Islam - What's your view on it?

[SalmanBH]

16 p a litre I want to cry

Costs me around 11 pounds to refill the tank with premium petrol, although it's quite dirty compared to what you get.

 

[vasiliflame]

Costs me around 11 pounds to refill the tank

£90 to fill up our tank to go to Goodwood recently , u sold it all too cheap mate no wonder there's none left

 

[SalmanBH]

£90 to fill up our tank to go to Goodwood recently , u sold it all too cheap mate no wonder there's none left

Again, it's subsidised so much that it costs consumers less than the cost of production. This is one of the reasons why everyone here can buy Nissan Patrols and Toyota Land Cruisers.

If you think about it, it's cheaper than a litre bottled water.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Costs me around 11 pounds to refill the tank with premium petrol, although it's quite dirty compared to what you get.

I hate that my parents in Saudi ask me how much gas is here ($4.30 for premium) and then they laugh and say "gg noob we only pay a couple cents per gallon".

 

[DK]

I'm just wondering - could the authoritarian nature of most Muslim-majority states be down to the lack of an era like the Enlightenment taking hold over there? In the West, the two most prominent Enlightenment concepts that I can think of are democracy and secularism. Contrast that with much of the Islamic world, were power is usually in the hands of a monarch or dictator and Sharia is a massive influence on their laws.

 

[Blitz24]

I'm just wondering - could the authoritarian nature of most Muslim-majority states be down to the lack of an era like the Enlightenment taking hold over there? In the West, the two most prominent Enlightenment concepts that I can think of are democracy and secularism. Contrast that with much of the Islamic world, were power is usually in the hands of a monarch or dictator and Sharia is a massive influence on their laws.

It could be because Enlightenment is seen as an "evil". I'm not sure though. They could view Enlightenment as what the Western World has become.

 

[KSaiyu]

I'm just wondering - could the authoritarian nature of most Muslim-majority states be down to the lack of an era like the Enlightenment taking hold over there? In the West, the two most prominent Enlightenment concepts that I can think of are democracy and secularism. Contrast that with much of the Islamic world, were power is usually in the hands of a monarch or dictator and Sharia is a massive influence on their laws.

Probably. The troubles over there could be seen as their Thirty Years War, though I don't hold much hope of a similar age of Enlightenment.

 

[sumbrownkid]

I'm just wondering - could the authoritarian nature of most Muslim-majority states be down to the lack of an era like the Enlightenment taking hold over there? In the West, the two most prominent Enlightenment concepts that I can think of are democracy and secularism. Contrast that with much of the Islamic world, were power is usually in the hands of a monarch or dictator and Sharia is a massive influence on their laws.

Islam already had its enlightenment period and that was during the Golgen Age. In fact, you can argue that Europe would not have been able to go through it's Enlightenment if it did not re-unite with the vast amount of ancient Greek and Roman knowledge the Muslim world diligently held and protected during the crusades. What it's going through right now is similar to what Europe went through during the Reformation period, only more critical because it's taking place in a volatile region where the world gets most of its energy from.

It could be because Enlightenment is seen as an "evil". I'm not sure though. They could view Enlightenment as what the Western World has become.

That you can thank the Islamists for. The very same Islamists that forget that early Muslims pioneered and advanced many scientific works. Especially in Medicine and Astronomy.

 

[Blitz24]

That you can thank the Islamists for. The very same Islamists that forget that early Muslims pioneered and advanced many scientific works. Especially in Medicine and Astronomy.

It's so easy to look at history and just ignore it.

 

[Rage Racer]

I supposed there was quite a massive number of people who profess Mohammedanism in Russia, and former part of the USSR as well(especially in the countries in the caucasian area, i.e. Azerbaijan, Georgia, Armenia, Abukhasia and Ossetian part, and of Central Asia including Turkmenistan, Tadzhikistan, Uzbekistan and its adjoining Afghanistan), but the way that those people are treated is pretty much different compared to the countries with population of majority of people believing in Muslim.

I don't know what you mean by Mohammedanism, but our local Muslims are Sunni Muslims, that's what I know. And some Shias in (and from) Azerbaijan.
And on a cite note - Armenia, Georgia, Abkhasia and Ossetia have Christian majority.

 

[Dotini]

I'm just wondering - could the authoritarian nature of most Muslim-majority states be down to the lack of an era like the Enlightenment taking hold over there? In the West, the two most prominent Enlightenment concepts that I can think of are democracy and secularism. Contrast that with much of the Islamic world, were power is usually in the hands of a monarch or dictator and Sharia is a massive influence on their laws.

Great question, though the short answer is Yes.

Though you ask about "states", that is also a key question, as empires and caliphates were and still are competing as models for social organization and government. I do not think an Enlightenment could or will arise from a caliphate, or most empires.

