PENALTY SYSTEM IS STILL A PIECE OF ****!!!

[BaareCZ]

To be honest I thought the guy who went off would rejoin gently on the left hand side as I didn’t anticipate him hitting the left wall, that’s why I moved gently right when I saw him go off. But this wasn’t a post about avoiding the accident etc it’s more about the weird penalty judgement!

We understand, man. The penalties for hitting an out-of-control car have been a "highly appreciated" addition to the penalty system for quite a long time now. So, we're just trying to help you avoid them in the future. While pointing out that this one was one of the easier cases.

Hindsight is always 20/20. By the time it was clear the rejoining car was veering over the track instead of staying on the left there was simply no time left to react. It's always a guess. I've gambled before on cars veering over that then did not and instead went sideways on the edge to tap me as I went by for a lovely penalty.

I agree. He would have had to react immediately after that car had gone off. And reading and judging a situation like this so quickly comes down to experience. I personally would have moved to the other side of the track immediately after the car had gone onto the grass. Probably even before that, just to be sure. I, just like you, do a lot of racing without qualifying (because I will not have my race destroyed by some stupid, unjust and unreasonably severe penalty) so I'm used to dealing with crazy 🤬 happening around me.

I made a small racecraft guide for those wondering what the rules of racing are in 1.55

It seems the new philosophy is: The car behind is always right.

This is pure gold, it needs to go viral. Someone from PD needs to see this, so they could be ashamed of themselves.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

The problem is that even with a bad penalty system it's still fun and games. It would have to be truly hideous for me to stop playing. Even with the version we have now, or the one before the update it's still enjoyable to play.
So for me to stop to make a point would have to be an organized strike like the one in Call of Duty about a decade ago. Still, with the majority of buyers not even playing Sport Mode I doubt we got much leverage.

I have kind of given up on playing in the evening, it's not worth the frustration. This morning the races were mostly excellent, lots of contact free side by side action, swapping places, traffic going through corners together without any trouble even 2 wide through the corkscrew. Friday is still the cleanest day, yet after the schools are out all bets are off.

Yesterday evening, pure chaos, pretty much unplayable in the back field. If only we had a working SR system that would keep the crash kiddies in lower SR. Penalties are not the answer, but will PD ever come to that conclusion...

 

[Leggacy]

Based on a few races it seems like this isn’t the 1.52 system, but a hybrid of 1.53 and 1.54. Side contact penalties are there, and seem a bit more aggressive than 1.52, but front/rear contact seems to either be missing or reduced for the instigator. Have seen tons of penalties being dished out for side contact while also seeing blatant punts go unpunished.

Either way, it’s better than nothing and I’m glad to see some of these dirty drivers getting near-insta demoted back to where they belong.

Yeah, it’s not quite how it used to be but it’s way better than the last version.
I’ve done some daily races (race a) and found the general standards of driving to better.

 

[killerjimbag]

The problem is that even with a bad penalty system it's still fun and games. It would have to be truly hideous for me to stop playing. Even with the version we have now, or the one before the update it's still enjoyable to play.
So for me to stop to make a point would have to be an organized strike like the one in Call of Duty about a decade ago. Still, with the majority of buyers not even playing Sport Mode I doubt we got much leverage.

The problem is PD has not addressed the problem. Putting a bandaid on an axe wound won't stop the bleeding. Inept programming or just basic stupidity is pretty sad for a company of it's stature. Can you imagine if they release the next game on PS5 with this crap?

 

[RacingGrandpa]

The problem is PD has not addressed the problem. Putting a bandaid on an axe wound won't stop the bleeding. Inept programming or just basic stupidity is pretty sad for a company of it's stature. Can you imagine if they release the next game on PS5 with this crap?

Actually yes. It would be very sad for the 5% of the buyers that play Sport Mode, or maybe just for the minority of those who wants to race clean. We might be 2% of the buyers....

