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R1600Turbo
Absolutely agreed. This is no worse than betting. Melky Cabrera, in my mind, you are in the area now of Pete Rose and Tim Donaghy.
Major League Baseball: 2012 Season
- Thread starter JohnBM01
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Absolutely agreed. This is no worse than betting. Melky Cabrera, in my mind, you are in the area now of Pete Rose and Tim Donaghy.
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It's been proven that he bet on (and possibly against) his Reds when he managed them in the late 80's. When players hear that (If I heard it, at least), they think of someone who does not care how they perform, posing as someone who is supposed to be a teacher and a leader.
That, if you ask me, deserves a lifetime ban. Managers are teachers to young kids coming up from the minors. Rose just completely ignored this concept.
That, if you ask me, deserves a lifetime ban. Managers are teachers to young kids coming up from the minors. Rose just completely ignored this concept.
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Rose should have been banned as a manager 100% and not allowed to any of the games, but I'd still elect him into the hall. If Clemens, Bonds or A. Rod make the HoF and Rose doesn't there's something wrong.
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I know. If I was a player I would feel good because it shows that the manager believes in the team. Why would he bet on them to win if he didn't care how the team performed?
I'm sure he was still an teacher and a leader. Yes, he did things he shouldn't have done, but doesn't mean he completely ignored the concept.
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Patrick
I truly believe he bet against his Reds, because the MLB probobly wouldn't have banned him for life if he bet for them. I'm sure most of the players who played for him would agree with me.
When you are that high up in an organization (being possibly your franchises' best player ever, plus being a manager), and you backstab them like that (if the accusation is true)?
No, just, no.
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Well here is the thing...
Anabolic Steroids weren't banned until 2002 and HGH (What Bonds did) wasn't banned until 2005. So it wasn't 'cheating', there were no rules against it. Players used it to get back from injuries faster and a stimulant more then did for 'getting stronger'. Betting... well that's different. He knew the repercussions but didn't seem to care.
Yeah he should be in... But if were going to get serious about rejecting cheaters. We should start by removing cheaters.
Babe Ruth
Hank Aaron
Ricky Henderson
Bob Gibson
Another thing... Why is it that only a certain selection of steroids users get highlighted but others ignored and still adored by fans and media...
Andy Pettitte
Mike Piazza
Jerry Hairston Jr
Troy Glaus
Matt Williams
Bronson Arroyo
Brian Roberts
Ivan Rodriguez
Its still massive among players as there are creams that are you of your system over night. Every team still has em'
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Pettitte shouldn't make the HoF either. The others I have not heard anything regarding steroid use. Might as well throw in Derek Jeter, Pujols or anyone in that generation.
CodeRedR51
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🤬 back to back home runs, and we're now losing 5-1. And there's still nobody out in the inning. 👎
Edit: 8-1 now. 🤬 it, I'm done watching. At this point the storm outside is more interesting.
Edit: 8-1 now. 🤬 it, I'm done watching. At this point the storm outside is more interesting.
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Max Powers
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Of course a huge amount of guys in that era were juicing, but like it or not, Bonds was the most successful and famous, so you're gonna hear about him the most. I don't personally agree with anything performance enhancing, but there's no way Bonds shouldn't be in the HOF, one of the best ball players ever, roids or not.
It really makes you respect the guys in that era who really did play clean. Ken Griffey Jr. and Frank Thomas come to mind immediately.
CodeRedR51
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I'm calling it right now. Diamondbacks don't have what it takes to make the winning run they need to take their division. They will finish right where they are. Why? Because our starting pitching SUCKS. Saunders gave up NINE earned runs in 3 innings tonight. Kennedy is not the guy he was last year by any stretch. Hudson is out for the season, but he sucked before that anyway. Cahill sucks at home, so that leaves us with the two rookies who seem to be the best of them all, Miley and Corbin.
Once we get to the games where we play the Dodgers and SF, our season will come to an end.
Once we get to the games where we play the Dodgers and SF, our season will come to an end.
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Stephen Drew has been traded to Oakland.
CodeRedR51
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Probably for another player we don't need. Better be for a pitcher...
Edit: A minor league infielder. Oh joy.
Edit: A minor league infielder. Oh joy.
CodeRedR51
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Of course you haven't heard about them, that's my whole point. But just because you haven't done any research about any of it doesn't mean they didn't do it. Well.. because they've all been 'caught'.
Andy Pettite has admitted to using HGH on more then one occasion (2002 and 2004) to help recover from injuries. Same thing as Bonds with his knee issues.
