High Performance Honda Thread: The S2000 is Back?

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^ Sorry to spoil the mood, but the new G37 gave a good serving to the TL SH-AWD. And take note, that is not even the G37 S!

09.comparo.g37.vs.tl.group.2.500.jpg


^ Fail from the start...now let see the future holds. :indiff:
 
^ Sorry to spoil the mood, but the new G37 gave a good serving to the TL SH-AWD. And take note, that is not even the G37 S!

09.comparo.g37.vs.tl.group.2.500.jpg


^ Fail from the start...now let see the future holds. :indiff:

How about actually posting the review though? Just because the G37 beat it doesn't mean the TL is a failure.

Road & Track
At Honda's Ohio test track, I sampled a TL against its competitors. The TL was easily the fastest car around their test track; the closest competitors were the Audi S4 and BMW 335i. But almost all the cars lacked the sensitivity, corner-exit speed and sporting character of the Acura.

Gone are the days of burning up the front tires. The Acura TL is a real performance sedan. What used to be a nice, sporting sedan, is now a serious bear-your-teeth sports sedan.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=6&article_id=7120

Car&Driver
We got a sneak peak of the six-speed TL at the Transportation Research Center in central Ohio, Acura/Honda’s de facto North American proving grounds. Eager to prove that the TL is all that and a bag of chips, they brought out a BMW 335i and 335xi, Infiniti G35, and Audi S4 to compare as we lapped around the Dynamic Handling Course, a twisting track circuit penned by Allen Wilson, designer of Miller Motorsports Park and Barber Motorsports Park. All five cars, including the TL, were fitted with sport packages and the most aggressive summer tires available from the factory.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...010_acura_tl_sh_awd_manual_first_drive_review


Oh wait, before I'm done, look at this. Though your picture's link leads to Edmunds' website, Edmunds were also at the event. How ironic that you only posted the G37 beating the TL SH-AWD, yet not the review where the major competitors got beat.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=132226
Edmunds
The competitor cars each featured a manual transmission, the sportiest configuration currently available, and aftermarket brake pads that would stand up to an afternoon on the racetrack. The cars included a 2008 Audi S4 Quattro manual; 2008 BMW 335i Sport; 2008 BMW 335xi Sport and a 2008 Infiniti G35s.

We'd go out, run one lap, two hot laps and one cool-down in lap. Then we'd come in and switch cars with our press colleagues and repeat until all five cars were sufficiently flogged. We repeated the round robin twice and were given the opportunity to revisit any two or three cars we thought we hadn't had enough time in.

The 2010 Acura TL SH-AWD 6MT kicked serious butt. And we're not talking tenths of a second on a 1.6-mile racetrack, but instead 2 seconds (a light-year on a short racetrack like this) separated the TL from the next quickest sedan, the Audi S4 Quattro, on the challenging Dynamics Handling Course. This Alan Wilson-designed, 13-corner course is a laboratory instrument, and it dissected the strengths and weaknesses of these five cars with an array of fast/slow, compressed/unweighted, opening/closing corners.

Question, have you even driven the base TL, to have at least any kind of credibility for you to call the car a fail? From my experience, it's the complete opposite regardless of how the exterior is.
 
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^ I read all the reviews, all in print to be exact (well, except Edmunds which is online). Sure, the TL beat all other entry-level luxury AWD. But it was an Acura controlled event, all based on a controlled enviroment that Acura purposely arranged weeks before the event.

-> Asking if I had driven the TL, never had the chance...yet. I'm just stating the design aspect of the vehicle as a whole.

-> I will wait for a multi-car comparison test of the TL and its peers soon.
 
How many times have they made the NSX successor without actually making it? 3?

They are building/have already built this one though. ;)



Do some of you think that Honda may try to come along with a proper NSX successor in the mid/RWD configuration in the future? What if Honda or Acura wanted to make a new NSX feauting this same engine?

Was the front engined Ferrari 550 Maranello not a proper successor to the Testarossa/512TR/F512M?

These days a front engined, rear driven supercar can be every bit as good as a mid-engined one. The front engined configuration means less compromises for the interior packaging and therefore a better cabin space for the occupants.
 