 

[Stoicfall]

Experimental times continue. I was nudged from behind twice very lightly, neither of us went off the track. I got two 1 second penalties over the course of one lap (went from 5th to 7th). I don't think they intended it, no one was racing dirty and I stayed on the racing line. No big deal, I figure. Then I see my SR dropped 18 points. I don't even know what I did to deserve that, especially since every other sector was green SR+. I would love to know if it's true that 99/99 drivers are treated more harshly by the system. Still, although it's annoying, I prefer it to no penalties at all because the race was free of aggressive punts. I just wish they could find a middle ground.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

Experimental times continue. I was nudged from behind twice very lightly, neither of us went off the track. I got two 1 second penalties over the course of one lap (went from 5th to 7th). I don't think they intended it, no one was racing dirty and I stayed on the racing line. No big deal, I figure. Then I see my SR dropped 18 points. I don't even know what I did to deserve that, especially since every other sector was green SR+. I would love to know if it's true that 99/99 drivers are treated more harshly by the system. Still, although it's annoying, I prefer it to no penalties at all because the race was free of aggressive punts. I just wish they could find a middle ground.

Any time penalty is -10 SR (no matter what) plus the loss of the SR up for that sector. -20 SR for getting two 1 sec penalties, I guess you gained less than 3 SR from clean sectors, thus -18 in the end. Race A and B aren't worth a lot of SR. (Race C is 16 SR, 2 time penalties there is -5 SR over all)

 

[barak181]

Actually yes. It would be very sad for the 5% of the buyers that play Sport Mode, or maybe just for the minority of those who wants to race clean. We might be 2% of the buyers....

One would think that the majority of people buying a game who's tagline is "The Real Driving Simulator" would be interested in clean racing. The others would be playing Mario Kart.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

One would think that the majority of people buying a game who's tagline is "The Real Driving Simulator" would be interested in clean racing. The others would be playing Mario Kart.

That would be great, but the reality is very different: https://www.kudosprime.com/gts/stats.php?stat_preset=sport_play_ratio

 

[GTP_TO Blue]

Getting rammed off at the final chicane on Race B still gives no penalty to the rammer, and at least a 5 to 7 second time loss for the rammee.

So frustrating!!!! Twice in 4 races today that's happened.

Also, getting dive bombed at T1 can also result in a 1 second penalty for the innocent party.

It does seem that the current penalty system is backwards.

The left hander after the Schumacher esses, a cor 2 places ahead goes way way wide onto the huge concrete pad. I see them coming back on the track, so move to the left hand side, and slow a little to avoid any contact. That's still not enough room, they slam into my right side, and I get a 1 second penalty for colliding with another car. The perp got nothing for hitting me, and nothing for going out of track limits.

I just can't bring myself to race dirty to keep a blue S at the end of a race.

 

[Sean YZF]

It's a battlefield tonight at Nurburgring GP. Started12th was 2nd start of lap 3, mainly due to my skill of avoiding road traffic collisions more than racing skills. End of lap 3 P1 messes up final turn, so I ease up slightly on the straight to give him room, I punt him into the gravel at T1, he slowed a lot more than I was expecting. I should have got a penalty, nothing. Yet I have had 5 sec penalties for hitting a out of control car at 90 degree's to me.
Not looking forward to Bathurst Sunday.

 

[Tea_Leaves]

One would think that the majority of people buying a game who's tagline is "The Real Driving Simulator" would be interested in clean racing. The others would be playing Mario Kart.

Well, the game is marketed to enthusiasts and casuals alike. With a low price of entry point and without its own subscription service (other than PSN), you're going to have all kinds of people playing. Some of whom will play popular games like Wreckfest/GTA and migrate their driving style in those games over to GTS.

E: I did another race C and still total carnage. I've absolutely no idea why punting from behind was made incredibly lenient in this version. It's ridiculous. With 1.52, you'd have at least got a 3 or 5s penalty. With this version, nothing.

