- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
So, with 4K, will GT7 still need to use anti aliasing ? I figured with 4K resolution, PD won't need to implement resource heavy anti aliasing.
GT7 in 4K?
- Thread starter yanfloist
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Zer0
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If they don't scale and use a native 4k mode (3840x2160) the lack of AA it will be less noticeable than a good texture filtering. If they scale some pixels, a cheap antialias solution will probably hide most of the jaggies seen on screen, but at those resolutions is not something to care really.
- 1,245
There is almost zero chance of a 4K GT on PS4 (outside a tech demo of some sort). A PS4 has hardware on a par with a lowish/mid-range gaming PC, but does benefit from superior optimisation. However, this is the sort of hardware needed to run graphically demanding games in 4K (and judging by Polyphony's track record, we can be fairly sure GT will continue to be visually and technically impressive):
http://techbuyersguru.com/2500-extreme-4k-gaming-pc-build
That PC costs around the price of 7 PS4s. It requires two extremely high end GPUs (each of them individually costing significantly more than the PS4), twice the RAM of the PS4...
4K hardware is simply on another level to the PS4. Bearing in mind a few of the best looking PS4 games can only do 30fps at 1080p (like Driveclub), a 4K GT is safely off the cards.
A PS4.5, therefore, would have to be significantly upgraded to make that sort of visual performance work at a decent framerate. If a PS4 was an MX-5, (a decent low-mid range sports car), that PC is an F1 car - and that's a significant jump.
- 1,537
- GTP_Soundtrack
I'd be curious to see what kind of cooling a native 4K 60fps capable GPU would need inside a PS4-like form factor. Hopefully they want be shy on thermal paste...
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
I went to a local shopping mall yesterday, one of the electronic store there displays primarily UHD TVs ( some are curved and 3D ), more than 2 dozens models were on display, from 40+" UHD to 60" UHD tvs ( Panasonic, Sony, Samsung, etc ) There were only 4 or 6 1080p tv set on sale, they were 40+" size. Price for 4k ranges from less than US $1000 to just over $ 1800. ( I'm in Asia )
4K tvs have been around the shops since last year and it's getting more proportion on the market as the price gets cheaper every few months.
4K tvs have been around the shops since last year and it's getting more proportion on the market as the price gets cheaper every few months.
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- Rockay City
Oh, 4K/UHD will definitely become mainstream, but the same does not apply to the current generation of consoles. The leap in required performance and associated costs is just too big. While TVs have advanced in both technology and price, the current generation of consoles is still very much the same as it was in 2013.
I think this is a valid assumption. Solid 1080p/60FPS and VR/60FPS is the first step (PS5). UHD/4K/60FPS is step 2 (PS6).
- 1,537
- GTP_Soundtrack
Looking at the recent major manufacturers lineups and price drops you could easily conclude UHD is here indeed, but that doesn't mean the rest of the industry is ready/prepared for the switch. As a matter of fact, most of the UHD Bluray launch blockbusters titles have a 2K Digital Intermediate.
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
My post was about the UHD and SUHD tv ( one of the samsung on display at the shop ) being more common and cheaper, nowadays, people knows 4k content is scarce, but they would still buy the latest tech if the price is right 
When 4k tv becomes the basic line up offered by tv manufacturer, it will speed up movies and gaming industry to follow the step to 4k. Maybe 2017 will be the year 4k bluray starts to replace 1080p and 2k movies ? I think 2 years time is reasonable for 4k to mature, when most tv on sale will be 4k.
When 4k tv becomes the basic line up offered by tv manufacturer, it will speed up movies and gaming industry to follow the step to 4k. Maybe 2017 will be the year 4k bluray starts to replace 1080p and 2k movies ? I think 2 years time is reasonable for 4k to mature, when most tv on sale will be 4k.
2015 was the year according to people in the thread. 4K sets are obviously abundant now but they don't dominate the market, not in the West anyway.
If a new PS4 does happen I really can't see them including a new GPU and divide the gaming community. I would find it more likely they'll simply add UHD BR support and 4k video support. Probably charge $50 more.
If a new PS4 does happen I really can't see them including a new GPU and divide the gaming community. I would find it more likely they'll simply add UHD BR support and 4k video support. Probably charge $50 more.
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Interesting looking at large screen TV sales, seems 4K is dominant.
In September 2014, this was the case: Link
Given the increase in sales in 2015, majority of large screen TV sales is likely to be 4K UHD.
In September 2014, this was the case: Link
Given the increase in sales in 2015, majority of large screen TV sales is likely to be 4K UHD.
Something like Zen/Polaris APU with GDDR5X memory should help make it possible if they do release an improved console with hopefully three to four times the compute power. Would be good if they could release it by around late 2016 or early 2017 at same size and price as launch PS4.
GT is quite efficient on hardware, don't think there are many games pushing as many pixels on PS3 and at such a high framerate on PS3. Side scrollers like Trine 2 seemed to be more demanding than GT.
Says one researcher without any real numbers, and last time I checked 40% is not a dominant percentage.
Given the increase in sales in 2015, majority of large screen TV sales is likely to be 4K UHD.
Great, they're shipping a load of them. That isn't sales.
I swear you're just living in your own dream world. It's like in your world GT6 is true 1080p at constant 60fps in all scenarios.
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Add to that that while PD may have had an advantage on the obscure hardware of the PS3, they have no such advantage on the PS4, which is just x86/64 (which other developers are much more skilled/experienced at than PD). Expecting them to magically pull 4x performance out of this hardware is insane.
