How important is paint/vinyl customization in GT5?

Racing liveries would be cool again if they're not going to put in paint options and individualistic vinyls.

There should be a range of different race series styles on certain cars aswell. Being able to change the colour of your car should be allowed. Hmm... GT Paintshop.
 
so let me get this straight, people against the livery editor are arguing that the cars are going to get "riced" out or look like crap because of other players? now thats a freakin joke.
 
PuTTe_TuTTe
I would love if they took the racing modification back from GT1/GT2! Wich could be much more detailed with GT5, because you should be able to see a rollcage, racing seats and so on..

Also they could make it in 3 levels or something, where level one is only weight reduction and a simple rollcage, level 2 is a more complicated rollcage and maybe a rear spoiler and level 3 is a full racing chassis and racing body kit. And then a seperate section where you paint the car and put on stickers.
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Your right, when i mod the car, let me see what i've done

If i buy exhaust from Blitz, i want to see and hear a Blitz exhaust on the car.
This is a feature that Blitz should test on all their products and send the noise results to GT. This goes for every other tuner. It's free advertisment is what it is.

I can pick my car and hear the best one to let me pick which one to buy.

The same goes for weight modification.....i doubt a car with a "stage 3" weight reduction would still have all the carpet, seats, and other bits of the interior trim. Show me what i've done.

On the issue of bodykits....Have companies like C-West, Re Amemiya, Vertex, ect.... Send there stuff to GT so they can keep adding to the GT library of content. It doesn't all have to come out at once, just down loadable content that will be easy to identify when it comes out.

Just imagine.... you have a 350Z in your garage..... none of the kits are to your taste, then TAS 2009 and all these tuners send Gigs of content to GT for purchase. You then find the one you like and purchase it. (Game credits not actual money) You still keep your stock one but you can alternate. Same story for Group N TRD Fender flares for AE86 .... go to TRD to have them equipped.

GT needs to let the tuning world come alive, Just like GTTV is designed to bring Bestmotoring, HotVersion, TopGEAR, to veiwers round the world that cant see it. Expose the world's aftermarket tuners to everyone so that you dont have to spend hours on google looking for stuff for your 350z. You can look through the selection you want and event contact (phone/email) the manufacturer.

The database should actually be on the internet so you only have to save your garage and game progress on your hard drive.

What you guys think?
 
I don't want a bunch of downloadable content because then it's just going to turn into everything the 360 does or at least what Forza does. It nickels and dimes the gamer to get stuff that probably should have been in the full game to begin with.
 
Joey D
I don't want a bunch of downloadable content because then it's just going to turn into everything the 360 does or at least what Forza does. It nickels and dimes the gamer to get stuff that probably should have been in the full game to begin with.
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nickel and dimes shouldn't exist, it should be a one time charge of $70 for the game itself, then an xbox 360 style live where you pay once a year to be part of the network. All the downloadable content is stored in their library and is bought with game credits, not actual money.
 
Southend Rage
Yeah, but some genuine stuff would be nice tho, like new tracks.
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100% correct

it makes me sad to see the track selection in Forza and compare it to GT.
Same is true with many of Forza's cars. Hopefully these thing get dealt with by the time gt5 is released.

Let's stay on topic of body/graphics/ect for this thread.
 
RedOak
I think if GT5 is to embark in the online world; with its challenges, leaderboards and clans... Liveries and custom paint jobs are a necessity. The ability to customize one's avatar is not paramount to any online players and communities; it basically went from being en emerging gameplay to a full core gameplay mechanic.

Even most racing "clans" in the real world have war colors and custom designed logos for their cars.

Overall, some people are against it because they see it as something that is not necessary to driving, but then again its not to any kind of games.
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Undoubtedly there are even more arguments for why visual customization is increasingly essential in Gran Turismo, but I have to get on with what's left of my day.

Many MANY years ago when I was just getting into racing and NASCAR/Winston Cup was the only thing available in "stock" car racing, I watched some single make races where all the cars were basic color schemes with no team liveries, and it just wasn't the same.

Part of the thrill of racing is to see some car with an incredible paint job making it's way through the pack. And that's why some of us buy posters of some racer or other, because his (or her) car has an eye catching livery.

I personally think most people's objections boil down to "I don't think I can make a nice livery, so I don't want anyone to be able to." I think the obscenity line is just not thinking things through or they're grasping for a convenient line. The world we live in is obscene. There's no getting away from it. Heck, Grand Theft Auto, piece of crap though it is, is a huge seller. But how many of you naysayers don't watch TV or movies because of nasty content? I think many are spouting out of both sides of their mouths on this.

As I said in another thread, the Forza community has grown substantially because of user created content, and there are some magnificent pieces of work from those either recreating some fantastic livery from the racing world, or as I do (did), coming up with our own.