Also, I'm not entirely in agreement with the notion that democracy and secularism are the most prominent Enlightenment concepts. I would propose democracy and individual freedom/liberty/expression (take your choice).

Still, a great question!

 

[KSaiyu]

European Court of Human Rights upholds French ban on full-face veils

The European Court of Human Rights has upheld a French law banning the wearing of the full-face veil, the niqab.

The Strasbourg-based court was ruling on a case brought by a 24-year-old French woman, who argued that the ban on wearing the veil in public violated her freedom of religion and expression.

The ruling by the European Court's Grand Chamber was immediately condemned by a leading UK human rights campaigner for "criminalising women's clothing". Liberty's director Shami Chakrabarti also linked it to "the rising racism in Western Europe".

You see this spreading throughout Europe?

 

[GBO Possum]

My view of Islam is that it's a danger to the world today. Maybe not because of the vast percentage of Muslims who fortunately ignore their Koran and don't bother to kill non-Muslims. But because of a huge number of Muslims who DO insist on killing people, and even themselves if that's what it takes to kill people who have a different belief set. Even if it is a branch of its own Islam.

Fill in the missing word:- "XXXXXX suicide bomber"

How many of you answered "pastafarian" or "atheist"?

And that's not to say that I don't regard Christianity and other non-Muslim religions as a danger. Look at what just happened in the US Supreme Court where religious nutters managed to get the Court to agree to their demands for "Religious Freedom" in that they didn't want to include contraception in the health insurance provided to employees. Next thing, they'll argue that in the interests of "religious freedom", the employers in the Christian Right will want to not provide salaries to employees since the money could be used to pay for contraception, and they don't want to aid and abet contraception.

The difference between Islam and other religions is that it is causing more misery than the others today and that level of misery is growing. Its advantage is that it IS recent and like religions prior to it, it has evolved to become stronger than most predecessors. The bad news is that what is required to sustain successful evolution of a religion has turned out to be bad for the host organism. Fanaticism is great for this "mind virus", but really bad for us humans.

If the god of Muslims really existed and wanted its "word" spread, then it would have visited a wider geography than Saudi Arabia many centuries ago. And in fact would have done it worldwide tens of millennia ago, rather than just in recent history.

In the previous paragraph, substitute the name of any religion, past or present for "Muslims" (and change the geography to suit) and it works just as well.

I wonder what gods have been invented on exoplanets. And if anyone has worked out a way to uninvent them.

 

[Dotini]

You see this spreading throughout Europe?

From my North American perspective, yes.

 

[SalmanBH]

If the god of Muslims really existed and wanted its "word" spread, then it would have visited a wider geography than Saudi Arabia many centuries ago. And in fact would have done it worldwide tens of millennia ago, rather than just in recent history.

It did.

Also, tens of millennia? I do not know if you were exaggerating, but Islam was only introduced in the 7th century AD and spread rapidly in the time period of less then a hundred years.

 

[KSaiyu]

Thank "God" for the Battle of Tours?

 

[zzz_pt]

It did.

Also, tens of millennia? I do not know if you were exaggerating, but Islam was only introduced in the 7th century AD and spread rapidly in the time period of less then a hundred years.

This green is not consequence of god. Is consequence of death, swords, fire and blood. Like in any other acient empire.


Fortunately, all empires have ended and will end. Because there is not a god "backing up" any of them.

 

[BobK]

It did.

I hate to tell you this, but the world is somewhat larger than north Africa, a small corner of Asia and a couple small bits of Europe.

 

[SalmanBH]

This green is not consequence of god. Is consequence of death, swords, fire and blood. Like in any other acient empire.


Fortunately, all empires have ended and will end. Because there is not a god "backing up" any of them.

I hate to tell you this, but the world is somewhat larger than north Africa, a small corner of Asia and a couple small bits of Europe.

I should have pointed out the fact that I was trying to disprove GBO Possum's remark on how it didn't ever visit anywhere beyond the borders of Saudi Arabia.

 

[GBO Possum]

It did.

Also, tens of millennia? I do not know if you were exaggerating, but Islam was only introduced in the 7th century AD and spread rapidly in the time period of less then a hundred years.

You make my point for me. Since humanity has been around for between 400,000 and 250,000 years, you'd think a true god would not have waited for tens, no hundreds of millennia to get around to saying "hello". What was constraining this god's communication capabilities?

Furthermore, the map shows that this god could not even cross oceans given a century to do so and could only do so in the minds of humans. The same god which made a universe in seven days, or was that another one?

Spread "rapidly"? About 5,000 miles in a hundred years? Less than a mile a week? How long would it take a real god to get from say, Saudi Arabia to New Zealand? Or from New Zealand to Saudi Arabia?