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- United Kingdom
2014 that was when sales were a lot lower. Now I think it is likely to be dominant, not going to pay to find out more detailed statistics.
1440x1080 at close to 60FPS is a lot more than most 720p games close to 30FPS on the same platform. Simple maths, maybe dream world for you...
They probably make use of GPGPU and don't think GT is particularly demanding. So much work must have been done to get it running on platforms with such low memory like PS3 and PSP, quite incredible really with the level of car detail shown. PS4 should be a lot easier to hit high performance targets while increasing detail.
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Sure, if 20-40fps is close to 60fps.
Most games are also not doing all they can to improve performance over quality of the game. Most racing games I play may be lower resolution and framerate but they actually have packs of cars racing each other. GT doesn't, because if it does, framerates dip even further. Same goes for weather, or using the in car view.
What PD managed on PS3 was no doubt impressive, I won't argue that, but to suggest it doesn't really tax the hardware is laughable.
To suggest a 2D sidescroller is more demanding on hardware than a 3D driving game is frankly hilarious. Trine 2 (Your favourite topic seemingly) is made by indie developers with a tiny budget, of course they don't have the resources to target 1080p60 on the PS3. Rayman on the other hand, a similar game but with a bigger budget, managed it just fine. Rock solid, true 1080p60.
...and you say you're not in a dream world?
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On PS3 it's absolutely pushing every ounce of performance out of the platform that it can. The framerates and the lack of standing starts are a testament to that (though there are more, e.g. not having weather/time cycle on all tracks).
What I believe GT7 on PS4 is capable of is solid 1080p/60FPS. But only given that they will keep the on-track car count down (definitely not PCARS amount of cars), also assuming full time/weather cycle. On top of that they might be able to make some compromises here and there, but nothing in the order of 4x the power.
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
With GT6, PS3 needs to be forced to 720p to get stable fps, even then, try do supergt race at Big willow using courtesy car ( HSV ), get into close pack with 4-5 premium cars in cockpit view and watch fps fluctuates. PS3 could not maintain stable fps with more than 5 premium cars in close pack even on 720p in cockpit view.
This may be the reason as said before, no standing start, reduced cars in arcade single race ( usually ten cars ), mixed premium and standard. Imagine all premium race against AI ( 16 of them ) with weather and 1080p, it will kill the PS3 with lots of fps dip
I always suspect PD intentionally keep the standard to help reduce the load by mixing them in offline races.
This may be the reason as said before, no standing start, reduced cars in arcade single race ( usually ten cars ), mixed premium and standard. Imagine all premium race against AI ( 16 of them ) with weather and 1080p, it will kill the PS3 with lots of fps dip
I always suspect PD intentionally keep the standard to help reduce the load by mixing them in offline races.
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Game mode I play in is usually 60FPS. Anyway in worst case scenarios, still a lot more throughput than most games on PS3.
GT has a lot of quality, impressed by game comparisons that it looks good compared to PC and PS4 racing games. Performance and quality visually is quite decent. Amount of cars you can race against is also high. It likely has very high hardware utilisation like Naughty Dog games but generally a lot less demanding per frame. Probably why on Naughty Dog recent games on PS3, it sounds like it is overheating seriously and about to melt
but not the same case with GT.That developer can get that game to render 1080p 60FPS Stereo 3D on PS4 though so can only be good for developer like PDI who seem to use the hardware really efficiently compared to most so far on all platforms they have released games.
I agree they are pushing for every ounce of performance they can get from the platform. That should be good for PS4 if they continue to do the same as getting as much performance from the system should make game run better.
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- Johnnypenso
Keeping the standards going forward to help "reduce the load" will mean that the game is not optimized for premium content. If it was there would be no need for standards to "reduce the load". Not optimized for premium content is essentially the story for GT5/6 and also won't fly with VR either, which requires a rock solid 60 fps in order to avoid the dizziness issue.With GT6, PS3 needs to be forced to 720p to get stable fps, even then, try do supergt race at Big willow using courtesy car ( HSV ), get into close pack with 4-5 premium cars in cockpit view and watch fps fluctuates. PS3 could not maintain stable fps with more than 5 premium cars in close pack even on 720p in cockpit view.
This may be the reason as said before, no standing start, reduced cars in arcade single race ( usually ten cars ), mixed premium and standard. Imagine all premium race against AI ( 16 of them ) with weather and 1080p, it will kill the PS3 with lots of fps dip
I always suspect PD intentionally keep the standard to help reduce the load by mixing them in offline races.
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- GTP_Orido
Just my theory, the standard in GT7 may be the GT5/6 premium level LOD cars, the super premium that has been thrown around on GT Sport thread may be the new "premium" for PS4 ( more detailed cars than PS3 premium ). With VR, PD may use GT5/6 premium level LOD instead and may change dynamically using tesselation in real time according to load ( say there are 16 cars, 8 of them PS4 level, the other 8 in GT5/6 premium level and change dynamically on track )
Make your mind up.
Or they could try to push it too far again and we end up with yet another game that doesn't maintain 60fps at close to all times. Remember that? GT4 was the last game to manage it.
I'm actually curious why you seem to prefer higher resolution over framerates.
No offense but that is a sample size of how many? I can just as easily say I don't know a single person with a 4K set and have three 1080p sets in my house, It's still a tiny sample. In terms of big numbers the biggest selling sets on the big sites and stores are still 1080p. They are still widely available, unlike what people were predicting early in this thread.
I'm not denying 4k sets aren't pretty popular now and getting more and more popular but the prediction that you pretty much wouldn't be able to buy a HDTV in 2015 that wasn't 4k was very wrong.
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