And this is where I hope GT5 breaks ground. Racing online with plain street cars or race cars from the roster Kaz and the lads give us is okay, but it's much cooler than you can imagine to create your own racing identity with paint, racing bodykits and decals, and taking this car, unlike any other car in the world, on the track. In my opinion, This is why Forza is so cool. The racing isn't that much different. It's the ability to create something unique which is completely and totally your own that identifies you to a planet full of other racers. The worst thing I can imagine is a race full of the Raybrig NSX or the Castrol Supra.

For those of you who don't want this, can you imagine the worldwide outcry which would erupt if Kaz decided that only street legal sportscars would be in Gran Turismo 5? No race cars? And this is very much like what some of you are complaining about. "No. No modified cars." Does this sound like a good idea for a racing game? And how many of you who don't like modifications modify your cars anyway?

If you pick a race car out of the list, don't you choose one with a paint job you like? Wouldn't it be even better if you had one that no one else had? Furthermore, having racing bodykits and vinyls means you'll have a never ending car list. If GT5 is missing a car you wanted to see in the game, now you can recreate it. And if you can't, either Polyphony can give you templates to making your own, or some artist in the community can make one for you.

The only thing I can see as a negative is the crude art and language which might happen. But I have to say that in my experience online in Forza, I never EVER saw one. I know they exist, but their numbers are so few, you have a better chance of winning the lottery. And like I say, I doubt any of you lock your doors, refuse to watch TV or read any magazines because you might come across something offensive. ;)

The only thing I can see for this subject is an even more enthusiastic reception for Gran Turismo.

Edit: skimming this thread, several of you echo my sentiments exactly. When a new race car comes into the racing world, give me the ability to recreate it. If I have an idea for a race car of my own, give me the tools to build it. That's going to have me playing Gran Turismo and no other game for the rest of my life.
 
Bloody well said old boy, bloody well said.

I agree with that 100% 👍.
 


Good write up. There is the definite bunch that has been brain washed into thinking bodykits and graphics are things you don't do to a car. This will pass because just like Forza let you build what you want, GT5 will hopefully do the same.

The factor of graphics already being in the library is important too.

example:

You have a Honda Fit, You've gone to the J's Racing garage and bought their exhaust suspension and brakes. Now you should be able to give it their paint scheme as well. If GT fails to but a certain version of a car into the game, then why not be able to make it into that car.
Example: STI from D1GP car from Tex Modify Team Orange, i should be able to make my sti into that car.


Let the user be able to go all out with no limits.
 
Dave A has done some great painting in Forza, and I've done a few cars I'm happy with. But the artists in the Forza community have done some simply amazing work, either recreating some real life livery or creating something unique but looks like it came from a professional designer. Sometime, I should upload some images from Forza 2 from my own garage and others to show you guys what you can do with even Forza 2's basic painting tools.

I should add that GT probably won't be my only racing game. At some point, I do want to see if I can get Live For Speed to run on my PC, and there are rumblings that some developer will hire the guys to turn it into an actual GT style racer. But so far, PC racing for me is broken for whatever reason (Windoze). I'd also like to try GTR2 on the console. But honestly, both GT and Forza give me almost everything I want in racing. XBox Live fees aside. :P
 
You remember my old phone camera shots from Forza 1. I'm still proud of that RX-7 I styled on the 787b from Gran Turismo.
 
Racing liveries etc = cool and acceptable.

ricer style vinyls and stickers/paintjobs = uncool, non-acceptable.. {insert endless list of negative descriptions here} etc etc.

same goes for bodykits.
 
I do lament over the loss of racing modification, but other than that, I say leave liveries out. Forza has many, many problems with profanity, nudity, and racial slurs, that I'd hate to see ruin the GT franchise. While there are many talented artists out there who do wonderful recreations of authentic racing liveries, there are just as many scum bags willing to paint their filth. Plus, I can't imagine it would be easy for Polyphony to get the okay from all the many car companies, a la BMW's in GT2.

These are just my .02 cents, take them with a grain of salt.
 
Here is how I would solve one of the big issues. For any league or online tournament race the race director ( person that sets up the race or races ) has the option to inspect players cars. This would mean a quick visual and maybe quick read of what all is installed on the car. Then if there is something the director does not like they can ban that person from racing in that race. For open quick races this might not be needed but anything more seriuos it would be important to have. To review a 16 car field would take maybe 5 to 10 minuets and you could even do this while they was running qualifying or something. I am saying this on the hopes that there will be a very intensive online options.
 
I don't see how stickers and body kits make a car "rice". All race cars have some sort of aero kit on them and I see no reason why they shouldn't be offered in GT5. Also most race car liveries have a ton of stickers on them, so once again I see no issue with it. The only thing this would allow people to do is enjoy GT5 for longer because they could take any car and make it their own. I know it would be cool to style my exact car.
 