I should have pointed out the fact that I was trying to disprove GBO Possum's remark on how it didn't ever visit anywhere beyond the borders of Saudi Arabia.

I didn't state that any "it" didn't ever visit anywhere beyond the borders of Saudi Arabia. Although, to the best of my knowledge none of the gods which originated in the Middle East have ever been seen outside that geography. By "seen" I mean observed by enough independent witnesses to be an actual credible sighting.

 

[SalmanBH]

You make my point for me. Since humanity has been around for between 400,000 and 250,000 years, you'd think a true god would not have waited for tens, no hundreds of millennia to get around to saying "hello". What was constraining this god's communication capabilities?

Furthermore, the map shows that this god could not even cross oceans given a century to do so and could only do so in the minds of humans. The same god which made a universe in seven days, or was that another one?

Spread "rapidly"? About 5,000 miles in a hundred years? Less than a mile a week? How long would it take a real god to get from say, Saudi Arabia to New Zealand? Or from New Zealand to Saudi Arabia?




I didn't state that any "it" didn't ever visit anywhere beyond the borders of Saudi Arabia. Although, to the best of my knowledge none of the gods which originated in the Middle East have ever been seen outside that geography. By "seen" I mean observed by enough independent witnesses to be an actual credible sighting.

This whole thing was taken out of context, the spread of the Islamic empire did spread with battles and strategic placement along with the blood of hundreds of thousands of people.

I am not denying that.

 

[sumbrownkid]

European Court of Human Rights upholds French ban on full-face veils



You see this spreading throughout Europe?

Full face veils I feel is taking it a bit far. In the Prophet's time it was only meant for this wives. Today, with IDs and whatnot, it's counterproductive. All a woman has to do is cover her hair and dress modestly. Imo, let the woman decide, not my issue nor anyone else's but her's.

On a side note, it's Day 4 of Ramadan and thankfully I haven't killed myself yet.

And @GBO Possum, erm I don't ignore my Qu'ran and yet I don't think about killing others. You're assertion sounds asinine to me. There are two billion of us. If we all really hated you that much, rest assured you'd be screwed. The problem is that the people who take the extreme view of the Qu'ran are taking the views of extremists who don't know what they are reading to begin with and are taking their view because they feel it's the best outlet to vent frustration at their current situation. Your average Jihadi is from a poor background, not much formal education, and lives in a state with few if any rights and corruption running rampant. In fact a lot of these jihadis are fighting because that's the only way they can feed themselves and their family and get some sense of pride, for right or wrong reasons. My friend served tours in Iraq and Afghanistan as a Marine and he told me many of the fighters they captured fought because they were hungry and desperate. Hunger is one key ingredient to extremism.

The so called Jihadi's that live in the West are just 🤬 dumb and need to get slapped upside the head. They don't realize how good they have it compared to other Muslims.

I'll be the first one to tell you that the Qu'ran is full of exceptions and contradictions, like the English language. One moment it says to go to war with those that oppose Allah then the next it says make peace and let them be?

The reason it's like this is because the Qu'ran was revealed over a period of 20 years. Some of it was revealed during peace and it reflected that, other times it was revealed during war and it reflected that. Knowing the Qu'ran is one thing, but knowing history behind it is a whole other thing. This is why I want young Muslims that are reading the Qu'ran to read the background history to it also.

People have been killing and maiming since they created tools. Even atheists and rastafarians would kill another if they found justification for it, no matter how wrong that justification is. Josef Stalin found no qualms butchering his own people, and he was Atheist.

The reason why the issues of the Muslim world seem much more pronounced is because A.) Most of these issues are in third world countries B.) poverty C.) lack of education D.) Old grudges die hard. E.) Like mentioned above, it's happening in a region where most of the world gets its energy from

That's not to say Muslims themselves don't inflict issues on one another, no indeed Muslims do the most hurt to each other. But it doesn't help to view ordinary Muslims in the West under this microscope and make them feel like . If you treat people as outsiders then they become outsiders.

Man it's 🤬 like this makes we wish Big Boss was real so I can immigrate to Zanzibarland.

 

[SalmanBH]

Full face veils I feel is taking it a bit far. In the Prophet's time it was only meant for this wives. Today, with IDs and whatnot, it's counterproductive. All a woman has to do is cover her hair and dress modestly. Imo, let the woman decide, not my issue nor anyone else's but her's.

On a side note, it's Day 4 of Ramadan and thankfully I haven't killed myself yet.

