Project Cars vs. Forza 6 - Poll added September 18th

[FS7]

What you notice is that both FM and GT are gradually turning into a mainstream 'car' games, instead of a racing game. Probably because it sells better with the general public. The simulation of real life racing takes second or third plan in their design direction as long as there are lots of cars and pretty graphics.

I don't mind developers setting the default options to suit casual players but ideally there should be options for hardcore players too. Setting defaults to all aids on, damage off, fuel/tyre wear off, qualifying off, short race distance, easiest AI, etc to make the game more approachable to the casual gamer is ok as long as I have the option to adjust all those settings to fit my preferences.
That's one of the great things about PCars, I can make it as easy or as hard as I want.

 

[doctorrg]

The physics are identical on all versions of the game, the only difference is in graphics and it takes a decent pc to exceed the console versions of the game. I'd guess the pc version probably runs better overall, but bugs aside, the experience should be the same. Is it the bugs that turn you off the game or the gameplay itself?

Mainly the game play. Reading @UKMikey's comment, that's exactly what it does, though I didn't personally put it down to framerate before. Subjectively, the driving experience just isn't smooth, and I'm mainly talking about what you see based on your control input. The (other) bugs just tip it over the edge.

 

[mister dog]

Edit: please delete.

 

[Mike_grpA]

It seems to me most people that don't like Pcars are controller users. I liked it with a controller, though admittedly after a lot of tweaking the controller settings, and even then it felt cumbersome trying to control the cars with the limited freedom of a controller.

Once I got my wheel, the game finally made sense. I knew from reading about the physics and watching videos of people racing with wheels in Pcars that a controller was just not going to cut it. It's fine to use casually, but if you want to actually explore the physics then a wheel is a must.

Playing with a wheel was what showed me the huge weaknesses of GT6's physics, and it's what's shown me the realism of Pcars' physics. Though it is a colossal pain in the ring having to tweak all the ffb options lol, but once you've worked out what they all do, the game comes alive in a big way.

Best racing game I've ever played, but I'm on PS4, and the frame rate is stable for me, so I can't comment on if it's still bad on X1. I also hope they crush the remaining bugs, though I don't experience them often now thankfully. AI also still needs to be smoothed out as it's still suicidal.

I can't comment on FM6. It looks awesome from the videos and screens I've seen, but I'm used to dynamic time and weather now, and races in Pcars' career are quite long if you do 100% distance, which I do, so the short career races and no quali would be a bit of a downer. GT suffers the same problems with it's career, and I hope it doesn't do it again with GT7, though I won't hold my breath.

 

[notanexpert]

I do enjoy seeing fair opinions here on gtplanet. Much more peaceful here than say, a tweet from project cars then scrolling down to see the replies. Its brutal there. They hit me directly in my soul with rude comments about pcars.

 

[OzOldTimer]

I do enjoy seeing fair opinions here on gtplanet. Much more peaceful here than say, a tweet from project cars then scrolling down to see the replies. Its brutal there. They hit me directly in my soul with rude comments about pcars.

Agreed ... the general atmosphere at the PCars forum is quite hostile and confronting. Its just a game after all. I have considered FM6 but I am still not seeing/reading anything that would justify the cost of an XBone and wheel.

 

[Mike_grpA]

This is the best videogame forum I have ever been a part of. It's on par with F1technical.net's forum for maturity and conversation. Unfortunately, most videogame forums tend to be full of fan boys and children who would rather troll each other than converse about their hobbies. Pcars official forum is full of people that full on get offended if you level any criticism at the game, no matter how nice you are about it, they'll just chuck a tantrum and troll you 'till you give up. I've seen it happen to a lot of people over there. That nonsense isn't put up with here, which is great, as the trolls get banned quite quickly, and the rest of us can converse or debate maturely .

 

[Bjorn Lucas]

Reading reviews is the best way to avoid deceit

reading reviews is one way to get a opinion about something you never played
reviews are just a view from a person about a that game/movie whatever,...

i like reading them but i never take it for granted!!
(IMDB is a good example of ****ed up scores)

 

[SimTourist]

Have both on my X1. Forza 6 obviously has about 100 times the budget which shows in menus, car models, car count, track detail, sounds, etc. It's very polished and plays very well. Easily the best Forza yet.
As for PCars comparison, I just couldn't get into PCars, the career is stale and barebones, hardly any cars, the tracks look horrendous, bugs waiting at every corner. The experience just doesn't feel thought out or complete. It could use another 2-3 years in development, but they probably ran out of money.
Physics wise on a gamepad it's no contest, FM6 blows PC away like it's nothing. PC has nice things like dynamic ToD and weather but pays the price of lower resolution and horrible framerates.