Omologato
Forza has many, many problems with profanity, nudity, and racial slurs, that I'd hate to see ruin the GT franchise. While there are many talented artists out there who do wonderful recreations of authentic racing liveries, there are just as many scum bags willing to paint their filth.
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This is the main problem with this discussion. People get too emotionally entangled with their reactions, and they exaggerate things.

Being a Live member for a while now, and avid Forza 2 Auction House shopper, the above is not the case at all. While there are literally tens of thousands of people using the Auction House, and 100 or more artists you want to watch for excellent work, there are perhaps a couple dozen offering porny or otherwise offensive cars. And their numbers are dropping a bit as the Turn 10 mods ban repeat offenders who are warned what will happen if they continue.

Now I'll grant you there are too many cartoon, fantasy and Fast n Furious paint jobs, but that's another story. ;)

It's just like crime, drugs and sleeping around. While a few muckheads are a problem in society, everyone isn't doing it.

And dittos to Joey D above.
 
offtopic: If livery editing does make it in GT5. This design'll be my first project

Dscn4811-700.jpg

:drool:
 
I personally think that adding stickers and things of that sort takes a way what GT is all about. Its always been about upgrading and tuning, everything you can purchase for your car is funtional, including light weight wheels. As a pure enthusiast most of the factory based cars in my garage I would not want to see a vinyl on. It would be cool to see a personalized license plate, car number (like Sega GT) or team logo on the car. Race cars have paint schemes and sponsor logos on them already thats one thing that makes them races cars.

I would rather see them (Polyphony) invest time in funtional mods for ex: If I go through the different levels of weight reduction will my passenger seats be gone while im in the cockpit view? When exchanging for lighter body panels can I chose carbon fiber or carbon kevlar and can I have it painted or unpainted? Also will players have a choice of driving seats (Bride, Recaro, Cobra, Sparco etc). I want the interior stripped and have a racing wheel, guages and toggle switches on the console.

wrc99x.jpg


Or even better can I have boost controller and have it physically mounted in the console. When buying a big break kit I would like to see them behind the wheels. It would be nice if they could compose actual performance parts that you could buy in real life for each particular vehicle. But I think that would be to complicated and technology hasnt come far enough to make that an easy task.

Point being to do one thing they have to take away from another. It seems like on games like Forza kids spend more time in the paintshop than actually tuning there vehicles. I can tell you if I join a race right now online that there is a 80% chance someone will wreck me before the second turn. Simply because he bought the car, spent $100k on all engine mods and body kits didnt tune it but spent 30mins with the decals and then actually thought it can stop on a dime and turn corners like hes Tak Fuji. Which is why I dont play it as much. I dont want stickers, and I dont need them to make my car look unique. If I have a variety of brand name parts to choose from and actually see them installed on my vehicle with the right setup it'll be unique were it counts. Besides its not all its worked up to be, (vinyls and all) I still play GT3 A-Spec on the regular basis while FORZA2 is an every blue moon thing.

I really hope the GT series doesnt get to flashy. Concerned it will attract NFS, Mid Night Club and Juiced crowds. Those games can be fun but GT is for the serious.
 
If you don't like the idea, you can simply ignore it. Why is it that most of the time you mention "LIVERY EDITOR" people thought of it as "RICING", "PIMPING" etc. Yes, creating a solid livery editing system eats development time and resources but it's not like they're sacrificing a feature over another. Read Tenacious D's or Dave's take on livery editor and be enlightened.
 
Be enlightend that my comment was not aimed at "livery editor". And notice I mentioned team logo and "personalised". Dont be so deffensive my, comment was directed towards no one and if you dont like it ignore it.

I simply am trying to find out, if a person puts a racecar paint scheme on his factory base car, whats the point of having an actual race car. People do this in Forza, but no one drives the racecar classes anymore. You mit be able to find a P1 race every now and then but thats about it. It tends to draw people away from the real actual race cars.

POINT BEING: Thats what GT is about working your way up with tuned factory cars to official championship racecars. Thats what makes Gran Turismo-Gran Turismo. And if you want a race car you have to work to get it. It really takes away from the tradition and falls in line with every other want-to-be and street racing game out there now wouldnt it
if every one could just manifest there own full blown ultimate race car.
 
Tenacious D
This is the main problem with this discussion. People get too emotionally entangled with their reactions, and they exaggerate things.

Being a Live member for a while now, and avid Forza 2 Auction House shopper, the above is not the case at all. While there are literally tens of thousands of people using the Auction House, and 100 or more artists you want to watch for excellent work, there are perhaps a couple dozen offering porny or otherwise offensive cars. And their numbers are dropping a bit as the Turn 10 mods ban repeat offenders who are warned what will happen if they continue.
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It only takes one bad apple to ruin the rest. While you do have a point that it has ebbed down quite a bit, it's still present. Think of the time and resources Turn 10 has to waste to keep up. Just not worth it.
 
