How does the GT community really feel about catch the rabbit races?

[Macboyilija]

Can you share some foto’s ? Just for the memories ?

Every online race that I have been in, I have been able to finish higher than my starting position, but not high enough to keep my DR rating from dropping like a rock.

Maybe because of lack of good qualify ? Should not be the case normally.

Also having said that I am getting my monies worth if only for the online private lobbies.

This. I notice many people dont realise there is a great online private lobby community. It goes further than only thinking “what can I join now”. There are great series and championships going on you can visit and have the best online races in those private lobbies. See online lobby section on GTP for some good examples.

 

[TonyJZX]

i sort of play GTS FH3 and FM7 in spurts... like obviously 26 miles of GTS... then maybe 30 mins of FM7 etc. etc.

There's three different dichotomies...

FH3 is a dumb arcade racer... the competition is basically to overtake what seems like a fast AI but they're only fast in a straight line with their magic Horizon boost.

FM7 is the race winner is whoever takes the 1st corner. You need to restart the race often mainly on the very high performance cars. This was always the way even back to FM4. Putting 12 dudes in 750hp rwd hypercars will be unpredictable to say the least.

GT Sport is chase the rabbit. You need a car fast enough to overtake someone who's driving at 7 or 8/10ths.

I rarely restart the race so to me its not very jarring. I prefer the bad way GTS does it.

 

[klondike]

Not to start a game war as each game in this genre has it strengh.

But in my opinion Forza 7 has a much better single player system compared to GT Sport.

Yeah the AI is still a bit dumb ( Real problem is its not easy to program a good AI )

But in FM 7 there are a ton of options to make races much more interesting. Its posibel to select between dificulties. The hardest one is not easy for most people. So unless you are pretty good at sim racing it will be very hard to beat it. Also its posibel to chose the lenght of races in carrer. The longer races are often very much enjoyable because you dont have to force your way through the field in a few laps. You can actually try to race clean versus the AI.

Not saying Forza is a perfect game, but it certanly a good game to adt to the collection to anyone who likes racing games. And to be honest its proberly a much better game compared to GT sport for the people who wants to play by them self in a carrer mode.

 

[ImaRobot]

But in my opinion Forza 7 has a much better single player system compared to GT Sport.

That's because the structure was reworked from past iterations. They listened to the community and implemented changes that seemed to have worked well on the outcome. However, that's because it had a clear focus in the beginning, much like GTS. They aimed for opposite ends of the spectrum - One focused primarily on multiplayer aspect and the other single player.

Much like GTS implemented offline activities after the fact, Forza is trickling in features for the multiplayer side of things after release as well.

But in FM 7 there are a ton of options to make races much more interesting. Its posibel to select between dificulties. The hardest one is not easy for most people. So unless you are pretty good at sim racing it will be very hard to beat it. Also its posibel to chose the lenght of races in carrer. The longer races are often very much enjoyable because you dont have to force your way through the field in a few laps. You can actually try to race clean versus the AI.

I've mentioned it before somewhere( I think in this thread, actually), but that feature would be great, in any racing game. Just implementing that alone would do so much for the players who prefer offline racing.

You can change the grid, TOD, Weather, Laps, and even micro manage it beyond that and make specific restrictions to HP, weight, year, and so on. There's even a lot that I can't remember off the top of my head, but it's very extensive.

Not saying Forza is a perfect game, but it certanly a good game to adt to the collection to anyone who likes racing games. And to be honest its proberly a much better game compared to GT sport for the people who wants to play by them self in a carrer mode.

In the single player aspect, you'd be correct, if that's what you prefer than Forza has that covered much better than GTS. The game structure is based around it. However, that's not an insult to GTS either, they just have different priorities.

 

[Blindside92]

It's not representative of real motorsport, and the worst part is it creates ingrained bad habits in the players, for when they go to race real people online. By having events that teach you to do this in the driving tests/single-player mode in general with little to no vehicle damage/penalties/failures due to contact with other vehicles/walls of the track - it's forming habits of things like divebombing and ramming opponents/the walls to corner faster, corner cutting - it rewards being a horrible racer on the track.

