High Performance Honda Thread: The S2000 is Back?

[Eric.]

You can't tell me that you like the 2009 TL. It's probably one of the ugliest new cars there is. Even big Honda fans don't like it. I don't know though...I rather have a Lexus IS. Acrua doesn't have anything really appealing when compared to Lexus or Infiniti. The G37 is nicer or just as nice all there cars but looks better.

Who said we were comparing? I was under the impression that you were saying that Acura's lineup had too much overlap and that some models weren't necessary, like I was saying for this rumored model going between the Civic and Fit.

And to answer your question, I also hate the TL's redesign.

 

[TVC]

Who said we were comparing? I was under the impression that you were saying that Acura's lineup had too much overlap and that some models weren't necessary, like I was saying for this rumored model going between the Civic and Fit.

And to answer your question, I also hate the TL's redesign.

Oh that's what you thought. No I don't think there is to much over lap. I don't think there needs to be a car in between the Civic and Fit besides the Civic hatchback.

I just said I hope Acura doesn't ruin this car because of their new designs...they are terrible...

 

[Eric.]

Oh that's what you thought. No I don't think there is to much over lap. I don't think there needs to be a car in between the Civic and Fit besides the Civic hatchback.

I just said I hope Acura doesn't ruin this car because of their new designs...they are terrible...

Just thought of something that probably would fit right in. The CR-Z. Ideally it would be offered as a hybrid with the new Insight's powertrain (failing that, the Civic hybrid's), the 1.8L 140hp engine from the current Civics, and a slightly detuned K20 with around 165-175hp to distance it from the Civic Si. Probably would need to make the LSD an option for the Si model both to keep the cost down and to separate the two cars.

I think Honda could move them.

 

[McLaren]

Not really. The RL and TL are blurring the line nowadays, but the RL is probably due to be phased out or updated some more. The TSX gets you the entry level Acura luxury sedan with a healthy four cylinder. The two SUV's are distinct in size and attitude. So aside from those first two, it seems to me that each model has its own purpose.

The RL's actually much nicer than the TL. It's a nice cruiser, luxury car with some pickup. The new TL, though, likes to drive like a sports car when you push it, or a nice daily driver if you want it to. You're pretty much spot on though with the TSX.

None of the Acura's really overlap each other at all.

 

[Eric.]

The RL's actually much nicer than the TL. It's a nice cruiser, luxury car with some pickup. The new TL, though, likes to drive like a sports car when you push it, or a nice daily driver if you want it to. You're pretty much spot on though with the TSX.

None of the Acura's really overlap each other at all.

I was guessing that would have been the difference with the RL and TL, but seeing that the TL is the newer car I wondered if it wasn't stepping on big brother's toes in the cruiser aspect as well. Thanks for clarifying.

 

[ranhammerR34]

NSX: KIA
S2000: KIA
V8 Program: MIA
RWD Acura Flagship: MIA

Okay Honda, sales for you were down by only 8% last year. I vote to call these all bad decisions...

Well, they are not good decisions for speed enthusiasts of the brand. The S2000 is wonderful car both in GT and real-life. I wish it did have a cvt automatic (sorry, driving a manual for me would be a nightmare!) and a hardtop version for us who live in the northern part of the world. The NSX may have been as Richard Hammond of Top Gear said... "an engineer's project," but you know what.. aren't all vehicles sometimes an engineer's project? The NSX was a great car that nobody loved... My main concern is are they going to kill the international Type-R's? I don't think the US has had Type-R since... the Civic Type R of the 03-04 model year?... Guys can you confirm or deny this?

V8 program? Wow, I wonder what a VTEC-V8 would sound like... sad that we may not see it at all... And the RWD Acura? TL would be nice, how about TSX, or maybe an RSX? Hmmmm... Tempting... especially the 160 hp with automatic that can be played with to become a sleeper.. double Hmmmmm 👍 Randy

 

[homeforsummer]

Just thought of something that probably would fit right in. The CR-Z. Ideally it would be offered as a hybrid with the new Insight's powertrain (failing that, the Civic hybrid's), the 1.8L 140hp engine from the current Civics, and a slightly detuned K20 with around 165-175hp to distance it from the Civic Si. Probably would need to make the LSD an option for the Si model both to keep the cost down and to separate the two cars.