Car behind is king and controls whether you stay on or leave the track.

I also observed reactions of people in the replay who had penalties and most were more prone to revenge punting or ruining an innocent person's race which of course, gives them no penalty. This can cause a chain reaction too. I'm beginning to think it was better without penalties. If you're going to bring back a system with penalties, at least extensively test it to make sure they're correct.

 

[Cherryturbo]

Penalty system still worthless. Race A at D/S. Punted from behind at first hairpin...wall...reset.....7 seconds adrift of field...race done.......no penalty given.
Place is infested with morons. I just want to do what it says on the lid....real driving.

 

[CBH]

Penalty system still worthless. Race A at D/S. Punted from behind at first hairpin...wall...reset.....7 seconds adrift of field...race done.......no penalty given.
Place is infested with morons. I just want to do what it says on the lid....real driving.

Yep, that is a Real Driving Simulator game and it is called Wreckfest.

 

[mclarenLB]

I've done it, I'm officially the recipient of GT Sports worst penalty, I'm pretty honoured

 

[cleanLX]

What everyone needs to realize, is that PD has no desire to have a clean racing game... for the masses...
Now hear me out...
Wayyyy back in P1.13, they got the penalties right (IMO)... all they had to do is remove the time served on track mess.
Unfortunately, the masses hated it... and cried loudly... wishing for rubbing is racing, and pushing people offline is just fine.
So PD chose to cater to the crash and thrash crowd... rather than force them to learn to drive clean/considerate... you know, develop you know, some racecraft... or if nothing else patience.
I simply refuse to race in sport mode.

Many complain and hate, and yet keep on playing... I get it, I loved racing online too, it was addictive... until it became more of a frustration than enjoyment... and believe me, I'm not the type that simply must win, I simply don't want my race ruined, with no corrective learning behavior implemented to the guilty/uninformed... and I don't have a bunch of time to invest in crappy races for hopes of that one good race.
Only way the clean players will ever be taken serious, is if they move on, aka, stop participating in online.

Why oh why can PD not have a 4th "daily"... oh heck I'd settle for a Friday night once a week deal... with required qualifying, a decent race distance with accurate tire/fuel consumption, the P1.13 penalty system and penalties carried to the end of the race, where only folks with a long history of Sr.95+(open to suggestions) can enter... I'd even pay to subscribe at this point inorder to be rid of all the kids trying to preserve their allowance or out for kicks and grins.

OK, I'm off to play "off line" again this Friday eve... because I love the game (even paid $$ for the LH add on) but will not subject myself to the chaos that is Sport mode.

I've done it, I'm officially the recipient of GT Sports worst penalty, I'm pretty honoured

Certainly no Pro at this, but, was that penalty due to not using the correct allotment of tires in the race?

 

[Sven Jurgens]

I've done it, I'm officially the recipient of GT Sports worst penalty, I'm pretty honoured

I guess that confirms it, the penalty system must be in coding hell, runaway conditions working against each other. This does kind of negate the theory that penalties are handled on the server now since there is no server in lobbies...However the server code could be running on the host, which would explain why it can't spend too much time analyzing what really happens since lobbies are still peer to peer and run the same penalty crap.

 

[GOTMAXPOWER]

This time last week that would've been "Thanks for the race, that was fun". Now it is a total crap penalty and race over. Then you get the controller tossers and wheel slappers who will be incensed by the penalty and smash the other innocent car out of the race, PD are encouraging dirty driving.

We had 2 weeks of great racing now we're back to 🤬.

 

[Krypton78]

I don't have a bunch of time to invest in crappy races for hopes of that one good race.

Thats it.

They need the masses, they need the numbers at any cost. Not realizing that 1 dirty driver causes 5 clean racers to leave the game in long term, or participate only with second accounts and getting rough theirselfes.

They have all the history of all drivers, look at kudosprime. It would be so easy to select the rotten apples out, or at least to force them to change their behaviour by temporary banning. But that would lower the numbers they desperately need- but only in short term. In long term most likely many players would come back.