There's no aspects of motorsport/racecraft defence really taught either from what I've seen (ie. guarding your position from a evenly matched opponent attempting to overtake you from behind, taking into account racing lines, track positioning, early/late apexing, timing of braking, in a respectable/fair way) - only super-duper-offence in the "chase down the 19 opponents ahead of you and come 1st in a short timespan" objective in most of these events.

Too many rolling starts and not enough grid starts, and qualifying is a non-existent aspect. Annoying, things could be better within the single player modes.

 

[Zowy52]

One of the less discussed features of off line play is the "clean race bonus", an additional 50% for not hitting other objects in the race, like other cars or walls, or on some tracks cutting corners. You actually have to pick good lines and even slow down sometimes to make a pass at the correct place on the track. The AI will spin you out or crash you into a wall if you have placed yourself in a vulnerable position. Blocking done well will not result in a penalty. Passing in the wrong spot can also lead to problems. Off line racing is a personal satisfaction event. Can you do a faster lap? Can you do a faster race? Can you do it cleanly every time? Maybe even learn a little bit about good racecraft. GTS seems to do this in a way that keeps me coming back for more. I enjoy chasing the rabbit and detuning my cars to make it a little harder as I get better. Using a lower rated car also increases the "car handicap" bonus, further increasing your winnings. As you detune your car, it becomes much more about your driving than it is about having the fastest car on the track. You can make chase the rabbit as hard and challenging as you want. Your results may be different.

 

[MatskiMonk]

One of the less discussed features of off line play is the "clean race bonus", an additional 50% for not hitting other objects in the race, like other cars or walls, or on some tracks cutting corners. You actually have to pick good lines and even slow down sometimes to make a pass at the correct place on the track. The AI will spin you out or crash you into a wall if you have placed yourself in a vulnerable position. Blocking done well will not result in a penalty. Passing in the wrong spot can also lead to problems. Off line racing is a personal satisfaction event. Can you do a faster lap? Can you do a faster race? Can you do it cleanly every time? Maybe even learn a little bit about good racecraft. GTS seems to do this in a way that keeps me coming back for more. I enjoy chasing the rabbit and detuning my cars to make it a little harder as I get better. Using a lower rated car also increases the "car handicap" bonus, further increasing your winnings. As you detune your car, it becomes much more about your driving than it is about having the fastest car on the track. You can make chase the rabbit as hard and challenging as you want. Your results may be different.

Gotta agree with all this. It tends to be why I do more N class races in League mode than Gr. races, as the combo of the clean bonus and the slow car bonus can be quite rewarding.

 

[golfer07840]

One of the less discussed features of off line play is the "clean race bonus", an additional 50% for not hitting other objects in the race, like other cars or walls, or on some tracks cutting corners. You actually have to pick good lines and even slow down sometimes to make a pass at the correct place on the track. The AI will spin you out or crash you into a wall if you have placed yourself in a vulnerable position. Blocking done well will not result in a penalty. Passing in the wrong spot can also lead to problems. Off line racing is a personal satisfaction event. Can you do a faster lap? Can you do a faster race? Can you do it cleanly every time? Maybe even learn a little bit about good racecraft. GTS seems to do this in a way that keeps me coming back for more. I enjoy chasing the rabbit and detuning my cars to make it a little harder as I get better. Using a lower rated car also increases the "car handicap" bonus, further increasing your winnings. As you detune your car, it becomes much more about your driving than it is about having the fastest car on the track. You can make chase the rabbit as hard and challenging as you want. Your results may be different.

I'd like to see someone Do the Rally Race at Tokyo Expressway and get a clean bonus.

 

[Loverson]

What makes it worse? It's that you already have plenty of chase the rabbit scenario in the driving mission.
Hopefully they do something about the AI.

 

[6BK]

Not sure if anyone has mentioned this in the previous 5 pages...I looked but didn't see. I personally recon ALL of the single player league races are a bit lame (just my humble), however I also managed to spend 6 months properly enjoying GT Sport off line racking up considerable hours and miles until only about a few months ago when I figured I was enjoying it so much it was worth getting a PS+ account and move to the next step. This enjoyment was found in the custom races, an area I think is largely overlooked. I suppose to a small degree all of my races were "rabbit" but more realistic than the Single Player Campaign:

Set as much as you can to "realistic" levels for example: Opposition Professional, BOP On, Boost Off, Damage High, Penalties High, Fuel Use 7 (sample), Tyre Wear 4 (sample). Start somewhere between 11th and 20th (rolling or grid - take your pick), 15 to 60 mins of racing. OK, lots of you here will be faster than I am but for me I could pick off the first few places easy but catching and passing the lead AI when starting in the bottom half of a race in a 20 min event was a challenge. The settings of using damage, penalties, fuel & tyre wear, BOP etc definitely prepared me for Sport Mode when I eventually got access.

