basic call to get the data called Job 1. There are others Jobs that returns more data like hours player, cars owned, races won, etc... all activity data can be extracted.
  • There are others sites with similar data but they just extracted 10% of the base and extrapolated to get the full picture. My data will divert from them a lot because mine is exactly what you have on GTS site without any extrapolation or estimations.
  • Status are divided in two numbers: 1 - Profile that played GTS final game and 2 - Profile that played only the Beta. If a profile with status 2 (Beta only) play the game today then it changed to status 1. I will try to track these Beta only profiles to see if they changed to 1 regularly.
  • Some profiles numbers can't be extracted because the API returns error while the GTS site works fine, it is about 700 profiles that I will try to cover manually in the future.
  • The country is determined by the PSN location (I'm from Brasil but my PSN is US so I'm counted in US numbers).
  • Profiles are PSN users that played the game and not game sales. Used games and family sharing can increase that number even when you had only one copy sold.
  • All the data extracted can be checked in this csv file (comma separated values): https://1drv.ms/u/s!AsRlMSDzwvw8g3OPhbR6SzdjVjqq
  • I will try to update the file and thread at least once per week. That way you will know how many profiles where created in GTS since the last time.
The data
  • Latest profile number: 5793135
  • Total profiles: 4,792,514
  • Total GTS profiles: 4,088,249
  • Total Beta only profiles: 704,265 * Beta profiles turn in GTS profiles after play the final game"
From March 2018.

Source : https://www.resetera.com/threads/number-of-gran-turismo-sport-profiles-statistics-by-country.18614/

Someone said there that GTS profiles increase at about 60-70k per week and also interesting trivia that GTS is called GT7SP internally.

I'm sure some will claim 1 million+ of these profiles are fake/dupes lol
 
I'm sure some will claim 1 million+ of these profiles are fake/dupes lol

Leaving those aside, it says right there that 704,265 profiles only played the beta. That figure were generated from a full scan of all profiles, so was 100% accurate at the time. Granted, a few of those might have decided to wait until GTS was heavily discounted and may have bought it since, but it had already been discounted before March so I doubt it is a significant number.

It's one stat where K'prime's sampling gets it quite wrong (400k vs 700k). It's easy to see why though, since all of the beta-only profiles are bunched up at the low profile numbers rather than being evenly distributed throughout. Before you say that proves all other K'prime stats are invalid, it doesn't, because the others will be much more evenly distributed.
 
Leaving those aside, it says right there that 704,265 profiles only played the beta

I'm not talking about beta profiles. Take the 5.5 million number in this thread and you will see how some think there are like a million dupe accounts.

Granted, a few of those might have decided to wait until GTS was heavily discounted and may have bought it since, but it had already been discounted before March so I doubt it is a significant number.

From May and June, GTS had 600k new profiles iirc. 2 months.
Hardly significant?
 
I'm not talking about beta profiles. Take the 5.5 million number in this thread and you will see how some think there are like a million dupe accounts.

I know you weren't, which is why I said "Leaving those aside" :rolleyes:

From May and June, GTS had 600k new profiles iirc. 2 months.
Hardly significant?

Yes - what I was getting at was that none of those new profiles will be people who played the beta, because in that case the profile just converts into a full one. So I say that 700k figure has probably not been reduced significantly since March.
 

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