 

[bleeder]

Was pCARS not 1080p on xbox?

As for the rest, I think that opinion will be shared by a lot of xbox owners unfortunately. Forza is just a well made series generally. I wonder what the majority of xbox wheel users think between the two? I haven't heard much feedback about F6 and wheel support.

 

[NLxAROSA]

Physics wise on a gamepad it's no contest, FM6 blows PC away like it's nothing.

In what sense does FM6 blow PC away with regards to physics? Specific examples? Or do you mean purely controller wise? Haven't played FM6 personally, but I hate the controller with pCARS, haven't been able to get a decent setting out of it (both Xbox 360 and Xbox One controllers on PC).

 

[FuriousDemon]

Yeah, Forza is just tuned for a controller, so it's just easier to drive. Physics are obviously the same on pCARS for both wheel and controller, but until you dial in the settings right, you will get more enjoyment out of Forza. I think that's the main difference.

 

[mister dog]

In what sense does FM6 blow PC away with regards to physics? Specific examples? Or do you mean purely controller wise? Haven't played FM6 personally, but I hate the controller with pCARS, haven't been able to get a decent setting out of it (both Xbox 360 and Xbox One controllers on PC).

He must mean 'with regards to controllers'. I mean.... he must!

reading reviews is one way to get a opinion about something you never played
reviews are just a view from a person about a that game/movie whatever,...

i like reading them but i never take it for granted!!
(IMDB is a good example of ****ed up scores)

The emphasis is on reviews. I always read a ton and they haven't disappointed me so far. If you would only base yourself on IGN for example yes, but reading a lot of them including user reviews on message boards gives you a clear picture of what to expect.

 

[SimTourist]

In what sense does FM6 blow PC away with regards to physics? Specific examples? Or do you mean purely controller wise? Haven't played FM6 personally, but I hate the controller with pCARS, haven't been able to get a decent setting out of it (both Xbox 360 and Xbox One controllers on PC).

Even after using some decent settings I felt like only Formula 3 cars drove somewhat decently, all road cars handle like absolute trash is PCars. Plus it's got some strange things going on sometimes which reminds me of the Shift series. So I don't believe for a second they dropped that physics engine entirely. Plus inaccurate ugly tracks didn't really inspire me to lap them.

 

[mister dog]

Even after using some decent settings I felt like only Formula 3 cars drove somewhat decently, all road cars handle like absolute trash is PCars.

After a weekend trying out the new DLC and having had a genuine blast with the YB and the Mustangs, i resent that claim dear sir. On a wheel PCARS offers the best physics you can experience, even topping other sims like AC and R3R.

 

[FS7]

It seems to me most people that don't like Pcars are controller users. I liked it with a controller, though admittedly after a lot of tweaking the controller settings, and even then it felt cumbersome trying to control the cars with the limited freedom of a controller.

I think the problem with most controller users is their driving style.
I play PCars with a DS4, default setup, realistic aids, I can play the game just fine. I try to be very smooth with my inputs, I had a hard time driving the FA around slow corners when I first got the game, but other than that I never had any trouble controlling the cars. The key is to have smooth precise inputs.
In GT6 & FM4 it's possible to drive cars using sloppy inputs even with all the aids turned off, that's not the case with PCars. While I agree that adjusting some settings can make PCars easier to play I think the most important thing is to forget all the bad habits learned in other games.

 

[Johnnypenso]

After a weekend trying out the new DLC and having had a genuine blast with the YB and the Mustangs, i resent that claim dear sir. On a wheel PCARS offers the best physics you can experience, even topping other sims like AC and R3R.

It's a rough transition for many gamers used to GT or Forza when driving street cars in a sim. With a single tire model, cars tend to be more responsive than they really are. When you introduce more variables into the equation as PCars, Assetto Corsa and others do, all of a sudden your formerly pointy and precise street car has softer carcass tires with more flexible sidewalls and a lot less grip. Responsiveness slows down and it gives the impression of awful handling when it's actually, IMO anyway, more realistic handling.