 

[seandimes]

Dont like them, but I think its necessary because the AI is just that bad. I often set up custom races when I am not in the mood to race online, starting myself in 20th place, usually 20-40 minute races. And there is usually no way I dont finish first with a seizable lead in the end, sometimes despite crashing once or twice a race, and I am by no means a fast driver. There would have to be at least 2 more AI levels beyond professional to make it challenging, until then the rabbit race style is the only one that provides sometimes somewhat of a challenge

 

[6BK]

Dont like them, but I think its necessary because the AI is just that bad. I often set up custom races when I am not in the mood to race online, starting myself in 20th place, usually 20-40 minute races. And there is usually no way I dont finish first with a seizable lead in the end, sometimes despite crashing once or twice a race, and I am by no means a fast driver. There would have to be at least 2 more AI levels beyond professional to make it challenging, until then the rabbit race style is the only one that provides sometimes somewhat of a challenge

There’s the advantage of me being a crap driver. Starting 20th on a 20 min race with fuel & tyre wear has proved difficult to win for me. So, if you want AI to be a challenge, just stay crap yourself.

Perhaps after 3 months online I should try custom races again and see if I’m any faster.

 

[MarchingSaint]

I think PD needs this ploy because on easy and medium difficulty races, the AI never goes full throttle. While i think this format got stale pretty quickly, things would be a tad better if BoP was allowed on campaign and single races. Fire GTS right now and do a quick race in Gr3 class, you'll find on top positions the two BMWs, the GTR, Ford GT Ferrari and so on. On top of that: penalties works only against you if not at all. The direct contact penalty doesn't show up even if you were to go on a massive rampage on track. It's a pity, said mechanism would bring much more interest campaign and single race

Tl;Dr yes, chase the rabbit races are appalling enough but i'm pretty sure things are going to change soon.

 

[sirjim73]

 

[Guffaluff]

I'm not a big fan of the formula of GT League. Starting in the back of the field or dead last, having to overtake everyone and win the race in just a handful of laps, should be exclusive to the mission challenges. I feel like the GT League is lacking quite a bit being this way, and being all single races. If we ignore the faults with the AI and just focus on the format, there is so much potential for improvement with very basic coding (or so I would think).

Here's my most wanted changes that I feel would greatly improve the experience:

- The option to qualify for each race, just like it was in the PS1 era. If you don't qualify, you start last. Fair, right?
- Proper grid/rolling starts with false start checks. No more starting "mid race", 30-40sek away from the leader, it's a big immersion breaker for me.
- Inclusion of championships/cups with point systems with either a random reward car for winning or a nice price money pool. Having all races as single races gets a little bit stale.
- Tweaking of the price money, could be a bit higher for some events.

I'm gonna finish the GT League events, but I'm doing them in small bursts as I usually don't feel like doing them for too long at a time.

Fortunately we have custom races. It could have a little more options for setting up, but at least there we can have proper race, with proper starts. Biggest problem there is the AI, as I feel it could benefit of one more level of difficulty. I find the Professional difficulty too easy.

 

[seandimes]

- The option to qualify for each race, just like it was in the PS1 era. If you don't qualify, you start last. Fair, right?
- Proper grid/rolling starts with false start checks. No more starting "mid race", 30-40sek away from the leader, it's a big immersion breaker for me.
- Inclusion of championships/cups with point systems with either a random reward car for winning or a nice price money pool. Having all races as single races gets a little bit stale.

All these points would instantly improve the fun in GT League. I really dont get why its all single races, and not a cup system in the first place.