And @GBO Possum, erm I don't ignore my Qu'ran and yet I don't think about killing others. You're assertion sounds asinine to me. There are two billion of us. If we all really hated you that much, rest assured you'd be screwed. The problem is that the people who take the extreme view of the Qu'ran are taking the views of extremist who don't know what they are reading to begin with and are taking their view because they feel it's the best outlet to vent frustration at their current situation. Your average Jihadi is from a poor background, not much formal education, and lives in a state with few if any rights and corruption running rampant. In fact a lot of these jihadis are fighting because that's the only way they can feed themselves and their family and get some sense of pride, for right or wrong reasons. My friend served tours in Iraq and Afghanistan as a Marine and he told many of the fighters they captured fought because they were hungry and desperate. Hunger is one key ingredient to extremism.

The so called Jihadi's that live in the West are just 🤬 dumb and need to get slapped upside the head. They don't realize how good they have it compared to other Muslims.

I'll be the first one to tell you that the Qu'ran is full of exceptions and contradictions, like the English language. One moment it says to go to war with those that oppose Allah then the next it says make peace and let them be?

The reason it's like this is because the Qu'ran was revealed over a period of 20 years. Some of it was revealed during peace and it reflected that, other times it was revealed during war and it reflected that. Knowing the Qu'ran is one thing, but knowing history behind it is a whole other thing. This is why I want young Muslims that are reading the Qu'ran to read the background history to it also.

People have been killing and maiming since they created tools. Even atheists and rastafarians would kill another if they found justification for it, no matter how wrong that justification is. Josef Stalin found no qualms butchering his own people, and he was Atheist.

The reason why the issues of the Muslim world seem much more pronounced is because A.) Most of these issues are in third world countries B.) poverty C.) lack of education D.) Old grudges die hard. E.) Like mentioned above, it's happening in a region where most of the world gets its energy from

That's not to say Muslims themselves don't inflict issues on one another, no indeed Muslims do the most hurt to each other. But it doesn't help to view ordinary Muslims in the West under this microscope and make them feel outsiders. If you treat people as outsiders then they become outsiders.

Man it's 🤬 like this makes we wish Big Boss was real so I can immigrate to Zanzibarland.

Bravo, my friend.

And Ramadan Kareem

 

[sumbrownkid]

Bravo, my friend.

And Ramadan Kareem

Ramadam Kareem.

My god my stomach is ready to murder me. Georgia sucks because we have like 16 hours of sunlight.

 

[PeterJB]

This is the worst possible time of year for Ramadan to coincide with. I can't imagine how bad it must be in the Middle East.

 

[sumbrownkid]

This is the worst possible time of year for Ramadan to coincide with. I can't imagine how bad it must be in the Middle East.

They cheat the system, at least in Saudi. They literally flip the schedule around where they sleep in all day, only to get up for prayers, and then "really" wake up to break the fast and then have fun at night.

 

[vasiliflame]

There are two billion of us. If we all really hated you that much, rest assured you'd be screwed .

Ermmm if you really believe that I think you are miss guided, come on china and Russia do not really tolerate religion well as one example a 87year old woman in china was giving a life sentence for apparently using a taichi breathing exercise , but she wasn't performing this banned religious exercise she was just trying to catch her breath. Forget the west uk USA Europe these two country's would kill every single one of you without remorse.. All I see is a bunch of rebels thinking there bad boys none of them have any discipline and I can tell you one thing if it was all out war I been told all my life this will probably be the cause of WW3 I can tell you for certain the Muslims gihadist would be in serious trouble.

 

[sumbrownkid]

@vasiliflame: China and Russia, well at least their governments, don't care about religion, they only care about maintaining their power. Like any other country.

And rest assured if there was WWIII, then the entire world, not just just Muslim Jihadists would be in serious trouble. Let's hope it doesn't come to that.

 

[vasiliflame]

@vasiliflame: China and Russia don't care about religion, they only care about maintaining their power.

Exactly you step out of line in any of these country and you ass is grass, they will no negotiate with people who can not be reasoned with.. They will put you down because they will definitely no take you as a prisoner and feed you... The muslim gihadist are clever enough not to attack these country's because they know they will eliminate them , and what will the west do nothing because these are the only nations that could actually be a threat to us, who have actual military power and not just a bunch of mad people with ak47's

 

[sumbrownkid]

Exactly you step out of line in any of these country and you ass is grass, they will no negotiate with people who can not be reasoned with.. They will put you down because they will definitely no take you as a prisoner and feed you... The muslim gihadist are clever enough not to attack these country's because they know they will eliminate them , and what will the west do nothing because these are the only nations that could actually be a threat to us, who have actual military power and not just a bunch of mad people with ak47s

To be fair I think most Jihadists attack American and UK interests and people is because America and UK interfered with the Muslim world, in their opinion at least, much more so than Russia or China. Russia does have its issues though in Chechnya, and China's Uighars, though Uighars tend to keep to themselves.