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^ I read all the reviews, all in print to be exact (well, except Edmunds which is online). Sure, the TL beat all other entry-level luxury AWD. But it was an Acura controlled event, all based on a controlled enviroment that Acura purposely arranged weeks before the event.
So the fact that the original TL Type-S besting the old IS350 & G35 sedan, and only coming in second to the 335i due to being FWD in an old review, means the direct successor can not achieve the same outcome?

Bullocks.

Besides, the review on the G37S now that I've read it is a giant POS and should not be taking seriously. 85% of the review is just design bashing on the TL, and the writer had his mind made up who would win before the 5th paragraph. It was incredibly biased, and unbelieveably stupid. Why compare the RWD G37 to the AWD TL instead of the AWD G37? Because the writer knew who would win this competition before he ever typed a letter.
-> Asking if I had driven the TL, never had the chance...yet. I'm just stating the design aspect of the vehicle as a whole.
So then you have zero reasons to call it a fail car. You've never driven it, so you're pretty much basing your opinions on crap. I hate the design as well, but I've already been awwed by the way the car drives.

It's not a fail in any way. The design, maybe, but not the car.
 
Honda has cancelled the new NSX as part of a radical restructuring of its car making business.

The V10-engined supercar, which was a direct challenge to Ferrari and Porsche, would have been the most powerful production car that the company had ever produced.

Honda CEO Takeo Fukui announced the move in his end of year speech, saying that all development of the car would be cancelled. The company has also withdrawn its plan to introduce the Acura brand to Japan in 2010.

The Honda boss had previously emphasised the importance of the NSX to Honda's brand, unequivocally telling Autocar at the end of last year: "The new supercar is necessary for Honda."

Fukui had decided to concentrate on Honda's environmental credentials. He believes that hybrid drivetrains offer "the most realistic path for CO2 reduction at this moment". This means that Honda will focus its energy on developing hybrid technologies and "achieving mass market penetration as soon as possible".

The cancellation of the Honda NSX will come as a bitter disappointment to fans of the old model, which finally went off sale in 2005, after 15 years in production.
http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/Honda-Concepts/236594/
 
Oh man...:indiff:

Surely they will continue the development of the car when things get better? if they ever will...
 
Oh man...:indiff:

Surely they will continue the development of the car when things get better? if they ever will...

It was in the very final stages of development by the looks of things anyway. By the time things are looking better economically and with the direction Honda are heading i doubt the 'new' NSX will ever see the light of day.
 
Yeah, that sucks. The car is basically done. They even had all the tooling and stampings made for the production body parts! Judging by their Ring jaunts they were in the process of tuning the suspension. The car was pretty much done. Now I agree with Cracker that it probably is done.
 
That's very, very unfortunate. That really makes me wonder what will happen to the LFA program and the like.

The Carmagedon is a very unkind time, indeed.
 
Did they have any plans for the launch of the official car?

It curious why they did this though. Surely the money they would have made selling them in a year or so would have made up for the remaining costs of development...
 
What a waste of money. Why not just re-engineer the platform to take a hybrid drivetrain, or even a diesel-hybrid drivetrain, and sell it as a loss-making 'halo' car. They've already spent so much... :(
 
I think I was wrong about that whole 2NX thing.

a pair of rear quarter panels for the chassis. It's got a tiny triangle shaped window set in such a way that makes me think the beltline will be angled upward towards the rear quite sharply. It also has a door opening like a described previously, which angles back from the bottom, and then angles forward halfway up and into the roof. The NSX prototypes don't do that--the sideglass is a completely different shape. But, this thing does have a very sleek fastback design. It's pretty neat. It looks like the taillights would be long, sharp, and would swoop way around to the side of the car.

The bottom line is that if they cancelled the project, and the CEO certainly knew beforehand that he was going to make that decision, then why have I seen the parts? Why would the Civic plant in Anna, Ohio have NSX parts? Speaking of that, all these other parts are Civic related. The Civic, CRV, Element. That's what they build at Anna. So why do we have this fastback thing sitting here? I am confused.
 
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Maybe you've got something for some kind of new Civic spin-off coming down the line? A Del Sol redux?
 
This means that Honda will focus its energy on developing hybrid technologies and "achieving mass market penetration as soon as possible".