Mike Piazza has also admitted to a reporter and had a bad case of back acne (side effect) and it was 'magically healed' in 2004 when they first started testing.
Jerry Hairston Jr orded two cases of HGH from Applied Pharmacy in Mobile Alabama in 2004. Denies it... but don't they all? It was legal at the time though.
Troy Glaus was prescribed banned steroid substances by Roman Scruggs from September 03 to May 04.
From 2002-2005 Matt Williams received $16,000 in various substances (Steroids and HGH) from Palm Beach Rejuvenation Center. Matt retired in 2003, helping some buddies out eh? Some of it being HGH meaning it was legal at the time.
Bronson Arroyo admitted to using Andro a then legal substance, he did stop when 'found out' it contained steroids. In the interview he hinted both Manny Ramirez and David Ortiz were both using as well.
Brian Roberts admitted to using steroids at least once in 2003.
Pudge reportedly used Deca-Durabolin and/or Winstro with Canseco, Palmeiro and Juan Gonzalez. Not a huge stretch.
To be honest, I don't think anyone is innocent... I wouldn't be surprised if any player used anything steroid/hgh related from the 70's until nowadays.
To me, I just don't care. If tomorrow there was a headline that Posey used... I wouldn't be surprised.... Or Matt Kemp... Or Jeff Mathis... Or Derek Jeter... No one would 'surprise' me.
I defend Bonds because the substance he used wasn't illegal until 2005, so is it really cheating?
However I won't defend Cabrera... or Mota. I didn't defend Guillen in 2010 either. I'm pissed off at Cabrera, I feel sick thinking about it. A bit heart broken... He was a huge part of the team and a huge part of the fans... The Melk Men and the Melk Maids... A huge hit. Everyone loved him and he loved back. Now hes gone... And he pissed a lot of teammates off... Especially Posey who was interview and seemed livid.
But you got to move on you know? And you know what, I've prosecuted Bochy over the years for his love of certain players and dog house rules with rookies. But I don't think there is a better manager in baseball when dealing with this.
Anyways we have a healthy Sandoval finally... And hes a much better player then Melky. I think we'll be fine.
Max Powers
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I don't really blame Bonds for juicing, because, let's face it, almost every power hitter was. He was just trying to keep abreast of the competition. However I wouldn't go as far as to say he is innocent just because it wasn't banned. I believe more that Bud Selig was guilty of looking the other way for far too long, than Bonds being innocent.
This is coming from somebody who got into baseball because of how awesome Bonds was on the 92 pirates. I can't blame him for cheating, and he deserves to be in the HOF, but him, like everybody who used during the era, still cheated in my book.
Frank Thomas was very vocal about drug testing in baseball as early as 1995, voluntarily submitted tests, and was the only active player to be interviewed for the mitchell report, if anyone didn't juice, it was him. As much as I respect bonds, I have even more for a guy like that who did it the right way even when his competition wasn't.
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My Astros will more than likely get killed at St. Louis in their next series (and every other series remaining) of this 2012 season. Not even 50-year old Roger Clemens would save us if he actually made it back to the majors- assuming he'd play for HOU. Whatever series your team(s) will be taking part in, best of luck to your team(s).
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Patrick
If 47 year old Jamie Moyer throws a 79 MPH fastball...
Yup. Looks like the juice is still loose.
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I have no doubt that Thomas was/is clean. Vocality doesn't mean much to me, as Hank Aaron is a dirty cheat but never seems to skip a moment to trash talk possible users.
Well, first of all. Jamie Moyer is 49 not 47. Second look at the body differences, Clemens is a big STRONG guy naturally who was always a power pitcher. Moyer is skinny as a stick and was never a power pitcher.
At the age of 45 Randy Johnson was still throwing 91-94 with the Giants... Must be steroids.
Nolan Ryan (63, now 65) threw out a 70 MPH first pitch in 2010.... Must be steroids.
Anyways, Maddy pitched a gem last night. 8 IP 0 ER 10k 0bb 4H. Kersh pitched damn good too... and was overall a very good game. But its funny, for a city full of sellouts there was a ton of empty seats.
Oh... and Lew Wolff was at the game in LA last night. Hahahaha. Its amazing how he doesn't even try and hide the fact hes the worst owner in baseball... Well next to Jeffrey Loria and David Samson.
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Blitz24
Good lord! Does Usain Bolt play baseball now?
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I'm shocked at it too. In 82 games in High A, he had simply 104 SB in 83 games (more than 3x his RBI [30]), also had 34 more SB than K's (70). This is beyond ridiculous.