 

[VXR]

Forza has had tyre deformation for three iterations at least now and it's not like FM4 where you can just take liberties with the cars in 5 or 6 with the aids off. On pad, there's very little difference between the two (6 and PCars).

 

[UkHardcore23]

Was pCARS not 1080p on xbox?

As for the rest, I think that opinion will be shared by a lot of xbox owners unfortunately. Forza is just a well made series generally. I wonder what the majority of xbox wheel users think between the two? I haven't heard much feedback about F6 and wheel support.

900p and it's pretty jaggy compared to the PS4 version...However i cannot believe it's more jaggy that Forza.

 

[bleeder]

900p and it's pretty jaggy compared to the PS4 version...However i cannot believe it's more jaggy that Forza.

Ah ok. Makes sense now. Jaggies aren't too bad on PS4 but we could always turn that nasty phantom ghost slider back up to max if we really want them gone.

Man, remember the ghosts? Dark times they were. Dark indeed.

 

[mister dog]

It's a rough transition for many gamers used to GT or Forza when driving street cars in a sim. With a single tire model, cars tend to be more responsive than they really are. When you introduce more variables into the equation as PCars, Assetto Corsa and others do, all of a sudden your formerly pointy and precise street car has softer carcass tires with more flexible sidewalls and a lot less grip. Responsiveness slows down and it gives the impression of awful handling when it's actually, IMO anyway, more realistic handling.

That and the standard FFB wasn't good at the beginning for the modern street cars, major clipping etcetera.
But that has been resolved now also if i'm not mistaken.

 

[NLxAROSA]

And don't forget the updated tire model for street tires. Road cars are my favorite to drive with a controller.

 

[ImaRobot]

You are definitely missing out then, no offense but I'll never understand people who are that picky about frame rate.

It is in your mind. Just play the games without thinking about fps. Your eyes, sense will adjust accordingly. It is not like jerky or unplayable. Only under extreme condition and very few places. Obviously t if the game is not optimized and controls are not good before they patch in. It is better to wait before they can improve and prices go down

Locked frames at a lower rate is not a problem, what becomes a problem is wildly fluctuating frame rates. I can not just ignore that as it's not just a visual interruption, but a physical as well. That is my one and single problem with PCars, outside of that area I think the game is amazing.

1080p/60fps, 45 cars on track and full weather tells you it's optimized.

Playing it on the Xbox One tells me it's not Like mentioned, I was getting extreme slow down/speed up effects as well as stutters. I admit I have not played it in a couple of months so I have not experienced any changes so far, but my interest is all but gone.

It's a rough transition for many gamers used to GT or Forza when driving street cars in a sim. With a single tire model, cars tend to be more responsive than they really are. When you introduce more variables into the equation as PCars, Assetto Corsa and others do, all of a sudden your formerly pointy and precise street car has softer carcass tires with more flexible sidewalls and a lot less grip. Responsiveness slows down and it gives the impression of awful handling when it's actually, IMO anyway, more realistic handling.

As mentioned, Tire deformation has been a thing with Forza for years now. That may be the case for GT, but not so much on Forza. The only thing that took getting used to coming from Forza to PCars was the lack of controller optimization. Trial and error with control settings took a bit of time, but after I got it down I was enjoying the hell out of it.. that was until I reached certain events that I couldn't even get past the first few turns because of a weird slowmotion effect. I really enjoy the more precise controls of PCars, makes it all the more rewarding when you nail a lap. Although, I imagine that Forza's Simulation handling will produce the same effect, I just always stood away from it.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

It's a rough transition for many gamers used to GT or Forza when driving street cars in a sim. With a single tire model, cars tend to be more responsive than they really are. When you introduce more variables into the equation as PCars, Assetto Corsa and others do, all of a sudden your formerly pointy and precise street car has softer carcass tires with more flexible sidewalls and a lot less grip. Responsiveness slows down and it gives the impression of awful handling when it's actually, IMO anyway, more realistic handling.

That's where GT and Forza differ IMO, by quite a significant margin: turn-in. GT's is very pointy, you're right there, but that's never really been the case with FM, especially on the One. If anything, I see a fair amount of people complain about the cars feeling too cumbersome - and, as luck would have it, those tend to be people that prefer GT. Odd, right?