Woo ****ing hoo. We get it Honda, you're doing the whole hybrid/eco thing with your hydrogen fuel cell, now will you please shut up about it for a bit?
 
http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/Honda-Concepts/236594/
Fukui had decided to concentrate on Honda's environmental credentials. He believes that hybrid drivetrains offer "the most realistic path for CO2 reduction at this moment". This means that Honda will focus its energy on developing hybrid technologies and "achieving mass market penetration as soon as possible".

I hear there's no dealer network in Antarctica.

Was this really a surprise to anyone without rose-tinted glasses? Considering world-wide economic market conditions, the cancellation of their Formula One program, and the fact sales of the usually-unshakable Honda brand are down 30% compared to a year ago?
 
Yup. I was wrong about the 2NX being the NSX. And by a long shot, too.

The car is being handled by Honda's East Liberty, Ohio plant. Currently it builds Civics, CRVs, and Elements. I'm not sure about the SUV counterparts, but as you may know Honda is moving Civic production to a plant in Indiana.

Anyway, this 2NX "floor comp", which is the name of the floor section of the chassis, is similar to the Accord in size and weight. The rear quarter panels show that the car will have a steeply sloping rear window--much more so than an EX35, for example, which is a very car-like crossover. Think more like Rapide, Passat CC, and actually quite like the FCX Clarity. Strange? Apparently the car is going to be a sort of stationwagon/crossover-type deal about the size of an Accord. Yes, it is a Honda, and yes, it is strange, and no, I've never heard of anything like this in Honda's pipeline.

Have any of you heard anything about any upcoming Hondas besides the now defunct NSX and Insight? I know every now and then car companies will spring a new one on people at an auto show without fancy concepts or camouflaged prototypes, but jeez, usually something lands in the news.
 
...Apparently the car is going to be a sort of stationwagon/crossover-type deal about the size of an Accord. Yes, it is a Honda, and yes, it is strange, and no, I've never heard of anything like this in Honda's pipeline....

Have any of you heard anything about any upcoming Hondas besides the now defunct NSX and Insight?.

I let this one slip under the radar!

Apparently They're Making a Honda CUV

2011-honda-accord-cuv-i001.jpg


2011-honda-accord-cuv-i003.jpg


2011-honda-accord-cuv-i002.jpg


Its on-task for 2010. They're calling it the Honda "Latitude," apparently.
 
At least this Latitude looks worlds better than the latest CR-V. In fact, I'd want this to replace that horrid newer CR-V. Proves another "theory" of mine of cars made intentionally ugly so that nobody will buy them and thus, die out (like the 2003 Chevy Cavalier). Looks pretty nice.
 
Well, alright, that explains the floor comp. FYI, it's going to have a removable third row seat, lol.

But the rear quarter panels are a different shape than that. When I say Rapide-rake, I mean Rapide-rake. I never got a chance to take a picture--people get fired for that ya know.

EDIT: Now that I look closer at it, the rear edge of the rear door looks very similar to the rear quarter panels we have. But teh rear window and quarter window are still different. Hmm. I hope those two panels weren't in the group we returned today. If they are I'll be pissed...
 
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I can't even recall that myself... Its been such a long time. I assume that this is going to be some kind of quasi-competitor to the Venzia, but only in "hey, I'm a car-based crossover thats more like a wagon" way than anything else. It makes you wonder how likely it would be that we would see more wagon versions of mainstream sedans pop up at other houses. Then again, the Magnum did fall flat on its face...
 
And for those that jump in and say the Magnum was impractical, so did the Freestyle and Mazda 6 wagon.
I'd personally be amazed if Toyota could find anyone stupid enough to buy the Venzia.
 
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What's with Honda's ugly wheel designs lately? The new Accords, Civics, and whatever this wagon/crossover is have some pretty bad ones. Even the 2009 Si's aren't very good, and are one of the main reasons that I went ahead and got the '08.
 
I'd personally be amazed if Toyota could find anyone stupid enough to buy the Venzia.

I've seen two or three on the road up here, one even in my school's parking lot. Silly stuff.

Personally, I "don't get it" with that "car."
 
Apparently nobody really gets it. I have yet to see one here in the Toyota "mecca" of the US. Granted I haven't really gotten out that far yet. They could also jsut not be out yet.
 
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