I still think the only way to improve the offline racing part is to improve the AI. There isnt a single track that the AI is competitive on, not even (or especially) ovals. In addition to that, its not only that the professional AI is driving slow, its intentionally slowing down on parts of the track where you absolutely dont have to, and its even unintuitive to do so. For example closely following the AI through Bathurst is impossible, since they will slow down on parts of the mountain where you simple dont expect it.

Since offline racing isnt the focus of GT Sport, I dont even expect an AI that defends its position and is aware of its surroundings. But I think an AI level that can follow the racing line as fast as possible isnt too much to ask.

Also the rabbit race style works for the short sprint races, but in the endurance races the AI is simply too slow to provide any challenge, and for the second half of the race you are basically running a time trial with fuel and tire wear

 

[golfer07840]

All these points would instantly improve the fun in GT League. I really dont get why its all single races, and not a cup system in the first place.

Stupid me, I thought the Audi TT Cup in the GT League was in fact that. Single Races but when I got 1st in all three, I thought I'd get some sort of award for it.

Nope, nothing.

 

[beyond72]

I don't agree with the "if you don't like it, don't play it then" mentality. As Forza had a "chase the rabbit" structure in last gen, but it was still more competitive, if you made a mistake the CPU could punish you, in GT it seems they just give up once you past them. But I guess this is why they didn't want to continue with single player originally.

 

[TonyJZX]

I dont think I've ever seen the AI "give up" when I pass them... they usually give chase with cartoon rocket boost.

Or I'm in a car so vastly superior they have no hope of catching me.

 

[05XR8]

All these points would instantly improve the fun in GT League. I really dont get why its all single races, and not a cup system in the first place.

I still think the only way to improve the offline racing part is to improve the AI. There isnt a single track that the AI is competitive on, not even (or especially) ovals. In addition to that, its not only that the professional AI is driving slow, its intentionally slowing down on parts of the track where you absolutely dont have to, and its even unintuitive to do so. For example closely following the AI through Bathurst is impossible, since they will slow down on parts of the mountain where you simple dont expect it.

Since offline racing isnt the focus of GT Sport, I dont even expect an AI that defends its position and is aware of its surroundings. But I think an AI level that can follow the racing line as fast as possible isnt too much to ask.

Also the rabbit race style works for the short sprint races, but in the endurance races the AI is simply too slow to provide any challenge, and for the second half of the race you are basically running a time trial with fuel and tire wear

Worse thing is, PD programming AI to crash and/or spin, every time when racing a certain race.

 

[Loverson]

Not sure if anyone has mentioned this in the previous 5 pages...I looked but didn't see. I personally recon ALL of the single player league races are a bit lame (just my humble), however I also managed to spend 6 months properly enjoying GT Sport off line racking up considerable hours and miles until only about a few months ago when I figured I was enjoying it so much it was worth getting a PS+ account and move to the next step. This enjoyment was found in the custom races, an area I think is largely overlooked. I suppose to a small degree all of my races were "rabbit" but more realistic than the Single Player Campaign:

Set as much as you can to "realistic" levels for example: Opposition Professional, BOP On, Boost Off, Damage High, Penalties High, Fuel Use 7 (sample), Tyre Wear 4 (sample). Start somewhere between 11th and 20th (rolling or grid - take your pick), 15 to 60 mins of racing. OK, lots of you here will be faster than I am but for me I could pick off the first few places easy but catching and passing the lead AI when starting in the bottom half of a race in a 20 min event was a challenge. The settings of using damage, penalties, fuel & tyre wear, BOP etc definitely prepared me for Sport Mode when I eventually got access.

Try doing a high damage, full car and high fuel consumption in bathurst with grid start. It is a wreckfest haha

 

[beyond72]

I dont think I've ever seen the AI "give up" when I pass them... they usually give chase with cartoon rocket boost.

Or I'm in a car so vastly superior they have no hope of catching me.

I can't really comment on Sport.
(Although I did see a video where I thought the guy was doing a hot lap but then realized he had just taken first place in seconds!)
But I meant the rest of the field, on GT6 - so depressing to just breeze past amazing cars even in a less powerful car.

 

[MisterOne77]

I think I'd like racing against the A.I more if they weren't insane. But I can't race online so I'll just have to deal with them as they are.

 

[TenderLoins]

I haven’t raced offline other than time trial with BOP on for practice.