But as I wrote before, they're just stupid in their decisions.

 

[mclarenLB]

Certainly no Pro at this, but, was that penalty due to not using the correct allotment of tires in the race?

In a lobby? No, that's not even a setting

You can see "Forced a car off the track" clear as day as well

 

[Pearl Jam]

Well seeing as I’m in a sling now for at least 2 months I won’t be getting frustrated at the ridiculous penalties for quite a while now, kinda hoping it’s fixed by then but we all know it won’t be. 🤬

 

[GTP_TO Blue]

This time last week that would've been "Thanks for the race, that was fun". Now it is a total crap penalty and race over. Then you get the controller tossers and wheel slappers who will be incensed by the penalty and smash the other innocent car out of the race, PD are encouraging dirty driving.

We had 2 weeks of great racing now we're back to 🤬.

Had the same happen at the exact same corner, except it was a Stukka from 3/4's of a second behind, I'm their pivot for the corner, and I get the penalty.

PD should just do one at the moment. They are embarrassing themselves!!!

 

[RacingGrandpa]

View attachment 886823 Well seeing as I’m in a sling now for at least 2 months I won’t be getting frustrated at the ridiculous penalties for quite a while now, kinda hoping it’s fixed by then but we all know it won’t be. 🤬

There is no way I can like this. Get better soon and no complications I hope!

 

[Jagman XK8]

Well seeing as I’m in a sling now for at least 2 months I won’t be getting frustrated at the ridiculous penalties for quite a while now, kinda hoping it’s fixed by then but we all know it won’t be. 🤬

I hope you make a speedy recovery.
With best wishes.

 

[breeminator]

This time last week that would've been "Thanks for the race, that was fun". Now it is a total crap penalty and race over. Then you get the controller tossers and wheel slappers who will be incensed by the penalty and smash the other innocent car out of the race, PD are encouraging dirty driving.

We had 2 weeks of great racing now we're back to 🤬.

I'm thinking they had some code that was like:
Do stuff relating to collision between cars A and B
Pick which car is to blame
Give penalty to car blamed

And people complained it gave the penalty to the wrong car more often than the right car, so they changed it to:
Do stuff relating to collision between cars A and B
Pick which car is to blame
Give penalty to car not blamed // seems wrong but people say the other way is worse

 

[RacingGrandpa]

I still say shared penalties is the way to go.

 

[GTP_TO Blue]

I still say shared penalties is the way to go.

Why though?

PD knows where the braking zones are, the HUD tells you so.

So, a racer brakes in the braking zone (as defined by the flashing gear change), but the person 1, 2 or 3 cars behind doesn't.

The racer way, way back takes out the ones ahead who are braking when they 'should'.

The racer behind takes out 1, 2 or maybe 3 cars in the process.

Tell me, why should all 4 racers share a penalty?

 

[Krypton78]

We had 2 weeks of great racing now we're back to 🤬

Agree. This is very interesting:

The best behaviour I saw was also 1.54 (with no penaltys) and there was a version long time ago, with harsh and shared penaltys even for little contact.

Hmm. Only much fear of consequences does work:
- with no penaltys-> fear of revenge
- with shared & hard penaltys-> no way to get out from dirty move without consequences

For me it looks like that only the both extremes are the best- or lets say- least worse.
Anything in between: thumbs down. Funny somehow

 

[Lion-Face]

So my experience tonight. Shows the incident at turn 1 at Nurburgring, the offending parties got away no problem. I picked up 8 seconds, and two other innocent drivers picked up a 2 second and 4 second penalty in the chaos. Just all kinds of wrong. (set to correct time in stream to view my replay/reaction on it)

 

[Pearl Jam]

There is no way I can like this. Get better soon and no complications I hope!

Thank you

I hope you make a speedy recovery.
With best wishes.

Cheers