Omologato
It only takes one bad apple to ruin the rest. While you do have a point that it has ebbed down quite a bit, it's still present. Think of the time and resources Turn 10 has to waste to keep up. Just not worth it.
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Turn 10 is not keeping up, there are still countless bugs in the game. If I move to fast through the garage while passing through cars that have just a light amount of graphics on them my Xbox will freeze. But this is a problem we have gotten use to.

If a persons car doesnt load correctly before the game is started it mite be a chance that the server will crash. Sometimes you will wait in the loading screen for 2-3 minutes and the game will start but on some occasions several people may drop out.

I recall there was a tounament going on were the winner could win a 2008 Nissan Sentra Spec V. Believe it or not people found ways to glitch the crap out of this system. It was a limited class, rules were that each person would mod a Spectre up to the B class limitations, and that would be the competition car. There were kids glitching there cars to go outrageous amounts of speed (220+). If I remember correctly on some courses they were going speeds that were not even physically possible for P1 vehicles. It took them more than 2months to fixed this problem.

Note: B class FF cars built with a balance of power and handling usually wont have more than 350hp.

Online play creates a whole-nother bulk of problems. I believe Polyphony will have there priorities straight and not fall to Forza's level.
 
I just figure if they are going to do a livery editor, why not do it right, and easily.

I'm sorry, but Forza 2's livery editor, although effective, was one of the most annoying tools to use in the world. Sitting there shaping, layering, copying, colouring, re-colouring, moving, and resizing various geometric shapes got old...quick.

Although I have the utmost respect for the talent required for some of the masterpieces I've seen on the auction block, you've almost got to give your head a shake at the amount of time required to put something of that complexity together.

Enter the PS3.

Sony has already been playing up the possible link between PC and PS3 for content creation. I'm pretty sure Unreal Tournament III has been the first one to try this. So why not the Gran Turismo series.

Opinions of worth and purpose in a GT game notwithstanding, let's say they did it.

The proper way of going about this would be to make a PC Livery Editor. Make your skin in your graphical editor of choice (Photoshop, etc), using templates provided by Polyphony, then upload it to a Sony based server to a folder linked to your PSN account.

Open up Gran Turismo 5, log into the Livery editor, download the skin to the hard drive, and a few moments later, its linked to your car. I think this method would sure as hell beat Forza 2's livery system hands down, not to mention make it ridiculously easy for online racing teams to have carbon copy liveries for all of their cars.

Just an idea ;)
 
Yes I agree Forza's livery editor is a bit complicated to use, my biggest complaint though is that the camera angels aren't free enough to give you the control for close in areas. This was especially bad when I had my smaller TV. Hopefully GT makes it better and I do like the computer integration idea.
 
Gturismo1
I just figure if they are going to do a livery editor, why not do it right, and easily.

I'm sorry, but Forza 2's livery editor, although effective, was one of the most annoying tools to use in the world. Sitting there shaping, layering, copying, colouring, re-colouring, moving, and resizing various geometric shapes got old...quick.

Although I have the utmost respect for the talent required for some of the masterpieces I've seen on the auction block, you've almost got to give your head a shake at the amount of time required to put something of that complexity together.

Enter the PS3.

Sony has already been playing up the possible link between PC and PS3 for content creation. I'm pretty sure Unreal Tournament III has been the first one to try this. So why not the Gran Turismo series.

Opinions of worth and purpose in a GT game notwithstanding, let's say they did it.

The proper way of going about this would be to make a PC Livery Editor. Make your skin in your graphical editor of choice (Photoshop, etc), using templates provided by Polyphony, then upload it to a Sony based server to a folder linked to your PSN account.

Open up Gran Turismo 5, log into the Livery editor, download the skin to the hard drive, and a few moments later, its linked to your car. I think this method would sure as hell beat Forza 2's livery system hands down, not to mention make it ridiculously easy for online racing teams to have carbon copy liveries for all of their cars.

Just an idea ;)
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That would be the best way to do it! You could even just transfer them straight from your PC to PS3 via USB... Photoshop with car engineering drawing templates provided by PD would be the easiest way to create really amazing works of art!

I just hope its one of the things PD don't drop at the end due to lack of time like Drag Racing or more crucially online in GT4...:indiff:

On another note, whatever came of this xfire/ sony collabertaion which would see PC and PS3 gamers being able to message and maybe even play online together, did anything ever happen? any game use it?

Robin
 
I'm guessing since Xfire is a terrible programme Sony didn't want it cluttering up their system.
 
I think that might be be "tuned" option you get in Prologue. Would be very cool if you could pick and choose what you wanted on your car though.
 

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