I think Honda could move them.

Nice idea, but I'd do it with nothing larger than a 1.6. Maybe even the 1.5 the Fit has. With light enough weight that'd be all you needed for a small, quick, fun car. Witness the EG/EK Civics as proof. Take the spirit of those cars and mix it up with modern features, safety and creature comforts and you'd be onto an absolutely epic winner. Then, obviously, the hybrid model would be a great choice too. Still fun, not as fast, but incredibly economical, like the first-gen Insight.

 

[Azuremen]

Nice idea, but I'd do it with nothing larger than a 1.6. Maybe even the 1.5 the Fit has. With light enough weight that'd be all you needed for a small, quick, fun car. Witness the EG/EK Civics as proof. Take the spirit of those cars and mix it up with modern features, safety and creature comforts and you'd be onto an absolutely epic winner. Then, obviously, the hybrid model would be a great choice too. Still fun, not as fast, but incredibly economical, like the first-gen Insight.

The problem is modern safety features mean more weight. That is why the average weight of a car has increased so much over the years - safety.

 

[homeforsummer]

The problem is modern safety features mean more weight. That is why the average weight of a car has increased so much over the years - safety.

There's still no reason a modern, small car can't be light though. I'm talking 1000kgs roughly. The Mazda 2 and new Fiesta manage just fine, as did the first gen Insight, I can't see any reason why the CR-Z would be too overweight. 1000kg should be an easy target, and for that weight you wouldn't need an overpowered engine. A smaller one would be more economical and more in the spirit of the car, and small Hondas of old.

 

[Tornado]

If Honda gave the S2000 a little more torque and released the Civic Type R in the US they would really be able to compete with the 370z, Mazda Mazdaspeed 3, and the Cobalt SS.

No they wouldn't. The Mazdaspeed 3 and Cobalt SS are at least a performance class above the Type R.

I'm glad that the S2000 successor is dead, because the rumours of it being 2+2 boat rather than a taught roadster made me die more inside than the NSX replacement becoming akin to a Japanese Corvette.

 

[niky]

There's still no reason a modern, small car can't be light though. I'm talking 1000kgs roughly. The Mazda 2 and new Fiesta manage just fine, as did the first gen Insight, I can't see any reason why the CR-Z would be too overweight. 1000kg should be an easy target, and for that weight you wouldn't need an overpowered engine. A smaller one would be more economical and more in the spirit of the car, and small Hondas of old.

The only car with halfway decent room at that weight is the Honda Fit.

And to hit that target, you give up a few things. Engine size, for one, interior plastics (they're thinner) for another, and lastly, sound deadening... which can add a lot of weight to a car. And size. Making the Fit narrower and shorter than a compact makes it much lighter.

The closest modern compacts come to the target weight are the Honda Civic and the Toyota Corolla. Both around 1200 kilograms. But the Civic is a bit tinny compared to some competitors (as is the Corolla) and both cars have a lot more thin plastics than their predecessors.

I was disappointed when the Corolla, the last of its breed under 1100 kgs, went over the mark, especially while maintaining the same engine size, but when you consider the previous Corolla scored only 4-stars on the EuroNCAP and 2-stars for pedestrian safety, while the new one is 5-stars and 3-stars respectively, you start to understand where the extra weight is coming from.

 

[YSSMAN]

Honda Grants A Reprieve To V8, RWD Acura Programs?

*link there in the title

What you need to know:

Acura is still telling their dealers that a "Tier-1" program is go, which is believed to be code for the big, RWD, V8-powered Acura that has been talked about for a year or so. Perhaps not all hope is lost, but either way, the loss of the S2000 and "NSX" is a little sad.

 

[McLaren]

I'll have to see this. Needs to be ready in a year, though, if I decide I'd like it.

 

[Philly]

And this is an RL or TL replacement? Or will they adapt the platform to fit both cars?

I don't think I can really believe this until I hear more about it.

 

[YSSMAN]

I think this new V8, rear-drive sedan is supposed to replace the RL. The TL is still a pretty good car, overall, so I don't think they'd kill it yet.

 

[Eric.]