FM6 lets you feel the differences. I love racing the slower cars, so the introductory League in D Class (PI of 400 or less) was perfect last week. I have an ND Miata tuned for tighter circuits, and it won me a fair amount of races despite having a piddling 160HP. On the other side of the spectrum, I have a '69 Mustang Boss 302 tuned for speed, with over 400HP in the same class. On some tracks, it simply won't see which way the Miata has gone. On others, like Daytona's alternate road course, I'm currently sitting at 32nd in the Americas (or 8th, if you remove the glitched Mini times).

It shouldn't be a surprise, but they feel massively different. It's not that the Mustang lacks grip - it does, but that's not just it. It needs to settle into a corner, to almost be poured in. The tires squish a bit, almost as if they need to be convinced that yes, you are indeed turning into this corner. The Miata meanwhile has what can, comparably, be referred to as "steering thought" versus the "steering response" of the Ford. It dives in, with the odd result being I'm more likely to be collecting it in moments of oversteer than the Mustang, if only because it's lively, terrier approach to corners has me over-cooking it. In the Stang, I'm always cautious, not applying full throttle until I know the fronts are pointed straight.

Locked frames at a lower rate is not a problem, what becomes a problem is wildly fluctuating frame rates. I can not just ignore that as it's not just a visual interruption, but a physical as well. That is my one and single problem with PCars, outside of that area I think the game is amazing.


Playing it on the Xbox One tells me it's not Like mentioned, I was getting extreme slow down/speed up effects as well as stutters. I admit I have not played it in a couple of months so I have not experienced any changes so far, but my interest is all but gone.


As mentioned, Tire deformation has been a thing with Forza for years now. That may be the case for GT, but not so much on Forza. The only thing that took getting used to coming from Forza to PCars was the lack of controller optimization. Trial and error with control settings took a bit of time, but after I got it down I was enjoying the hell out of it.. that was until I reached certain events that I couldn't even get past the first few turns because of a weird slowmotion effect. I really enjoy the more precise controls of PCars, makes it all the more rewarding when you nail a lap. Although, I imagine that Forza's Simulation handling will produce the same effect, I just always stood away from it.

This is what turned me off of PCARS so quickly; the odd zooming sense of speed. When I was braking into a turn, it felt like the whole game slowed down, not just the car. The best way I can explain it: the sense of speed would immediately feel like the 60mph I'd be aiming to enter the turn in, despite me starting breaking at 160mph. It felt wholly unnatural, and contributed to me not hitting a single apex.

Perhaps I owe it to PCARS to try again (even though I've heard the One version is the worst), but it's not winning the battle for my interest right now.

 

[FuriousDemon]

If you guys tried the launch version of pCARS only, you owe it to yourself to try the current one after the updates. The framerate is much more stable, only rain+evening+lots of cars will bring it down below 60. During "normal" conditions (driving solo/light traffic) it's pretty stable now.

 

[ImaRobot]

If you guys tried the launch version of pCARS only, you owe it to yourself to try the current one after the updates. The framerate is much more stable, only rain+evening+lots of cars will bring it down below 60. During "normal" conditions (driving solo/light traffic) it's pretty stable now.

That's the thing though, I've never had a problem in solo/light traffic. So that shouldn't make much of a difference so far.

My interest is pretty much gone, and with FM6 out it's even more so, now.

 

[CHEN255]

Have both on my X1. Forza 6 obviously has about 100 times the budget which shows in menus, car models, car count, track detail, sounds, etc. It's very polished and plays very well. Easily the best Forza yet.
As for PCars comparison, I just couldn't get into PCars, the career is stale and barebones, hardly any cars, the tracks look horrendous, bugs waiting at every corner. The experience just doesn't feel thought out or complete. It could use another 2-3 years in development, but they probably ran out of money.
Physics wise on a gamepad it's no contest, FM6 blows PC away like it's nothing. PC has nice things like dynamic ToD and weather but pays the price of lower resolution and horrible framerates.

I would definitely get F6 if I had an XBone, but I'm on PS4.
It sounds like a stellar job by Turn 10 and I would choose it over PCars myself.

 

[diesel97]

That's where GT and Forza differ IMO, by quite a significant margin: turn-in. GT's is very pointy, you're right there, but that's never really been the case with FM, especially on the One. If anything, I see a fair amount of people complain about the cars feeling too cumbersome - and, as luck would have it, those tend to be people that prefer GT. Odd, right?

FM6 lets you feel the differences. I love racing the slower cars, so the introductory League in D Class (PI of 400 or less) was perfect last week. I have an ND Miata tuned for tighter circuits, and it won me a fair amount of races despite having a piddling 160HP. On the other side of the spectrum, I have a '69 Mustang Boss 302 tuned for speed, with over 400HP in the same class. On some tracks, it simply won't see which way the Miata has gone. On others, like Daytona's alternate road course, I'm currently sitting at 32nd in the Americas (or 8th, if you remove the glitched Mini times).

It shouldn't be a surprise, but they feel massively different. It's not that the Mustang lacks grip - it does, but that's not just it. It needs to settle into a corner, to almost be poured in. The tires squish a bit, almost as if they need to be convinced that yes, you are indeed turning into this corner. The Miata meanwhile has what can, comparably, be referred to as "steering thought" versus the "steering response" of the Ford. It dives in, with the odd result being I'm more likely to be collecting it in moments of oversteer than the Mustang, if only because it's lively, terrier approach to corners has me over-cooking it. In the Stang, I'm always cautious, not applying full throttle until I know the fronts are pointed straight.

that odd zooming into corners is a option , it can all be turned up,down or off

This is what turned me off of PCARS so quickly; the odd zooming sense of speed. When I was braking into a turn, it felt like the whole game slowed down, not just the car. The best way I can explain it: the sense of speed would immediately feel like the 60mph I'd be aiming to enter the turn in, despite me starting breaking at 160mph. It felt wholly unnatural, and contributed to me not hitting a single apex.

Perhaps I owe it to PCARS to try again (even though I've heard the One version is the worst), but it's not winning the battle for my interest right now.

 

[Johnnypenso]

This is what turned me off of PCARS so quickly; the odd zooming sense of speed. When I was braking into a turn, it felt like the whole game slowed down, not just the car. The best way I can explain it: the sense of speed would immediately feel like the 60mph I'd be aiming to enter the turn in, despite me starting breaking at 160mph. It felt wholly unnatural, and contributed to me not hitting a single apex.

Perhaps I owe it to PCARS to try again (even though I've heard the One version is the worst), but it's not winning the battle for my interest right now.

Doesn't that zooming phenomenon come from the FOV Speed Sensitivity adjustment? Not sure what the particular adjustments are, but it gives you a larger FOV and hence a greater sense of speed the faster you go, then a smaller FOV and hence the zooming/slowing effect, when you slow down. I tried it and hated it but I've seen it in some videos so some people must like it. I turned it off, just didn't work for me.

 

[Mike_grpA]

I think the problem with most controller users is their driving style.
I play PCars with a DS4, default setup, realistic aids, I can play the game just fine. I try to be very smooth with my inputs, I had a hard time driving the FA around slow corners when I first got the game, but other than that I never had any trouble controlling the cars. The key is to have smooth precise inputs.
In GT6 & FM4 it's possible to drive cars using sloppy inputs even with all the aids turned off, that's not the case with PCars. While I agree that adjusting some settings can make PCars easier to play I think the most important thing is to forget all the bad habits learned in other games.

Yeah you may be right. I always felt I was smooth with the controller in GT6, but Pcars I always felt like I had to make a concession in the settings. If I had speed sensitivity too low, the car would be twitchy as hell at high speed, and I would struggle to even keep it in a straight line, but if I put it too high, it'd be very slow to get to lock at high speed, making catching slides very hard. In the end I found a decent compromise in all of the settings, but I shelved the game for over a month to wait for my wheel, so I could spend time finishing Driveclub and The Crew, because I knew when I got the wheel Pcars would basically live in my PS4, and that has been the case lol.

There's just no way to even scratch the surface of it's amazing physics without a wheel imo.

Ah ok. Makes sense now. Jaggies aren't too bad on PS4 but we could always turn that nasty phantom ghost slider back up to max if we really want them gone.

Man, remember the ghosts? Dark times they were. Dark indeed.

I'm glad they patched the temporal slider in quickly, those ghosts really ruined the image. It's great with the temporal off, nice and sharp, and the jaggies on PS4 aren't any worse than any other game.

If you guys tried the launch version of pCARS only, you owe it to yourself to try the current one after the updates. The framerate is much more stable, only rain+evening+lots of cars will bring it down below 60. During "normal" conditions (driving solo/light traffic) it's pretty stable now.

I can't speak for the X1 version, but I haven't noticed any slowdown at all no matter how many cars are on track, or how bad the weather gets. The PS4 version's frame rate has been really good ever since 2.0 for me.