I think this new V8, rear-drive sedan is supposed to replace the RL. The TL is still a pretty good car, overall, so I don't think they'd kill it yet.

I'd have to agree with that. Expect a new name since the RL was known for its fancy SH-AWD, and a new RL would likely keep that. I don't suppose they could fit an optional AWD system under this new model though...

 

[SagarisGTB]

I'd have to agree with that. Expect a new name since the RL was known for its fancy SH-AWD, and a new RL would likely keep that. I don't suppose they could fit an optional AWD system under this new model though...

Theyd need to. AWD makes much more sense than RWD in much of Canada.

 

[McLaren]

I'd have to agree with that. Expect a new name since the RL was known for its fancy SH-AWD, and a new RL would likely keep that. I don't suppose they could fit an optional AWD system under this new model though...

If they're going to do that, they might as well just throw this RWD, V8 under the TL along with a SH-AWD version after the 4th gen., and market it as a high performance sedan. That, or go for making a new car altogether in a coupe form.

 

[Eric.]

If they're going to do that, they might as well just throw this RWD, V8 under the TL along with a SH-AWD version after the 4th gen., and market it as a high performance sedan. That, or go for making a new car altogether in a coupe form.

That would cause more overlap between the TL and RL in my opinion, in terms of which is the halo car. I say make the V8 RWD car be the top luxury model, more or less taking the RL's spot but probably moving it up a few notches in the performance department (which the V8 should easily do). Then the TL will keep the sporting nature alive with a horsepower bump to maybe 350-ish?

Though I doubt Honda is going to be dumping all of this money into the brand right now to reorder its lineup.

 

[Tornado]

Especially when they just blew a ton of money making the entire Acura line suck.

 

[Keef]

Honda's CUV: Latitude?

Article and larger pics at Temple of VTEC

So, it looks just like it did before. Now we see that it has similar attributes to the Audi Allroad, in its higher ground clearance, wider track, and AWD--you can see the rear differential in the third pic. It looks like an offroading beast with those snow tires on. Maybe this will be promoted as more of a multipurpose vehicle than the Venza. I hope so, because they Venza is pretty lame-ass.

Still no word on those mystery 2NX quarter panels though.

 

[Philly]

Looks pretty weird. I wonder if this will flop as badly as the Venza.

 

[YSSMAN]

This appears to be the new wave in the mass exodus from SUVs and large-ish crossovers, sedan-based off-road thingies. Saab has the 9-3X coming, which is otherwise a SportCombi with a raised suspension and the fancy XWD system. We've already had the Allroad, the Venzia, and I think we could make an argument that the Taurus X and Flex fit into this category as well.

Not that I'm complaining. I like the look, I love the idea, and if it comes at the right price, more power to them. Now they just need to do something similar with a Civic-sized car (but not the Element!)...

 

[Tornado]

Bah, YSSMAN! The Flex is far too large.

 

[Picc84]

Am I the only one seeing an Aston Martin Vanquish in this picture?

 

[Bones Brigade]

Yes.

Vanquish has bulbous fenders, and everything is rounded off. Save the the vaguely similar profile due to being an FR layout, they have almost nothing in common. Design language isn't close at all.

 

[YSSMAN]

In Case You Didn't Know...

The S2000 is dead after the MY2009, and its going out with one last hurrah. Europe will be getting whats being dubbed as the "Ultimate Edition" S2000.

Makes me hopeful that we'll get something in the US, but overall, it makes me want to race out and get a used S2000 that much more.

 

[Jim Prower]

nuuuuuuu....

Thy will be missed. Honda now has no RWD cars.

 

[Eric.]

In Case You Didn't Know...

The S2000 is dead after the MY2009, and its going out with one last hurrah. Europe will be getting whats being dubbed as the "Ultimate Edition" S2000.

Makes me hopeful that we'll get something in the US, but overall, it makes me want to race out and get a used S2000 that much more.

I wouldn't be that concerned about getting the "Ultimate" model...Its basically a color package. It is sad to see the S2000 go, though. Hopefully it won't be on hiatus for too long.

 

[Picc84]

Yeah the S2000 is one of honda's best car's for racing. If they do dissapear for ever, I wonder how long it would take for them to dwindle down circulation in the racing series's?